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First HTPC

A

Alai

2[H]4U
Joined
Jul 19, 2008
Messages
2,701
Looking for advice on a future build that runs as cool and power-efficient as possible while still running without a hiccup or delay. I also need a case that is easy to work with (i.e. don't need to take apart the whole case to switch HDDs or PCIE cards, etc.). The case should have as high of "HDD spaces to total volume" ratio as possible.

Location: Los Angeles, CA

Budget: No strict limit, but looking for under $800... the cheaper the better

When to Build: Unclear

Already Own: PSU, SSD, HDD, Fans, External Sound Processor, 30" Dell Monitor

Already Decided: Intel Ultimate-N 6300 WiFi, possibly Lian-Li PC-V354

Activities/Features: HD playback, HD streaming, TrueHD, DTS-MA, Web Browsing, Office software (lots of Excel, Access, Word, and other data software), USB 3.0, ability to connect to a future TV/Projector, a lot of downloading/uploading (computer may be on all day at times), and possibly creating a media server out of this HTPC

Overclocking?: Probably not. Most CPUs run hot and power-inefficient when they are overclocked which is not what I want.



Miscellaneous:

Are most HTPC software and streaming going to be CPU-based or should I perhaps wait for AMD APUs to get better? If most software are CPU-run, then IVB CPUs seem to be the way to go.
 
Easy to work with cases are also bigger. Do you have a size limitation? For example are you trying to fix this box into a specific place? I saw you already chose the Lian-li v354, but that's a tight case. I'm not sure if it's so easy to work wih. For instance of you decide to have a graphics card you cannot have the 2nd HDD bay.
 
I will definitely not have a discrete graphics card in this HTPC. I don't know where I will put it, exactly, so I do not have specific volume/shape requirements. I am just looking for suggestions for the best bang-for-the-space kind of case.

Is the Lian-Li difficult to use for adding extra cards or swapping hard drives? And... compared to what other case is it difficult?

I just don't want to be stuck with a bigger case that has ridiculous space around the motherboard because it was intended for large graphics cards to fit in... only to be empty in that space because I won't have a discrete graphics card.
 
xcetera said:
The Core I3 2100 is what is in my HTPC and is excellent CPU for your HTPC, its just $79.99! http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1721441

If you want to drive to Tustin for Micro Center here is another good deal and the processor is a Ivy Bridge. http://slickdeals.net/f/5293270-Intel-Core-i3-3225-3-30-GHz-LGA-1155-Boxed-Processor-and-Gigabyte-GA-H61M-DS2-mATX-Motherboard-119-98-tax-AR-B-M-Micro-Center
Click to expand...

Go with the Intel, not the AMD APU. You didn't mention gaming and the i3 will save you a significant amount of power over a Trinity or Llano, especially being on 24/7. Also, you mentioned "lots of Excel, Access, Word, and other data software." On a HTPC? the phrase "you're gonna have a bad time" comes to mind.

My advice is this. Build your HTPC to function like an appliance. Keep it simple. Run XBMC, Plex, Chrome/Firefox, and some people like Windows Media Center (personally I don't.)

Keep your spreadsheets on a separate machine not in your living room, use that pretty Dell 30" for those spreadsheets, its kind of a waste using it for an HTPC display.
 
Ok, I may go Intel if that is what you guys are recommending. Is the integrated graphics of the i3 2100 strong enough for HTPC purposes or do I need a discrete card?

I have been doing more research and I may build a separate server (which would run 24/7) from the HTPC so perhaps I could just build a mITX with just the i3 2100 for the HTPC.

However, the Dell U3011 is going to be used for ALL of my computer related functions, server, HTPC, games (using my gaming computer), etc... It will be connected to all of my different machines. I won't buy a separate TV until far into the future unless I happen to find a really really good deal.
 
The integrated graphics of my Core i3 2100 works fine. I have it connected via HDMI to my Denon AVR and then to my Samsung HDTV also via HDMI.

My build consists of the above mentioned CPU, Intel DH77EB MB, G.Skill DDR3 2x4Gb RAM, Ceton InfiniTV pci-e card, Casatunes XLi card, LG GGC-H20L optical drive, 1-2tb Seagate HD, 1-1 128Gb OCZ Agility 4 SSD, case Antec NSK2480, Kill-a-Watt meter reports I'm running at 59 watts.

