Building a gaming, coding and architecural design computer - would like some feedback

[DreamBliss]

1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc
This computer will serve multiple functions:

I will play the occasional game on it but will not be looking for super blazing fast speeds and so forth, just the ability to run certain titles. These include UT3, UT 2004, UDX and Unity 3D (shader 2.0 support required, version of DirectX, etc.)

I will also be coding webpages and doing some programming.

In addition I will be video casting, transcoding videos, using Photoshop, using 3DS Max and using ArchiCAD for architectural design.

Finally I will also be watching YouTube videos, browsing the internet and downloading a lot of content including maps, models, mods, patches and programs.

2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?
$1000.00, of that roughly $365.00 has been spent on a TV which will double as a monitor and $190.00 has been spent on a PSU and case.

3) Where do you live?
USA, Washington

4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. The word "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.
The final parts I need at a minimum will be a motherboard, CPU, RAM, video card and hard drive if I have enough left.

I have set a goal of $300.00 for the mobo and CPU, although this can go as high as $350.00.

For RAM I have set a goal of $50.00 with $70.00 being the top end. I want a Dual-Channel setup.

For a video card I have set a goal of $100.00, although I can go as high as $150.00. I may have to go with a DirectX 10 card and would like to know the ramifications of this considering what I want to do with the system.

For a hard drive I have set a goal of $50.00, although I can go as high as $75.00.

Obviously things are going to be VERY tight...

5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.
I have a DVD reader/writer from an earlier build that I would like to use in the new build, however it is an IDE interface as I recall so I need some help figuring that out.

I have a very old SATA 120 - 160 gig drive that I can re-use until I save enough for another drive.

I will re-use my old crappy Microsoft wireless desktop (keyboard and mouse) unless there is a gamer out there going wired who will sell me a better wireless rig for dirt cheap (PM me.) Be sure everything works because if its broken I will hunt you down. Also be sure you have an Amazon Payment account because I do not use PayPal.

UPDATE: I looked and I have an ancient ASUS EAX1600XT Silent PCI Express card that I could probably use in a pinch. I'm gonna list it for sale now and see if anyone wants this or my old case. Be interesting at least. Dunno the shader support for the card or compatibility with the mobos I'm looking at or the games I listed. Could use some feedback here.

6) Will you be overclocking?
Most definitely not.

7) What size monitor do you have and/or plan to have?
I have purchased a 32" Vizio LED-LCD TV to use as a monitor:
http://www.vizio.com/m320nv.html

8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?
Right now! I'll be keeping an eye on the deals at NewEgg and finishing my purchases next month. Basically looking for any deals right now as I started with $860.00 in the bank (my parents borrowed some) and now have something like $300.00 left. They will pay me the $140.00 they borrowed next month, and I may get another $10.00 - $20.00 to work with from my grandma for work around the house.

9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? etc.
I am designing this on the theory that the foundation of any build as its case, PSU and mobo as everything else can be easily upgraded. I want to future proof my system (for 5 years) and I have tentatively decided on an AMD/Nvidia build although I MIGHT be swung in another direction. Therefore I am looking at AM3+ mobos right now which I have narrowed down to 3 contenders. All three allow for crossfire/sli and all have USB 3.0 and SATA 6.

10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If so, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit?
I will be using Windows XP SP3 for which I have a license.


OK so now on to the good stuff... I would like your thoughts on my TV, case and PSU purchases. Here are the links:

TV
Vizio m320nv
http://www.vizio.com/m320nv.html

Case
LIAN LI Lancool PC-K63
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112320

PSU
Lepa LEPA B850-MA
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194093

These are the three motherboards I'm looking at one. I need to know which one you recommend and exactly why:

ASRock 890FX
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157248

GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128514

MSI 990FXA-GD65
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130604

They all have good and bad. The MSI has military components. Gigabyte looks the best and was recommended to me at another forums. ASRock has the best feature set. I just need to know which one to choose, OR, if you are going to try to push me into an Intel build, then I need a comparable in price and feature set board and processor combo.

This is the processor I'm looking at:

AMD Phenom II X4 965
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...27&cm_re=amd_phenom_II-_-19-103-727-_-Product

Looks like if I order the thing today I would save $10.00, so let me know if I should move on that. If I get that I have this RAM I should order with it as it also has a discount:

G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231440

I will buy the processor and RAM by the end of the day unless you recommend I shouldn't.

