Cannot own PS3 games?

[MonkeyShave]

Seems like Sony denying this:

http://www.engadget.com/2006/05/24/rumor-sony-to-disable-used-ps3-games-sony-nope/

Thank god. Corp. PR flaks have never led me astray before.

Even with the patent, they won't implement this unless they're sure they can get away with it (I don't doubt for a second that they'd love to do it). If the PS3 doesn't take a commanding marketshare lead (70%+) then they won't use it.

A slightly interesting question is whether they'll include the hardware for this in the PS3. The patent mentions several possible implementations, all require some overwritable region. Presumably the game developers would know about it long before we would (it's a major benefit to the game studios), but it seems very unlikely that Sony would implement this in their first round of games (even if you assume they'd implement it ever).

 

[dotK]

Sony does own SecuROM, which can produce CDs with unique keys on each one. These keys could be used in an activation process, if they so desired. For those without internet access they could do a phone based activation thing, but that seems like it would be more hassle than it's worth. With Sony's notorious low quality drives in the PS2, one could only imagine that nightmare that would ensure if/when a bunch of PS3s died and had to be fixed/replaced - potentially changing the console's unique ID which would require people to reactivate. I really don't think they'll do it, and if they do it won't happen right away.

One thing is for sure, if they try some sort of activation BS midway through the lifespan of the PS3, Sony better plan on getting out of the console business permanently because tha will definitely prove to be unpopular. Windows activation is not a big deal because it's not done that often. However, people buy games all the time and imagine what it would be like to try to activate a product around Christmas when millions of new games are being opened up.

Even if Sony is denying it, I don't put a lot of faith in their claim based upon the past.

 

[morningreis]

Well, this pretty much seals the deal for me. I likely wasn't going to buy a PS3 anyways, now I definitely won't. Sony just doesn't care about their customers at all. In fact, I'd wouldn't doubt it if they secretly get off on walking all over them.

Minus the secret part.

 

[Baredor]

I feel compelled to comment, so here goes:

While I, personally, do not buy preowned games because I, personally, like my money to go to the developers who made the game, rather than some moneygrubbing company who just made 1600% profit on reselling it, I recognize the market and broad appeal of the concept. If this information is true, it will most assuredly strike Sony for massive damage.

 

[Nuzzles]

^^^^ Best post of the thread XD LOL

 

[SuperSparky]

Well, I guess they are going to have to convince local governments they are only selling a license and not a product as well. You can't charge sales tax on something you didn't sell.


Can you imagine a book publisher making the same claims? Rediculous. This won't fly when the government sues. Copyright law goes both ways, despite what Sony may think. It spells out what rights a consumer has as well as a copyright holder's rights are. A license cannot circumvent the law.

Besides, I don't think the FTC would allow such a monopolistic approach.

 

[pooky(1)]

Sony is just digging themselves deeper into a hole they can't get out of...cmon now $600 for the console and you can't buy 2nd hand games? Fk that, son.

Wii for the win.

Amen brother! I've been loyal to Sony for many years. Never bought X-Box or 360 and was looking forward for the PS3rd miracle. Not anymore. I like buying 2nd hand games just because they are cheap and by doing so I do not have to submit to piracy. I am not alone into this. I know many others that do the same. There are many video club stores that from time to time issue real bargains for 2nd hand games regarding all major consoles. These bargains I'm after, I buy cheap quality games and when I don't play them anymore I sell them to others or exchange with friends. Bought many 2nd hand games for about 10 Euros, while, here in Greece, you can find the exact pirated copies for the same amount of money.

Wii for the win my friends. I wonder what marketing schools those Sony execs attented. So(rr)ny, I won't follow anymore. Wii360 for me from now on.

PS. Don't know if these roumors are true and honestly I don't care anymore. Just ordered my 360 after reading them. The waiting is over!!!!! Ordering Wii also, when available for sale.

 

[The King of Pants]

I feel compelled to comment, so here goes:

While I, personally, do not buy preowned games because I, personally, like my money to go to the developers who made the game, rather than some moneygrubbing company who just made 1600% profit on reselling it, I recognize the market and broad appeal of the concept. If this information is true, it will most assuredly strike Sony for massive damage.

But then Sony will retaliate with their Giant Enemy Crab!

