Do I upgrade my computer? Or Replace it?

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Punkrulz

[H]ard|Gawd
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Nov 11, 2001
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Yeah here's another thread guys. :) So my current rig is in my signature. I downloaded BF3 last night, and I kinda knew it wasn't going to be that great to play... but it turned out to be pretty bad with some skipping and what not. So I'm back to the decision.

Do I upgrade components? Upgrading components look like it would be most of the compouter... Proc, Mobo, Mem, Video, and probably PSU. That's most of the computer as is.What would I even do with the components after being upgraded?

Do I build a new computer? Right now my biggest problem is that if I can remember my current rig doesn't seem to be that old, and it already is too far outdated to run both BF3 and MW3 successfully. I'm looking for something that can run these games like a champ with no issues, and will either be able to A) Run future games for quite awhile, or B) Not need much to upgrade for future games. I only run 1x 23" monitor so I'm not thinking that I need to do SLI or Crossfire or anything. Or do I wait for new equipment, which would suck but would be kind of understandable.

I'm really not looking to break the bank with this one. I would prefer not to spend more than 700-800 if possible, but if that needs to be stretched then it can be. I'm the idiot who remembered I could pay for everything on a credit card just to make me happy lol. Please let me know!
 
At a minimum to get a very solid performance in modern games you want to play you'll need to go with a new motherboard, cpu, video card and memory. You could reuse other stuff if you wanted, but personally if I'm going to do all that I'd prefer to get a new case.

Food for thought about your power supply... ATI cards are pretty energy efficient as compared to Nvidia so if you got a Sandy Bridge and a single 6870 6950 or 6970 you may be able to re-use the power supply.
 
You probably really need to go to a quad-core, but when you do your video card is still going to limit you. Your best bet would be to make the jump to Sandy Bridge with a new CPU, motherboard, RAM, and then add a new GPU, which you could do for under $600-700 (depending on card). If you decide you want to upgrade, repost with the answers to the stickied questions and you can get some good recommmendations for parts.

If you wanted to try to limp along, you could look for a used Q9550 to put in your current board, and then get a new video card to put with it - that would be about $400 or so, depending on the card you choose.

A 6950 or GTX 560 Ti is probably the video card range you'd want.
 
I actually just upgraded my E8400 and P5Q-E
Am using
Phenom II x4 955BE C3 overclocked to a bit over 4Ghz
G.Skill RipjawX1866Mhz F3-14900CL9D-8GBXL 1.5v 9,10,9,28 memory at 1866 9,10,9,24 1.5v
Asus M5A99X EVO motherboard
Coolermaster Hyper 212+ cooler dual stock fans R4 79CFM fans
centurion 590 old case, now in Raven 03
OCZ Agility 3 60Gb SSD
WD Caviar black 640 HDD
Coolermaster Inferno Mouse
dual ASUS 24B1ST DVD all drives
HX750 PSU
Extra Xigmatech Purple Crystal LED fans
1 Scythe Slipstream 110CFM acting as top exhaust
ASUS Radeon 6870 with Arctic cooling S1 Rev 2 cooler overclocked to 965 core and 1140 or 4560 effective memory speeds

Anyways :p

The cpu/motherboard/ram by itself would have only set me back around $340 after tax/shipping cause I pricematch very carefully :p

Performance is stunning.

if it were me and building a new system on the cheap side, running at 1920/1080 resolution cpu doesnt play as important in BF3, as long as good cpu it will suffice.
my choice
Phenom II x4 955BE C3 stepping with good cooler such as Hyper 212+ with dual stock fans(like me)
M5A99X EVO motherboard
same listed ram, or the slightly slower speed 1600 save $25?
XFX Radeon 6950 XXX or one thats clocked at 830 core and 5200 memory with dual fans, or a factory overclocked 560Ti

Many of my buddies are using Phenom II x4 955, or 965 at stock and overclocked as well as 6870(me) 6950(a few) or 560Ti(a few) and none of us have better or worse play time be it using a 2500K, 2600K or the Phenoms.

Though its hard to argue Sandy bridge performance, if you are trying to save a few $$ and still get something that has alot of bang for buck, it hard to argue with the above, can easily overclock to 4Ghz+ range, with a couple minutes of your time, and be about $350 cheaper then sandy B setup, no it will not be faster on the cpu, but in regards to gaming and multimedia and such, it will still work very well, not to mention have more things such as Sata ports, usb, pci-e then most but the more $ Sandy B motherboards.

