Formula One Driving Is Surprisingly High Tech

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by HardOCP News, Sep 29, 2016.

  1. HardOCP News

    HardOCP News [H] News

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    Holy crap, watch how many buttons this race car driver presses during this lap. Wow! I had no idea that Formula One racing was this high tech. :eek:
     
  2. T_A

    T_A Limp Gawd

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    F1 Cars are the Pinnacle of automotive technology , the tech they are using is only available to consumers many years later, it is known.
    Don`t mean to sound like a douche , but to my knowledge, in America , racing cars are mostly NASCAR style cars that are pretty basic technology wise (big engines on cars the go in circles all day long).
     
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  3. amddragonpc

    amddragonpc [H]ard|Gawd

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    How to take the fun out of driving a race car.
     
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  4. DocSavage

    DocSavage 2[H]4U

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    Nascar isn't even just big engines. The competitors are forced to use restriction plates -- which means everyone has the same horsepower cap.

    Edit: Restrictor plate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Well damn. Looks like all the competitions have artificial restrictions.

    Edit 2: Also Nascar engines aren't that big. "In 1971, NASCAR handicapped the larger engines with a restrictor plate. By 1972, NASCAR phased in a rule to lower the maximum engine displacement from 429 cubic inches(7.0 liters) to its present 358 cubic inches (5.8 liters)."

    Edit 3: That "DRS Open" at the start seems to be a Drag Reduction System. Pretty cool stuff. And after watching the video, I realize I could never be a race car driver.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2016
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  5. spugm1r3

    spugm1r3 [H]ard|Gawd

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    It's like an oversized Xbox controller on a stick...
     
  6. Armenius

    Armenius I Drive Myself to the [H]ospital

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    I don't see what the big deal is. He isn't even adjusting the differential through that lap. The video might be misleading, too, as it is visualizing every time he shifts up and down.

    The two other primary things being done is adjusting the brake balance forward or back for upcoming corners (BBal), and adjusting the response rate of the brake-by-wire system (BMIG; "brake pressure" when the pedal system was still hydraulic).

    The driver doesn't have to manually close DRS into a braking zone, as it automatically closes when brake is applied, but you can to give more control in your braking rate going into a corner.
    NASCAR is just one racing series that is a drop in the bucket of all racing series in North America, but it is certainly the most publicized. Its popularity has been steadily declining in the past decade. I've always preferred watching the various SCCA-sanctioned series and WeatherTech Sportscar, and still enjoy IndyCar.
     
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  7. DocSavage

    DocSavage 2[H]4U

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    I've never been a fan of Nascar, and I find it sadly hilarious that someone built a Nascar track here in Kansas City just in time for people to stop caring.
     
  8. Armenius

    Armenius I Drive Myself to the [H]ospital

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    Kansas City, MO or Kansas City, KS? If the latter they have had a NASCAR-style oval there since 2001. The Craftsman Truck Series was initially the only "major" NASCAR division to race there.

    Kansas Speedway - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  9. JDanser

    JDanser Limp Gawd

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    SCCA SSR class races are a sight to behold. The only thing I enjoy more is the 24 hours of Lemons.
     
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  10. Activate: AMD

    Activate: AMD [H]ard|Gawd

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    5.8L is still a damn big engine in my book.. especially considering the biggest engine in F1 in the last 20 years has been a 3.0L and they're currently running 1.6L Turbo V6's.

    I think F1 is really cool, but ironically I think the more they mess with it in the quest to make it more "exciting" the more boring it becomes. They've turned the sport into a bit of a farce with all the goofy tire changes, no refueling, etc that they're mandating. The heyday of the sport is over, but even at its worst its still far more interesting than a mind-numbing NASCAR race
     
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  11. magoo

    magoo [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I think the Indy Car series fans would argue with you there.
    The Indy cars are just as advanced as F1, but like NASCAR have much more conformance to keep competition tight.

    NASCAR is just what it is......a "stock car" Nascar has stayed as true to it's roots as any series. They are however tightly regulated in body style and technical make-up, again to keep competition tight.

    NASCAR cockpits are pretty basic.
    They actually manually shift gears. The driver can adjust brake bias, but that's about it.

    The restrictor plate in NASCAR is only used on certain tracks where the size and degree of banking could lead to dangerous speeds. Those tracks tend to be big ovals like Daytona and Talledega.
    I think Atlanta is also restricted.
    If I recall Bill Elliot set the NASCAR speed record in an unrestricted Plymouth Super Bird at Talledega......excess of 220 MPH

    I'm really suprised that so many people are amazed by the tech in F1.
    That series has always been at the front in tech. So much so that their races are often very boring, dominated by the best tech'ed car.
     
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  12. [21CW]killerofall

    [21CW]killerofall Aliens...

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    No they are not. F1 is much more advanced (and much much more expensive). The Difference Between IndyCar And Formula 1: Money, Lots Of It!
    The F1 steering wheel alone is about $35k (about $10k more than Indy car).
     
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  13. Mistral

    Mistral Limp Gawd

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    F1 lol. LMP1 has been more technologically advanced and relevant for years...

