Building a PC

I've just bought the XFX 8800GTX, and I have to say I was amazed, it's freakin' huge! I'm very happy with it so far, it came with Company of heroes, free! Buying the monitor tomorrow, the rest will be ordered soon. Probably tomorrow.
If anyone could help me out on the TV-Tuner, that would be great.
 
Deadeye said:
I've just bought the XFX 8800GTX, and I have to say I was amazed, it's freakin' huge! I'm very happy with it so far, it came with Company of heroes, free! Buying the monitor tomorrow, the rest will be ordered soon. Probably tomorrow.
If anyone could help me out on the TV-Tuner, that would be great.
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Oh, Company of Heroes is so fun. Once you're all updated to v2.3 and online, download the CoH2300dev (unblocked) exe so you can play custom maps. Then add SPARTANVI to your friends.. :)
 
I will do that! CPU cooler is still a problem too. Scythe Mugen sounds like a decent solution though. Almost 100% sure that I'm getting a E8400 as we speak. Actually, I'm not even as sure as I was about overclocking. I didn't realize that it removes the warranty off of my products. That really does suck.
 
I'm not sure how cable in the netherlands works, but here in the US, you'd need a tuner with QAM for any clear-QAM channels (unencrypted). If you'd like all the channels you pay for through cable, you'll need to order another cable box instead of a tuner card. Hopefully someone with more experience with your cable standards can chime in. All I know is your guys' format is PAL. You might want to check some AV forums, like avsforum.com, for more help.
 
The infinity is on par with the ninja, but it costs more, so we usually recommend the ninja over the infinity. However, since the Ninja (full-sized) isn't available to you, the Infinity will work just as good.
 
Still a bit afraid of overclocking though. I didn't realize that it screws your warranty.
 
Hm.. Something I just found! Corsair 650W ATX, aka Corsair TX650, for less money than the HX520. The HX620 is still more expensive, and thus not really an option. Would the TX650 be a good PSU? Atleast it has enough power for a few upgrades, I guess!
 
Yes, the TX650 would be a good PSU.

If you're worried about the warranty, just don't OC.
 
Great! It's cheaper than a 520 unit, which makes no sense at all. Suppose it's a sale, they want to get rid of their last ones, or something.
Also, I might be able to get a cheap Cooler Master Real Power 620W. That one is modular. It's a bit less quality though, I suppose.
How big of an advantage is a modular PSU anyway?
 
One reason the 520W might cost more is because its modular. Don't get the Cooler Master. Its most likely a rebadged 500W (though I'm unsure, since I don't have a model #). Stick with the Corsair 650W or 550W.
 
Deadeye said:
Great! It's cheaper than a 520 unit, which makes no sense at all. Suppose it's a sale, they want to get rid of their last ones, or something.
Also, I might be able to get a cheap Cooler Master Real Power 620W. That one is modular. It's a bit less quality though, I suppose.
How big of an advantage is a modular PSU anyway?
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I only go modular. If you didn't know, a "modular" PSU gives you the ability to attach only the cables you'll be using. This takes a lot out of cable management, makes your insides look neater (if your case has a window), improves airflow, and just makes getting your hands in and out of your case a little easier. No longer do you have to worry about the traditional pony tail heap of unused molex and floppy power connections!
 
Deadeye said:
How awesome is a modular PSU? I'm a first time builder, so I have no preference. Might as well just get the 650W, right? Not like having a system that demands less than that hurts.
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Well it's awesome for all the reason I listed. :D I bet if you look into the PC you have now, you'll find a zip tied up bun of un-used cables. No problem with this other than it's unsightly and might inconvenience you when you're installing your drives and such.

Also I wouldn't go cheap on your PSU. If it fails, and I've seen them fail, they can possibly take out a few components with it... and I've seen that too. A pain to troubleshoot when you get the PSU replaced.

A modular PSU is more of a luxury than a necessity.
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Yep, and I insist on it with every new build. Hate cable management. Unless you're an origami guru, then by all means!
 
I have never(repeat never) killed a cpu with overclocking.

You will upgrade your cpu before you could ever kill it by overclocking.
You just need to hang arround the overclocking subforum and guys will help you do it right, dont be chicken. Even if you do smoke the cpu, it's the most fun you'll have for two hundred dollars!:eek:
 
Gah, I suppose you are right.. But my mind is currently set to the E8400, and with this ram, I can't get past 3,6Ghz. Suppose an AC 7 Pro would be good enough for that?
 
It apears that Coolprices.nl has 1 more GA-P35-DS3L Mobo, for the same price of the Asus P5K SE. Should I take it?
 
