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EVGA down to 1.2 years

Vaulter98c

Vaulter98c

[H]ard|DCer of the Month - October 2009
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May 21, 2008
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5,840
Wernt they just at 1.4 like not long ago? Whats yalls thoughts on this? Will they be able to maintain a 2+ milPPD lead on us for that long? What do we have that we can pull out of our hats? Anything else for conversation sake? Im bored as hell and I'm stuck here another 2 hours.

I know I'm trying to do my part, Ive got my main rig online (22k PPD) and within 2 weeks I hope to get my 88 rig online (16k PPD) and maybe 2 weeks after that my GX2 rig (12k PPD)
 
I think we need to get a rally going.

They have been gaining on us for too long. Where is our [H] spirit? With winter coming I hope many of us can ramp up.

 
It's hard to bet against them staying over 5 million PPD as long as they've been there now. But on the other hand, long time established teams like OCAU, MaxPC and OCN have had similar overtakes on us before and couldn't maintain it. Either way, 1.2 years is a long time and anything can happen.
 
I added a 5th GTX285. My [H] spirit is still crunching wu's.
 
Thats what I'm talking about! If I can get some spare time I'll try to get my 88 rig up on Sunday, atleast to test fire it before I put it in the rack
 
alan2308 said:
.....But on the other hand, long time established teams like OCAU, MaxPC and OCN have had similar overtakes on us before and couldn't maintain it. Either way, 1.2 years is a long time and anything can happen.
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I'm not buying it...I think the EVGA overtake threat is very real, and unless we pull some things together soon and get some new and [H]ard dedicated members, then we're gonna be sniffing the exhaust fumes of another team. :(
 
Axdrenalin said:
I'm not buying it...I think the EVGA overtake threat is very real, and unless we pull some things together soon and get some new and [H]ard dedicated members, then we're gonna be sniffing the exhaust fumes of another team. :(
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I'm in no way suggesting eVGA is to be taken lightly. We've had the ducky way too long to be giving it up now.
 
but then were back where we were last month, how do we get our old guys back without being a pain in the ass? Granted, it would be nice to get just 100 or even 50 of our dromant guys up with a new CPU client but how? It seems like the folding team doesnt get any [H] love these days...
 
I'm not buying it...I think the EVGA overtake threat is very real, and unless we pull some things together soon and get some new and [H]ard dedicated members, then we're gonna be sniffing the exhaust fumes of another team.
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Same here. It doesn't help that eVGA produce only NVidia cards which give grossly high PPD values...

I'm in no way suggesting eVGA is to be taken lightly. We've had the ducky way too long to be giving it up now.
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Well, we need to do something about it...if only someone could sponsor a pair of spiffing new 295s and a new PSU for me...
 
Email Steve to threaten [H]ard members with that shot of him in a bra unless they help F@H. :D
 
I always keep an emergency capability of 5-10% of my total possible production unused in case of a call to arms. If a competing team surges to less than a year overtake time and they sustain that level for more than a month, I might deploy those reserves. It would take a lot of convincing though. I've seen teams manage to hit the ~1 year overtake mark once or twice before in the last couple of years, yet it eluded them. Granted, EVGA has been maintaining a good PPD lead over us through much of this year, and they have the best chance to overtake us of any team I have seen since 2004. We'll know by Q1 next year for a better forecast on this possibility.
 
I have never had more then three slots folding at one time, because thatss all I had.
After this weeks purchases from members of [H]Forums, my slot count is now up to 12!
As money keeps flowing in I will continue to upgrade and fill these slots.
By the end of the month I hope to have all my boxen full and help the [H]orde maintain its lead!!

 
i dont have the resources to significantly up my PPD, i am trying to move to GPU on all my boxes. added one (only a 8600gts but better than CPU client), and gave my best show at the barebones contest.so i am hopefull for another 8800 crunching for me/us soon.

i see the volume of inactive/dormant members and wonder how to get that ratio adjusted.
 
xxGriff said:
i see the volume of inactive/dormant members and wonder how to get that ratio adjusted.
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The number of inactive folders is a bit misleading. This team has been folding since the very beginning of the decade. There have been so many people who joined the team and stopped since that time, the number of inactive folders is bound to increase. I'm absolutely certain all long-running teams show the same phenomenon to lesser or greater degrees depending on their overall contribution. When we look at the list of inactive folders, some of these people may have folded for only a few days or weeks back say in the middle of the decade, as an example. Some perhaps earlier. As time goes by the number of inactives will likely increase simply for the fact the team has folded for a greater number of years.
 
