Dell U2410

wagsrules said:
I may be wrong but will they actually flash older monitors with the new firmware or just limit it to new monitors?
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My understanding is that you can exchange your old-firmware monitor for one with the new firmware but you won't get a "brand new monitor", instead a refurb that has had the firmware flashed. I was looking for the Dell post I read this from but I couldn't find it...
 
Thedrun said:
My understanding is that you can exchange your old-firmware monitor for one with the new firmware but you won't get a "brand new monitor", instead a refurb that has had the firmware flashed. I was looking for the Dell post I read this from but I couldn't find it...
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Yes, this is correct. Presumably then your old monitor will get flashed by Dell in turn and then sent out to someone else as a flashed refurb. And the Cycle of Monitor Life goes on...
 
DAMN IT. I got my monitor in today and it is a A00. I am scared to open it up to find if there are any problems. I wish they sent me a A01.

I'm highly consider reselling this since it is not a A01. What would you guys do?
 
retardude48 said:
DAMN IT. I got my monitor in today and it is a A00. I am scared to open it up to find if there are any problems. I wish they sent me a A01.

I'm highly consider reselling this since it is not a A01. What would you guys do?
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Sorry to hear you got the bum firmware. It sucks that a fix which was supposedly in the hubs on Nov. 20th according to the Dell rep is still nowhere to be found in the hands of actual customers.

I guess the rep didn't exactly say it would be labeled A01 - "The fix was in place on November 20 for the sRGB dithering. Even though the fix was put to all in the factory and hubs, the label may not have been changed." If their plan is to fix a problem but give no visible indicators on the box that something has changed I dunno what they're thinking.
 
On the Dell Forum no one has confirmed that the updated firmware is actually going to say A01 on it.

If you read this thread it does not say anywhere that it will say A01.

http://en.community.dell.com/forums/t/19307543.aspx?PageIndex=1

ChrisM from Dell is checking to see if the label actually does say A01.

If I were you I would open the new monitor you received today and see whether it has dithering or not. If it doesn't then they fixed it, but you did not get a new label... In the thread I posted here ChrisM said the label might not be changed. Check it out and report back to us.
 
Do you guys think that they would be able to check if this monitor has the new firmware if I gave them the serial number for the monitor?
 
For what it's worth, i spoke to someone in Ireland Tech Support yesterday and provided my order # to see if they could let me know what firmware it would ship with. They were pretty helpless, and didn't even know what i meant by new firmware. But they said i should contact them again when my monitor is in-hand and perhaps they could help me further. So it can't hurt to call and ask.
 
retardude48 said:
Do you guys think that they would be able to check if this monitor has the new firmware if I gave them the serial number for the monitor?
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You don't need Dell's help. You may as well go ahead and open the monitor and check it out. Just go to this page and look at the dark grey squares.

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php

Under the preset modes, flip from an RGB mode to any other mode. Watch the squares. If your monitor has not been updated, you will see dithering in the grey squares under both RGB modes. If they are smooth in all modes, your monitor has been updated.

I have a feeling this process is in the early days yet and it will take weeks, or months, to get all the inventory processed. They may not even reopen and flash currently sealed and packaged monitors, instead relying on most users not ever noticing. It's what I would do if I was a morally deviant executive pressed to a hard profit line by a faceless Board of Directors with homes in the Grand Caymans. Not saying Dell is, mind you, but you get the drift.
 
Betaboy said:
You don't need Dell's help. You may as well go ahead and open the monitor and check it out. Just go to this page and look at the dark grey squares.

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php

Under the preset modes, flip from an RGB mode to any other mode. Watch the squares. If your monitor has not been updated, you will see dithering in the grey squares under both RGB modes. If they are smooth in all modes, your monitor has been updated.

I have a feeling this process is in the early days yet and it will take weeks, or months, to get all the inventory processed. They may not even reopen and flash currently sealed and packaged monitors, instead relying on most users not ever noticing. It's what I would do if I was a morally deviant executive pressed to a hard profit line by a faceless Board of Directors with homes in the Grand Caymans. Not saying Dell is, mind you, but you get the drift.
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Hee hee, that's pretty good. Anyway I think he's wanting to know without opening the box for ease of resale or return.
 