Hah, this is awesome. I was just talking to the shop guy about the P5K SE, and he said that he still had one left. He gave it to me with 25 euro discount, awesomeness. :)
1066 ram is quite a bit more expensive than 800 I am afraid, I'll look for you now and update in a minute or five..

Update: Wow, another thing I didn't know. There actually is DDR2 1000 ram. Not on cool prices, but on the site I am getting my PSU. Cool prices has some DDR2 1066, but it's way overpriced. More than twice as much as 800.
The other site, has some nice ones though!
For example:
OCZ 4GB DDR2 1000Mhz Platinum Kit
1000MHz DDR2
CL 5-5-5-18
(CAS-TRCD-TRP-TRAS)
Available in 2GB modules
Unbuffered
Platinum Mirrored XTC Heatspreader*
Lifetime Warranty
2.1 Volts
240 Pin DIMM
For 15 euro's more than 4GB kingston 800 ram.
I suppose that is just perfect for me, with that an E8400 could reach 4Ghz.
Now, this raises a question again, can an AC 7 Pro get an E8400 to 4Ghz?
 
I've got a new question. Could anyone tell me how much a Corsair TX650 weights? I really can't find it on the interwebz.
 
Deadeye said:
I've got a new question. Could anyone tell me how much a Corsair TX650 weights? I really can't find it on the interwebz.
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email Corsair customer service.
most PSU weigh in at about 6 KG, wires included in the weight (just a guess, mind you)
 
Well, I've just found this:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/specpage.html?CSR-TX750
This says that the TX750 weights 2.6 Kilograms. The TX650 should be safe under the 5kg limit of that shop.
I'm doubting about the processor and the ram, again.. If I would take that 1000 ram, I would have to wait 10 days. If I would take the 800, I would have everything in 3 days. Now, say I would take the Q6600 afterall, I won't need the DDR2 1000 ram. For the E8400 I suppose 4Ghz would be cool though, but is it worth the extra waiting..
Yet another thing to think about, is that the TX750 is available for 20 euro's more than the TX650 and 10 euro's more than the HX520. Now, 650 already is overkill. But 750 would last me like forever!
 
Corsair RAM should easily OC from 800 to 1000, but you can run the board "unlinked", meaning the RAM will run irrespective of the CPU overclock. I find this keep the board nice and stable and allows independant OCs of both the CPU and RAM, if you so desire.

My 6 kg figure probably comes from shipping weight.:eek:
 
Well, I would only need to overclock the ram to 890 in order to get 4Ghz. I don't really understand what you said about unlinked though. I have found some RAM overclocking guides, but maybe you can recommend one. Anyways, I don't have corsair ram, I have Kingston ram. Would that work too, assuming the result is 890?
 
Well, the 8400 probably runs on a 1333 FSB. 333x4 = 1333.
(FSB is quad pumped)
native clock of the 8400 is 3.0 GHz (333 x 9 multiplier)
Ram is double pumped. DDR2.

So to reach the OC of 4 Ghz the FSB increase is 450.
A 1:1 Ram divider puts the RAM at 900 Hz.
If you choose unlinked the RAM will run at stock of 800Hz.

You should read this document. It is written for the nvidia 680i MBs, but applies well to the current Intel C2D and Quad CPUs. It makes overclocking pretty straight forward.
Also download your MB manual and read the BIOS section until you can recite it in your sleep. Ask questions about what you dont understand.
http://www.nvidia.com/docs/CP/45121/nforce_680i_sli_overclocking.pdf
 
I will do what you said, and read those things.
I had calculated the FSB already (4000/9 /=/ 445), and multiplied it with 2 to get to the ram value. What I didn't know was that you can have your ram running at 800 while your CPU is running at the FSB of 445 (or the quad pumped 1780), why would you want to overclock your ram if you can do it this way?
 
Deadeye said:
I will do what you said, and read those things.
I had calculated the FSB already (4000/9 /=/ 445), and multiplied it with 2 to get to the ram value. What I didn't know was that you can have your ram running at 800 while your CPU is running at the FSB of 445 (or the quad pumped 1780), why would you want to overclock your ram if you can do it this way?
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Why overclock a 150 dollar CPU to 3.5 GHz when you could buy an "extreme" CPU for 1000 dollars that runs at the same speed???? Because you can.:D
Same for RAM.
Obviously, some RAM will overclock better than others, its a crap shoot. Me, I think RAM overclocking is tedious and mysterious. I prefer to leave that stuff alone and just OC the CPU. Other guys want to squeek out every bit of speed, so they OC everything, some would overclock the PSU if they could.:eek:
 
Not really what I ment, I might not understand you correctly. What I've understood is that you can OC your CPU with a FSB higher than your RAM, and still get a stable PC. Would OC ing your RAM help you reach higher numbers or something like that?
 