Although the Wolfdale/Yorkfield Q series or Q8k Q9550-9650 are good chips, the Phenom II setup that I just bought is actually slightly faster in every regard, and was around the same $ as just buying a Q9650 cpu(part of the reason I didnt just upgrade to a quad core for the P5Q-E) which would have cost me around the $320 mark before shipping/taxes here in Canada. I am sure you could find it cheaper USED, but why not get someting new for the same $?
 
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dragonstongue said:
Though its hard to argue Sandy bridge performance, if you are trying to save a few $$ and still get something that has alot of bang for buck, it hard to argue with the above, can easily overclock to 4Ghz+ range, with a couple minutes of your time, and be about $350 cheaper then sandy B setup, no it will not be faster on the cpu, but in regards to gaming and multimedia and such, it will still work very well, not to mention have more things such as Sata ports, usb, pci-e then most but the more $ Sandy B motherboards.
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I don't see how that setup is $350 cheaper than a Sandy Bridge? The CPU is only $100 less than the 2500K (which is quite a bit faster) and the motherboard you linked is the same or more expensive than many SB boards (significantly more expensive if you have a Microcenter nearby), and the RAM is the same. So where's the other $250 coming from?
 
here in Canada, I can get cpu $100+ cheaper, $105.09 vs $219.95
Motherboard for something comparable P8Z68V is $185 vs the $135 is paid for the M5A99X EVO through price matching
Ram $80 for 8gb 1866Mhz memory(the one I am using)

So basically +/-
$320.09 for my setup
$484.95 for the 2500K comparable setup

Price difference of $164.86 not including tax/shipping and such, so yeh, my #s are off a little bit, my bad, but it still is pricier, but faster, I thought I established that, and yes, it is more $ then some sandy B motherboards, but all the better Sandy B boards, that do not have quirks, and are all aorund worth it are around to + more.

And yes 2500K is faster, I didnt say it was not, but all the benchmarks I have seen using comparable setups in regards to memory speed, hard drives, GPU and such for something like BF3 DID NOT show that much of a performance difference between a Phenom II x4 955, Phenom II x6 1100T vs 2500K or 2600K.

It comes down to $ does it not, if you do more then JUST gaming, then yes, get what fits the need, faster can only be justified if it gives a definate edge in what you do, and for the most part at higher resolutions, CPU do not have as much to do, so therefore both 2500K or my chip are both very good choices.
 
I have decided to upgrade some of my slower PC's from older Phenom and Intel 63xx chips along with Mobo, memory and video cards to handle BF3. Seemed to be the best choice, that 260 you have in your sig also won't support DX11.
 
for the price, the best cards based on current drivers and properly supporting DX 11

GTX460, Radeon 6850/5850/6870/5870, GTX560, Radeon 6950, GTX560Ti, Radeon 6970/GTX570.

The 560Ti and 6950 are the best in regards to playable frame rates and the price they are selling for.

CPU wise a stock/overclocked Phenom II x4 955-980 Phenom II x6 1055-1100T or 2500K are your best bets.

Only suggestion I have in regards to cpu is research the motherboards very well, it may only look to be a hair more $ but sometimes you get shortchanged in regards to features, performance, compatibility, etc.

Its worth looking at all options, and not just rely on "speed" if the car doesnt always go its rated speeds, then its not much of a vehicle sort of speak.
 
If you got alot of cash, wait for ivy bridge & get something like an msi mobo with pci 3.0 support such as the MSI Z68A-GD80 (G3) then when the 22nm gpus come out you'll be set like a boss
 
Ivy Bridge are going to be very sick fast cpu`s, AMD piledriver MIGHT be, but none knows yet.

If you have the $$ wait until Ivy Bridge comes out, if you dont have that kind of cash, the Sandy-E or an AMD setup will do you fine.

with AMD setup, you can save quite a few $ if you are strapped for coin
A 6850/6870 or GTX460/GTX550Ti
Phenom II x4 if strapped

if money no option
Core i7 2600K or wait for Sandy E/Ivy
if so just up your gpu to a 6850 for now or a GTX 460 which are reasonably cost and at least you can play BF3
for now, till the new 22nm GPU are out in december to march 2011/2012 time frame and same for Sandy E/Ivy/Pile driver
 
Punkrulz, what is the priority for you? Is it a high-end video card for excellent gaming performance? Or is it a nice CPU/mobo/RAM platform that will allow future upgrades?

Looking at your sig, you could easily reuse your case, hard drive, optical drive, and CPU cooler. (AMD's Bulldozer currently uses the AM2+/AM3 socket and Intel's Sandy Bridge can support Socket 1156 coolers.) You could reuse your PSU as a short-term stopgap, though I don't really support that option.
 