A question about Dell monitor warranties. If I buy a used Dell monitor from someone that had say a 3 year warranty and the monitor is only 6 months old, does the remainining 2.5 years of warranty transfer over to me?
 
vjcsmoke said:
A question about Dell monitor warranties. If I buy a used Dell monitor from someone that had say a 3 year warranty and the monitor is only 6 months old, does the remainining 2.5 years of warranty transfer over to me?
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You might want to look into a transfer of ownership, ala http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/change_order/tag_transfer
Dunno if there are special rules for monitors but I think they have service tags like anything else Dell.
 
Thedrun said:
Hee hee, that's pretty good. Anyway I think he's wanting to know without opening the box for ease of resale or return.
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Yeah, I caught that...but I don't think it matters. Just keep the box and packing in good shape. Having been through three returns/exchanges myself, I'm an old hat at it. ;) Within 30 days or purchase, you will get new monitors exchanged for your existing one. Past 30 days, you get a refurb. Opened/unopened won't matter IMO...
 
setekh said:
That's not exactly true. In Portugal, there's no warranty for 2nd hand products. Also, for items bought outside the border, some manufactures refuse to provide warranty, so that's something you have to arrange with the store you bought the screen from.

Bacano, try and call Dell Portugal. I don't think they've started selling to the general public yet, but they're your best bet. If that fails, you'll most likely have to pay carriage back to the UK yourself and sort it with overclockers.co.uk.
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Dell is only one so I hope the costumer service is as good as in USA or UK. I'll call them tomorrow and see how It'll go. I'll post more news.
setekh are you from Portugal? do you have the U2410?
 
Betaboy said:
Yeah, I caught that...but I don't think it matters. Just keep the box and packing in good shape. Having been through three returns/exchanges myself, I'm an old hat at it. ;) Within 30 days or purchase, you will get new monitors exchanged for your existing one. Past 30 days, you get a refurb. Opened/unopened won't matter IMO...
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Why only 30 days? If the warranty is 3 years I think they should exchange for a new one if the other has any problem.
 
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tubedogg said:
My U2410s came yesterday (ordered about a week ago).

A00.

Regardless, this is a flawless monitor and I'm very happy with my purchase. I tried as hard as I can to find the "tinting".. but it's not there!
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Can you us some pics of the monitor?
 
Bacano said:
Dell is only one so I hope the costumer service is as good as in USA or UK. I'll call them tomorrow and see how It'll go. I'll post more news.
setekh are you from Portugal? do you have the U2410?
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Let's see how that goes! Nah, I thought about getting it, but the tint issue made me change my mind.

Sim, português. Em relação ao apoio, creio que a Dell ainda não tem a estrutura de apoio ao cliente montada em Portugal (suponho que só para clientes empresariais), pelo que talvez seja difícil fazer a troca pela Dell portuguesa.
 
retardude48 said:
Check out the latest post from Chris M.

"Is it possible to exchange my current monitor for a A01 revised U2410 monitor?
* Not at this time. My advice is return it and repurchase when I have a date of the A01."

http://en.community.dell.com/forums/p/19307543/19606480.aspx#19606480
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I saw that too, very confusing. I thought the sRGB dithering fix was supposed to be A01, just that the labeling might be delayed. Now it seems like it's a different thing altogether.
 
I just got my u2410 yesterday, and unfortunately it has the dithering issue (judging by the lagom test). I was wondering what the dell exchange experience is? Am I going to have to suffer without a monitor for a period of time, or do they send one once I fill out the rma form and let me send mine in once I get it? Also, is there any final word on the dithering fix? The card on my monitor says it was assembled in Nov in Mexico. If I send it in for an exchange can I be reasonably sure I'll get a new one with the fix applied?
 
Just opened this bad boy up. First impressions. ITS HUGE. :D:D

Checked out the dithering problem and I have it. It will be sent back to Dell for an exchange. Mine was made in Mexico as well, with a November assembly date.


Here is a youtube video I made showing my the dithering problem.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b43vduFPinQ&fmt=22

Youtube is still processing the video so the quality may improve in a little while.
 
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If I were you I would post in the Dell thread and tell ChrisM that you got a November monitor and it still has the problem. ChrisM said that after Nov 20 the monitors should be fixed. See what he says to that.
 
