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EVGA's First Folding Advertisement

Yeah, most of us knew about this as it was.

Its there choice on how to do it.... They can afford to do full sponsorship for there team, thats not a bad thing.

Grats to there winners and stuff too, some nice stuff.
 
Personally I've always felt the sad part is the way the Folding group has continued to increase the amount of points awarded for the units completed, meanwhile unit count has stayed flat. In a way it's "devalued" the work done over Folding 1 and the first 6 years or so in Folding 2 in a system graded by the amount of points awarded. EVGA may have only started a few years ago, but then these massive points that's being award for unit completion now also only started a few years ago too. One look at the stats showing the number of completed units will show that.

http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/team_list.php?s=&srt=7

When viewed in that way EVGA is actually fourth.


Not trying to start a points vs units argument (we've already had those years ago too). Just pointing out the fact that point totals alone don't tell the whole Folding story.
 
Keep in mind the WU that we do today are much larger and get more work done than one a number of years ago.

I also am not pleased about corp taking advantage of what is a non profit.
 
Keep in mind the WU that we do today are much larger and get more work done than one a number of years ago.

Absolutely true. But team / player rankings have always been based on the points system and an individual (or team) can come in now with the new clients and hardware and produce more points in a much shorter period of time than individuals (or teams) who have been dedicating time and money to the project since it's beginning. The overwhelming number of points for me personally have been over the last 12 months when I upgraded hardware and clients. But the majority of work units completed is still left from the previous years.
 
Glad to see this stayed on topic. I take that as you guys don't give a shit. Moving on...
 
Honestly, I didn't really get the topic in the first place. That promo page has been there forever, and it was updated with the prizes like the day they hit #1.

Am I wrong?
 
The guy listed in third that won the X58 MoBo is a co-worker where I work. He folds part time and makes about 100 k points a month. Lucky Fecker. Good part is, he is going to build him a new system around this board and I am buying his old system. Same guy I got both my GTX295's from for $100 each.

Fish :cool:
 
That's $7,500 in cash money as an incentive for folding with EVGA.
 
Kyle, looking at it in terms of monitary value, YES, evga made it "more" enticing to fold for them in return for being the best folder you get some peice of hardware that cost us money to make and to give to you. Its corporate sponsorship.... I dont entirely agree with the motives behind it, because us here at the [H]orde have always done it for something far more priceless than money itself and that is that we do it cause we love others (or we could be like some people who do it cause they want to have more PPD than anyone else, dont act like you dont know who you are ;) ).

In retrospect, now that they are first, and that promotional sponsorship idea is done, Im willing to bet we will see there numbers dropping farther down now since they have only the "EVGA bux" system left to work with now which isnt as worthwhile in the end.
 
Not trying to start a points vs units argument (we've already had those years ago too). Just pointing out the fact that point totals alone don't tell the whole Folding story.
Exactly, you're 100% correct. Much like the arguement of which individuals actually process more science research, those with a few mega-point capable -bigadv/SMP machines or the guys with the huge GPU farms like Atlasfolder, or we can go further in that debate and bring FELCOM into consideration who has completed one-third of a MILLION WUs almost entirely on P4 machines.
 
Meh, it's not that...most of us have joined the "quit bitching and build more boxen" crowd since last week.

Nowhere to really go but up from here. We can complain, nothing will get done other than we have a momentary "feel good" moment, but the ranking won't change and we'll just look even worse to the people on their team who actually do give a shit about the cause and who actually do value folding as more than just a team competition or a "earn free crap" thing to do. They may have a corporation behind them, but a fair amount of their members do try to keep things civil and put more stock into the cause (as a whole) than the competition.

I care, I just choose not to gripe about it anymore because it won't solve anything. :eek: If their trend chart continues on it's current slope downward, we won't have to do much (other than what we're already doing) and they won't be in 1st for long. :)


Nice thoughts!
 
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Exactly, you're 100% correct. Much like the arguement of which individuals actually process more science research, those with a few mega-point capable -bigadv/SMP machines or the guys with the huge GPU farms like Atlasfolder, or we can go further in that debate and bring FELCOM into consideration who has completed one-third of a MILLION WUs almost entirely on P4 machines.

