Fresnel Lenses Alternatives?

Aireoth

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I love my Vive vr, but absolutely hate the fresnel lenses as the ridges pick up any glow and create a lense flare effect.

Has anyone tried any optional lenses?

does the index have the same fresnel lenses? are the index's lenses compatible with the vive (I use glasses and have prescription inserts, wondering if they would fit the index)?
 

MaZa

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Unfortunately glare/godrays is one of the known downsides of Index. So far I think only Oculus has managed to eliminate most of it, though I am looking forward to the HP Reverb G2. In a QA they did with MRTV they promised to reduce the glare. We will see soon enough they were successful or not.
 

N4CR

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I guess this is a cost and compactness/optical packaging thing, as I come from a background where we do not skimp out on optics, because otherwise shit breaks. I can have custom solutions made that practically nullifies wavefront distortion across the visible range while expanding an objective, so I don't see why it is not possible here whilst avoiding Fresnel approach..
 
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Aireoth

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Unfortunately glare/godrays is one of the known downsides of Index. So far I think only Oculus has managed to eliminate most of it, though I am looking forward to the HP Reverb G2. In a QA they did with MRTV they promised to reduce the glare. We will see soon enough they were successful or not.

That is disappointing but good to know, been on the fence about the Index and that puts a pin in it until a better solution comes out. I'm 95% certain that my motion sickness in VR is coming from the godrays distracting my eyes.
 

reaper12

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That is disappointing but good to know, been on the fence about the Index and that puts a pin in it until a better solution comes out. I'm 95% certain that my motion sickness in VR is coming from the godrays distracting my eyes.

Very unlikely.

The most likely causes are running too high of settings and dropping down lower than the refresh rate of the headset, this can happen a lot easier than people think. Especially if you are running SS.

Or that you haven't fully got your VR legs and you continue to play even after you start feeling nauseous.
 
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Aireoth

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Very unlikely.

The most likely causes are running too high of settings and dropping down lower than the refresh rate of the headset, this can happen a lot easier than people think. Especially if you are running SS.

Or that you haven't fully got your VR legs and you continue to play even after you start feeling nauseous.

Unlikely. I've had vr since the oculus DK2, went from that straight to the vive on launch, I make sure to keep frames up over graphics, though I've never tested fps.

I find the fresnel lines visible and the godrays cause my eyes to flicker and focus on them rather than the game. It was in a hour long session of elite last night that i finally pulled my HMD out for that I really noticed the effect the godrays where having on my experience.

edit: I do push past nausea a little bit, trying to extend my vr legs as you say. weird part is in the DK2 I could play for hours without issue, used Vorpx and rocked payday 2 for days was a blast.
 
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reaper12

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Unlikely. I've had vr since the oculus DK2, went from that straight to the vive on launch, I make sure to keep frames up over graphics, though I've never tested fps.

I find the fresnel lines visible and the godrays cause my eyes to flicker and focus on them rather than the game. It was in a hour long session of elite last night that i finally pulled my HMD out for that I really noticed the effect the godrays where having on my experience.

edit: I do push past nausea a little bit, trying to extend my vr legs as you say. weird part is in the DK2 I could play for hours without issue, used Vorpx and rocked payday 2 for days was a blast.

As I said, it's highly unlikely that the Godrays are giving you VR sickness. If your symptoms were headaches or sore eyes or feeling dizzy I might say it was the Godrays.

A Game like Elite Dangerous is the kind of game most likely to cause VR sickness. So first you should try turning off all SS and lowering the settings and see if you still get motion sickness.

If you are still feeling motion sickness even with lower settings you will have to go through the process of retraining your brain again. How you do that is that you stop playing and take off the headset the second you feel VR sickness coming on. Stay away from VR then for at least 15 minutes. If you have fairly good VR legs it won't take long at all to get to a stage where you aren't feeling sick at all.