Hmm, that's kind of off topic... DRM = teh devill!

There all better.

 

[The DarkBlade]

If I was unable to buy pre-owned games, I never would have purchased a Playstation 2. About 7 years ago, I worked at a Babbage's (Gamestop) and the way it happened is this: There are alot of people who buy new games all the time. But one of the reasons they do it is because they play the game, do everything, and then 60-70% of the time, they turn around and sell it back to the store for credit on their next purchase. On the newest titles, you can recover a fair chunk of your investment. Take away this incentive and Sony *will* make less new sales. Besides, like I said I wouldn't have plunked the money down if I didn't think I could pick up the occassional beater title for a dime.

 

[Martyr]

Besides, I don't think the FTC would allow such a monopolistic approach.

you do know the ftc is AGAINST laws regulating price gouging in the oil industry. sounds like they can be bribed. but thats another topic

 

[PSYKOMANTIS]

Sony needs to wake up and smell the HOT COFFEE!

So they are expecting consumers to:

1: Adopt to their new Blue-Ray technology
2: Lose all rights to sell a game and purchase second-hand titles
3: Pay through the nose to get all the features the technologically better system
4: Be forced to utilize their Sony store to buy and purchase music
5: Be connected to the internet so that content put on the console is monitored because you PURCHASED a license to just OWN the system under THEIR terms

Fuck you Sony. You've crossed the line. I'm sad about the fact that MGS4 is going to be on the PS3 and I will NOT adopt the technology just because of the items stated above.
I'm hoping Microsoft kicks your ass back to where you belong... That place is creating some of the finest audio video equipment available on the market. Stick to your guns, the community will speak out with their pocket books. Right now I suspect M$ will drop their system by 50-100 bucks before the PS3 comes out therefore making it the loss leader.
Plus Microsoft's robust library and inexpensive and innovative little box from Nintendo will help weigh heavy on Sony's shoulders.

 

[psychoace]

5: Be connected to the internet so that content put on the console is monitored because you PURCHASED a license to just OWN the system under THEIR terms

You guys just love living on speculation, rumors and lies now don't you? Sony already denied they are going to kill second party purchases and who in the hell said you had to be connected to the internet in order to play your ps3? Blu Ray dosn't need it to function and neither do the games so why in the hell are you kids so paranoid? Do you have your tin caps permenetly stitched into your head or something? Get over it and stop taking these lies as truth. Sony is trying there best to make a good product but "someone" is spreading rumors in order to try and take it down. Wait til it's release and then if you don't like it then fine atleast it isn't because of your wild imaginations.

 

[RGMBill]

You guys just love living on speculation, rumors and lies now don't you? Sony already denied they are going to kill second party purchases.

<Engaging tinfoil beanie phase>Did you read what Sony actually SAID in the announcement, or did you interpret what they said to fit your expectation of it's meaning? The exact quote mentioned NOTHING about second hand purchases... it simply said that SONY wasn't going to use a technological means to stop users from being able to play PS3 games on ANY PS3 console; the discs are not locked to a specific console.

You can therefore interpret that in a number of ways:

1) All is well in the reseller market... this was a tempest in a teapot. (What many, such as you, assume from Sonys comment).

2) Goodbye Second Hand stores... you can't legally resell, but we won't hurt your customers, just expect the SLEA (Sony Legal Enforcement Agency) to be suing you into bankruptcy for violating our copyright by reselling without permission. On the other hand, your users (Pirates that they are!) are ok. (What I personnally think Sony MEANS with the comment, due to it's peculiar wording).

3) Goodbye any kind of for sale process on titles.... totally illegal, and the SLEA will be hunting you down. They've just hired Jack Thompson, btw, and he's looking at YOU. It is legal to own multiple PS3s and use the same title on all the >YOU OWN< however... so it'll cost you $1200 but you can now play MGS4 both in your living room and in your bedroom! Yay! They're still up in the air as to whether or not they should sue you if you let your buddy borrow the disc to play the game at his place.(what Mulder thinks, except substitute "Little Green Aliens" for Jack Thompson... which seems pretty close regardless).

See how you can interpret what Sony said very differently depending on how paranoid you are?