Now if only there was some sort of system that was able to gauge the relative science value of each work unit processed...
 
Personally I'd like to see PG start a new team category. EVGA is doing a good job for science, but they are screwing the team contest by injecting bucks into it. I think it is fair to say we are the number one community team in the world and they are the number one corporate team. Nothing wrong with that and PG needs to make it so.
 
Now if only there was some sort of system that was able to gauge the relative science value of each work unit processed...

Yeah it's called POINTS! There's a good one if I ever heard it.

We've already discussed EVGA's contest, and you're really beating a dead horse. You should be focusing on attracting new members to [H], not on criticizing EVGA.

Honestly, you criticize them for using F@H as a marketing tool, while at the same time, have you ever put F@H testing into any CPU or GPU reviews? A GTX 460 review went up on [H] two days ago, and there is not a single mention of Folding@Home. Steve has done a great job of promoting team 33 with his news posts, but it seems like the only thing you're doing is injecting more negativity in this area by bashing EVGA whenever you get a chance. That is not the right way to go about this. If you are really interested in helping the team, you'll start thinking of ways of attracting people by highlighting the good things about F@H. There are plenty of ways to use HardOCP's resources to grow the team that do not include resorting to hurling insults at another team.

Why? We have HardWare Canucks for that :D Couldn't resist Zero....

The problem with folding benchmarks is much can depend on the work units.
 
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Allow me to bring some humor to that list of giveaways.

Please note user "jcgamo88" from group two. If you check the EOC stats you will see that he folds for the lovely [H]orde aka team 33. You will also notice that he folded a total of 12 WU's for EVGA for a total of 5490 points. Those 12 WU's and few thousand points gave him a free GTX460 to use for the [H]orde.

I don't necessarily condone what he did but I do think that it is funny as fuck.
 
Allow me to bring some humor to that list of giveaways.

Please note user "jcgamo88" from group two. If you check the EOC stats you will see that he folds for the lovely [H]orde aka team 33. You will also notice that he folded a total of 12 WU's for EVGA for a total of 5490 points. Those 12 WU's and few thousand points gave him a free GTX460 to use for the [H]orde.

I don't necessarily condone what he did but I do think that it is funny as fuck.

ahahaha that's awesome.
 
I don't see anything wrong with EVGA putting money into it. It's their money, they've earned it, and they're donating it to a good cause. I'm folding for [H] because I read this forum every day, but I'm folding because of its purpose.
 
Meh, it's not that...most of us have joined the "quit bitching and build more boxen" crowd since last week.

I actually caught myself looking at new hardware on Newegg today to make use of my idle video cards. WTF have you guys done to me?! Not sure what it is, but I think I like it. :D
 
Allow me to bring some humor to that list of giveaways.

Please note user "jcgamo88" from group two. If you check the EOC stats you will see that he folds for the lovely [H]orde aka team 33. You will also notice that he folded a total of 12 WU's for EVGA for a total of 5490 points. Those 12 WU's and few thousand points gave him a free GTX460 to use for the [H]orde.

I don't necessarily condone what he did but I do think that it is funny as fuck.

Why not? I do. Ultimately when a folding contest like this happens, there are always going to be those who can take advantage of it.

And if that card is put towards folding, win-win!!!!!!!!!

I don't see anything wrong with EVGA putting money into it. It's their money, they've earned it, and they're donating it to a good cause. I'm folding for [H] because I read this forum every day, but I'm folding because of its purpose.


Me neither. If it attracts more folders then it's great.

Of course 33 put up a hell of a fight tooth and nail. And while I can't discredit team EVGA for passing team 33, I can always give more heaps of credit to team 33 for doing it without a single corporate buck.

Well except RATBuckz that is. :D
 
I'm sure that Kyle is swamped getting his ATI Barts GPU reviews up for the NDA expiration on it, but any of you guys have any clue what he meant when he said he was working on something? I'm kind of curious.
 
What Kyle does in the [H]ard bunker, only Kyle knows.
 