Thanks for the posts guys. I'm not quite sure if I feel that it fully answered my questions... Mostly answers about new setups, so actually I guess that does answer a question. I guess I'll make a new thread with the questions answered.

As much as I wish to be one of those guys who have the latest and greatest with regards to Ivy, I have a huge feeling it's gonna be extremely pricey, possibly far out of my range. I also don't really want to have to wait for Q1 2012 for that to come out and for me to upgrade... Look for the new post soon so I can get some more ideas. I don't think I'm partial to either intel or AMD, so that doesn't matter. Cost vs Performance is important. I'd like to not have to max out the credit card lol.
 
Sorry Tiraides,

I was posting on my cell phone and didn't notice your update. To be honest... that's a tough question for me to be able to answer. I'm going to throw my thoughts out there, and they may kind of string together so let me know what you pick from it.

One of the biggest things that bothers me right now is it doesn't feel like I've had my computer that long, but after doing some research it feels like it's been almost 3 years since building this (my how time flies!). So now my own thoughts are getting the best of me.

Gaming performance is paramount. I don't do too much video editing at all (if ever, tbh... I'm not that guy). Gaming, homework, and basic web design are all I really do on my desktops. I am concerned though that if I build a computer right now, I'm going to be gimped 2 years down the line being unable to play the latest video games again.

What are your thoughts?
 
Punkrulz said:
I am concerned though that if I build a computer right now, I'm going to be gimped 2 years down the line being unable to play the latest video games again.
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You got caught out last time on the wrong side of the dual/quad watershed, so your CPU is really going to hold you back. If you buy now, you'll be getting a fast quad (at least), and it is very unlikely that anything in the next 2 to 3 years is going to need anything more than a fast quad. We aren't on the cusp of a big change like the dual/quad one - there is no quad/hexa/octo change coming in the next few years.

You can definitely improve your current situation by dropping in a used quad for that socket (like a Q9550) along with a new video card - but really, for not a whole lot more money, you can ditch the CPU/RAM and motherboard and get a new system that supports all the new technologies. What you do is up to you, but it is a relatively good time to upgrade - with nothing compelling on the price/performance front in the next 6 months.
 
I think that cpu cooler will work fine, if you can get the crossbow for it, it will work splendid for AMD or Intel system.

Like I said, if you went Intel, you can upgrade your current cpu for about the same price as getting a new board,cpu,motherboard AMD wise, and this will allow current stuff Phenom II X4, Phenom IIx6, Bulldozer, and more then likely Piledriver CPU, and the board I listed is the one I choose to go with, its younger brothers are a hair over $100 or around $90

To go Intel wise, you could stick with current board, and up the cpu, but for maybe ~$150 more then that you can get a full, new, much faster, board/cpu/memory, Sandy B chips are very fast by all means, however finding the right motherboard, that offers a fair amount of features, is more gamer oriented, and mostly, allows some tweaking, can be hard to find a good one, in a decent price range without suffering some kind of bad penalties.

Anyways, as far as gaming wise, Phenom II x4 955/965/970 black edition of course, would be my choise, they are very capable gaming cpu, and a possibility in a few months(~6mths) you could bump the chip for a boost if needed.

Intel you of course have Core i7 950/960/970 chips, or Sandy B. i7 800/900 series LGA 1366 there is no upgrade path, Sandy B current ones socket LGA 1155 there may be an upgrade path(though this REQUIRES compativble firmware supplied by vendor such as ASUS and not offically Intel supported)

I know many folks that have both camps, and they are all very happy, if you are on a tighter budget, I would go AMD, if you have a little room to spare say $120-$220 I would go Intel(obviously this doesnt include GPU price)

FYI that power supply I am sure is ok for the moment, but I wouldnt be pressing your system to hard, or for that matter going to high end on the gpu, a 6950 or 560Ti would be as high as I would go with anything below a QUALITY 700w power supply, that is the last thing you want giving out on you, especially as it is a few year old.

Either way, I know like I said folks that have the 2500K, 2600K, Phenom II x4 955, 965, Phenom IIx6 1090T/1100T, and others that are rocking first gen i7 800 and 900 class chips, we are all happy with them, we all get very very smilar frame rates using similar hardware, so if your main focus is more modern games, honestly, you will not notice much, if any difference, no matter the CURRENT Quad core.

Put into frame rates, 5-10 FPS in a given game with a given gpu, is not worth $100 price difference when both are very playable now is it?? Better to save your money and put that towards an SSD or better GPU, as you will get more out of it, well if you are running at proper settings that is.
 
