EA’s Origin EULA Proves Even More Sinister

+ for the people backing up Steam by saying it isn't a Trojan like EA Crapforce Origin.

Steam scans worthless crap for the benefit of users and developers. EA scans your shit for mischievous reasons.
 
BurntToast said:
+ for the people backing up Steam by saying it isn't a Trojan like EA Crapforce Origin.

Steam scans worthless crap for the benefit of users and developers. EA scans your shit for mischievous reasons.
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You can OPT out of steams collection. You can NOT at this point OPT out of Origin at this point.

Thats the damn difference.
 
Any lawyers that can explain how the EA Privacy Policy might supersede the origin tos/eula?
|'ve been reading the discussion on RPS/Escapist. But it's hard to follow with all the sensationalism
 
I think I'm just going to play it safe and buy a second SSD card and have a Windows 7 installation just for gaming....I'll unplug my main SSD every time I want to game.

I stepped away from PC gaming for 6 years and this is what I've come back to...:(
 
Essentially this is still an OPT out. Don't like the EULA then don't install Origin, sounds pretty simple to me :).
 
BurntToast said:
+ for the people backing up Steam by saying it isn't a Trojan like EA Crapforce Origin.

Steam scans worthless crap for the benefit of users and developers. EA scans your shit for mischievous reasons.
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No, you're right, Steam is adware, I can't fire it up without getting popups for shitty indie games I'll never buy or are interested in.

The only difference between the two is one gives you an opt in box and the other doesn't. They do the same things, it's just worded in different legalese (people might know this if they actually read them and not just blindly click yes).

I mean it's EA it must be fucking evil. Couldn't possibly mean that they're scanning to provide game updates, look for hard/software conflicts, see average user hardware so as to make games to run on a wide range of machines etc. No, no, no it's evil, it's all up inside your pc raping your files and giving them the aids.
 
Steam asks you if you want to send the information and what is being sent, EA sticks it right in the ToS because nobody will read it.

Oh well. Human Revolution, Skyrim, RehashedShitofDuty 3, beta testing a 2012 MMORPG that isn't GW2, whatever will I do this fall and winter.
 
And if Steam is giving you popups, wait until the salvia gets out of your system okay?
 
This is soo funny. Honestly who gives a shit. Shut up complaining about everything, install origin and play BF3 when it comes out, you are going to anyway.......

Thanks
 
MrLonghair said:
And if Steam is giving you popups, wait until the salvia gets out of your system okay?
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You're right, I'm totally on drugs, Steam never pops up adds on top of the client. (I was being facetious, since I have the notify me tab checked.)

Since it's relevant from the other thread on this:

limitedaccess said:
I'd like to point something out since people mention you can "opt out" of Valve Hardware surveys. This does not mean the hardware surveys (or software surveys) is actually the limit of what data Valve collects. The agreements you agree to actually give them greater scope in collecting information than this, and it is quite obvious if you look at many Steam functions they collect more data than simply the hardware and software surveys. As far as I know there is no generic opt out of everything clause. You can also note that Valve is not a publicly traded company, so there is actually less disclosure and related regulations concerning their operations.

The truth is no one knows for certain what Origin/Steam or likely any program/service collects specifically. I wouldn't be surprised if the EULA in the Microsoft programs you use have similar language. You might as well not buy from Steam or Origin or anywhere online either since you CC company likely tracks your purchases as well. Run your own e-mail server as well. This is the age we live in of data mining. You can either accept it, start a grass roots movement for change and regulation, or live off the grid. If you just want to protest one company for doing it, that would be frankly either pointless, ignorant or stem from personal hate.
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Not that im sticking up for EA, but Blizzards Warden Software does the same thing soit's not like this is somthing new or unheard of;uncool and creepy and bs to be sure but it's not new.
 
LeninGHOLA said:
E oola or Yula? I'm going with Yoola for now.
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I like to use Yoola and unfortunately I don't really care what she has to say. I just smile and nod, acting interested or outraged when I think I'm supposed to. All the while thinking, just shut up already and give me what I want, what I paid for, then gtfo. Wait, what?...
 
Shotglass01 said:
No. An EULA can't circumvent a law. And, you are right in what they can collect on my game drive. They'll know what games I play. They won't know what else I use as those are on completely different drives that are physically turned off when game drive is running. All I can do is try to limit my exposure. And, on the game drive, there is no personally stored information. Steam could link my Steam ID to my real name as I have bought from Steam. But Origin won't be able to do that. Again, it's limiting as much as I can while still playing the games I want to play.
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Sorry but you could ship your "app" harddrive to outerspace and they will know at minimum that you had installed (and have not uninstalled it).