Unfortunately can't post pics of my monitors since I don't have my camera at the moment...

BUT:
I just visited http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php and see that the monitor does have the "dithering" problem.

Question though:
Why exactly is this bad for normal monitor usage?

I understand that we should expect top notch quality when paying this much for a monitor.. but are we just splitting hairs here?

=========

Also:
 
Just did some research on the issue.. someone correct me if my understanding is incorrect.

-- Adobe RGB and sRGB are color standards; Primarily to be used by graphic designers and photographers to make sure that colors they see match colors that others see.

-- While the monitor has an "Adobe RGB and sRGB mode", using these is not reliable and is merely an approximation designed to get you part way to these true color standards; You still need to calibrate your monitor with a hardware device.

-- Therefore, even for graphics designed professionals it is best to leave monitor in "standard" mode and calibrate from there.

-- "Dithering" issues on U2410s appear only when you switch to sRGB mode.

Given that 95% of us have no reason to be in this mode, what's the big deal?
 
tubedogg said:
Given that 95% of us have no reason to be in this mode, what's the big deal?
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The main reason is that this is a wide-gamut monitor and any mode but the RGB will display colors in a very....vivid fashion. If you can calibrate the Standard mode, it will look better. If you can't you will find things look very saturated. This is due to the monitor's wide color gamut. Reds will look almost neon, for example. Green grass will look like the Hulk sat down and had a haircut.

The best modes out of the box in terms of looking proper are the RGB modes. I use the Adobe RGB for most tasks and gaming. I don't want to have to switch around with modes and load different ICC profiles each time I run an app.

Windows is not color managed and neither are most apps, so if you use the other modes, you'll have saturated colors.

If you like the look of the saturated colors, you're good to go. However if you find them too cartoonish your only options are calibration and/or using your video card software to turn down the saturation, etc.

This is a future-forward monitor...it's too bad the rest of the OS's and apps haven't caught up yet.

Firefox v.3+ is the only browser I know that is color managed.
 
Just received my U2410 today. It does have the dithering problem in sRGB and aRGB. :mad:

However, I'm running on a Mac and can use the Standard preset, so I may keep it.

Button beep is annoying as hell. Turned that off within 5min of using the display. The IPS sparkle is a little worse than my 2490wuxi, but for 1/2 the cost, I may live with it.
 
Well, I just got off with a great representative from dell. Pretty much he guaranteed me that I will get the new revision. He looked through the system and found out these new batches are in stock and will ship me one. Only drawback is that he is charging me the retail price with tax and what not and he will credit me back my money once I ship my old monitor out to them. Hopefully everything will work out fine.

I suggest if you guys have this option, to go with this route. I will keep you guys updated at always.

Best.
 
Thanks retardude48 for the video, a little guerrilla on the camera work but it gets the point across. Your updates regarding your experience with the U2410 are much appreciated. How's the tint uniformity?

Thanks Betaboy for explaining succinctly why the dither issue is a legitimate concern.

Thanks foodle for your monitor report. Have you looked over for any tint issues?

If there were some way to be assured of receiving a non-dithering monitor I would try my luck with the tinting problems at sub-$500 price tag. I get the sneaking suspicion that the sale prices currently being offered are a result of Dell not wanting to re-flash all the existing stock (opening sealed boxes, etc.) and hoping they can flush out what they have without customers noticing. I'm further convinced this is the case because they wouldn't give retardude48 one with the fix at the lowered price he purchased the first one at. In any event I won't be bothering until the dither issue is gone for good. Why take chances with dither and tinting when it can at least be limited to just tinting.
 
tubedogg said:
Just did some research on the issue.. someone correct me if my understanding is incorrect.

-- Adobe RGB and sRGB are color standards; Primarily to be used by graphic designers and photographers to make sure that colors they see match colors that others see.
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Not quite. Many people want to use sRGB mode to avoid the problems associated with wide gamut monitors too, which will make greens and particularly reds look over-saturated in non colour-managed (read: the majority of) Windows applications and games or TV content etc, so there are major reasons to want a good sRGB mode.