Honestly, you criticize them for using F@H as a marketing tool, while at the same time, have you ever put F@H testing into any CPU or GPU reviews?

In years past I know he and/or some of the folks that's written reviews for OCP used the Folding client in some.
 
In years past I know he and/or some of the folks that's written reviews for OCP used the Folding client in some.
I've been reading [H] reviews for almost 10 years now, and I don't remember seeing F@H consistently used in reviews. I think I recall what you're talking about, but I don't believe it lasted very long, and in any case, it hasn't been done in years.
 
I think it may work in our favor actually. I mean, now that they've spent 10's of thousands getting first, what's left but the bucks? I can't see them doing another 7500$ give out now that they've got 1st. They will always have a very unfair recruiting tool (If I see a folding "paper" ad getting boxed in hardware I'll have some feelings on that) but I can't honestly see them going beyond the bux program. Maybe that will give us a chance to build back up?
Posted via [H] Mobile Device
 
If they include a sheet about folding with their GPUs then I say all the better for promoting the project.

True, but if they do that, how much different are they than Google who bundled the client with their old toolbar?

Google got put into the "special" category for it.
 
True, but if they do that, how much different are they than Google who bundled the client with their old toolbar?

Google got put into the "special" category for it.
The situation is completely different. EVGA isn't actually allowed to distribute the client (according to the F@H rules the client can only be obtained directly from the official site), so all they would be doing is promoting the project. The most they can do is direct people to the site while asking that they fold for EVGA. What Google did was to build the F@H functionality into their toolbar, so by opting in you would automatically be folding for their team. They had a direct hand in getting people to fold under their name, whereas EVGA can't do the same thing.
 
If they include a sheet about folding with their GPUs then I say all the better for promoting the project.
Probably, if clients bothered to look at it. I don't know about you but unless I purchase a product I am unfamiliar with not having any prior experience with similar products, I generally take the item out of the box and install it. I rarely make use of included software or documentation, it all goes in the trash. I almost exclusively refer to digitized documentation when the need arises.

The situation is completely different. EVGA isn't actually allowed to distribute the client (according to the F@H rules the client can only be obtained directly from the official site), so all they would be doing is promoting the project. The most they can do is direct people to the site while asking that they fold for EVGA. What Google did was to build the F@H functionality into their toolbar, so by opting in you would automatically be folding for their team. They had a direct hand in getting people to fold under their name, whereas EVGA can't do the same thing.
True, yet EVGA is skirting other areas well in the grey zone of what's deemed permissible by a corporation. So, they are not including the F@H software with their products nor are they distributing the clients in any way directly. By offering very tempting financial incentives to fold is not exactly kosher either. There exist other possible avenues a corporation can pursue financially to further their influence in F@H that are not readily observable either. I can think of at least two to three possible ways corporate might has an enormous advantage over most other DC communities. One of them is obvious to most and it is advertising.
 
Probably, if clients bothered to look at it. I don't know about you but unless I purchase a product I am unfamiliar with not having any prior experience with similar products, I generally take the item out of the box and install it. I rarely make use of included software or documentation, it all goes in the trash. I almost exclusively refer to digitized documentation when the need arises.
The average Joe Schmo consumer is more likely to read the included documentation than an enthusiast who knows what they're doing. EVGA's consumer base is probably made up of a significant amount, if not a majority, of those kinds of people.
True, yet EVGA is skirting other areas well in the grey zone of what's deemed permissible by a corporation. So, they are not including the F@H software with their products nor are they distributing the clients in any way directly. By offering very tempting financial incentives to fold is not exactly kosher either. There exist other possible avenues a corporation can pursue financially to further their influence in F@H that are not readily observable either. I can think of at least two to three possible ways corporate might has an enormous advantage over most other DC communities. One of them is obvious to most and it is advertising.
I think if Pande Group was going to sanction the EVGA team for the corporate involvement, they would have done so already. At this point, we need to stop worrying about whether or not EVGA's actions are legitimate, because in the end, the amount of points they bring to the table are still of considerable benefit to the project. Like I've said before, if [H] wants to pass EVGA, the team needs to focus on positive ways to increase its production, and not dwell on any problems that people may have with EVGA. We can scream and shout about corporate sponsorship until we're blue in the face, but the only thing that will accomplish is making our throats sore. The situation with EVGA isn't going to change and there's nothing any of us can do about it.
 