I was down for a few weeks but I'm back now, hopefully I'll stay steady with my production from here on out. Dual 260s, 8800gs and 9600gso all folding for the [H]orde! I think a far more user friendly (and efficient!) windows SMP client would be just what we need to pull us away from the evga monster.

 
Well check out our active members as compared to theirs:

[H] = 964 / 14,719
vs.
eVGA = 1,043 / 5,244

Not a whole lot more, but considering I'm sure they're mostly running GPU clients, that's a potentially significant amount more PPD per member there. Plus, it's sad that only 6.5% of our members are active. Point taken and agreed from APOLLO, but maybe if we put a reminder every month or so on the front pages to keep people Folding and make them aware of our threat from eVGA, it will entice them to help out the [H]orde (again for inactive members and for new members)! I haven't seen Steve post on the front page about it in a couple months, it seems. A few people buying multi-GPU rigs isn't going to be enough, we need power in numbers (of active members).
 
T4rd said:
Not a whole lot more, but considering I'm sure they're mostly running GPU clients, that's a potentially significant amount more PPD per member there.
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They also had megafolders earlier in the year who folded only on server hardware with SMP clients. These individuals were the biggest contributers in the life of that team. Now, I believe what we are seeing is close to 90% of their output from GPU hardware.

Plus, it's sad that only 6.5% of our members are active. Point taken and agreed from APOLLO, but maybe if we put a reminder every month or so on the front pages to keep people Folding and make them aware of our threat from eVGA, it will entice them to help out the [H]orde (again for inactive members and for new members)! I haven't seen Steve post on the front page about it in a couple months, it seems. A few people buying multi-GPU rigs isn't going to be enough, we need power in numbers (of active members).
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I have also mentioned in another EVGA thread during the summer that a monthly reminder on the front page would be a good idea. Others recently mentioned that a sticky in the video forum would also be a great idea. These are two things we can implement right away.
 
I wish we could see a break down of all the clients that are feeding into a given team, I'd bet were about 1/3 CPU driven, if not more, while they are most likely damn near all GPU driven

If only these new clients would even out the points some...
 
All of our suggestions have fallen on deaf ears. If you want to get the team going, it needs official support, which means more involvement from Kyle and some mentions on the front page. I couldn't even get Steve to put up a news item about Kendrak's F@H contest. The only suggestion I can make is to send messages to Kyle and Steve and let them know that you want to see some changes. I don't think we'll see anything happen unless a lot of people start speaking up.
 
Zero82z said:
All of our suggestions have fallen on deaf ears. If you want to get the team going, it needs official support, which means more involvement from Kyle and some mentions on the front page. I couldn't even get Steve to put up a news item about Kendrak's F@H contest. The only suggestion I can make is to send messages to Kyle and Steve and let them know that you want to see some changes. I don't think we'll see anything happen unless a lot of people start speaking up.
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Yeah, I noticed and agree with this too. Did Steve even reply to your PM about posting the contest or did he just ignore/not respond to you? If they're just ignoring you, then I'm definitely going to PM (hopefully along with everyone else) them too to see what's going on and try to get some response from them. I believe without their support, our team is definitely going to fall from the #1 spot. It doesn't take much effort to make a post on the front page, I don't see what the problem would be :confused:.
 
I was down for a few weeks but I'm back now, hopefully I'll stay steady with my production from here on out. Dual 260s, 8800gs and 9600gso all folding for the [H]orde! I think a far more user friendly (and efficient!) windows SMP client would be just what we need to pull us away from the evga monster.
Click to expand...
Totally agree. Seeing as it's eVGA, most of their points would come from GPU clients. Therefore, a vastly improved Windows SMP client would help a lot.
 
Zero82z said:
All of our suggestions have fallen on deaf ears. If you want to get the team going, it needs official support, which means more involvement from Kyle and some mentions on the front page. I couldn't even get Steve to put up a news item about Kendrak's F@H contest. The only suggestion I can make is to send messages to Kyle and Steve and let them know that you want to see some changes. I don't think we'll see anything happen unless a lot of people start speaking up.
Click to expand...

