Consumer Reports Pulls Tesla Model 3 Recommendation Again

Discussion in 'HardForum Tech News' started by AlphaAtlas, Feb 22, 2019.

  1. AlphaAtlas

    AlphaAtlas [H]ard|Gawd Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,713
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Consumer Reports has a complicated history with the Tesla. The Model S an X weren't exactly loved by the nonprofit testing organization, and Consumer Reports pulled their recommendation for the Model 3 last year after it found serious braking issues with the Model 3. In a remarkable demonstration of Tesla's update system, the flaw was quickly fixed, and Consumer Reports reinstated their recommendation, but New Atlas reports that withdrawn it again. According to the magazine's website, Model 3 owners have "identified a number of problems with their cars, including issues with its body hardware, as well as paint and trim. CR members reported these results in our annual reliability survey, which includes data on about 470,000 vehicles."

    Consumer reports talks about the Model 3's reliability score in the video here.

    Model 3 owners in our spring survey sample reported some body hardware and in-car electronics problems, such as the screen freezing, which we have seen with other Tesla models. The latest survey data also shows complaints about paint and trim issues. In addition, some members reported that the Model 3's sole display screen acted strangely. "The touch screen would intermittently begin acting as if someone was touching it rapidly at many different points," one member wrote in. "This fault would cause music to play, volume to increase to maximum, and would rescale and pan the map in the navigation system." Some owners also complained about glass defects, including cracks in the rear window, in their survey responses. In fact, CR experienced similar problems with its own Model 3. Earlier this year, our test vehicle developed a large crack in its massive rear window during a cold spell when it was parked outside.
     
  2. DrDoU

    DrDoU 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,370
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2007
    as if someone where touching it.Might have ghosts.I see the dead touching my screen.
     
  3. YeuEmMaiMai

    YeuEmMaiMai [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    14,816
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    OMG!!!!! OMG!!!! NOT THE ALLMIGHTY TESLA!!! they can do no wrong!!!!
     
    LightsOut41 and kirbyrj like this.
  4. travisty

    travisty Gawd

    Messages:
    815
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2016
    Huh. My Model 3 has had not problems.
     
  5. Biznatch

    Biznatch 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,223
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2009
    These sound like minor problems that exist in pretty much every car from every manufacturer..... But getting it fixed by tesla is typically much easier than dealing with dealership repairs from any of the other big 3.... Try getting ford to fix a minor issue. They'll just tell you it's 'normal' and send it back without even looking at it. I know from experience..... I still wouldn't trade my RS for a tesla, but if I had room/money I would love to have a 3 as a second car.
     
  6. KarsusTG

    KarsusTG 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,992
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2010
    Didn't the new tesla suv get their first ever perfect safety score for an suv?
     
  7. Sikkyu

    Sikkyu I Question Reality

    Messages:
    2,882
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2010
    model 3's are crap, the really expensive ones have enough testing but are way overpriced anyway.
     
    LightsOut41 likes this.
  8. Biznatch

    Biznatch 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,223
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2009

    Have you seen the video of them trying to get the car to roll over? That battery pack puts the COG so low it's almost impossible to roll. That thing was like a 40* angle from the ground and still ended up back on its wheels. NO other SUV on the market can match that, and a lot of them flip very easily.


    Is this based on ANY personal experience, are are you just a forum parrot repeating stuff you read online? We must have 30+ models 3's in our garage at work, and at least that number of model S's. I haven't heard anything but minor complaints from any of the actual OWNERS of the cars....... And any time there is an issue, tesla doesn't make it difficult to get warranty repair work done like the big manufacturers (with shitty dealership mechanics). Hell, tesla will send a trained tech to your house with all tools required to complete minor repairs when possible....... When I have to get warranty work done at ford, I have to wait in a long ass line (with an appointment scheduled 2 weeks in advance), then let the car sit in their lot for a week before they can even look at it. Then they either say it's normal or blame some completely irrelevant 3rd party part installed and do nothing.....
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
    refraxion likes this.
  9. SLee

    SLee Gawd

    Messages:
    955
    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2002
    It's not new, the scores were from years ago and done by the US Government's NHTSA. However, since the introduction of the Model X, it's yet to be tested by other agencies, such as IIHS or Europe's NCAP. The Model S's NHTSA's scores were used to claim incredible safety as well, but didn't do as well in European or IIHS testing.

    https://www.euroncap.com/en/results/tesla/model-s/7897
    https://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/vehicle/v/tesla/model-s-4-door-hatchback
     
  10. Wierdo

    Wierdo [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,776
    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2011
    That's the challenge the publication has with these cars, they don't have yearly update cycles but rather get iterative design tweaks on a monthly or even weekly basis. How do you review something that's already updated with new features, fixes or improvements the following month?

    They'll keep switching between recommending and not recommending and then back, just like they did with the Model S and Model X before that, as the company doesn't make it easy to track the "version" of the product on the hardware side.