While the monitor has an "Adobe RGB and sRGB mode", using these is not reliable and is merely an approximation designed to get you part way to these true color standards; You still need to calibrate your monitor with a hardware device.
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Dell provide these modes pre-calibrated. Whilst this calibration is only to a dE of <5 (which isn't spectacular) most screens have reports which claim a dE of <2 for the majority of colours, which is fairly reasonable. The reality is also that the majority of people likely to buy a U2410 are never going to own their own hardware calibration device,

Therefore, even for graphics designed professionals it is best to leave monitor in "standard" mode and calibrate from there. -- "Dithering" issues on U2410s appear only when you switch to sRGB mode.
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Not quite :) Using the onboard LUT's features of the U2410 means you can correct for colours in a universal way - no profiles required - It's all contained inside the monitor. It's just a nicer way of doing things and you can easily switch mode from the monitor. Many people have reasons to want to switch between sRGB and wide gamut modes too, not just people using Photoshop (EG As mentioned, you probably wouldn't want to watch TV on wide gamut settings) so it's just a lot less messy if the monitor can handle things properly. It comes with this feature, so it'd be nice to use them without darker images appearing grainy.

Given that 95% of us have no reason to be in this mode, what's the big deal?
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I don't see too many people saying the dithering was THAT big of a deal - more of an annoyance. However, because so few applications are colour managed, and so much content is create with sRGB in mind, many more than 5% of people will want to use sRGB mode to minimize the wide gamut issue, but still have a way to get back to a wider gamut if necessary. The U2410 is supposed to provide this without the need to buy additional hardware, which the average user doesn't have and (as said) is unlikely to ever have - So it's best Dell get it right and provide something usable from the start.

The only thing I'd say is a "big deal" on the U2410 is the monitors which suffer noticeable gradation tint issues. Indeed, I won't be returning my Rev A00 unless I actually have a hardware problem, because I don't want an A01 back which is green on one side and pink on the other, which Dell will then tell me is "within spec" and thus not covered by their warranty, and there appears to be a significant risk of this with current panels..
 
And thanks to PatK for a much more involved explanation of why the dither issue is a legitimate concern =)

I definitely share your outlook, the dither issue is the smaller of the two issues. If I had one with good tint uniformity and dithering I would take that over one without dithering and bad pink/green in the corners. Since I guess we have no control over getting good or bad tint though, at the very least we can wait to make sure the dither issue is gone.
 
Cursory check of my display shows only the barest of minimum tint issues (bluish on the left, ok on the right). All I did was display a white background and look at it. Is there a better way to check for tint. Slight to the point of possibly being psychosomatic.

I've made the mistake of setting up the U2410 right next to my 2490wuxi. The NEC is clearly better (but again at 2x the cost).
 
foodle said:
Cursory check of my display shows only the barest of minimum tint issues (bluish on the left, ok on the right). All I did was display a white background and look at it. Is there a better way to check for tint. Slight to the point of possibly being psychosomatic.

I've made the mistake of setting up the U2410 right next to my 2490wuxi. The NEC is clearly better (but again at 2x the cost).
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Sounds like you got a good one. Trust me, if it had tint issues, you would see it immediately. As per my Chernobyl Revision specimen. It wouldn't have looked out of place in a Rainbow Brite commercial.
 
foodle said:
Cursory check of my display shows only the barest of minimum tint issues (bluish on the left, ok on the right). All I did was display a white background and look at it. Is there a better way to check for tint. Slight to the point of possibly being psychosomatic.

I've made the mistake of setting up the U2410 right next to my 2490wuxi. The NEC is clearly better (but again at 2x the cost).
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One thing I've seen people doing - If you really want to go crazy on it, crank the saturation to the max while looking at a white screen. It will make the colors go wonky, but any color gradation issues will appear super-obvious.

Also in other news: GIVE ME YOUR 2490WUXI !!! :eek::eek::eek:
 
Checking for tint - If it's anything to be concerned about your eyes will definitely spot it without any effort or any additional boosting. Certain shades of lighter grey may actually show the problem up more than a white background will. The background on the Lagom viewing angle test might show it more than a white background does
http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/viewing_angle.php

It can also be either red, green, or blue tints. Blue is reported less often and can tend to look more like that area of the screen is darker, rather than having an obvious blue tint. It can also run top to bottom as well as left to right although the most common one is definitely a green bottom left and pink top right.
 
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