</tinfoil head cover phase>

 

[MonkeyShave]

<Engaging tinfoil beanie phase>Did you read what Sony actually SAID in the announcement, or did you interpret what they said to fit your expectation of it's meaning? The exact quote mentioned NOTHING about second hand purchases... it simply said that SONY wasn't going to use a technological means to stop users from being able to play PS3 games on ANY PS3 console; the discs are not locked to a specific console.

Good point. (Link to the Sony rebuttal on second-hand games, primary sources are good)

Even the patent describes storing the key (disc defect) data on a memory card, and Jennie Kong's statement didn't exclude that.

I would like to clarify that this is false speculation and that PlayStation 3 software will not be copy protected to a single machine but will be playable on any PlayStation 3 console.

I don't know what "copy protected to a single machine" means. The question didn't involve copying, it was about using a legitimate goddamn disc, please try to keep up.

Even so, if we trim that clause, we get: "PlayStation 3 software ... will be playable on any PlayStation 3 console." Which doesn't mention second-hand sales at all.

It still strikes me that they won't deploy this if they don't have a spectacular lead in marketshare (it would assist any competitor enormously), but since the patent mentions "counterfeit or used software" many times, I'm pretty sure Sony would like to end used software sales.

(edit)
Found another article, titled PS3 second-hand clampdown is "false speculation" - Sony,

We have definitely not been communicating that. It's false speculation. We don't have any further knowledge about this topic - either officially or unofficially, to be frank.

also

there has been no official comment on this since the story that came up a few months ago - it hasn't changed since then, and we're quite surprised by why this has popped up again, to be honest.

So they have no new official word and SCEE denies telling its retail chains... something. I'll leave the task of sorting out the pronouns in those statements to somebody more intrepid than me.

 

[thefluffy]

I hate sony more and more every day....

 

[Wondernerd]

Sony already denied they are going to kill second party purchases

That settles it for me. Sony wouldn't lie about anything. I can't wait to bring my 7 friends over to play Riiiidge Racer on dual HDMI screens at 120fps and 1080p. I'm lying of course, I don't have any friends.

Sony <> Sony BMG. Different company, different management.

Sony is Sony. Sony wants to be a content provider which is where the real money is. The PS2 was a game console with a media player. The PSP and PS3 are media players with game functionality. Sony is pushing their media players and their media formats and if the way to do that is to sneak it in as a game console then that is what they are going to do.

That way they can license their formats to other IP holders so they can sell us the same movie we have on DVD on UMD and on Blu-Ray.

 

[The King of Pants]

I'm also getting a little tired of the argument that Sony != Sony BMG.

Yes it fucking does, if Sony didn't want to be associated with their music division it would have a different name, kind of like Disney and Hollywood Records.

And like it or not the whole rootkit thing fits right in with some of the other tactics Sony has employed to attempt to control various markets over the years. This was not one division within the company going rogue, this was a division following the examples set by the parent company.

My plans? Well if the market for second hand PS3 titles is going to be nonexistant or crippled in any way, I'm gonna be sticking with my Wii60 thank you much. Publishers and developers will want to reach that install base so i'm not too worried about missing out on MGS or any other third party franchises.

 

[maxius]

as it stands sony better rethink there price points for the ps3 and if the cell isnt measureing up its time to adopt a similar chip to replace it aka the opteron

 

[psychoace]

That settles it for me. Sony wouldn't lie about anything. I can't wait to bring my 7 friends over to play Riiiidge Racer on dual HDMI screens at 120fps and 1080p. I'm lying of course, I don't have any friends.

Name a game/system/product provider and I bet I can find something they said early on in production but had to scrap later on. Half life 2 and it's mysterious sept 30th release date that came and past. Yet it still sold millions and no one has said a thing since it's release about the delay (it was just a convience I guess that the source code was stolen near the day it was going to be released. So I guess they had to destroy all the cd's they produced and boxes were put into storage right??) Xbox 360 was supposed to be water cooled (check e3 demo reels) and have a 3rd sku for a home theater pc type xbox 360. They were hoping for this stuff but things fell through. You can't predict the future but you can try your best to make the future happen sooner. Sadly they wern't able to happen for the ps3 or the xbox 360 or Half life 2.