    Software side is easier though at least.

    I believe the European and IIHS testing preceded - or perhaps aided in, who knows - some further tweaks to the products, so some of those tests may need re-testing, I assume that's a yearly process, not sure.

    For example the Model 3's lighting got an upgraded score in the IIHS tests after a tweak a few months ago, enough to land the car in their "top safety pick" category:
    https://www.greencarreports.com/new...3-now-in-the-running-for-iihs-top-safety-pick
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
  11. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    I don't know why you think it's common for major manufacturers to produce cars with paint, trim, glass, electronics, and safety issues but it's simply not true. It's not reasonable to expect a company that is just learning how to manufacture something like a vehicle to produce them at the same level of quality control companies with over a hundred years experience are doing, but at the same time it's not useful to ignore the problems they are exhibiting.
     
  12. Biznatch

    Biznatch 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,223
    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2009
    Because it is common.... Especially for budget cars, and the 3 is a 'budget' tesla. I have all sort of minor issues on my RS (a 40k focus....), and a lot of them are common among most users. Most of these users have also had other cars and experienced other minor problems, myself included..... Creaks/rattles, misaligned panels, cracking windshields etc. I can give an example of each of these issues in non teslas. Subarus have ringland issues, I would know because I had to replace the fully stock engine on my forester.

    Maybe you're just the luckiest person alive, and have never had a car with minor defects, but that is definitely not the norm for any budget car from any car manufacturer.
     
  13. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    No, none of those are minor defects.
     
    LightsOut41 likes this.
  14. Sikkyu

    Sikkyu I Question Reality

    Messages:
    2,882
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2010
    pack it in boys, travisty says it has no problems.
     
    kirbyrj, MrTryfe, LightsOut41 and 2 others like this.
  15. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Paint is minor. If you get a chip in your paint, do you freak out it's going to crash or something?
     
  16. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    hahaha, ok, so in your mind the concerns are over chips in the paint? The problem is that a chip in the paint is not a major issue, but if I bought a new car with chips in the paint I would not accept that vehicle. If you want to accept subpar quality that's your choice.

    But more to the point, no one is talking about chips in the paint. If the entire car's paint is orange peeled, that's a quality control issue.
    You keep slagging on Ford. When was the last time you bought or even saw a Ford, even one 10 years old, where the entire paint job was orange peeled?

    I've heard some people complain about their domestic vehicles in terms of comfort, quality, and sometimes misaligned trim. But I've never seen or even heard of a major manufacturer just completely forget to put an entire trim panel on a door, as the case has been with Teslas.

    I've never seen misaligned body panels like Telsa vehicles. Perhaps you can get into the gaps between the panels and detect mm differences, but Tesla owners have reported things as drastic is one side of the hood is rubbing against a fender while the other side has a half inch gap of space.

    So again, you can choose to accept those, but no one is going to buy your claim that a Model S is a "budget" car compared against a $15K Ford stripper model that doesn't have those issues even in it's worst incarnation.
     
  17. Brian_B

    Brian_B 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,174
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2012
    I think if I just spent $40-60k on my new car, "budget" or otherwise, I would expect the damn thing to be perfect.

    In fact, even if I just spent $1 dollar flat on a Hot Wheels, I would still expect it to work and be in a new condition as advertised. Or I would take it back for exchange or refund.

    Funny thing, thinking that you don't deserve what you are paying for. I don't accept the excuses that Tesla is young, that the car is new, that Tesla is a startup, or that Tesla is still trying to figure it out. Those are all just that - excuses. That being said, I also don't put a lot of account into what media puts out - they love to overblow things, because hyperbole sells. I'd believe folks here if they posted that their Model 3 sucked, or is great. Hey, it may not mean much as a sample of 1, but those individual stories start to add up.... Just like the claims of nVidia RTX failings.
     
    kirbyrj, LightsOut41 and Unter Dog like this.
  18. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    After I submitted my post I googled "Tesla paint problems" to see what the latest hits would bring up. The top link was a forum discussion of Tesla owners complete with pictures: https://forums.tesla.com/forum/forums/model-3-paint-issues-factory
     
  19. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    The point being it's minor. I did not choose anything. Only stating that the paint is not going to affect the car and fly apart, blow up, not stop, crash, etc.
     
  20. Snishsnoosh

    Snishsnoosh n00b

    Messages:
    20
    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2018
    No love lost for Tesla, but Consumer Reports is absolute trash.

    Suzuki Motor Corp. v. Consumers Union of the U.S., Inc
     
  21. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Seems I mixed you up with Biznatch, but I don't really care about your (or my) *opinion* about whether something is or isn't a minor problem. The severity of an issue is subjective. What I wrote is that other manufacturers do not have as many of these problems, which is an *objective* statement.