Thanks for taking the time to read this! I would really appreciate your thoughts here! The threads I started in the other forums died on me. I need multiple viewpoints from more experienced people to help me make the best choices, and to verify if the ones I already made were correct. This will be my first build in many ways, although I attended a class back in '06-07 when I was going to college where we ripped out computers and put them together again. That was the best class I had, and I have my trusty 20 pound A+ guide on a shelf nearby. Also I've logged a few hours worth of PC build videos at YouTube, so I think I can handle this.

Looking forward to your replies!
- Deathbliss

 

[Mr34727]

I would not buy that psu, pick up a corsair TX750 instead. Buy the shell shocker ram instead (if I were you). $70 for 1866 and a free flash drive.


The cheaper PC-K57 will give you better airflow than the case you listed if you can live without the bling.

XP? Really a waste to build this system and put XP on it.

Are you set on 990FX? looks like you are keeping the door open for BD, but I believe there are several cheaper boards that will support BD in the future. Personally, I would trade the 990FX board for something like this-
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128490&cm_re=am3+-_-13-128-490-_-Product


And use the saved money for a cheaper SSD boot drive

EDIT: Also, that CPU is fine for what you will be doing, but it would be cheaper to get a 555 and unlock it (just buy a used one that is proven to unlock). It would game the same, and you could use the change to put more money into the video card (I see you will be transcoding, so maybe put the money saved into this- http://www.cyberlink.com/products/mediaespresso/overview_en_US.html?fileName=overview&r=1
and use your gpu, which will be loads faster than using just the cpu)

 

[E4g1e]

I would not buy that psu, pick up a corsair TX750 instead.

Actually, neither the OP's original choice nor the original TX750 is ideal. If the OP chooses a TX750 he should make sure that it's a "v2" model and not the original since the original revision is now a bit outdated and obsolete.

 

[DreamBliss]

So I'm screwed since I already bought my PSU and case? You know it helps if you read a previous post before posting, just sayin'...

What exactly is wrong with the Lepa? Give me a really good reason to turn it it and I will.

I appreciate the recommended board, but remember I want to future proof my rig. So I would want Crossfire and SLI support for some day when I'm rolling in dough and want to have a dual video card setup.

I may only have Windows XP SP3 now, but sooner or later I will run 64 bit Windows 7 (remember, future proofing here...)

I ended up getting $30.00 off that case, and shipping upped that to a mere $20.00 off, but that's still a $140.00 case for $80.00 - $90.00. Once again however give me a reason to turn it in and get something else and I will.

When it comes to a case I want something well built, I would like to have a window but you could twist my arm to go without one, I want a bottom-mount PSU and some features I would like to have are easy access dust filters over the fans, rubber mounts under the drives, non-breakaway rear slot plates, mobo back-plate access (again future proofing here) and cable management. Screwless designs, painted interiors, LED fans, number of fans, etc. are not important to me. I can always add fans later. I'm aiming for 0.8mm - 1.0+mm metal (for durability.)

I can live without the expense of SSD drives for now. I don't need anything to boot 5 seconds quicker than normal, or whatever boosts an SSD gives you. I can go get a glass of water while Windows loads or use the restroom.

Two of the mobos I'm looking at support 1866 without overclocking, so I will look into that RAM if I get one of them. I'll know which mobo I'm getting once I have some good numbers in my poll.

Keep those suggestions coming! Thanks!
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

For RAM I have set a goal of $50.00 with $70.00 being the top end. I want a Dual-Channel setup.

I recommend this RAM if you can't take advantage of that G.Skill RAM deal:
$60 - G.Skill Value Series F3-10600CL9D-8GBNT 2 x 4GB DDR3 1333 RAM

For a video card I have set a goal of $100.00, although I can go as high as $150.00. I may have to go with a DirectX 10 card and would like to know the ramifications of this considering what I want to do with the system.

Well for one thing, many newer, faster, and better bang for the buck cards these days are DX11 capable. So you would be doing yourself a disservice by going with a card that can only go as high as DX10. Now if you go with a DX11 card, it'll just let you play newer DX11 capable games at DX11. Simple as that.

Considering your usage scenario, you should be looking at the $119 GTS 450 1GB, $140 GTX 550 TI 1GB, or the $165 GTX 460 (Make sure that it's not the SE version). I isted the cards from slowest to fastest BTW. Stick with MSI, Gigabyte, Asus, or eVGA for Nvidia cards.

For a hard drive I have set a goal of $50.00, although I can go as high as $75.00.

Pretty much the best bang for the buck hard drive out now:
$65 - Samsung Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive

5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.
I have a DVD reader/writer from an earlier build that I would like to use in the new build, however it is an IDE interface as I recall so I need some help figuring that out.