These apps makes wmi calls to Add/remove programs to inventory software on your computer, which essentially is just registry entries with information on what is installed, what version, how frequently it is used (in general terms) and how to uninstall.

The fact that you shutoff your drive doesn't mean that registry data disappears.

Now they generally cannot track apps that don't show up in add/remove. For that they would have to do a full drive scan. I would be sort of surprised if Origin did a full exe/dll inventory.
 
Good thing I have no plans on buying BF3, I don't have to deal with this spyware/malware.
 
sp_1501_clip08.jpg


Why won't it read?!

As much as I hate reading EULAs, it's a requirement.
 
03grandam said:
Essentially this is still an OPT out. Don't like the EULA then don't install Origin, sounds pretty simple to me :).
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There's a huge difference between being able to op-out and still use a service uninterrupted, and not being able to use a service at all.
 
dandirk said:
Sorry but you could ship your "app" harddrive to outerspace and they will know at minimum that you had installed (and have not uninstalled it).

These apps makes wmi calls to Add/remove programs to inventory software on your computer, which essentially is just registry entries with information on what is installed, what version, how frequently it is used (in general terms) and how to uninstall.

The fact that you shutoff your drive doesn't mean that registry data disappears.

Now they generally cannot track apps that don't show up in add/remove. For that they would have to do a full drive scan. I would be sort of surprised if Origin did a full exe/dll inventory.
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You really are not getting this. I'm aware they'll pick up what is on my game drive. The production drive which hosts resume, e-mail, online bills, etc. is on another whole drive SHUT OFF with it's own OS without Origin or Steam or anything else installed like that. I promise you no WMI calls are going to pick it up.
 
Shotglass01 said:
You really are not getting this. I'm aware they'll pick up what is on my game drive. The production drive which hosts resume, e-mail, online bills, etc. is on another whole drive SHUT OFF with it's own OS without Origin or Steam or anything else installed like that. I promise you no WMI calls are going to pick it up.
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if you have to go to those kind of lengths to keep your machine ready for gaming, then something is seriously wrong.

And that wrong is identified as Origin, and the people who stand in line for it and buy it on release day are nothing more than sheeple.
 
god bless all those hardworking people who surgically remove all this crap and allow me to download all this software for free :) thankyou :)

Even the games i've bought have been hax0rd.. because i aint fucking putting up with all this DRM crap on my computer... wanting discs, serial number, windows live, their own appliation, internet connection, pound of flesh, 2L of blood etc etc..
 
jrrandell said:
This is soo funny. Honestly who gives a shit. Shut up complaining about everything, install origin and play BF3 when it comes out, you are going to anyway.......

Thanks
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Yeah no, after all the bullshit about platforms, software requirements, origin terms of service, lockouts, etc. that have come about since we started seeing bf3 previews, I'm afraid I will be steering clear of this amazing looking game. From day 1 to day none for me.
 
I think it's more of a case of a badly worded EULA than EA planning something sinister. All EA has to do to fix this is tweak the wording of the EULA to indicate that it will only collect hardware data, and software data about which OS is in use, what drivers are in use, and information about software specifically connected to EA's Origin service, and do so with the user's consent. It won't stop everyone from worrying about privacy, it certainly won't do anything for the utterly paranoid, but it will give most of those concerned clarification.
 
ljbade said:
For all of those saying Steam already does this read the Steam EULA:
http://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/ or privacy policy
http://www.valvesoftware.com/privacy.html

No where in there can I see a clause that allows Steam to collect information about my PC without asking (unlike the Origin EULA). Hence that is why Steam must ask you for permission before transmitting stuff to them.

EA can download anything they want off you computer without asking. Hell they could even scan your hard drive to find pirated copies of EA games and use that as evidence at court.
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I believe this quote, from the Steam Subscriber Agreement, is saying the same thing the Origin EULA is... just in a sugar-coated way:
"Steam and the Software may include functionality designed to identify software or hardware processes or functionality that may give a player an unfair competitive advantage when playing multiplayer versions of any Software, other Valve products, or modifications thereof ("Cheats")."
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If Origin's intent is to scan systems for cheats, then they'd be smart to spell it out like Steam has. In this case, I wouldnt want to give people a way to opt-out. On the other hand, third-party sharing, anonymous or not, definitely should be a "no" by default.
 