The motherboard generally will or will not allow one to overclock the RAM in conjunction with the CPU overclock; or leave it to it's native frequency.

With overclocking, there are a number of variables that define success and a stable computer. If you can overclock the RAM , obviously it will be faster. Faster doesn't always mean better and sometimes will lead to instability.

When the box crashes, You, the overclocker must answer the question: CPU or RAM that is the culprit.
I prefer to leave the RAM alone or "unlinked" from the FSB increases needed to overclock the CPU as that leaves RAM out of the equation.
 
Deadeye said:
...Now, 650 already is overkill. But 750 would last me like forever!
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Nothing lasts forever in this industry. New standards will come out, motherboards will get new plugs, molex connectors will fade away in place of new connectors, etc. Though, the 750W should last you about 10 years, IMO, lol. Though, the 650W would still last nearly that long, if not that long.

magoo said:
Corsair RAM should easily OC from 800 to 1000, but you can run the board "unlinked", meaning the RAM will run irrespective of the CPU overclock. I find this keep the board nice and stable and allows independant OCs of both the CPU and RAM, if you so desire.
Click to expand...

Deadeye said:
Not really what I ment, I might not understand you correctly. What I've understood is that you can OC your CPU with a FSB higher than your RAM, and still get a stable PC. Would OC ing your RAM help you reach higher numbers or something like that?
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IIRC, only nForce boards allow you to unlink the RAM from the CPU/FSB... which is also known as using RAM dividers. On P35 boards, all you get are RAM multipliers. The slowest RAM speed is 2x the base FSB, so your calculations are right.

If you can OC a Q6600 to 3.6Ghz and an E8400 to 4Ghz, I'm not sure the 400Mhz increase will outlast the two extra cores. So, with longevity in mind, the quadcore would last you longer. However, the dual core will give you great performance right now aside from video encoding (and whatever else makes much better use of 4 cores over 2 -- which isn't much right now).

And I'd go with the DS3L over the P5K-SE.

Waiting a few extra days isn't much, IMO, if you really wanted a 4Ghz dual core. If you're that impatient, get the quad.
 
Right, so I wouldn't be able to get 4Ghz on the E8400, without overclocking the ram or buying DDR2 1000 ram. That's a hard decision to make.
 
I've read the manual and the overclocking manual you provided, I don't have a lot of questions really. It looks quite simple in theory, Increase the FSB, see if it's stable, if so, increase it even more or try to lower Vcore. If unstable, make the Vcore higher, but watch the load temperatures.
One thing I don't know for sure, do I put in the quad-version of the FSB, for example 800 for 200 Mhz, or do I put in 200 Mhz? Would say 200, from how far I can judge.
Ram overclocking isn't very clear so far, how to I read those temperatures? And is it safe to do?
 
Deadeye said:
I've read the manual and the overclocking manual you provided, I don't have a lot of questions really. It looks quite simple in theory, Increase the FSB, see if it's stable, if so, increase it even more or try to lower Vcore. If unstable, make the Vcore higher, but watch the load temperatures.
One thing I don't know for sure, do I put in the quad-version of the FSB, for example 800 for 200 Mhz, or do I put in 200 Mhz? Would say 200, from how far I can judge.
Ram overclocking isn't very clear so far, how to I read those temperatures? And is it safe to do?
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Yup, thats pretty much the jist of it. Which FSB number you use depends on the board. Its not really worth it to OC RAM past a 1:1 ratio. While OC'ing the CPU, keep it at 1:1 (2x). Once your CPU is stable, then tweak your RAM. You may raise the RAM multiplier, but it won't yield any noticeable improvement, since the Intel platform doesn't scale well in that respect. Also, as far as timings go, you won't really notice the difference from CL5 to CL4 either, so it may not be worth trying unless you're having fun.
 
Right, thanks again all of you.
I think I'll just screw it and get a Q6600. I am able to get a Xigmatek HDT -S1284, is that one even better/comparable to the 1283? If so, I'm taking it.
 
Havent read any reviews comparing the two, but they look to be very similar. It seems to be a flashier, better looking version of the S1283.
 
Sounds good. :) Although I still seem to doubt, dammit. I've been told that it is better to buy parts for now, not for in the future. By the time I would replace my E8400, there would be a ton of CPU's that would outperform the Q6600 for a decent price. I guess. But having to buy more expensive ram is rather annoying. Argh, why can't it all be simple..
 
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