 

[dotK]

Name a game/system/product provider and I bet I can find something they said early on in production but had to scrap later on. Half life 2 and it's mysterious sept 30th release date that came and past. Yet it still sold millions and no one has said a thing since it's release about the delay (it was just a convience I guess that the source code was stolen near the day it was going to be released. So I guess they had to destroy all the cd's they produced and boxes were put into storage right??) Xbox 360 was supposed to be water cooled (check e3 demo reels) and have a 3rd sku for a home theater pc type xbox 360. They were hoping for this stuff but things fell through. You can't predict the future but you can try your best to make the future happen sooner. Sadly they wern't able to happen for the ps3 or the xbox 360 or Half life 2.

Half-Life 2 also didn't cost $120 when it came out.

 

[psychoace]

Half-Life 2 also didn't cost $120 when it came out.

Huh???? What does that have to do with anything? They havn't lied about the price. If you don't feel the ps3 is worth 600 bucks now (although did you really think it would be that much in the first place? Most of you seem to think that this price came out of no where and you thought it would be much less) then don't buy it. Just get a brain and don't discredit a company for doing the same thing as all other companies do on a daily basis unless you are going to protest as loud as you are now about them. It seems like everyone is just picking on Sony because it's the popular thing to do. If you could afford the ps3 you would buy it and love it just like every fan boy does but because the price reminds you how broke and poor you are you decide to call names. Why are you crying get a xbox 360 or a wii and move on. All your forum posts are doing is making people dumber. You and many others provide no intelligence to this topic and only dumb down the easily manipulated.


Anyway I now you would of really used the two hdmi ports for your dual hdtv setup and the 120fps would be the only tolerable frame rate you can watch but it's not going to happen I am sorry you dedicated yourself into hoping these features will come to fruition but it's not. So I guess your going to have to take your fat payroll elsewhere rich kid.

 

[Wondernerd]

If you could afford the ps3 you would buy it and love it just like every fan boy does but because the price reminds you how broke and poor you are you decide to call names.

Anyway I now you would of really used the two hdmi ports for your dual hdtv setup and the 120fps would be the only tolerable frame rate you can watch but it's not going to happen I am sorry you dedicated yourself into hoping these features will come to fruition but it's not. So I guess your going to have to take your fat payroll elsewhere rich kid.

I'm rich but I'm poor? Or is this a money can't buy love deal? One thing Kutaragi has said that I agree with is that if you see the PS3 as being a worthwhile machine, then the price isn't that important. And really, the price to me isn't that bad. But I look at the 360 and I look at the PS3 and I see the same performance levels. I can't justify the price. I can't see Tekken 6 being worth the price. I can't justify the price when it looks like they have taken every idea from Microsoft that isn't bolted down. They come out a year later, charge more then everybody else and their big appeal is that they do exactly what the other guy has been doing for a year?

My dislike for Sony isn't the "Be cool by hating the big guy" hate. After all, everybody that has a console coming out is the Big Guy. My hate comes from years of poorly made products sold at a premium with an almost total lack of respect for the customer. Sony hasn't just lied about the PS3. They lie about every product?

Remember when they kept trying to tell everybody the PSP didn't have any dead pixels? Or if your PSP had sticky buttons it was because you had gotten the Double Secret Dragon Platinum edition PSP? Or the PS2 being able to render the Final Fantasy movie in real time? Or when they said all the other kids like to have their privates touched so I should let them do it and it is a secret just between us? Or any of the million billion formats they have tried to get us to buy?

 

[dotK]

Huh???? What does that have to do with anything?

Everything. You break a release date - it's not a big deal. It happens all the time and it really doesn't matter. Now, let's say that HL2 was going to be released at a price point of $120 - but it featured a next-gen engine that would be the holy grail of game engines (way beyond what the actual HL2 engine was like), amazing sound, 200 hours worth of gameplay, and generally be the best game of all time. Then, as it comes closer to launch time you find out that the engine won't be nearly as cutting edge as they promised and will end up like the real HL2 engine did, the sound will still be very good, the 200 hours of gameplay was reduced to 30, and the game is only going to be in the 8.0 range because a lot of the cool features were cut. But, the game is still going to cost $120. This is basically what Sony did, using HL2 as an example. The release date thing is not a good comparison.