Phoenix333 said:
I think it's more of a case of a badly worded EULA than EA planning something sinister. All EA has to do to fix this is tweak the wording of the EULA to indicate that it will only collect hardware data, and software data about which OS is in use, what drivers are in use, and information about software specifically connected to EA's Origin service, and do so with the user's consent. It won't stop everyone from worrying about privacy, it certainly won't do anything for the utterly paranoid, but it will give most of those concerned clarification.
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I don't think they are planning anything sinister like having ads popping up everywhere, but I think their mistake was to no allow user op-out of it.

Those statistic are not important, why must all Origin users be forced to share them? All they need to do is allow users to op-out, or even better, op-in by choice, then this will be no issue at all.
 
SonicTron said:
Yeah no, after all the bullshit about platforms, software requirements, origin terms of service, lockouts, etc. that have come about since we started seeing bf3 previews, I'm afraid I will be steering clear of this amazing looking game. From day 1 to day none for me.
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Not that I'm saying you are doing it, but if people dont want the game/origin fine, there's no need for all the bitching. Origin isn't the first program like this and it wont be the last.
 
jrrandell said:
Not that I'm saying you are doing it, but if people dont want the game/origin fine, there's no need for all the bitching. Origin isn't the first program like this and it wont be the last.
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The problem is that people want the game, but they don't want to be bent over a bench by EA in order to have the game.

If this is the future of PC gaming where every gamer has to have his/her life as an open book so companies can sell the details to research and marketing firms, then PC gaming can fuck off and die.
 
Plague_Injected said:
The problem is that people want the game, but they don't want to be bent over a bench by EA in order to have the game.

If this is the future of PC gaming where every gamer has to have his/her life as an open book so companies can sell the details to research and marketing firms, then PC gaming can fuck off and die.
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Of course, the evil asshole PC priacting community might find a way to fuck Origin off out of it so BF3 can be enjoyed without having EA perving on you through the window.
 
On another website I had a little chat with someone who has ties with EA. I don't know if it's true but he claims that selling information is part of their business practices... If that's the case then those expecting them to change their EULA it's "badly worded" shouldn't hold their breath.
 
Fail said:
if you have to go to those kind of lengths to keep your machine ready for gaming, then something is seriously wrong.

And that wrong is identified as Origin, and the people who stand in line for it and buy it on release day are nothing more than sheeple.
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This.

Phoenix333 said:
I think it's more of a case of a badly worded EULA than EA planning something sinister. All EA has to do to fix this is tweak the wording of the EULA to indicate that it will only collect hardware data, and software data about which OS is in use, what drivers are in use, and information about software specifically connected to EA's Origin service, and do so with the user's consent. It won't stop everyone from worrying about privacy, it certainly won't do anything for the utterly paranoid, but it will give most of those concerned clarification.
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EA has a history of exploiting its customers and trampling all over them. Assuming it is a badly worded EULA is pretty much denial or being uninformed. It isn't paranoia, it is just being fed up with a company that has as little or less respect for their customers than activision. They don't give a damn about your rights beyond how much money they can squeeze out of you.

Hornet said:
I don't think they are planning anything sinister like having ads popping up everywhere, but I think their mistake was to no allow user op-out of it.

Those statistic are not important, why must all Origin users be forced to share them? All they need to do is allow users to op-out, or even better, op-in by choice, then this will be no issue at all.
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Better yet, why must all BF3 players be forced to install Origin? For the Digital client..ok sure. However the opt out should include the retail copy. Give us the ability to never use Origin and the problem is solved for those who are concerned.

jrrandell said:
Not that I'm saying you are doing it, but if people dont want the game/origin fine, there's no need for all the bitching. Origin isn't the first program like this and it wont be the last.
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Yes there is a need for all the bitching. Companies need to know that anti-consumer behavior like this will result in backlash. If everyone is just a good little consumer and buy everything without question, then they will just continue assuming they can get away with it.

Plague_Injected said:
The problem is that people want the game, but they don't want to be bent over a bench by EA in order to have the game.