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2016
  14. OEM

    OEM [H]ard as it Gets

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    And the racing is better by leaps and bounds.

    Baku was the worst race in history. I'd watch 100 nascar races before watching Baku again. What a waste of time that race was.
     
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  15. IcePickFreak

    IcePickFreak [H]ard|Gawd

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    Pretty sure Bill Elliot wasn't racing when NASCAR had Superbirds in 1970. He set the record in the late 80's in a Ford Thunderbird. I use to watch it a bit back then with my grandfather.
     
  16. SpeedyVV

    SpeedyVV [H]ardness Supreme

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    While they do press a lot lot of buttons now, nothing compares to the crazy days where they had to take one hand off the steering wheel to shift gears.

    No traction control, no abs, no drs, no nothing!

    Ayerton Senna's lap of Monaco is epic. But a lot more dangerous back then too. Fun to watch but at the sacrifice of driver's lives was a high price to pay.

     
  17. B00nie

    B00nie [H]ardness Supreme

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    Well the formula1 has 1.6 liter engine and they pull 700hp out of it. They also have a load of tech restrictions limiting the maximum power - the biggest one being a cap on maximum fuel flow per minute. They have to conserve fuel while racing.
     
  18. OEM

    OEM [H]ard as it Gets

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    They need to keep today's safety standards and go back to cockpits like he had...that would be epic. Real driving with safe cars.
     
  19. Armenius

    Armenius I Drive Myself to the [H]ospital

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    Baku is a horrible track design that doesn't help. I feel the FIA just sanctioned this race to gain headlines.
    It was 1987, and you're right: it was done in a Thunderbird. The lap speed was 212.809 MPH, or 44.9981 seconds around the 2.66 mile tri-oval.
    The car in that video has active traction and stability control systems, in addition to variable ratio steering... ABS and sequential shifting came into play in 1991, if I remember correctly.

    There was a stink among drivers and teams when FIA decided to take away all the electronic control systems from the cars in 1994 because the cars were designed so close to the limit of drivability that the cars would be impossible to drive. I think the active suspension system the Williams FW15C incorporated was the final straw to which electronic aids were banned. A lot of the rule changes made for the 1994 season were an attempt to make the racing more entertaining to watch in an attempt to be similar to CART in the US at the time to try and draw more TV viewers.
    That is the whole powertrain including ERS. If I remember correctly there is no limit to the size of the fuel cell in the car, but of course you want to make it as small as possible while still being able to finish a race. Another restriction limits maximum engine speed to 15,000 RPM, but because of the limit on fuel flow rate most engines top out around 11k-12k.
     
  20. Kwaz

    Kwaz Whine & Cheezy

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    We lost our local track where I live several years ago. Maybe over a decade. Sucks. That place was awesome. Sure you needed a blanket to not get splinters in your ass and they caught the hill on fire every time they had fireworks, but it was great. I remember the aunt of a neighbor had a car when I was a kid.

    Good ol days. Our town just hasn't been the same since. It's a city now. Bleh
     
  21. Vader1975

    Vader1975 Gawd

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    While Nascar may be as you suggest. Indy Car and it's predecessors were once considered a equivalent racing league to F1. That has changed in the last 20 years specifically. Where Indy is now closer to a Junior league then F1, but the cars are still very fast, open wheel, and very very dangerous. It is now far more likely that you would be killed in Indy then F1. While the greatest drivers in the world may be in WRC where life and death await every race.

    We even got to see it proven watching Kimi Räikkönen do so poorly after wining in F1 and trying to do WRC.

    F1 drivers arn't guaranteed to be good Nascar drivers, WRC drivers arn't guaranteed to be good F1 or Indy drivers etc. So when anyone says that 1 specific racing series is the greatest driver I kind of flinch. Racing boats and WRC are some of the most dangerous in the world and I give more props for that but who are the best? I try and limit that to similar driving situations. Such as comparing F1 drivers to Indy drivers. They drive similar types of cars in similar fashions. But in the end I think most F1 drivers would have trouble in Nascar and most Nascar drivers would have trouble in F1. The driving just is totally different. I personally don't think much of Nascar, but if it was that easy then Juan Pablo Montoya would of dominated it. He didn't. Then he went to Indy where he instantly started doing well again. Indy is at-least like F1.

    I would also like to notify you that F1 is international not European. There is even a F1 race in Texas and there may soon be one in New Jersey.
     
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  22. Dullard

    Dullard [H]ard|Gawd

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    Yeah, Bernie has some strange bedfellows. It was at Baku that Bernie praised the place and called Montreal a North American shithole.

    100Kg of fuel per race, max.

    Despite the rosy headline, the article paints a bleaker picture of F1 NJ. It's hella expensive, not just to build even a street circuit, but to man it and pay F1 the $25million/yr franchise fee.

    Here's why F1 sale could mean new life for a race in New Jersey

    Not on the 2017 provisional calendar.