I can't argue that more support from the top would be a great help, but we're going to have to just do the best with what we're given, like we've always done. An occasional mention on the front page and a few perks on the forum was good enough for us to take #1 for the 7th time and stay here for nearly 4 years now. If we stand idly by and let eVGA snatch the ducky from us, we have nobody to blame but ourselves.
 
T4rd said:
Did Steve even reply to your PM about posting the contest or did he just ignore/not respond to you?
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I sent one e-mail to the [H]ard|OCP news e-mail address, and then a few weeks later I sent one directly to Steve's address. I didn't receive a reply to either one. Disappointing to say the least.
alan2308 said:
I can't argue that more support from the top would be a great help, but we're going to have to just do the best with what we're given, like we've always done. An occasional mention on the front page and a few perks on the forum was good enough for us to take #1 for the 7th time and stay here for nearly 4 years now. If we stand idly by and let eVGA snatch the ducky from us, we have nobody to blame but ourselves.
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It's hardly a [H]ard|OCP team if it gets ignored by Kyle, is it? I haven't seen a F@H-related newspost on the front page in months. And like I said, I didn't get a response to either of the two e-mails I sent. It's one thing to only give a mention here and there, but it's quite another to completely ignore what's going on. And I realize that Kyle has many other responsibilities with the site, but it really wouldn't take a lot of effort to implement at least a few of the suggestions that have been made.

And when you take a look at the support that this team gets from [H] and compare it to other large teams out there, you can see a huge discrepancy regarding how much attention is given to the team. Bit-tech is my favourite example of this, since they have been including F@H benchmarks in all of their GPU reviews lately (flawed benchmarks IMO, but better than nothing), and they've also put out several articles about F@H, including one that discussed the project and explained what it does and what its goals are, and an article that served as a guide to putting together a folding rig. So I think you'll excuse me if I'm a little disappointed because I see the potential for things that can be done but nothing is actually happening.

Yes, a lot of stuff does fall on the shoulders of the team members themselves. But that doesn't mean that the team shouldn't get some official support either. And I dare say that it would certainly be very beneficial to both the team and the project as a whole (because let's face it, the more team members we get, the more science gets done, and the closer we get to the cure, which is the whole point of this).
 
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Now that's an awesome idea. I never even thought of that. I might have to check out there reviews of video card now. I do agree that using it as a benchmark is flawed, but the information should at least be posted in the DC forums for us. Whats an overnight folding session going to hurt to keep the natives happy!

Zero82z said:
Bit-tech is my favourite example of this, since they have been including F@H benchmarks in all of their GPU reviews lately (flawed benchmarks IMO, but better than nothing)
Click to expand...

 
gkanakis said:
I do agree that using it as a benchmark is flawed
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No, I mean the way they perform their testing for that specific aspect is flawed. The point isn't to benchmark the card for gaming but rather for folding, which as a concept isn't flawed at all.
 
Zero82z said:
...The point isn't to benchmark the card for gaming but rather for folding, which as a concept isn't flawed at all.
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/nod i agree with the premise as well. and including the results/pro's/Con's and related info as it pertains to folding is not a bad idea, given [H] has a FOLDING TEAM :p

data gathered and included in a GPU/video card review is only relevant to F@H and those that participate, but folding does become a honorable mention and hopefully brought a little more upfront in the minds of [H] readership.
 
Mr. Pedantic said:
Totally agree. Seeing as it's eVGA, most of their points would come from GPU clients. Therefore, a vastly improved Windows SMP client would help a lot.
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Not sure I'd say "a lot". Over at EVGA, we've put together some pretty good instructions for running the SMP client in a VM and are helping members set it up every day.

Also, most users are Folding on their everyday systems, running a VM or two on their CPU and Folding with whatever video card(s) they have...just like your average [H] user. We've also got a lot of users running on i7 systems, so there's definitely significant points coming from CPU clients.

But sure, then you've got users like me who are getting about 80%+ of their points from the GPU client. But with a new and improved GPU client coming out and with the pending release of GT300, I don't think you're going to see a significant relative points shift any time soon.

If you guys are counting on an improved Windows SMP client to make a significant impact on an almost 2.5 million PPD (and growing) gap, you've already lost.