If this is the future of PC gaming where every gamer has to have his/her life as an open book so companies can sell the details to research and marketing firms, then PC gaming can fuck off and die.
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Basically this entirely. I have always preferred PC gaming above all else, however the steady march of BS DRM and tracking schemes has pushed me further and further away from it. I can take the same game and load it on a PS3 or 360 and never have to deal with bullshit third party spyware, always on drm, or ET Phone home drms telling me when I can and can't play. PC users get a special brand of screwing and frankly I am tired of these companies believing they can treat me like a criminal for simply purchasing their game.
 
Wasn't aware EA was being so authoritarian about their system. Although, it doesn't effect me in any way. I had already decided to never use their software. EA has gotten bad enough in the past, and I'm done with them after this. Oh, and has already been pointed out, Steam is optional. You don't have to participate. You are specifically asked if you would like to contribute.
 
Phoenix333 said:
I think it's more of a case of a badly worded EULA than EA planning something sinister. All EA has to do to fix this is tweak the wording of the EULA to indicate that it will only collect hardware data, and software data about which OS is in use, what drivers are in use, and information about software specifically connected to EA's Origin service, and do so with the user's consent. It won't stop everyone from worrying about privacy, it certainly won't do anything for the utterly paranoid, but it will give most of those concerned clarification.
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There in lies the test. All the hyperbola aside EA will or wont change the Eula. If changed EA will or wont make it less scary.

I have been severely disappointed in EA for some years now. DS3 was the last straw. I dont see myself buying much or even anything form EA for some time. I really dont want to have to deal with multiple game services either. I'll stick with Steam for now.

Steam politely asks to send information and horrid pop-up I have seen discussed up thread is an open window behind the game I played that I dont see 'till after I exit. BFD! I get worse pop up reading the news.
 
I've been pretty worked up about this for weeks now, glad there's finally more press getting out.

The complete absence of any opt-out and the fact that all new AAA EA games will be shackled to Origin pretty much means you forfeit your right to privacy if you want to play EA video games. That is not acceptable to me in any way, shape, or form.

I haven't pirated a video game in years, but I guess I'll be making an exception for ME3. I enjoyed ME1 and ME2 enough that I have to see the trilogy through to its end, but I will break the law (and not give Bioware the money I would, quite honestly, love to give it) before I permit EA nearly unrestricted access into my private PC life.
 
I find it appalling that the one game I really, really want to buy. The one game I got the most excited about. The game I would spend twice as much on DLC as the game because it ignites my passion for gaming.

Is getting fucked over by EA.

Why can't good companies like DICE get published without having to install shitty software like this? I could see if DICE wrote the software and was trying to do a Steam; I wouldn't mind communicating my opinion as a consumer for them to get it right.

But this is EA; the 800lb gorilla that knows better. Knows that a significant portion of their demographic is going to get pissed off. They don't give a damn how many copies they sell; it's all about the market research. It's like they are scared of Steam and by golly they are entitled to Valve's data.

Valve gives PC gamers a sense of community. Hey guys we're going to try catering to you but we need some data to know what we're dealing with. Would you like to opt in for this research? EA says here's the biggest game of the year. If you want to play sell me your soul. There's a slight difference in the approaches huh?

At this point I'm just as depressed about BF3 as I was excited earlier this year. No way this shit will make it's way onto my PC again. Bye bye EA and DICE. Would have been nice to spend my money with you'll, but of course one guy not buying your product isn't going to keep it from being a success.
 
Dion said:
Steam does this already.
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not nearly. steam collects basic hardware info and stuff directly related to the steam install, but it asks you first and you can easily click no.

there is a more detailed and explicitly opt-in software survey, but again, you have to specificly allow it prior.

EA's EULA launguage makes it so that this data mining is compulsory. by installing origins you are explicitly allowing them to collect very detailed amounts of information about everything on your computer. the only way to 'opt-out' is to not use it, which obviously means you cant play BF3 or any other games that require it.

so the price for playing BF3 is $60 plus your personal information and data. im going to be keeping both my money and data, thank you EA.
 
Want to help make a splash ?
Cancel your preorder, then re-preorder it at another retailer, rinse and repeat as much as you're willing to. Make sure the retailer knows WHY you are cancelling.
 
All EA needs to do is provide an opt out clause. Case settled. The amount of FUD that still goes on over steam is astounding.

If your getting pop ups in steam it is because pop ups are enabled. Go into the steam menu turn pop ups off.

If you don't want steam to collect your data turn it off in the menu or select the opt out option. Once that it is done Steam no longer legally collects your data.
 
Origin could set my keyboard on fire each time it loaded, and I would still install it to play BF3. 'Nuff said.
 
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