And if all that fails, try eating some ginger before playing.
 

drutman

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I guess this is a cost and compactness/optical packaging thing, as I come from a background where we do not skimp out on optics, because otherwise shit breaks. I can have custom solutions made that practically nullifies wavefront distortion across the visible range while expanding an objective, so I don't see why it is not possible here whilst avoiding Fresnel approach..
Good optics do not come cheap, I remember when we purchased a 1.5KW CO2 industrial laser off a textile floor facility to do ablation resaerch for 100 grand, the optics alone cost more than the laser. The laser looked like a industrial clothes dryer about 12 feet tall, scared the hell out of the Univ safety peeps. With no optics in beam line it would punch through a 6 inch block of bulletproof Polycarbonate in under a sec and the IR beam is invisible to the eye.
 

Aireoth

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As I said, it's highly unlikely that the Godrays are giving you VR sickness. If your symptoms were headaches or sore eyes or feeling dizzy I might say it was the Godrays.

A Game like Elite Dangerous is the kind of game most likely to cause VR sickness. So first you should try turning off all SS and lowering the settings and see if you still get motion sickness.

If you are still feeling motion sickness even with lower settings you will have to go through the process of retraining your brain again. How you do that is that you stop playing and take off the headset the second you feel VR sickness coming on. Stay away from VR then for at least 15 minutes. If you have fairly good VR legs it won't take long at all to get to a stage where you aren't feeling sick at all.

And if all that fails, try eating some ginger before playing.

dizzy is a better description, its not quite nausea, more like eye strain when my glasses prescription is off.

I'm going to order those lenses above and see what happens, will report back for those that may want to rid themselves of fresnel lines.
 

reaper12

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dizzy is a better description, its not quite nausea, more like eye strain when my glasses prescription is off.

I'm going to order those lenses above and see what happens, will report back for those that may want to rid themselves of fresnel lines.

Do report back, I hope they work out for you.

Wasn't there a mod for the Vive Pro that replaced the Fresnel lenses with ones from the Gear VR. Maybe that might work on the Vive?
 

MavericK

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For the OG Vive, the GearVR lens kits out there are great. I got a set from Ebay and they look WAY better IMO. Better sweet spot and no Fresnel rings.
 
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I can't imagine Gear VR lenses being an improvement, as I absolutely hate chromatic aberration, and the Note 4-era Gear VR (SM-R320) was rife with it.

Alas, it's a tradeoff. Fresnel lenses mean substantially mitigated chromatic aberration, though you get to deal with rings and god rays that are indeed annoying at times. The Rift CV1 had a greater sweet spot of focus than the Index, too, though the Index has noticeably wider FOV.

Perhaps one day, we'll have lenses that don't suffer significantly from either drawback in future VR HMD generations, but I wouldn't count on it at anything below StarVR One/XTAL VR-level commercial headsets.

Why? If you want to get an idea of what a really good lens costs, look up any sort of Canon L-series telephoto lens some time and watch your wallet weep. Professional photographers spend a lot more money on their lenses than the camera bodies they're attached to, and that's because they know that cheap lenses are prone to things like barrel distortion and chromatic aberration (the former of which is compensated for in software to suit that particular HMD's lenses). Many of these lenses get around it by using multiple elements and special coatings, and the former would add substantial weight to an HMD that is already heavy enough as is.
 

MavericK

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I can't imagine Gear VR lenses being an improvement, as I absolutely hate chromatic aberration, and the Note 4-era Gear VR (SM-R320) was rife with it.

I dunno, I've heard people talk about that and barrel distortion - I never really experienced either on my Vive with the GearVR lens mod. So I can't really say how big of a problem it actually is.
 
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I dunno, I've heard people talk about that and barrel distortion - I never really experienced either on my Vive with the GearVR lens mod. So I can't really say how big of a problem it actually is.
I'd like to try it for myself, but the problem there is that I've never tried a Vive out of never knowing anyone with one locally. Went straight from Rift CV1 in 2016 to the Index this year, and the Index, while featuring similar lenses to the Vive, don't appear to be easily detachable in a non-destructive fashion. Maybe I haven't looked closely enough.

I do have an unused SM-R323 lying around (a few generations after the Note 4's SM-R320), so I have a donor for the lenses already. I just don't want to wreck my Index installing them.

As for barrel distortion, that was another one of my concerns, since that's presumably set in software with the expectation of stock lenses. Even with said stock lenses, the Index exhibits some barrel distortion at the edges if you're not smack in the middle of its sweet spot, which is a smidge irritating.
 
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