Simple really: Get a new DVD burner. Most new mobos do not come with an IDE controller anymore. Yes the AsRock mobo you chose does have a IDE controller but I'll get to that mobo later. And a new SATA DVD burner is rather cheap these days:
$19 - Sony AD-7260S-0B SATA DVD Burner

UPDATE: I looked and I have an ancient ASUS EAX1600XT Silent PCI Express card that I could probably use in a pinch. I'm gonna list it for sale now and see if anyone wants this or my old case. Be interesting at least. Dunno the shader support for the card or compatibility with the mobos I'm looking at or the games I listed. Could use some feedback here.

It's really really old. You're better of with a new card man.

10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If so, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit?
I will be using Windows XP SP3 for which I have a license.

Is that the 64bit edition?

Case
LIAN LI Lancool PC-K63
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112320

Considering that it's out of stock, you proabbly won't be able to get that case at all in time to take advantage of that $15 off promo. Even with the promo, it's not a good choice for the money as there are better choices for the money:
$70 - Lian Li Lancool PC-K58W ATX Case
$90 - Lian Li Lancool PC-K56 ATX Case
$90 - Cooler Master CM690 II Advance ATX Case
$90 - Lian Li Lancool PC-K7B ATX Case
$100 - Lian Li PC-7B Plus II ATX Case
$100 - Cooler Master HAF 922 RC-922M-KKN1-GP ATX Case

PSU
Lepa LEPA B850-MA
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194093

Not a good choice for the money as the E4g1e and Mr34727 pointed out. I also recommend the PSU that E4g1e recommended:
$110 - Corsair 750TX V2 750W PSU

These are the three motherboards I'm looking at one. I need to know which one you recommend and exactly why:

ASRock 890FX
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157248

GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD3
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128514

MSI 990FXA-GD65
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130604

They all have good and bad. The MSI has military components. Gigabyte looks the best and was recommended to me at another forums. ASRock has the best feature set. I just need to know which one to choose, OR, if you are going to try to push me into an Intel build, then I need a comparable in price and feature set board and processor combo.

Well I'd ditch the AsRock mobo right away since it only has a one year warranty which is stupid considering the price of the mobo. As for the other two, heres my issue: earlier you said you had a $300 to $350 budget for the CPU + mobo. That's enough for a solid Intel setup:
$325 - Intel Core i5 2500K CPU + MSI P67A-G45 Intel P67 ATX Motherboard Combo

Granted you lose out on SLI capability but something tells me you won't be taking advantage of that. From a price to performance standpoint, the above Intel build is a significantly better choice than a $168 990FX mobo + $120 Phenom II 965 setup.

G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231440

I will buy the processor and RAM by the end of the day unless you recommend I shouldn't.

Go ahead and buy the RAM ASAP. The CPU is a different story as indicated above.

 

[DreamBliss]

Ok thanks for all of that!

RAM looks good, will most likely order the red kit tonight (although blue matches my case better )

BAD hard drive! VERY VERY BAD! Read the feedback - LOT of DOA units from that Seasonic and Samsung! I was looking at it as the buy is very good but I'm hesitating because of the feedback...

For a video card what are your thoughts on these:

GIGABYTE GV-N430OC-1GL
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125346

PNY VCGGT4301XPB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133356

On an unrelated note why are the older Jaton 96** GS right up there with the 430 and 520s? Are they some sort of amazing card or something, or is NewEgg all screwed up?

OK so I need a new reader - GREAT. No adapters or anything out there?

I just have the 32 bit version of Windows for now.

Once again I must point out the power supply and case were already purchased (they ran out of stock after my purchase so I believe I got both, although I will check my order status.) Folks keep telling me not to get the Lepa and I want some information as to why, in case it would be better for me to turn it back in once I get it. DETAILS PORFAVOR! (that means please) Keep in mind that Lepa uses Enermax components, so its a solid PSU.

I really need to future proof my system so SLI/Crossfire support in the MOBO is an absolute must. I will check out some Intel boards and processors to see if I can get an i5 at the same or close to the same price. Once question here... If I get an LGA1155 mobo - I think that's the one I need for an i5 processor - will it be compatible with future Intel processors? Or is this a dead-end? Also can the built-in graphics part of the Intel chips handle the programs I listed, removing the need for a video card? One of the reasons why I've been leaning towards AMD is because that way I can use anything from Athalon to FX and the processors are far cheaper than Intel. I don't know that Intel can beat that compatibility and future proofing, but if I don't need a video card perhaps it can compete on price.

I heard about the crappy warranty on the ASRock before. What I still need to hear is why boards by them are bad or good. Specifics please!