The Intel DH77EB is a micro atx motherboard and is designed for Ivy Bridge but backward compatible with my Sandy Bridge.What I lose in not buying a Ivy Bridge is enabling PCIe 3.0 If you get the equivalent replacement Ivy Bridge, Core I3 3220 you will get PCIe 3.0 and newer intergrated graphics in HD2500, if you go up to Core i3 3225 you get the PCIe 3.0 and a better graphics engine, HD4000.
 
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Alai said:
I will definitely not have a discrete graphics card in this HTPC. I don't know where I will put it, exactly, so I do not have specific volume/shape requirements. I am just looking for suggestions for the best bang-for-the-space kind of case.

Is the Lian-Li difficult to use for adding extra cards or swapping hard drives? And... compared to what other case is it difficult?

I just don't want to be stuck with a bigger case that has ridiculous space around the motherboard because it was intended for large graphics cards to fit in... only to be empty in that space because I won't have a discrete graphics card.
Click to expand...
If you're not going to put any card in there and will have access to all the drive bays, you should be fine. The case has great reviews, I was just pointing out the drive bay issue because you mentioned a lot of hard disks.

Are you putting in a tuner card? Make sure it fits. If you don't want to use the 2nd bay it's not an issue.
 
Ok, after going over everything and researching more, I will definitely be looking to follow the i3 2100/2105/2125 route unless Intel comes out with new integrated graphics that solves the stutter problem before I purchase. Additionally, I will probably just make a WHS/NAS separate from the HTPC so no worries on the "many HDDs" issue.

I will probably have an almost identical setup to xctera except SSDs instead of HDD and a different mITX case (undecided on which model exactly). I just want to make sure the mobo I get can bitstream TrueHD and DTS-MA properly to my receiver via HDMI.

Tentative Decision:
CPU - i3 2100
HSF - Nofan Fanless CR-95C IcePip (or something else that doesn't require fan)
MOBO - Intel DH77EB
RAM - 4GB low profile something
PSU - Seasonic X-400FL, X-460FL, Kingwin Stryker STR-500 (whatever ends up cheapest)
SSDs - 2x 128GB or 256GB of Samsung 830 or Crucial M4
OPTICAL - Anything
CASE - Silverstone CW02 (but Nofan may not fit)
ADD-ON - Intel 6300 Wifi, probably Ceton InfiniTV

I really want a case that fits the Nofan so I can have a CPU HSF that is passive but I don't think mITX cases can. The CW02 is the closest I can get but the diameter of the Nofan is slightly too big, if the specs are right. I may have to go mATX for the bigger cases instead... which will require I pick out a different mobo unless someone can suggest a different fanless CPU HSF?
 
No such thing as a fan that makes zero noise. I want literally no noise. Or as close as possible. That means all passive cooling except some case fans. And as few case fans as possible, at that.
 
I think this might be my last question regarding hardware... does anyone think it's worth it to try to grab CPUs with HD3000 or HD4000 as opposed to HD2000?
 
Alai said:
I really want a case that fits the Nofan so I can have a CPU HSF that is passive but I don't think mITX cases can.
Click to expand...
From the research I've done, the Silverstone FT03 and Inwin Dragon Slayer can fit that NoFan HSF with no problem. Yes those aren't mITX.
Alai said:
I may have to go mATX for the bigger cases instead
Click to expand...
Did you mean ATX? The mobo and case you've selected is already mATX. Hell the case is somewhat ATX as well.
Alai said:
I think this might be my last question regarding hardware... does anyone think it's worth it to try to grab CPUs with HD3000 or HD4000 as opposed to HD2000?
Click to expand...
IMO, no.
 
Re: Intel HD 2000 vs HD 2500 vs HD 4000. If you are using the HTPC for video playback then HD 2000 onboard the Core i3 2100 is fine, no use spending the extra money. http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/365147-33-intel-2000-discrete-video-playback

I've plugged in discrete cards, AMD HD 7700 & HD5450, just to test. No difference in video quality but it bumped up my total power usage to 67w (for either card, go figure). But it also took away a PCIe slot.

By the way the reason I picked the DH787EB was it has no legacy PCI slots which allowed me to use the CasaTunes soundcard, the Ceton InfiniTV card and the video card (which I only used for testing). Micro ATX boards don't have many card slots and I needed more PCIe slots and didn't have any PCI cards to use. This board does have a mini PCI express card slot which may fit your Intel wifi card.
 