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If you need to save some money, go with AMD. However, if you do go the AMD route for a gaming PC, do go not with any AMD CPU above the Phenom II 960T. Any higher than that and you're just wasting money at that point considering that those more expensive AMD CPUs are too close in price to the faster Sandy Bridge Core i5 CPUs.

But if you can afford to, go for the Sandy Bridge based setup. You get a faster CPU to begin with and overclocking that CPU will allow you to further hold off on upgrading the CPU + mobo + RAM again in a few years. In fact, a SB setup would have longer legs than an AMD Phenom II setup. However, I'd have to disagree with dragonstongue that finding a good SB based mobo is hard to do without suffering some kind of "penalty". IMO, it's not that hard at all.
 
I have many of my buddies that had a hell of a time finding "good" sandy B based motherboards ofr a decent price, that did not have many quirks associated with them, I will not argue on this, I have helped roughly 20 people over the past 1 3/4 years build top to bottom systems, so I know a thing or 2 about the reviews and such.

AMD or Intel, are both valid choices, this cannot be argued, save a few $ with AMD, get a little more for more cost Intel, basic thing to keep in mind though, in a pure gaming environment, not one is directly better overall then the other(with very few overall exceptions) like said and this is fact, pay some more, get some more, its up to the user to justify if paying the extra is worth it, and most times, for most users, it just simply is not, they are both incredibly fast for the costs that they are.

Oh and BTW, saying well one can up to Ivy when the time comes, and saying in a different sentence, but just overclock and you will not need to, the same can be said about the AMD side, not as much bang, sure, but it can be done, and there is less to monkey with(I know XMP works wonderfully, but most folks have no clue all the fancier features the core i series brought to the table, let alone, the sandy B ones, which rolled more into the mix)

I know the Z68 based boards are pretty decent, but I also know the vast majority of the mainstream performance style Intel motherboards are north of $160 on average, so it really comes down to cost, once again, if you can afford it, yes Intel is a better pick, but it IS NOT THE ONLY ONE that is worthwhile.

Best I can say is look at the sata port configuration, the ethernet, the pci-e configs, usb and such, MOST AMD motherboards have a damn good assortment of features through thier whole lineup, and offer more connectivity on the mainstream to performance end of the price spectrum, the upper echelon of both Intel and AMD for motherboards are around the same for features set.

I guess thats all, sorry to sound like arguing, or whatever, but I am trying to help inform some folks that may not know all the choices out there, I for one am about getting what I can, for what I can afford, and if that means company A or B so be it, as long as I dont short change myself, which I make sure does not happen, to the best of my ability, Gaming wise, there is simply alot of valid choices out there, and one does not always have to get the very best to have a very good experience for many years, with some room to bump up if they find they have a need to do so.
 
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dragonstongue said:
I have many of my buddies that had a hell of a time finding "good" sandy B based motherboards ofr a decent price, that did not have many quirks associated with them, I will not argue on this, I have helped roughly 20 people over the past 1 3/4 years build top to bottom systems, so I know a thing or 2 about the reviews and such.
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Unfortunately your whole post does sound like an argument. My thousands of posts here on numerous threads in this subforum alone over the past 6 years should tell you just how much I know about hardware reviews and such and my experience in helping people with top to bottom builds. So we've now established that we both know what we're talking about. Well supposedly.

Look at the specs for the main rig in my sig. That's an AMD setup. So know full well that I'm not some Intel or AMD fanboy. Like you, I am all about what I can get for what I can afford as long I'm not gimping myself. My budget at the time was limited and I took a gamble on unlocking a Phenom. So that should tell you something about where I'm coming from.

dragonstongue said:
I know the Z68 based boards are pretty decent, but I also know the vast majority of the mainstream performance style Intel motherboards are north of $160 on average, so it really comes down to cost, once again, if you can afford it, yes Intel is a better pick, but it IS NOT THE ONLY ONE that is worthwhile.
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Maybe that's true in Canada but you can often find decent mainstream style Intel mobos for under $160:
$120 - Gigabyte GA-Z68A-D3H-B3 Intel Z68 ATX Motherboard
$133 - MSI P67A-G45 Intel P67 ATX Motherboard
$145 - MSI P67A-GD55 Intel P67 ATX Motherboard

I will give you that AMD mobos tends to have two more SATA ports than their Intel counterparts. But that's balanced out by the higher performance of Intel CPUs IMO.

Look, we've both have said the same exact things: If low budget, AMD. If high budget, go Intel. Though if you have a high budget to begin with, I see no reason to go with an AMD setup. However the key thing I want to dispel is that it's had to find a decent Intel mobo for under $160. That's simply not true at all as shown in the above mobos I've linked.
 