Bit of an update here... Seems NewEgg put a lot of Phenoms on sale and this looks like a bargain I should jump on, if I don't go with Intel. So this is the processor I am now considering:

AMD Phenom II X4 945
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103809

Whew I hope I answered everything!
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

GIGABYTE GV-N430OC-1GL
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125346

PNY VCGGT4301XPB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133356

Neither are good for your usage. Your high resolution pretty much requires a significantly faster video card for gaming.

On an unrelated note why are the older Jaton 96** GS right up there with the 430 and 520s? Are they some sort of amazing card or something, or is NewEgg all screwed up?

No, they're not that great of a card. They're expensive for a few reason: Limited supply, newegg's automatic price adjustment software, etc.

OK so I need a new reader - GREAT. No adapters or anything out there?

There are adapters and add-on controllers out there that allows you to connect a IDE drive to a SATA port. However, the cheapest of those items costs around $10 to $15 plus shipping. As such, they're not a good choice for the money since an actual SATA DVD burner costs $19 and will be considerably less of a hassle and easier to cable manage than a IDE DVD burner connected through an adapter or controller.

I just have the 32 bit version of Windows for now.?

Then you will need to get a new copy of Windows 7 64bit as 32bit Windows XP will only let you use about 3.5GB to 3.8GB of RAM. As such, if you want to use more RAM, you need the 64bit edition of Windows 7:
$100 - Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64bit OEM

Once again I must point out the power supply and case were already purchased (they ran out of stock after my purchase so I believe I got both, although I will check my order status.) Folks keep telling me not to get the Lepa and I want some information as to why, in case it would be better for me to turn it back in once I get it. DETAILS PORFAVOR! (that means please) Keep in mind that Lepa uses Enermax components, so its a solid PSU.

I live in California. I think I know what Por Favor means . The main reason why I don't recommend the LEPA B 850W is because its performance is ok at best as shown in this review:
http://hardocp.com/article/2011/06/20/lepa_b_series_850w_power_supply_review/

Not to mention that its power layout effectively makes it a 750W PSU in actual use, not a 850W PSU. As such, at it's $100 price, it's not worth it over the significantly higher quality Corsair 750TX V2 which costs $110 these days. So it's not a good buy considering that there are better performing PSUs out there for the same price and with a higher chance of not dying on you as that LEPA does. Yes LEPA is branded by Enermax but it's still Enermax's low-end PSU model line. In fact, it doesn't even share components with the actual good Enermax PSUs. That LEPA B is made by Sirfa whereas virtually ALL of Enermax's high-end, mid-range, and/or good to excellent quality PSUs are made by Enermax themselves.

I really need to future proof my system so SLI/Crossfire support in the MOBO is an absolute must.

Ummm, SLI or Crossfire doesn't help future proof the system that much, especially if you're only using a low-end $150 card. SLI and Crossfire are more for those who need as much performance as possible right then and there. In light of today's pricing of past and present, as a future proofing tool, SLI and Crossfire doesn't help.

I will check out some Intel boards and processors to see if I can get an i5 at the same or close to the same price. Once question here... If I get an LGA1155 mobo - I think that's the one I need for an i5 processor - will it be compatible with future Intel processors? Or is this a dead-end? Also can the built-in graphics part of the Intel chips handle the programs I listed, removing the need for a video card? One of the reasons why I've been leaning towards AMD is because that way I can use anything from Athalon to FX and the processors are far cheaper than Intel. I don't know that Intel can beat that compatibility and future proofing, but if I don't need a video card perhaps it can compete on price.

Current LGA 1155 mobos will only be compatible with the new Ivy Bridge CPUs coming out later this year. After that, pretty much of a dead-end as Intel is switching to a new socket. The built-in graphics will not be able to handle your gaming needs.

The problem with planning for a FX upgrade is that no one knows just how fast those CPUS will be. Those BD CPUs are coming out close to the same time period as Intel's Ivy Bridge CPUs. So in order for a BD setup to be worthwhile, it has to be able to perform as well as those Ivy Bridge CPUs. Otherwise, you're better off with an Intel setup.

I heard about the crappy warranty on the ASRock before. What I still need to hear is why boards by them are bad or good. Specifics please!

Depends on which boards you're talking about. Some AsRock mobos are good and some are bad on account of their quality. The one you chose is ok from a quality standpoint but really overpriced compared to other motherbaords and that shitty one year warranty is also a deal killer.

Bit of an update here... Seems NewEgg put a lot of Phenoms on sale and this looks like a bargain I should jump on, if I don't go with Intel. So this is the processor I am now considering:

AMD Phenom II X4 945
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103809

It's an ok choice if an upgrade to Bulldozer CPUs within a year is pretty much your number #1 goal.