    My GSW TDI has 80,000 miles on it and the paint doesn't look like that car with only 21 miles on it.
     
    LightsOut41 and Unter Dog like this.
  22. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Well if you can prove the car will not work, run or whatever with some paint fading, please enlighten us. :)
     
  23. SLee

    SLee Gawd

    Messages:
    955
    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2002
  24. FearTheCow

    FearTheCow [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,713
    Joined:
    May 2, 2006
    I think you are missing his point, a $40k+ vehicle shouldn't have the fit and finish problems that the model 3 has.
     
    kirbyrj and LightsOut41 like this.
  25. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    No, the point is if it's major or minor. It's minor. Common sense says so.
    Brakes would be major or anything affecting safety. Should it have a problem with paint? At that price no, not even close.
     
  26. YeuEmMaiMai

    YeuEmMaiMai [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    14,816
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    uhm,

    seeing how it is a disproportionate amount of cars, those minor issues are major ones. even cheap cars do not have those fit/finish issues...
     
  27. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Uhm, you might need to read about what the definition of minor and major is.

    Paint fading, paint chips, a microscopic paint flaw, a scratch so small you need a microscope to see it, it is all minor. MINOR. As in it will not stop the vehicle from performing the way it should. Minor.
    It should not happen to any car really. But if it does, it is MINOR. If you think it's major, then you have more problems than paint and should see a doctor.
     
  28. YeuEmMaiMai

    YeuEmMaiMai [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    14,816
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    just might want to take a step back and figure out why this is a major problem....I could take the time and spell it out but I am busy at the moment....but I will leave you with this to consider

    the vast number of cars that they are letting out of the door with these minor problems are what makes it a major one.

    talk about quality control fail on a rather large purchase.... My phone is put together better than those cars are.... speak of cars MY SUBARU is better put together...
     
  29. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    It is a major problem to a minor one.

    I am not sure how they are put together but for the price they need more QA.
     
  30. Brian_B

    Brian_B 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,174
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2012
    I don't know that it matters a lot if it's major or minor. I mean, sure, there's a difference between a flaw that could spell life or death, and one that's purely cosmetic. But in the context of this discussion, I don't know that it matters.

    And I don't expect every car to roll off the assembly line "perfect" - there's always flaws.

    But what I do expect is that, if I find a problem that existed from the time of purchase, no matter how severe or of what nature, that my dealer takes care of it under warranty service.

    It's important if Tesla is shipping cars with a lot of defects, it points to manufacturing issues. Those can be corrected though. What really counts to me, as a consumer though, is if Tesla cares about their customers enough to correct the problems and make things right. When you find something wrong, do you fix it, or do you hem and haw and leave the consumer hanging...

    I actually have no idea if Tesla is good in this regard or not. I did read one story where they were dragging their feet on refunds, but I don't know if that is a widespread problem or just a media outlet looking for clicks and picked up on a handful of sob stories (click that link at your own peril, I'm not promoting them, only providing a source). I know that service after the sale counts as much as quality of product and price, for me.
     
  31. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Tesla seems to be making good on getting the issues resolved, but the problems are so numerous and the number of vehicles impacted are so many that it's taking some people more than 6 months to get their vehicles back.

    You're right in pointing out the major vs. minor issue is not a constructive difference to argue about. Hagrid is essentially arguing with himself. I already pointed out in post #16 that paint issues are not major. He quoted the post and then argued paint wasn't a major issue...so it's not entirely clear why he keeps quoting me and arguing against my posts to then basically write the same damn thing (paint issues aren't a major issue, quality control is not good enough).

    I did a search on "major" from the start of the thread to see what exactly set him off on that tangent and the only time I used "major" in the thread (and I was the first) was to describe the "major" manufacturers to distinguish them from say DeLorean or VIA Motors. The only other time I used "major" was to state that paint issues aren't major concerns, but that the widespread concerns point to manufacturing concerns (again, to differentiate it from the one-off problems people experience with their mainstream vehicles that don't exhibit such problems at such an alarming frequency).

    He just keeps banging away on his drum. Not sure what will get him to step off the soapbox since agreeing didn't work :/
     
  32. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    If I am arguing with myself then why are you answering? ;)
    You just said paint issues are not a major concern. That was my point. Overall there might be major issues.
     
  33. mope54

    mope54 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,437
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2004
    Literally no one in this thread has written that paint blemishes are a major defect, yet you keep quoting people and arguing with them.

    I'm generally a nice guy with empathy so I don't ignore people when they directly quote me or talk to me and I also don't ignore people when they are standing in the corner arguing with themselves.

    So maybe that's why I kept responding to you (I already wrote earlier that the first response was because I thought you were someone else), but whatever the reason it's because I'm trying to make sense of your irrational behavior rather than you making sensible points that need to be refuted.
     
  34. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardForum Junkie

    Messages:
    8,398
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    We have already established what was needed. Why do you keep arguing?