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well we seem to be going in circles here :p

I know if you were to look hard enough at enough reviews you could find out what motherboards to go with, and which to avoid.

The P67 boards, like AMD 890FX based boards, are still very good boards, and tend to be lower priced, then thier upper end brothers, those of Z68 and 990X/990FX based boards.

I suppose in the price range, like I said you have to look at the full package not just the motherboard, but the cpu, the bios, the features etc

The board I got, A99X is a 990X based board, to compare it with similar would be the GD80 type boards from MSI if I recall or the UD5 from Gigabyte, if you want to get lower cost of course you can find them.

I was just saying on features set, thats all. Nothing worse then finiky sata ports, pci-e slots, or a cruddy BIOS after all( I like ASUS UEFI, it works extremely well)

O and not that it matters, but it is nice(if you use it) AM3+ boards for the most part can support crossfire or SLI for almost all of thier lineup, so I suppose for the most part, you are not shortchanging yourself by much if any, if you are looking for a gaming rig, to go with Intel or AMD, research always pays in spades.
 
dragonstongue said:
well we seem to be going in circles here :p
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Yes we are since we share some similar positions but refuse to budge from the positions where we differ.
dragonstongue said:
The P67 boards, like AMD 890FX based boards, are still very good boards, and tend to be lower priced, then thier upper end brothers, those of Z68 and 990X/990FX based boards.
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I wouldn't consider the 990X an upper-end chipset. Or at least one ranked higher than the P67. If anything I'd say they're about equivalent to each other.

dragonstongue said:
The board I got, A99X is a 990X based board, to compare it with similar would be the GD80 type boards from MSI if I recall or the UD5 from Gigabyte
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I'm just gonna say I disagree with you on this and just leave it at that.

dragonstongue said:
O and not that it matters, but it is nice(if you use it) AM3+ boards for the most part can support crossfire or SLI for almost all of thier lineup
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Actually only the 970, 990X, and 990FX mobos support SLI. There are AM3+ mobos that uses the older 8xx and 7xx series chipsets btw.
dragonstongue said:
if you are looking for a gaming rig, to go with Intel or AMD, research always pays in spades.
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Fair enough. Could have just said that earlier and we wouldn't be having this discussion :)

And just to recap what I've been saying:
- Finding a good SB based mobo (whether in general or under $160) is not hard to do without suffering some kind of "penalty".
- If you have a high budget to begin with, I see no reason to go with an AMD setup and an Intel setup would be your best bet.
- If you have a low-budget, then yes AMD is your better bet up to a certain point: I.e when the AMD CPU costs more than $130, you're overpaying.
 
cheers on some of these points.

990X in regards to current gen offerings (for AMD of course) would be considered an upper mainstream or performance, 970 main stream, 990FX high end. This is why 990X in regards to being comparable to GD80 and UD5, as they are around the same features set and price (O, and yes I did have the numbers mixed some, the closest in comparison for MSI would be the GD55 based on price the GD65 on features, the UD3 FX based on features/price or UD3 990X based on price)

Main reason I say this the A99X EVO does have more features then the UD3, and GD55 respectively, so it does sit ever slightly higher on the totem pole, as it has "almost" the same feature set as the FX boards, and its bios alone is worth the extra few $ in comparison, something like the sabertooth 990FX is really not needed for the best unless you are running multi high end cards such as crossfire X or triple Sli, or similar

The am3+ boards based on 8xx and 7xx series, are not AM3+ cpu supported by offiicially by AMD, the manufacturers designed it this way, AMD did not, once again moot point, if you really wanted a damn good board, the 890FX boards are very much worthwhile as well, minus a couple "native" fatures

970 board--Best for single card or X2 modern card
990X--dual cards, or dual X2 modern(probably not best choice to do this though)
990FX--multi-card

P67 are "older" boards, z68 newer, so in a certain sence, I would say accordingly H67 to AMD 890GX/970, P67 to 890FX/990X, Z68 being the newest I feel is more comparable to 990FX(not counting processor) which are also the newest. Comparing on available features/price, being that it is always changing, as are the manufacturers board in the same price range, does make it more difficult.

In a broad sence I suppose I agree with you on this that the p67 is more comparable to 990X. As they both are intended for the performance mainstream, whereas both Intel and AMD high end boards, generally are quite a bit more $

I guess it all depends on what you would use it for, if you are crunching media or something like that, there is more that benefits from higher end Intel cpu`s, but that does not mean AMD does not have stuff that works splendid with thier chips and can use their grunt effectively.