Honestly, I don't really see why it matters....
All of the teams are striving for a common goal, so while the friendly competition is fun... Everyone is on the same "team".

In fact I'm actually quite honestly thrilled that a corporation is backing folding, it is GREAT to get the publicity and more people donating to the cause I mean they have their way of getting more people to fold for their team and they can afford it - its good for the research.

Like Zero I fold for H because I enjoy reading these forums, there is quite a lot of useful information that can be had simply using the search feature....

Now with that said, I'll keep folding as [H]ard as I can.
 
The average Joe Schmo consumer is more likely to read the included documentation than an enthusiast who knows what they're doing. EVGA's consumer base is probably made up of a significant amount, if not a majority, of those kinds of people.
I knew you were going to reply with this or something similar and I can tell you that most people I have come across both on and off the Internet do not. Whether they constitute the average "Joe Schmo" I think our opinions will decide, but it's not what's being discussed here...

I think if Pande Group was going to sanction the EVGA team for the corporate involvement, they would have done so already.
You betcha, and I do not expect any censure from PG.

At this point, we need to stop worrying about whether or not EVGA's actions are legitimate, because in the end, the amount of points they bring to the table are still of considerable benefit to the project.
I beg to differ. As long as this issue keeps on resurfacing, that in itself indicates that there exists an issue, and it needs to have resolution. Nothing that continuously rears its head as often as this very controversy should be silenced. It will set precedents and already has. A competition cannot continue if it is a competition in name only.

In regards to whether EVGA is responsible for greatly contributing to the surge in interest for the project, I think there is no controversy there. It's clear from my standpoint that no one is criticizing EVGA for increasing participation in the project. Good that they have done so. Another thing that I want to state is we need to separate different issues. The competition and the research to my mind although linked, are often inextricably tied together when debating this subject. I think they should be dealt with individually. That way it won't appear as if people are regretful for EVGA's contribution when that is not what is meant to be said at all. No one wants EVGA out of F@H.

Concerning the increase to the research, that can be a good and a bad thing. PG has always stated they desire speed over volume. If they can get their hands on a probabilistic computing device they'd gladly shrug all of us off with our millions of PPD of computing power. Having too much volume at certain junctures of the project (state of PG DC) at certain levels of sustainable infrastructure (framework) can be detrimental, as witnessed by the ongoing -bigadv shortage with apparent slowing of new iterations. Stanford cannot as yet select which SMP WUs are being issued to which hardware beyond the simple measure of thread count. Therefore, whatever problems may surface because of the nonspecificity issue multiplies with volume. The vast majority of hardware introduced into the project since the big team rivalry commenced in earnest is not very high end. Rarely is something positive attained without some drawback.

Like I've said before, if [H] wants to pass EVGA, the team needs to focus on positive ways to increase its production, and not dwell on any problems that people may have with EVGA. We can scream and shout about corporate sponsorship until we're blue in the face, but the only thing that will accomplish is making our throats sore. The situation with EVGA isn't going to change and there's nothing any of us can do about it.
Here I agree with you. That said, this is a forum where a large DC community communicates. There are so many people it cannot be steered in one direction or maintain topical policy for long. If people feel the need to voice their opinion, certainly nothing you and I are going to say will change things much. Bickering about the bickering is just, well, more bickering.
 
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In the end, it doesnt matter what EVGA does, because when there promotions start to slow down, than you will see what people who folded for them will really do. In reality, when its all said and done, I think we will see a drop in participation from EVGA because people are, "greedy". Doesnt mean there are not people who will continue to fold at EVGA, some do it for the cause as well, but it doesnt excuse the fact that there major ramp up happened "during" the promotion to take position #1 and another promotion to maintain #1 position for at least a week or more after.
 
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