 

[psychoace]

the billions of formats they tried to get you to use? Let's see dvd's ok scratch that who uses dvd's anymore. Blu Ray not out yet but we will see the outcome. UMD is the only format that failed on the gaming front for them (mini disk we arn't counting because they arn't being pushed by a gaming system although they are still around after 15 years)

Also the whole first saying your poor and then saying your rich thing was kind of a slap. I said the first one as the truth and that most of us can't really afford the ps3 (me included). Yet all I hear is complaints about features only rich kids will be able to utilize. They are complaining about the $600 price tag yet they somehow have 2 hdtv's in one room that can handle 120fps at 1080p?

Also if you believed Tekken 6 was going to look like the first shot you are easily suckered. Name any system now a days that dosn't show rendered videos that go beyond the quality of the systems output?

Anyway so you said it yourself you see no reason to buy the ps3 but that is because you are an individual with custom needs. The ps3 dosn't fit yours so there is no reason for the $600 price tag. While People like me and videophiles would love the blu ray playback and can see how it's an extremely good value at 600 bucks. It's almost like your getting a game system thrown in for free.

 

[Xeon22]

As far as the Sony licensing thing, I saw a thread a long time ago, maybe a year or so, that Sony was going to implement something like giving each PS3 a unique address or using the serial number and having the system burn it to a game apon it's first use, so that if the game were put into another console afterwards, that it would not work because that number had to match up w/ the console for it to play, thus pretty much making it impossible to sell used games. The thread also stated that the CDs would not be rewritable.

 

[psychoace]

There is no way for the ps3 to burn

 

[Xeon22]

Wouldn't be too hard to incorperate, and yes, would probably be the best way to crash the used game market, and rentals aswell.

 

[boomheadshot45]

yeah sony's in a bad position because they have some series/ games that may or are coming to the 360.

resident evil 5 is coming to the 360
assasins creed has been confirmed for the 360 by ubisoft
If capcom sees the ps3 sales down and the 360 sales going up then they may start making Devil may cry for the 360. And dare i say yes i will, if the ps3 sales are doing really poor then Kojima may switch MGs over to the 360.

 

[psychoace]

Wouldn't be too hard to incorperate, and yes, would probably be the best way to crash the used game market, and rentals aswell.

There is no way to do it because they are going to be using bd-roms which are not writeable. There is a total complete difference between a rom and a writable disc. This is why early dvd stand alone units had problems reading burned disc's because the burning processes is almost like an emulation of the actual disc. Unless they invent some way to have burnable space on the edges then it's possible but then you got to factor in that a burner is going to cost you a lot more money then just a reader. To them I think the losses of adding to the price tag and thus losing out on more customers is not the smartest idea. Remember they are denying they are going to stop 2nd market sellers. Only ignorent people are saying it's a fact.

 

[MonkeyShave]

There is no way to do it because they are going to be using bd-roms which are not writeable. There is a total complete difference between a rom and a writable disc.

Reading is fundamental, kids. From post #37 of this thread:

The relevant patent seems to be 6,816,972. Filed on April 17, 2000 and issued on November 9, 2004. Search for the patent number here, painful to direct-link patents at uspto.gov.

This describes an offline system. The disc contains certain built-in defects (misaligned tracks, noise in the data) and has (from example in the patent) an erasable magnetic region near the center-hole of the disc. The magnetic region contains information about that specific disc's intentional defects. When you first load the disc, it stores that information in the device (patent describes a memory card) and then erases the magnetic data. As long as you have the card, it can correct the errors. If you don't have the stored defect list, you can't use the disc.

The section of the patent titled "DETAILED DESCRIPTION OF THE PREFERRED EMBODIMENTS" seems to describe a game console. Unfortunately the images will not load for me.

As this would clearly be a dead-stupid move, I expect that Sony will not use this in the PS3, but for those of you wondering how they'd do it: they have published the method.

So if they did this, that's how they'd do it. I doubt they will, but they did bother to figure out how to do it.

 

[Weazmeister]

the billions of formats they tried to get you to use? Let's see dvd's ok scratch that who uses dvd's anymore. Blu Ray not out yet but we will see the outcome. UMD is the only format that failed on the gaming front for them (mini disk we arn't counting because they arn't being pushed by a gaming system although they are still around after 15 years)

LOL, you are forgetting things such as Betamax and their Mem stick lineup. He never said it being "pushed" by gaming systems, just that they tried to force their stuff on everyone else

 

[MonkeyShave]

Betamax, MiniDisc, ATRAC, DAT, HiFD, Memory Stick, SACD, and UMD.