If cost is no issue, then by all means Intel Sandy B, they are fast, no doubt.
If cost is somewhat of an issue, then Sandy 2500K/non K or Phenom II x4BE and overclock it.

I guess I can put it from what I have read. The Phenom II x4 are the best price/performance ratio for AMD cpu`s, very good all around performance, more focused to gaming performance. The x6 though they are good gaming cpu, they are designed more for media and crunching, so almost no point in paying the extra if just for gaming purposes. Although a 1055T overclocked is a fast chip for its price, and very well all around, for crunching or gaming.

In a pure gaming environment, with the same gpu, equivalent motherboards, both the 2500K and the Phenom II BE are damn good gaming chips(especially for thier price) not all that much difference really(plus or minus some FPS, but this FPS 99% of time is above and beyond what you can use anyways) The Intel chip is faster yes, but benchmarks and FPS tests I have seen, it is not truly justifiable, but I suppose this is dependant on the user.

The 2600K is in a league of its own, it truly is, but same as above, if purely gaming focused, being that most games only use quad cores as of now, it really cannot be justified over the price of the 2500K, if crunching and such, absolutely it can.

Ok, so once gain, very sorry for long post, I get long winded.

If money is no issue, 2500K, 2600K, or core i7 950/960/970/980, with a P67/Z68 or X58 board.
If money is a little tighter Phenom II x4 or x6 with a 990X or 970 based board.

As Danny said, no real point in paying to much for the cpu, as there is better for slightly more. The 955/965/970 black editions or 1055T/1075T are about as high a price as I would go, as they can easily overclock to equal thier more $ brothers(with a decent cheap cooler like a hyper 212 plus in push/pull)

My system top to bottom with my current parts, part for part would cost around ~$1500, the same but Intel wise with a decent P67/Z68 board and 2500 non K would be ~$1800 mark shipped+taxes, I can list my parts if needed
For me, gaming, and everything else I do, I personally decided against spending the extra after hours and hours of research between what I got and what I could of had, I could easily afforded to do so.

Anyways, best of luck, and if you do decide to go Intel, or AMD, hopefully we here have helped you at least some, and most certainly, I am sure, folks could help you find a good combination for a good price, if thats what you so desire :)
 
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Here's an upgrade option for you to consider:

$375 - Intel Core i5-2500K and Gigabyte GA-Z68X-UD3H-B3 combo
$40 - Corsair Value Select CMV8GX3M2A1333C9 2x4GB DDR3 1333 RAM
$280 - XFX HD-695X-CNDC Radeon HD 6950 2GB
$70 - Antec NEO ECO 620C 620 watt power supply
=====
$765 - Subtotal (not including shipping, taxes, or rebates)

Assuming that the monitor listed in your sig is correct, the HD 6950 may be a bit overkill for that resolution. I chose it as a guarantee for you to obtain excellent frame rates while gaming. The only thing that would make the system better, performance-wise, would be the addition of an SSD (and using that as your primary drive).

Regarding the Danny Bui-versus-dragonstongue "debate," I am going to side with Danny and recommend the Intel Socket 1155 platform because it's a proven performer. While Bulldozer can, and most likely will improve over time, it's not comparatively good right now. And Intel's current Socket 1155 lineup can support the upcoming Ivy Bridge processors, so your upgrade path won't be immediately limited.

Yes, dragonstongue is correct in stating that AMD has comparatively better features in its motherboards. However, Intel's comparatively better performance in gaming and the K-series processors' ability to be overclocked even further make Intel a better choice in my opinion.
 
dragonstongue said:
In a pure gaming environment, with the same gpu, equivalent motherboards, both the 2500K and the Phenom II BE are damn good gaming chips(especially for thier price) not all that much difference really(plus or minus some FPS, but this FPS 99% of time is above and beyond what you can use anyways) The Intel chip is faster yes, but benchmarks and FPS tests I have seen, it is not truly justifiable, but I suppose this is dependant on the user.
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Well from the FPS tests I've seen, the higher performance offered by the 2500K is pretty different from the Phenom II 955. This is dependent on the game and resolution though. When the differences are apparent, the performance and therefore price cost is fully justifiable IMO.

dragonstongue said:
Ok, so once gain, very sorry for long post, I get long winded.
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Yes you do.
dragonstongue said:
If money is no issue, 2500K, 2600K, or core i7 950/960/970/980, with a P67/Z68 or X58 board.
If money is a little tighter Phenom II x4 or x6 with a 990X or 970 based board.
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What?

