EU Is Making Progress on the Right to Repair Front

[AlphaAtlas]

Motherboard claims that right-to-repair activists are finally starting to gain traction in Europe. On Monday of this week, protesters gathered outside the Albert Borschette Conference Centre with a broken fridge and other busted appliances in support of a law related to the repairability of refrigerators, which the European Commission later passed. According to the report, repair enthusiasts like this are particularly desperate in Western Europe now, as the region doesn't have a particularly strong repair culture like the U.S. or Eastern Europe, but that's starting to change. In spite of corporate pushback and some questionable wording, supporters are viewing the law as an "opportunity to open the floodgates towards developing regulations which set the minimum requirement for repair."

The vote on changes to the Eco Design laws were the perfect opportunity for the EEB and other groups to make real political changes. "For the first time, within these proposals, they’re including some recommendations about repair...and how to expand the life of these products," Schweitzer said... Despite the pushback, Monday's vote was still a win. Going forward, refrigerator manufacturers selling the appliances in Europe will have to make them easier to disassemble. Before, the products were often welded shut or glued together, making it hard to replace parts without destroying the appliance. It’s an important first step towards enshrining the right-to-repair in European law, and the first such legislation that will affect the entire EU.

 

[nutzo]

It's not just the right to repair (mainly requiring that parts be available), but also the costs.

With many appliances, new parts are no longer available after 7 years.
If you have a common problem, you might not even be able to find parts after 5 years.

My dishwasher started leaking, so I did some research and pulled it apart and found out there was a small rubber gasket that needed replacing.
This appeared to be a very common problem.
None of the major parts places on line had the gasket in stock, and some referred to a replacement part, that was the entire assembly (for $100).
Found a few people on ebay selling the gasket for $30+
Finally found a link to a 3rd party company that makes generic gaskets. They sold the exact same size for $4. Problem fixed.

 

[Rizen]

The EU is way ahead of the US in terms of privacy and consumer protection regulations. We need more of that here.

 

[[Spectre]]

No politics outside the soapbox

 

[steakman1971]

It's not just the right to repair (mainly requiring that parts be available), but also the costs.

With many appliances, new parts are no longer available after 7 years.
If you have a common problem, you might not even be able to find parts after 5 years.

My dishwasher started leaking, so I did some research and pulled it apart and found out there was a small rubber gasket that needed replacing.
This appeared to be a very common problem.
None of the major parts places on line had the gasket in stock, and some referred to a replacement part, that was the entire assembly (for $100).
Found a few people on ebay selling the gasket for $30+
Finally found a link to a 3rd party company that makes generic gaskets. They sold the exact same size for $4. Problem fixed.

I ran into a similar problem with a stove a few years ago. GE (who doesn't bring great things to life) stopped manufacturing that model. They had parts - want to say it was going to be $100. I found a local appliance store that had the piece for $10. They also told me this part failed all the time.
We are expected to get 5-7 years out of an appliance, wait for it to fail out of warranty, then buy a new one.

 

[Oldmodder]

Planned obsolescence having a hard time, remember the Samsung TV capacitor debacle, and thats sadly not even the reason they are in the hole now.

 

[nutzo]

I ran into a similar problem with a stove a few years ago. GE (who doesn't bring great things to life) stopped manufacturing that model. They had parts - want to say it was going to be $100. I found a local appliance store that had the piece for $10. They also told me this part failed all the time.
We are expected to get 5-7 years out of an appliance, wait for it to fail out of warranty, then buy a new one.

Your 5-7 years number is correct for current appliances.
I had a long talk with a factory tech who came out to replace the compressor that died in my 2 year old fridge and that's what he told me.
Due to the ever changing energy efficiency requirements, they have to redesign the appliances every few years.
They make enough parts to cover the selling life (maybe 2-3 years) and the warranty period. If there is a part that has a higher than expected failure rate, then the part will end up out of stock.

The short 5-7 year replacement period makes these new appliances LESS efficient in the long run.
I had my washing machine for 32 years before I had to replace it. It developed a leak, and the parts where too rusted together to take it apart to replace the gasket.
Dryer lasted 35 years. I could have fixed it, but the finish on the inside of the dryer was wearing off after 35 years and I didn't want to start getting rust on the cloths.

My last fridge lasted 16 years, but I had to repair it twice. (luckily it was inexpensive parts I could replace myself)
With the newer fridges it's the main circuit board or compressor that end up going out, and those are very expensive parts.

 

[seanreisk]

Planned obsolescence having a hard time, remember the Samsung TV capacitor debacle, and thats sadly not even the reason they are in the hole now.

Back when LCDs were expensive, shotgunning caps on an LCD board was almost a business. One of the guys I worked with did it as a hobby, and even I did it successfully a few times. Replace the caps, make sure the logic board has proper cooling, fix broken inputs and replace wall warts, that was most of hobby LCD repair.

With the newer fridges it's the main circuit board or compressor that end up going out, and those are very expensive parts.