Their success include the 3.5" floppy, a few camcorder tape formats, and their collaboration on CD with Philips. "Philips and Sony abandoned their MMCD format and agreed upon Toshiba's SD format...", so they weren't all that involved in developing that either.

 

[pakotlar]

Everything. You break a release date - it's not a big deal. It happens all the time and it really doesn't matter. Now, let's say that HL2 was going to be released at a price point of $120 - but it featured a next-gen engine that would be the holy grail of game engines (way beyond what the actual HL2 engine was like), amazing sound, 200 hours worth of gameplay, and generally be the best game of all time. Then, as it comes closer to launch time you find out that the engine won't be nearly as cutting edge as they promised and will end up like the real HL2 engine did, the sound will still be very good, the 200 hours of gameplay was reduced to 30, and the game is only going to be in the 8.0 range because a lot of the cool features were cut. But, the game is still going to cost $120. This is basically what Sony did, using HL2 as an example. The release date thing is not a good comparison.

Good analogy. Sony isn't hungry anymore. That's the bottom line. Microsoft is, and if the put the good games on their system, i will buy them. Nintendo is still hungry, and they are taking a different angle. They may get my money too. Sony's game division became fat and lazy, and not only that, but they became condescending to the consumer as well. Comments like, "We don't care how much it costs, you'll have to work harder, ok?" and, "Yeah, it's expensive, but so what? Everyone will buy one anyways" don't fly with us.

$600? Hey Sony, 3DO called. They said that price point doesn't work, they tried.

 

[pakotlar]

yeah sony's in a bad position because they have some series/ games that may or are coming to the 360.

resident evil 5 is coming to the 360
assasins creed has been confirmed for the 360 by ubisoft
If capcom sees the ps3 sales down and the 360 sales going up then they may start making Devil may cry for the 360. And dare i say yes i will, if the ps3 sales are doing really poor then Kojima may switch MGs over to the 360.

The only games that I want on PS3 right now (doubt this will change unless we have another God of War come from out of nowhere) are DMC4 and MGS4. FF is not my cup of tea, but admittedly a system seller also. However, bar those 3 (Virtua Fighter is excellent as well), most other titles are either on the 360, or are not system sellers. And 360 has its own assortment of exclusives, like DOA4 (though not Virtua Fighter caliber, still good), Mass Effect, Too Human (hopefully good), GOW, Viva Pinata (say what you will, this is Rare). Microsoft may not win this round, but they will come close.

If Microsoft gets DMC4, I predict the PS3 will lose out in market share to Microsoft. I am counting that if that game gets ported, an assortment of others will as well. But as of yet, that looks like an impossibility.

edit: If I were Sony right now, I would be scrambling to get Lost Planet ported to PS3, and RE5 to stay time-exclusive. However, after losing GTA, I doubt there is much hope for them there.

 

[spigunk]

This is exactly what I think they are really up to. Right now they don't get any part of used game sales. They will strong arm the game stores into some kind of bogus license fee that amazingly enough equals the money they make off of new games.

I don't think they really care about used versus new they just want a % of the money.

Game stores make more money on used games than new. I'd guess Sony wants a piece of that action. If they do in fact impliment a liscense system, they could charge stores a "liscense transfer fee" for each disc they sell.

 

[NulloModo]

Betamax, MiniDisc, ATRAC, DAT, HiFD, Memory Stick, SACD, and UMD.

Their success include the 3.5" floppy, a few camcorder tape formats, and their collaboration on CD with Philips. "Philips and Sony abandoned their MMCD format and agreed upon Toshiba's SD format...", so they weren't all that involved in developing that either.

BetaMax wasn't trying to be pushed on everyone else, it actually came out before VHS, so it was the original option, JVC just killed it off by offering free licensing.

Minidisc (which ATRAC came with, though I think some sony MP3 players use it to) was a godsend to anyone who wanted to do live recording on the cheap, and was a better option compared to portable CD players in terms of size, battery life, and anti-skip long before MP3 or CD-Rs hit the market. <3 my minidisc unit.