I've not read every repky you have gotten but wanted to say that i was in a similar situation a few years ago and eventually I decided to build 2 machines. 1 a very small minimal HTPC and 2 a server.

This way you can have a small silent system which you can turn off and on as you wish, and a server you can leave on 24/7 downloading etc. you can stick the server wherever you like so noise won't be an issue - I know a few people who put them in cellars or lofts. You then just dump all your media onto the server and admin it via RDC.

As for your HTPC you then won't need high end hardware. You say your budget is $800, I just bought the following hardware for around 50% of your budget:

AMD Llano A6-3650 2.60GHz Socket FM1 4MB L2 Cache Retail Boxed Processor.
Gigabyte GA-A75M-D2H A75 Socket FM1 VGA DVI HDMI Onboard 7.1 Channel Audio mATX Motherboard.
2 x Kingston 4GB DDR3 1600MHz Hyperx Memory Module CL9 1.65

Ive been running this system a few weeks now and its pretty good, ive no issues at all.

I don't know if this is of any use to you but it's an option you may not have considered.
 
Many thanks to you guys for helping!!! I have made my purchases to build the HTPC I've always wanted. The only thing that I may or may not purchase in the future is a TV tuner card and/or audio card.

CPU: i3 2100 --- $95
HSF: Scythe SHURIKEN Rev.B SCSK-1100 --- $34
MOBO: ASRock H77 Pro4-M --- $98
RAM: Samsung MV-3V2G3D/US (2x2GB) 4GB --- $25
PSU: Seasonic X-460FL --- $100
SSDs: Samsung 830 128GB --- $75
OPTICAL: None yet
CASE: Silverstone GD06 --- $125
ADD: Intel 6300 633ANHMW Wifi --- $50
TOTAL: $602

I have been able to find many of the components on deals/sales or for sale so you may see some costs here that you may not be able to find. All high quality parts! WOOHOO!
 
Looks good, but the Intel 6300 wifi @ 50 is too expensive. I also found lower prices on some of the other parts, but they might not be good if you live in Cali or if you're picking up some kind of combo deal. If you decide to buy the Asrock board and Intel card from Ewiz, you'll have to make two separate orders to be able to use both promo codes. I'd really like to know why th e Intel 6300 is $50. $50 is way too expensive used or new.

It's only $31 shipped here with promo code CHERY3005 - http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php...1d5611b94490b93649fcba6e01375aa45ecd230e90d0c

Also the Shuriken is $30 shipped from a good reseller (Platinum Micro) via Amazon here - http://www.amazon.com/Scythe-Shuriken-Rev-B-SCSK-1100-Processor/dp/B002AIS97Q

ASRock H77 Pro4-M @ 85.99 Shipped with promocode Hauntware
http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=MB-H77PO4M


Edit: Well it looks like you are in Cali, but I'd imagine $31 + tax for the 6300 is less than $50
 
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Oh, it's because I bought the PCIe bracket to convert mPCIe to PCIe: http://www.hwtools.net/adapter/MP2H.html

As for the Shuriken, you're right. I should have bought it from Amazon. I am le sad now... But it would have only saved me a couple bucks due to taxes anyways.

ASRock board: NOOOO!!! That would have saved me a bit more. Now I am really sad!

EDIT: Double checked it... taxes cause the price difference to be almost negligible... less than $10 difference including Shuriken and the motherboard. I can live with that.
 
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Alai said:
Oh, it's because I bought the PCIe bracket to convert mPCIe to PCIe: http://www.hwtools.net/adapter/MP2H.html

As for the Shuriken, you're right. I should have bought it from Amazon. I am le sad now... But it would have only saved me a couple bucks due to taxes anyways.

ASRock board: NOOOO!!! That would have saved me a bit more. Now I am really sad!

EDIT: Double checked it... taxes cause the price difference to be almost negligible... less than $10 difference including Shuriken and the motherboard. I can live with that.
Click to expand...

LOL I was feeling bad when I started reading your post, but I'm glad the costs difference was minimal in the end :)
 
I have that exact same cooler and I set the fan to run only at 900RPM. It's honestly virtually noiseless.
 
Awesome! That's exactly why I bought this HSF... that and it's the only acceptable HSF that fits the GD06.
 
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