• Some users have recently had their accounts hijacked. It seems that the now defunct EVGA forums might have compromised your password there and seems many are using the same PW here. We would suggest you UPDATE YOUR PASSWORD and TURN ON 2FA for your account here to further secure it. None of the compromised accounts had 2FA turned on.
    Once you have enabled 2FA, your account will be updated soon to show a badge, letting other members know that you use 2FA to protect your account. This should be beneficial for everyone that uses FSFT.

Digital Camera Response time

Happy Hopping

Happy Hopping

[H]F Junkie
2FA
Joined
Jul 1, 2004
Messages
8,440
I used a Olympics 2 Mega Pixel digital camera that belongs to a friend of mine. Each time I press the button, there is a delay of 1.5 sec or so. So if you are taking picture of your pet at the back yard running, by the time you press that button, 1.5 sec. later, she is gone elsewhere.

If I am looking for a min. 8 Mega Pixel camera, is there any good brand name, that does NOT have this delay?
 
The Rebel XT or good number of D-SLRs should fit that bill.

Please post the budget, what you will be shooting, and all the other requirements because as of right now, that is a very broad choice.
 
I just need to take digital photo of my rabbit at the backyard, because she is always restless, I need to press the click button and it has to click instantly, just like the analog camera.

Budget would be approixmately $800, but doesn't has to be exact. I also like camera made in Japan. And I have good faith in Olympics, because the color quality of the output photo is very good.
 
$800 will get you a RebelXT with a kit lens after rebate
 
I say go for the Rebel XT. No delay at all. That is one of the reasons I went to the DSLR line. I can get like 3-5 pics a second now. it is great.....
 
I have the Rebel XT and it is a great camera. You can get the camera for around $800 with some coupon codes at Dell, go hunting. The lens are nice but not it's not like "those lenses must be made of diamond for that price and quality". Anyways, I like my rebel and I wouldn't trade it for any other camera aside for the D5.
 
Not to sound agianst the Rebel XT its a great camera, but to get the same zoom range and Fstop range that a typical P&S digital you have to buy at least 1 extra lens to compete with the mid line P&S digitals and 2 kinda spendly lenses for the "prosumer" P&S digitals.

I would recommend you go to a Best Buy or like store to try them before you buy and lean all you can about digital photography online not at the store before you buy.
 
VictorEM83 said:
Not to sound agianst the Rebel XT its a great camera, but to get the same zoom range and Fstop range that a typical P&S digital you have to buy at least 1 extra lens to compete with the mid line P&S digitals and 2 kinda spendly lenses for the "prosumer" P&S digitals.

I would recommend you go to a Best Buy or like store to try them before you buy and lean all you can about digital photography online not at the store before you buy.
Click to expand...


Thats complete utter BS
 
MattsOnlyHope said:
Thats complete utter BS
Click to expand...


that it is - there is NO comparison for a P&S to a rebel or a rebel XT or any entry SLR - except the small size of P&S's. - i owned a rebel - i owned a sony cybershot - the rebel is 10x faster in EVERYTHING then any P&S my friend - not sure where you got your info - but it is the furthest from the truth

and now even more i love my Canon 20D - .2 second start up time :)
 
MattsOnlyHope said:
Thats complete utter BS
Click to expand...

1st I said nothing about speed Im talking optics dollar for dollar

Say the Canon Powershot Pro1 it has a Canon L-series 28-200mm equivalent f/2.4-3.5 to get the same lens on the Rebel youd need a 24-70 F2.8L is $1200 to cover 28-70mm from 70- 200mm you need say the 70-200 F2.8L thats another $1200 now you could go 3rd party and save 30% on each but to stay under F3.5 your looking at $1800-2400 woth of optics thats a fact

Now you see my point? How about the Oly C-8080 it has a 2.4 5x Wide Angle Zoom lens 28 - 140mm equivalent for that camera youd need the 24-70 F2.8 to cover the low light photography agian $1200 and the 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS to cover the focal range is about $400, and you still dont have a F2.4 low light lens

Also some facts a F2.8 lens on a "prosumer" camera can focus faster than a lens on a Drebel at F5.6 when a lens using a Arc Form Drive motor aka non USM Ring Motor. Also many non DLSRs are very fast and can compare to the 1st rebel now days assuming the Rebel using standard lenses. Also the metering and wb modes leave some to be deisred.