HiFD.... great idea, but I guess sony killed it off by not marketing it well or getting deals with major system vendors to house the drives.

DAT became the industry standard for high end live recording and was used in plenty of recording studios before hard-disk systems became more affordable, it was hardly a failure.

Memory Stick: the flash memory market is full of proprietary formats. Olympus has their xD cards, Panasonic was the big name behind MMC and SD though the seem to have made them a defacto standard throgh licensing, Sony and some Samsung stuff use memory stick, it sucks that not everyone uses the same cards, but lots of companies kept coming out with new ones when Compact Flash for general use and SmartMedia for small devices would have suited everyone fine.

SACD - failed about as much as DVD-A, a shame for both formats, but most people are dumb and don't realize higher fidelity is worth paying for.

UMD - it's just the game disc format, which happens to play movies and music as well. You can buy kids shows on gameboy cartridges which a lot of parents do to keep kids occupied on road trips, how is this any different but with more variety?

 

[psychoace]

Reading is fundamental, kids. From post #37 of this thread:



So if they did this, that's how they'd do it. I doubt they will, but they did bother to figure out how to do it.

Reading is fundemental MonkeyShave. I was talking about actually writing information to the disc. Even though they are using a slightly modified version of the bd-rom it still dosn't have writable features. It can only erase a small bit of information that is on the inside tracks of the disc. No where in that article says it can write on the disc. Also you are forgetting they pushed dvd's with the ps2. So since I am sure your against being pushed to buy stuff then I am sure you have no dvd's/cd's/vhs tapes/pants/shirts/car/tv/computer/ect. Everything is pushed on you to buy that's the game of buisness. To sell you things you don't need and then figure some way to make them essential.

Remember when they kept trying to tell everybody the PSP didn't have any dead pixels? Or if your PSP had sticky buttons it was because you had gotten the Double Secret Dragon Platinum edition PSP? Or the PS2 being able to render the Final Fantasy movie in real time?

Yup so xbox 360 had no problems out of the gate right? Not like overheating boxes or scratching disc's right? Microsoft didn't confirm this problem right away. Yes they allowed you to exchange it but they didn't recall there xbox 360 because of it. To me a sticky thumb stick is more tolerable then a broken 60 dollar disc or a completly dead 360. Microsoft is thursty yeah for money not to make a great system otherwise they wouldn't have rushed out the xbox 360 like they did.

 

[Joose]

Yup so xbox 360 had no problems out of the gate right? Not like overheating boxes or scratching disc's right? Microsoft didn't confirm this problem right away. Yes they allowed you to exchange it but they didn't recall there xbox 360 because of it. To me a sticky thumb stick is more tolerable then a broken 60 dollar disc or a completly dead 360. Microsoft is thursty yeah for money not to make a great system otherwise they wouldn't have rushed out the xbox 360 like they did.

They rushed it, yeah... but they sure as hell made a great product. I hate Microsoft for everything else they've done in the last 5 years er so but with the xbox & now the 360(especially the 360), they have an excellent system. Brings back memories of when i first played the Sega DC and loved every minute of it. Quality system, innovative menu system, kick arse online play and a conroller actually more confortable the the PS2 dual shocks...What more could you want?

I've been a Sony fan*boy for awhile now but MS made me a believer with this system.

 

[psychoace]

I think the xbox 360 is an awsome product as well. I am neither a Sony nor a Microsoft Fan*boy I just hate ignorent people yelling out false statements and very thin rumors. If you are going to blast something atleast have your facts straight. Also it's still 5 months from being released and everyone is acting like it's already out and it sucks. Give something a chance.

 

[K600]

Yup so xbox 360 had no problems out of the gate right? Not like overheating boxes or scratching disc's right? Microsoft didn't confirm this problem right away. Yes they allowed you to exchange it but they didn't recall there xbox 360 because of it. To me a sticky thumb stick is more tolerable then a broken 60 dollar disc or a completly dead 360. Microsoft is thursty yeah for money not to make a great system otherwise they wouldn't have rushed out the xbox 360 like they did.

Every system has problems at launch. The difference? Microsoft didn't put their heads up their asses by calling those problems "art" (And yes, Sony did make references to artistic license with the faulty PSP buttons).