Here's the problem with that whole statement: For a gaming PC, there is zero reason to go wtih the Core i7 9xx series CPUs or Phenom II X6 series CPUs. Only reason to get the Core i7 9xx series is if you need more than 16GB of RAM. As for the Phenom II X6, as you've stated, their real world gaming performance is virtually the same as the Phenom II X4s. However even in multi-media editing/rendering applications where additional cores tends to shine, the Phenom II X6 CPU still tend to be outperformed by or perform as well as Core i5 2xxx CPUs.

dragonstongue said:
My system top to bottom with my current parts, part for part would cost around ~$1500, the same but Intel wise with a decent P67/Z68 board and 2500 non K would be ~$1800 mark shipped+taxes, I can list my parts if needed
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No need to do so since you live in Canada. The OP and I are located in the U.S and therefore will have different pricing and deals
dragonstongue said:
For me, gaming, and everything else I do, I personally decided against spending the extra after hours and hours of research between what I got and what I could of had, I could easily afforded to do so.
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Fair enough. But the OP has a budget of $700 to $800, which is mroe than enough to cover the costs of a Core i5 2500K + Z68 mobo + + DDR3 RAM + new video card without issue.

Also the OP already made his decision to go with Intel:
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1648371
 
well, if that is the case, best to go with as you pointed out 2500K, with a good cooler of course(Coolermaster Hyper 212 + with a second blademaster fan or similar) or a corssbow for that HSF you have)

Z68 mobo (which there are many good choices, but it will take you some reading to find what will best suit you, I am personally partial to ASUS or EVGA, ASUS cause I have had many, and they are always well thought out, EVGA cause many of my buddies have them and they seem to enjoy them with the performance they deliver) you can use pricewatch or something similar to pricematch it back to

8Gb of ddr3 1600 ram -or more (G.Skill RIpjaw, the set I have would work very nicely for you, Corsair Vengeance, Kingston Hyper X, Patriot G3) Sandy B tends to do very nicely with higher speed memory as its memory controller sees very good returns with faster speed-lower latency memory, just makjre sure to get as low voltage memory as you can find.

A radeon 6950/6970 or GTX560Ti GTX570, I personally recomend XFX 6950 XXX edition with dual fans, they work amazingly well, or ASUS 560Ti.

As for power supplies, you should be ok with the one you have for anything up to a single card for GTX560Ti or Radeon 6970(with no overclock by you or factory) however the 40a available on the 12v(if I have the right one) might be pushed a little hard, I would recomend upping the power supply to something a little more powerfull, generally so you KNOW it has room to breathe some, ANTEC TP new 650, ANTEC HCP 750 GOLD, Corsair HX750, Coolermaster also makes a few lower cost good units, possibly even silverstone Strider series, would do you well, even if you wanted to Crossfire, SLI, or use an X2 style card.
 
dragonstongue said:
well, if that is the case, best to go with as you pointed out 2500K, with a good cooler of course(Coolermaster Hyper 212 + with a second blademaster fan or similar) or a corssbow for that HSF you have)
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In other words, all that the OP needs is this mounting kit. I'm glad that we could agree on something.

dragonstongue said:
Z68 mobo (which there are many good choices, but it will take you some reading to find what will best suit you, I am personally partial to ASUS or EVGA, ASUS cause I have had many, and they are always well thought out, EVGA cause many of my buddies have them and they seem to enjoy them with the performance they deliver) you can use pricewatch or something similar to pricematch it back to
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You've missed Danny's point: There are now plenty of good Socket 1155 motherboards to choose from. In fact, for my build, I chose one of the better ones that he offered.

dragonstongue said:
8Gb of ddr3 1600 ram -or more (G.Skill RIpjaw, the set I have would work very nicely for you, Corsair Vengeance, Kingston Hyper X, Patriot G3) Sandy B tends to do very nicely with higher speed memory as its memory controller sees very good returns with faster speed-lower latency memory, just makjre sure to get as low voltage memory as you can find.
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DDR3 1333 RAM is fast enough for Sandy Bridge. If you're overclocking with a "K" processor, you'll be using the processor's unlocked CPU multiplier with no need to touch the RAM timings.

dragonstongue said:
A radeon 6950/6970 or GTX560Ti GTX570, I personally recomend XFX 6950 XXX edition with dual fans, they work amazingly well, or ASUS 560Ti.
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So a factory (slightly) overclocked, non-XXX version of the XFX 6950 wouldn't get the job done?

dragonstongue said:
As for power supplies, you should be ok with the one you have for anything up to a single card for GTX560Ti or Radeon 6970(with no overclock by you or factory) however the 40a available on the 12v(if I have the right one) might be pushed a little hard, I would recomend upping the power supply to something a little more powerfull, generally so you KNOW it has room to breathe some, ANTEC TP new 650, ANTEC HCP 750 GOLD, Corsair HX750, Coolermaster also makes a few lower cost good units, possibly even silverstone Strider series, would do you well, even if you wanted to Crossfire, SLI, or use an X2 style card.
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First, I don't believe that the OP should reuse his PSU if it's more than three years old. Power supplies degrade in efficiency over time, especially if they've been pushed to their limits constantly over that time.