Now to your defence yes the Rebel is a fast camera I own a DRebel but dollar for dollar a high end point and shoot can be a better buy and fast enough for even some very demanding work.
 
fugu said:
Yeah, Canon is a Japanese brand
Click to expand...
I know, but nowadays, all these camera are made in China, and I don't want to buy any digital camera made in China.

So I need to check it out at the store I guess, and make sure it says Made in Japan.

I had a camera (not a real brand name) give to me (free), the output photo is so dark, it's not even funny.

Anyhow, if I don't need to take 3 pic. in 1 sec., I can choose to take just one, right? As well, looking at the spec., is the battery MH or Li Ion and how many times zoom is given?

By the way, is there a head to head model of another brand name that competes w/ Canon?
 
VictorEM83 said:
Also many non DLSRs are very fast and can compare to the 1st rebel now days assuming the Rebel using standard lenses. Also the metering and wb modes leave some to be deisred.
.
Click to expand...

Name one that is instant. Just like those good old analog camera. You press that button, it snap that instant. That's my primary concern.
 
For a little over $400 you can get a Panasonic Lumix DMC-FZ5. ( http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicfz5/ ) It has a high-speed focus mode that can take 0.2 sec to focus, and after it is focused it only takes 0.1 sec to take the picture. That should be quick enough...just remember to prefocus.


A long time ago I was looking at the Lumix line of cameras, and the 12x optical zoom always caught my fancy. It basically has a 36mm - 432mm f/2.8-f/3.3 image stabalized lens.

To get something even remotely similar for Canon's Digital Rebel XT would cost about $2,000 over the initial $800 price tag for the camera body itself. Of course with $3,000 of gear that Digital Rebel XT will produce a slightly better picture, but it'll be a lot heavier...and the improvement wouldn't likely be worth $2,600 to you.


For the price, I think that Panasonic might be the camera for you.



* Digital Rebel XT Gear Prices Mentioned Above:
EF 100-400mm f/4.5-f/5.6L IS - $1,435 @ B&H
EF-S 17-85mm f/4.0-f/5.6 IS - $600 @ B&H
Canon Digital Rebel XT - $800 (mentioned in this thread)
 
MrGuvernment said:
that it is - there is NO comparison for a P&S to a rebel or a rebel XT or any entry SLR - except the small size of P&S's. - i owned a rebel - i owned a sony cybershot - the rebel is 10x faster in EVERYTHING then any P&S my friend - not sure where you got your info - but it is the furthest from the truth

and now even more i love my Canon 20D - .2 second start up time :)
Click to expand...

What he said was pretty true. You get a lot more focal range per $$ with a p&s. The drawbacks are speed of operation, optical clarity (you might get 200 mm, but it won't be as sharp), and high ISO performance.
 
Happy Hopping said:
I know, but nowadays, all these camera are made in China, and I don't want to buy any digital camera made in China.

So I need to check it out at the store I guess, and make sure it says Made in Japan.

Anyhow, if I don't need to take 3 pic. in 1 sec., I can choose to take just one, right? As well, looking at the spec., is the battery MH or Li Ion and how many times zoom is given?

By the way, is there a head to head model of another brand name that competes w/ Canon?
Click to expand...

Rebel XTs are made in Japan. Nikon dSLRs are made in Thailand (unless you buy a D2X I think, or the older models like pre-D100, which are made in Japan). I don't think either of those two companies have a Chinese manufacturing plant (though I don't think I'd really care where the camera was made, Nikon has pretty good QC, not sure about Canon). Funny how people will actively hunt down something made in a specific country.

The battery in the XT is probably Li-Ion (don't own one), and if you go with kit lens, the zoom is 18-55 mm, which is roughly a 3x zoom (but since you're starting out on the wide end, 3x isn't really all that much). With the crop factor it gives you the equivalent of 28 - 90 mm on 35mm film I think.

Anyway, I wouldn't be quick to recommend a Rebel XT, since lenses can add a lot of additional expense, especially if you buy high end glass (a la 70-200/2.8). Yes the dSLR is fast to take a picture, but the kit lens is 18-55 mm, which is not as long as many regular point and shoots (and could be very limiting if you just want snapshots and such).