 
I agree with Parja in one respect. If there is anything done to improve the clients all teams will jump on it, so there will be no team specific advantage there.
I do not agree that it is lost for you yet. You guys have proven through the years that you take this seiously. Right now it is purely a numbers situation. EVGA has more folders than [H]. If you guys can increase your numbers, or get significant increase in production from your current members by way of farm production, you can make up the difference. But it will take some time to do that. We are closing in on double your PPD. That will be tough to make up unless you do get more folders.Getting back inactive folders will be tough. Many have probably moved on, many have lost interest, and many just get burned out. Once you stop folding it is very hard to get the fire back to do it again as intensely as you did before.
Over at EVGA we also have a few guys doing the -bigadv workunits. I have not scanned your forum to see if you have any guys doing that also. But if you don't have that, perhaps you can try to find some folks who have the gear to be able to do it.
Cheers, and happy folding. In the end it is not who is first, it is doing the work. If this competition gets more work done, that is what we all want. I have nothing but respect and admiration for the [H] team. Keep up the good work guys.
 
Parja said:
If you guys are counting on an improved Windows SMP client to make a significant impact on an almost 2.5 million PPD (and growing) gap, you've already lost.
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Yeah, I wouldn't see this as a tide-turner either. Mostly because everyone else would just use the new SMP client also and cancel it out the advantage. The only way I see us as gaining another 2.5 mil PPD is through us gaining more active members and/or more active members using GPU/VM clients. I sent an e-mail to Brent and Kyle at like 2 AM this morning to see if we can get some more official support in this (by posting on the main page about the team some more) so we can get our numbers up. Hopefully me , Zero82z, and anyone else who might have contacted them about it, will be able to bring their attention to this and they'll help out the team.
 
heh, i dont think anyone here was looking for a new super charged SMP to allow crazy PPD and an easy win.

i think the remarks about new SMP client were more to do with getting more from the boxen we have. i personally wish ATI cards were more inline with nVidia GPU for folding.

while a new SMP client would allow everyone running SMP to put up more PPD, the ratio of SMP to GPU over at eVGA means a new client would not be a huge boon for them. but would help us.

its getting more active members....folding just aint gettin' the sexay front page kindness from El Jefe once a month or so it should. i still think the inclusion in V-card reviews is a good idea. pimp the cause and stump for 33 in a paragraph within a review is a small thing to ask or do...after all it is the [H]orde ;)
 
xxGriff said:
its getting more active members....folding just aint gettin' the sexay front page kindness from El Jefe once a month or so it should. i still think the inclusion in V-card reviews is a good idea. pimp the cause and stump for 33 in a paragraph within a review is a small thing to ask or do...after all it is the [H]orde ;)
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Well said!! My plan is to build hundreds of supercomputer and take over the worl....I mean fold like a beast and make sure [H] stay in first! :)

Now theres some wood and coal for the fire! :p:p:p:p:p

Just remember in the end the worlds population is the winner!
 
rcranfield said:
Over at EVGA we also have a few guys doing the -bigadv workunits. I have not scanned your forum to see if you have any guys doing that also. But if you don't have that, perhaps you can try to find some folks who have the gear to be able to do it.
Click to expand...

Where do I get some more info on this "-bigadv" flag? I have three boxen that run dual 5530 Xeons and each have 12 gigs and run CentOS 5.3, but I didn't see that option in the flag lists for the current SMP's I'm running.

rcranfield said:
Cheers, and happy folding. In the end it is not who is first, it is doing the work. If this competition gets more work done, that is what we all want. I have nothing but respect and admiration for the [H] team. Keep up the good work guys.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the nod here as well. It's nice to know that you guys will still respect us as you make us your own personal roadkill...:D
 
Where do I get some more info on this "-bigadv" flag? I have three boxen that run dual 5530 Xeons and each have 12 gigs and run CentOS 5.3, but I didn't see that option in the flag lists for the current SMP's I'm running.
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Linux A2 work units. You have to have the -bigadv flag set (even though I tried it and the client doesn't recognize the bigadv flag...), and your client must also have a passkey. They're specifically for 8-core systems; preferably 8 physical cores, but OC'ed i7s will do as well. They give about 25k points per WU; divvying that up it's still around 8-9000ppd, which is roughly what the Linux SMP client gets with normal work units. However, the special thing about these WUs is their bonuses, which can, if you're quick enough, double (or more) your ppd. To get these bonuses you must have completed at least 10 A2 work units, and you must complete at least 80% of the work units you receive on time.

http://foldingforum.org/viewtopic.php?t=10697
 
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