Even this isn't true. Maybe a fancy fridge that has a video screen on the door, a camera system and an internet connection would be complicated to repair, but the logic boards that handle the actual function of the refrigerator are a different matter. if it is engineered correctly, logic control boards are easily replaced. There is nothing about a control system that is complex - the engineer specifies the digital and analog inputs, the data, how the data should be analyzed, and the response to that data. The Ford Escort was one of the first globally assembled economy cars to receive an ECU, and the companies that manufactured replacement ECUs have changed a dozen times. More importantly, the actual logic circuit that handled the data has changed dozens of times, the only thing that didn't change is the module housing (which is why they're all refurbs).

Appliance manufacturers do the same thing with logic boards that they do with the other parts - they design for economical assembly, not ease of replacement. They solder logic boards in place, copyright the board operations, and then stop providing parts. I promise you, there isn't a logic board on any dishwasher, washer, dryer, stove or refrigerator that would cost more than $50 to manufacture if companies would allow third parties to manufacture parts. Appliance companies like to hide behind 'liability', but I would be happy to accept a law that said that an out-of-warranty appliance repaired with non-standard parts is no longer the liability of the manufacturer.

 

[R_Type]

This has made me realise I'd love a refrigerator with a big sad face on the front.

 

[seanreisk]

This has made me realise I'd love a refrigerator with a big sad face on the front.

Here's a picture of GERTY for you.

 

[Deleted member 222586]

Even this isn't true. Maybe a fancy fridge that has a video screen on the door, a camera system and an internet connection would be complicated to repair, but the logic boards that handle the actual function of the refrigerator are a different matter. if it is engineered correctly, logic control boards are easily replaced. There is nothing about a control system that is complex - the engineer specifies the digital and analog inputs, the data, how the data should be analyzed, and the response to that data. The Ford Escort was one of the first globally assembled economy cars to receive an ECU, and the companies that manufactured replacement ECUs have changed a dozen times. More importantly, the actual logic circuit that handled the data has changed dozens of times, the only thing that didn't change is the module housing (which is why they're all refurbs).

Appliance manufacturers do the same thing with logic boards that they do with the other parts - they design for economical assembly, not ease of replacement. They solder logic boards in place, copyright the board operations, and then stop providing parts. I promise you, there isn't a logic board on any dishwasher, washer, dryer, stove or refrigerator that would cost more than $50 to manufacture if companies would allow third parties to manufacture parts. Appliance companies like to hide behind 'liability', but I would be happy to accept a law that said that an out-of-warranty appliance repaired with non-standard parts is no longer the liability of the manufacturer.

Can relate: logic boards aren't really that pricey.

Our fucking refrigerator started freezing stuff in the wrong places (IE the refrigerator stuff was getting frozen, and the freezer stuff wasn't). Long story short, the technician came, "it is the board". He brought a new one, plugged it in. We paid around 140€ (including diagnosis and service). Guess what? It wasn't the fucking board: one of the sensors that controls where the refrigerant liquid is going is busted and "can't fix that because the fridge is mounted as a single unit and we would have to destroy it". OHHH FUCK THAT! The gentleman then offered us 250€ off on a new unit from the same brand. You fucking kidding me? Our fridge was 27 months old... you have to be insane if you think we will EVER buy the same brand again, knowing that they don't want to / they can't fix their fucking stuff.

All in all, this is great news. Shit needs to be repairable.

PS: we obviously got our money back for the board and service we didn't need. But to think that a 1000€ fridge simply "can't get fixed" after 27 months of usage is beyond imagining. That they think that a simple discount will make you buy from them again... AHAHAHAHAH. Next unit we bought from IKEA. Same OEM as the one we had (Electrolux) but with 5 year warranty.

 

[MMitch]

Planned obsolescence having a hard time, remember the Samsung TV capacitor debacle, and thats sadly not even the reason they are in the hole now.

Oh the memories and in Canada they wouldn't even honor the recall that was going on down in the US, what a scam. I ended up fixing it myself. Still have that TV working today, had to replace a few more caps another year later. (Yes it failed originally month 13, right after warranty)

 

[nutzo]

to think that a 1000€ fridge simply "can't get fixed" after 27 months of usage is beyond imagining. That they think that a simple discount will make you buy from them again... AHAHAHAHAH. Next unit we bought from IKEA. Same OEM as the one we had (Electrolux) but with 5 year warranty.

It can be repaired, the problem is that it would likely cost as much or even more than a new fridge.

I had a GE dishwasher, started having problems and found out it was recalled as the problem caused it to be a fire hazard.
Since it was a few years old, they offered $300 on a new one (had to be a GE). I found a good sale and used the $300.
A few years later, started having problems with the new one. It was also being recalled, except this time they where only offering $150 toward a new one.
I have not bought another GE appliance since, and never will.

My fridge was an LG. Bought it because they had the highest ratings at the time.
22 months later it died. They have a 1 year labor warrant, and 7 years on parts.
When I called LG and explained the problem, they sent out a tech and waved the labor fee (would have cost me around $400)
Found out from the tech that they have been having a high failure rate on the compressors, and they wanted to send the defective one back to be checked.
I will still consider buying LG products in the future.