Tim_axe's suggestion is very nice, I like the Lumix cameras. I also think they use Leica lenses which are reputed to be excellent.
 
I wont disagree with that Fugu, DSLR have a host of advantages but not every DSLR meet everyones needs. If I had $800-$1000 what would I buy nothing becuase my next lens is $1500. If you want the best advice read all the reviews you can about all the camera that look like they may meet your needs. Learn what the specs mean, and read all you can and take it all with some salt. Also dont forget the cost of key things you will need for your camera when your using it: extra batteries, if you go to sterlingtek they are cheap but still cost, memory its best to have too much rather than to little and the higher the MP rating the more you will need, a tripod its kinda lame but can save shots if lower shutter speeds are required or you need 8x10+ prints a little camera shake wont hurt a 4x6 but can kill an 8x10, a case to keep it safe, filters to protect the from element, a flash: the built in one is ubber ghey, and last but not least good cleaning gear for your lens(es) and camera sensor(the 1st time is kinda never rattling Ive yet to need to do mine but have done a few for a friend cuz im anal about dust before I mount any lens or caps on my camera and they are all weather sealed with O rings to help prevent the problem)
 
VictorEM83 said:
Not to sound agianst the Rebel XT its a great camera, but to get the same zoom range and Fstop range that a typical P&S digital you have to buy at least 1 extra lens to compete with the mid line P&S digitals and 2 kinda spendly lenses for the "prosumer" P&S digitals.

I would recommend you go to a Best Buy or like store to try them before you buy and lean all you can about digital photography online not at the store before you buy.
Click to expand...

I disagree. My sigma 18-200mm covers a decent range.

Also another P&S camera that you might want to look at is the Canon IS S2. It has 12X optical zoom, and builtin IS which is worth its weight in gold....
 
Well, it seems like his primary concern is the lack of shutter lag. A DSLR is really the way to go with regards to that.
 
darktiger said:
I disagree. My sigma 18-200mm covers a decent range.

Also another P&S camera that you might want to look at is the Canon IS S2. It has 12X optical zoom, and built in IS which is worth its weight in gold....
Click to expand...

I agree it does but at the cost of the aperture, and as for shutter lag anyone who has used a DSLR know that it is only as fast as your able to get focused and that depends on the lens and light you have to focus with unless your manually focusing.

I still stick with what I said he need to try the cameras and see what he likes and doesn't like. Just looking a specs and getting advice doesn't cut it because in the end if you don't like the camera or system you got you wont use it as much as if you love to use it.
 
fugu said:
What he said was pretty true. You get a lot more focal range per $$ with a p&s. The drawbacks are speed of operation, optical clarity (you might get 200 mm, but it won't be as sharp), and high ISO performance.
Click to expand...


Yes, now that he has clarfied that can be true - but lets see you get a 3500 x 2700 image :D with a P&S - many other factors are what make the DSLR's worth the extra money - as well the lense cost considerably more due to the higher quality of the glass used, number of "lenses" / glass plates in the lense, body contruction.


Yes a DSLR is an expensive hobby when you want to get into better lenses - that i wont deny! but over all if you have the funds i think a rebel would more then make up in all of it's other features the P&S lack.
 
fugu said:
Well, it seems like his primary concern is the lack of shutter lag. A DSLR is really the way to go with regards to that.
Click to expand...
I agree wholeheartedly. I have my D50 now and, it is sweet. Just turn it on and, it is focused and, ready to shoot. Lag time while measureable, is not perceptible to me. There are a ton of deals out there on the DSLRs. For example www.abesofmaine.com . They routinely have packages with extras at a great price. My D50 kit came with the remote and, a 512 SDcard at $699. Was a smokin deal and, they change the package often. Their current deal is 846.99 adds on the Nikor 55-200 DX lense.
While lenses will add to cost and, are not as handy as, P&S's. They are worth every penny.
 
If you guys think that for SLR I pretty much have to buy the extra len to be "in par" with the Panasonic, then that would be $3000 for a 8 MB pixel camera. In for a penny, in for a pound, I thought if someone were to spend $3K for a digital camera, might as well spend $8K+ hasselblad to get a 22 MB pixel camera.