    FIA releases 2017 F1 schedule; three key races slapped with provisional status
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2016
  23. Activate: AMD

    Activate: AMD [H]ard|Gawd

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    Fair assessment of it all. F1 and WRC are, to me, the most interesting to watch as I view them to be the pinnacle of the things i find cool in cars. Super technical driving skills, high speed, cool technology and varied track/road/dirt conditions
     
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  24. DocSavage

    DocSavage 2[H]4U

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    I'm not sure forcing them to use a stick-shifter at those crazy speeds with walls everywhere is the best idea though it is definitely more [H]ardcore. :D
    Really with all those buttons, you might as well let a computer do the shifting and take some stress away from the driver.
     
  25. Dullard

    Dullard [H]ard|Gawd

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    But that's the whole idea, a test of the driver's skill. That's why they took the traction control and suspension computers out. They only recently allowed the teams to coach/assist the drivers over the radio. They want the driver to do it all.
     
  26. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    And Monaco is the pinnacle of DANGER on the F1 calendar. A meter off your braking and you are into the barrier, especially in Senna's day with 1200hp cars little aero grip.
     
  27. OEM

    OEM [H]ard as it Gets

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    Fuck that. That'll show whos a real driver and who is just barely good enough to get a seat.

    The cars are too complex to have the radio ban they did. They could kill off the "brake 10 meters later" radio calls. But, when systems are failing, there is no way a driver could memorize all the procedures, because sometimes knowing how the system works intimately is required to memorize certain switches, etc.
     
  28. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    That's where you go when you retire from F1, or never made it to F1 to begin with.
     
  29. SpeedyVV

    SpeedyVV [H]ardness Supreme

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    Except there is a lemans winner that is and was an active F1 driver. ;)
     
  30. SpeedyVV

    SpeedyVV [H]ardness Supreme

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    Mind you, my take has always been that car racing is about cars, not drivers.

    Who can make the best car, based on some formula or specification. The driver is only there to make the best of what he is given. Try to make the most of the car by messing up the least.

    I do like races where everyone is given the same car, then we can call that a driver's race.

    If I am not mistaken, was that not the format of IROC racing?
     
  31. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    Sometimes a driver transcends the car, any car.

    *It doesn't matter if it was a spec racer because an ATG driver will own the field with their deft touches on car setup. You would not want to put Ayrton Senna into a spec series as the rest of the field will most definitely get owned and hard.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2016
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  32. Pieter3dnow

    Pieter3dnow [H]ardness Supreme

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    Supposedly there are over 74 combinations for drivers to switch on their "wheel" which is quite complex ;)
     
  33. DocSavage

    DocSavage 2[H]4U

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    Well with 2 way dip switches, 7 would get you 128 combinations.

    Unless you are talking overlays in which case, fuck that!
     
  34. spacecowboy863

    spacecowboy863 Gawd

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    now....let me go practice on forza. let the flame begin
     
  35. sirmonkey1985

    sirmonkey1985 [H]ard|DCer of the Month - July 2010

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    lol how little you know.. while yes nascar isn't all technology and computers running simulations through the entire race and some person half way across the world recording terabytes of data live it's just as technical for the exact opposite reasons. there's nothing telling you how much fuel you have or how much is in the car, everything is weighed then calculated by a single crew member on how much fuel is actually in the car, what their actual fuel usage is and it comes down to the driver knowing if they're saving fuel, not some thing on the steering wheel telling you to hit a specific fuel number. nascar also doesn't have a pit road speed limiter, they use 5 lug nuts on all the wheels, they don't have 4 tire changers, they refuel(screw you F1 for getting rid of refueling!!!), they rely on a tach to determine their speed. so while they're are completely different racing series they are both just as complex and challenging as each other for their own reasons.

    i watch all forms of motorsports to the stupid high and mighty crap of F1 fans claiming F1 is better than nascar is complete BS. F1's a video game compared to most other motorsports when it comes to the drivers which is sad because F1 use to be a true driver series where drivers could claim they were the best in the world.

    for most cars it's around 70-80 but theres some teams that are even higher than that.. it gets pretty nuts listening to the radio's when cars have issues.. i'd go fucking insane if i was one of those drivers..


    as nice as spec series sound i was never really a fan of them.. V8 super cars has mostly become a spec series and it's boring as hell now because the top 3 cars are basically determined in qualifying, the rest of the race is just a formality to see how many cars the bad drivers take out before it finishes.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2016
  36. Snakebyt

    Snakebyt [H]ard|Gawd

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    yeah walls and racing usually isnt a good idea

    [​IMG]


    ground gets in the way as well sometimes
    [​IMG]
     
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  37. Kor

    Kor 2[H]4U

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    Been this way for a a while. Force India took to using 3D printed steering wheels this year because it allows them to quickly produce updated variants from light weight materials.
     
  38. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    The back end comes out and guess what happens? Crash?

     
  39. sirmonkey1985

    sirmonkey1985 [H]ard|DCer of the Month - July 2010

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    thats guy has balls of steel. one tiny bump and it's all over.

    i love going back and watching Senna's old races, that guy was an amazing driver.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2016
  40. Dullard

    Dullard [H]ard|Gawd

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    And a development driver for one of the shittiest F1 teams won the Indy 500 this year.