Second, CrossFire or SLI (or a dual-GPU card) isn't needed for a 1680x1050 resolution. I specifically went with my video card choice to avoid that "need."

Before I forget, TL;DR: Reread my earlier post.
 
well, a single card such as 6950 is overkill for 1680x1050 resolution, and would get the most out of itself at the 1920x1080 or 1920x1200 reso, it has lots of power under the hood sort of speak, if it can power eyefinity 5x reso, it can handle a single monitor
And why the dual fan overclocked model, depends on where you are getting it, for the dual fan to reference XFX 6950 there is a $10 price premium, for the XXX over stock clocked, it is again a $10-$16 premium, I would at least pay the extra for the dual fan, is well well worth it, just make sure case has a fair amount of ventilation. XFX overclocked is Triple XXX version, it should have 830 core and 5200 memory, takes very very little extra power. The dual fan model is its own thingy, i.e non reference.

As for ram, lots of review places did test Sandy B with faster memory, it helps its bandwidth by a fair enough margin to justfiy the what $5-$10 price increase for decent 1600 class ram.

Motherboard wise, I did not miss Danny`s point, I know Gigabyte and Msi do make some good motherboards, I have also read time and time again that the GB boards flake out and they offer next to no customer support for thier lower end boards, MSI is hit and miss sometimes you never have issues sometimes it is a lemon 70-30, hence why I go with ASUS, I have never, not once, had an issue with them, even if I caused the problem to begin with., and they do tend to have the best bios, especially the newer ones that use UEFI, but that again is preference.

--I would recomend upping the power supply to something a little more powerfull, generally so you KNOW it has room to breathe some--I 100% agree with you on the power supply, I said it shoud be sufficent, but I myself would upgrade, unless I wrote that text for nothing.
 
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dragonstongue, I know that you're trying to help the OP out and show us some of the logic behind your recommendations, but could you try to do it another way? The way you're currently doing things gives me the impression that you find something horribly wrong with our comments. For example:

dragonstongue said:
Motherboard wise, I did not miss Danny`s point, I know Gigabyte and Msi do make some good motherboards, I have also read time and time again that the GB boards flake out and they offer next to no customer support for thier lower end boards, MSI is hit and miss sometimes you never have issues sometimes it is a lemon 70-30, hence why I go with ASUS, I have never, not once, had an issue with them, even if I caused the problem to begin with., and they do tend to have the best bios, especially the newer ones that use UEFI, but that again is preference.
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I know that MSI and Gigabyte have a hit-or-miss track record of quality and support. Guess what? Asus is no better. But rather than go around in circles nitpicking each other's remarks, why don't we work together to create the best build possible for the OP for under $800 shipped?
 
tiraides said:
dragonstongue, I know that you're trying to help the OP out and show us some of the logic behind your recommendations, but could you try to do it another way? The way you're currently doing things gives me the impression that you find something horribly wrong with our comments. For example:



I know that MSI and Gigabyte have a hit-or-miss track record of quality and support. Guess what? Asus is no better. But rather than go around in circles nitpicking each other's remarks, why don't we work together to create the best build possible for the OP for under $800 shipped?
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I suppose you are right on this, excuse me for doing so, meant no ill intentions.

I suppose we are after the same goal, and are trying to achieve such in a different fashion,

I know that the OP already ordered his parts, according to the other post, so I suppose, most of what I said did not matter much anyways.

I guess the only thing I pointed out, or could have done so in a better way, is maybe some of the brand recomendations, and why I would recomend them over top of some of the other ones. I guess only thing I would really like to say, is most times it is not always better to have some really good parts, held back by some not so good. High end only applied if the parts being used are not hindering its capabilities :p

Anyways, have fun all, and once again, I believe, like you pointed out, my intentions could have been construed as rude or ill willed, and for that I apologize, just bad experiences for folks taking recomendations that eventually bit them hard in the, well you know. That and I like to support the little guy as much as possible, competition, is always a good thing, that is if we as users, can make do with something "almost" the same, in regards to features, or on a "good enough" performance scale :D
 
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