But I don't use the camera often enough to motivate me to spend that kind of money.

So if the Panasonic Lumix DMC-FZ5.has no noticeable delay, and if compare w/ the $800 rebel XT, it has the same performance of lens. I'll go w/ the Panasonic.

Tim, is it made in Japan?

EDIT:

Tim, you got me, I almost went to the store. That camera is only 5 MB, I need at least 8 MB, do you any brand name, made in Japan, w/ 8 MB that is instant? Like the Panasonic you mention?
 
how big of pics are you printing or hoping to print? A good steady shot on a 6.3mp DRebel properly exposed can do 11x14's with ease.
 
But w/ 8 MB pixel, there can be a much higher resolution, and w/ today's 30" monitor, if the picture is not perfect, a higher resolution "not so good" photo can resize to say 2560x1600 and became a very good picture.
 
Happy Hopping:
There is a Panasonic DMC-FZ30 ( review: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicfz30/ ) that is basically the FZ5 but with a flash hot-shoe, an 8 megapixel sensor, a more powerful flash, and an overall larger/heavier camera body. It seems to sell around ~$600, though I don't know how easily it can be found. (somewhat new)



I become uneasy as the price gets above $500 for a digital compact / P&S camera, because that's quite a big chunk of cash. The $200 between the FZ30 and FZ5 gets you a flash hot-shoe & an 8 megapixel sensor.

Luckily they enlarge the sensor (and len's focal-length) a little bit so the average pixel size is only a tiny bit smaller on the higher-resolution camera so there should be only a small difference in quality at the "100% zoom" level.

But in general the ~$700 P&S digital is the same as the ~$400 ones, but with a higher "megapixel" number and (unforutnately) the same sensor area.




Definatley play with the camera in a store if you can to ensure it is made where you want it to be made, that it fits in your hand, and responds well for you. If it is too slow...there isn't much in the ~$500 range I can think of that should do better.

Most of the other high-end super-zoom digital compacts (Canon PowerShot S2 IS, Nikon Coolpix 8800) focus slower than the Panasonic, but once they're pre-focused with a half-press of the shutter-button, they take about the same amount of time to actually respond and take the picture (0.1 sec according to DPReview). Most cameras just need to be pre-focused to respond quickly.

And DSLRs are generally having shutter-lag times of 0.037 - 0.065 seconds in the high & mid-ranges (D2X - 20D) and 0.1-0.13 in the low-end (350D - 300D)...though the focusing and overall expirence (with the exception of lugging heavy gear bags around) is much better.


I bought a DSLR for what I do (sports/journalism) but I think a good P&S/Digital Compact can work for you. Cheers & Good luck with the camera hunt :)
 
Happy Hopping said:
But w/ 8 MB pixel, there can be a much higher resolution, and w/ today's 30" monitor, if the picture is not perfect, a higher resolution "not so good" photo can resize to say 2560x1600 and became a very good picture.
Click to expand...

umm, yes but all you have to do to get the same effect is make a B&W version on the currnt image and layer it over it and adjust the opacity to get the desired effect to shapen the image.

Your focus shouldnt be on bad shots it should be on how to get your shots good. If your gonna shoot a wedding, sprots, or something with some challenges worry about the mp and the rest. Ive shot monster trucks doing 60 mph on a $300 P&S digital for your rabbit a simple P&S will do too.
 
Kevlarman said:
What kind of rabbit do you have? :D
Click to expand...


mini066rv.th.jpg


http://img208.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mini066rv.jpg

It's a Flemish Giant.
 
Tim_axe said:
Panasonic, but once they're pre-focused with a half-press of the shutter-button, they take about the same amount of time to actually respond and take the picture (0.1 sec according to DPReview). Most cameras just need to be pre-focused to respond quickly.
Click to expand...

Tim, I think this is good for me w/ the 8 MB pixel. Obviously, it doesn't have the delay like the old Olympics I use.

If I pre-focus in a series of backyard shots, am I right as long as I don't move the camera, w/ distance keeping the same, then I only have to pre-focus once?

But if I were chasing my rabbit around, I'll have to constantly pre-focus before shooting the picture?
 
If the distance is kept the same, you only need to prefocus once. If the rabbit is moving around, you'll need to refocus. Or you can use the continuous focus mode of the camera, though that drains batteries faster and it isn't guranteed to keep up (though if it does it could reduce delays from a non-focus scenario)


One thing I came across though is that the camera we're talking about has a manual focus ring. When you jump into manual focus mode, the Electronic-ViewFinder (EVF) enlarges the center of the image and shows you how well it is focused. By turning the ring you can follow the subject (and there is a button to kick in the auto-focus for a short time to help out). So you could bypass the auto-focus entirely and may be able to manually-focus on your rabbit, though I don't know for sure how quickly it works.

It also has a mechanical zoom ring, which means you control the zoom level by turning it. Just like a decent zoom lens on a SLR camera.


See another review at:
http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/panasonic/dmc_fz30-review/index.shtml
 
Focusing times in these modes are usually 0.1 - 0.3 seconds -- even at the telephoto end. In the regular AF modes the focus times are practically twice as long.
Click to expand...

if the above is true, then I would be quite happy. I have 2 questions:

The "catch" with the high speed modes is that the image on the LCD and EVF freezes briefly when focusing occurs
Click to expand...

what would be the drawback of the "freezes"?

Q. 2: I thought the FZ30 is NOT a SLR camera. Why did the bottom of the review say it's a slr style camera?
 
Q. 1 - The freeze

The only draw back is the LCD won't update the picture for a brief period of time during the high-speed auto-focus. After that the LCD should work normally again, AND the picture would be in focus.


Q. 2 - SLR-Style

Unlike a compact or ultra compact digital camera where the components are packed into a box, the camera in question has a lens that protrudes from the body permanently. It is larger than the compacts, but smaller than a fully-loaded SLR. But it also lacks certain features that a true SLR has.

Unlike a SLR, this camera is missing a true optical-viewfinder & mirror-reflex mechanism. The lens is non-interchangeable, though it is a pretty good lens for a small camera. It is generally accepted that SLR lenses are interchangeable.

It does have a few features not found on most compact cameras though, such as the flash hot-shoe and image stabalization features. It also has an electronic-viewfinder (EVF), which many compact cameras leave out because it takes up a lot of space. This is a kick-back to people who are used to viewfinders on traditional cameras, though it is all digital and will all sorts of interface options.

SLR viewfinders are optical, that is the reflex-mirror in a SLR focuses the light from the lens into the viewfinder until the picture is made where the mirror is moved to focus light on the sensor/film.




Maybe that helped get you somewhere...but just go and check the camera out and see if it works for you. I don't have the camera in question, so I can't tell you a whole lot about it beyond what the reviews say.

BTW, not directed at you Happy Hopping, but has anyone else noticed we need to make a sticky that explains the camera lingo? We're probably the only [H] subforum lacking an informative sticky on our topic...
 
I own an FZ-20(precursor to FZ-30). If it's shutter lag you're worried about, DO NOT get a Panasonic unless you are comfortable with manual focus and know how to use it. The shutterlag on AF with the FZ20 is pretty bad for action shots. The Manual focus lag is actually alright if you know what you are doing and don't forget to focus.
 
Tim_axe said:
BTW, not directed at you Happy Hopping, but has anyone else noticed we need to make a sticky that explains the camera lingo? We're probably the only [H] subforum lacking an informative sticky on our topic...
Click to expand...

Make a thread, send me a PM, and I'll sticky it.
 
mwarps said:
I own an FZ-20(precursor to FZ-30). If it's shutter lag you're worried about, DO NOT get a Panasonic unless you are comfortable with manual focus and know how to use it. The shutterlag on AF with the FZ20 is pretty bad for action shots. The Manual focus lag is actually alright if you know what you are doing and don't forget to focus.
Click to expand...

It's shutter lag that is my main concern, having said that, what would you recommend?
 
mwarps said:
I own an FZ-20(precursor to FZ-30). If it's shutter lag you're worried about, DO NOT get a Panasonic unless you are comfortable with manual focus and know how to use it. The shutterlag on AF with the FZ20 is pretty bad for action shots. The Manual focus lag is actually alright if you know what you are doing and don't forget to focus.
Click to expand...

Really?
I have the FZ20 as well, and as long as I pre-focus or not use the multi-point AF, I find shutter lag to be very short.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top