 

[DreamBliss]

OK, you've given me a lot to digest here so I will look around and ruminate. Looks like I jumped too soon on the PSU. I did research it before buying but I guess I just didn't find the best reviews. SIGH...

I still want SLI/Crossfire support because maybe I get a crappy slow card now as I don't need speed because I'm not playing games online or in any traditional sense, but maybe later I want to get a set of some really nice ATI or Nvidia cards. Unless the whole Crossfire/SLI thing is going to be phased out I think it's worth it to get a setup that will allow me to do that in the future.

I don't like what I heard about Intel changing sockets. It means that after 5 years any Intel board I got now would be a price of trash and have little or no resale value, while an AMD board like the ones I'm thinking about will always have resale value, because you can put so many different processors in them.

Well I'll still price the Intel stuff and see what's going on. I'll also look at the PSUs again and see what there is. Could I get some advice as to what to look for in a PSU for my needs as listed now, for one of the three AMD boards and the processor I listed, as well as future Crossfire/SLI usage? Try to use the terms I can find in the specs of the PSUs at NewEgg or the manufacturer site. One example, about the only one I know, is that I'm probably gonna want an Active PSU. Could use some help with anything else I need to know.

Once again thank you for your continuing help and advice. I have to say this has been the most beneficial forums I've found so far. Please keep up the good work folks!
- Deathbliss

 

[DreamBliss]

Spent some time in PSU-land at NewEgg. Leaning towards this after I see if I can whine my way out of the NewEgg restocking fee:

Thermaltake Toughpower XT TPX-775M
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153127

Some pluses are the 5 year warranty, the SLI/Crossfire certification, and the 775 wattage.

Here are a few other random considerations for which I found no reviews here:

Rosewill BRONZE Series RBR1000-M
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182188

COUGAR CMX 700
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817553003

CORSAIR Professional Series HX750
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139010

XIGMATEK NRP-MC
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817815014

Thermaltake TR2 RX 750W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153136

Now please don't all of you come rushing in here and telling me to go with the Corsair because it's so much better. Keep in mind I have to add $15.00 (the restocking fee for the Lepa) to the price to whichever PSU I get, in addition to any shipping charges. So that Corsair really costs me around $150.00 or so. I need to get as close to $100.00 as I can, with shipping charges and considering the restocking fee. I'm looking for a good, reliable PSU here that can serve me for a good 5 years or so. The brand doesn't matter - just the parts inside - as your reviewer here proved when he or she refereed to the Enermax NZT 750W and seemed to imply how it's actually worse than the Lepa, even though Enermax is a far superior brand name. Perhaps the Cougar, at $90.00, has some amazing tech inside.

Remember the budget here is tight and with the return I will start to hemorrhage money. I haven't even added the price of shipping the item back to NewEgg.
- Deathbliss

 

[wwischerath]

If you arent doing SLI/Crossfire then you wont need that much power. Get a lower power PSU. 600W would probably cover anything you build at that point. Heck 500W likely would
Use this link for power calculation to verfify
http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

 

[Dangman]

I don't like what I heard about Intel changing sockets. It means that after 5 years any Intel board I got now would be a price of trash and have little or no resale value, while an AMD board like the ones I'm thinking about will always have resale value, because you can put so many different processors in them.

There's no guarantee that future AMD CPUs will be compatible with current AMD AM3+ mobos five years from now. Look at AMD's socket AM2 motherboards which was released in 2006. Only a handful of those mobos actually support AMD AM3 CPUs when they came out in 2009. Even then those AM2 mobos only support the first generation of AM3 CPUs. AMD's new Bulldozer CPUs officially work only on AM3+ mobos and some AM3 mobos.

Not to mention, how many people are actually selling AM2 mobos that are compatible with past or even current AM3 CPUs and how many people are actually looking to buy such mobos? You can get a brand new AM3 socket mobo for $5o to $55 these days. As such, I wouldn't factor in resale value as part of a five year plan.

Five years is a long time in the PC world. For all we know, AMD may be switching to a new socket in that time period that would break compatibility with past sockets/CPUs. As such, I would not plan for a CPU upgrade more than two years after the mobo's purchase.

Well I'll still price the Intel stuff and see what's going on. I'll also look at the PSUs again and see what there is. Could I get some advice as to what to look for in a PSU for my needs as listed now, for one of the three AMD boards and the processor I listed, as well as future Crossfire/SLI usage?

The problem is that we simply don't know the power usage of the future Crossfire/SLI setup you're planning. Nor can we offer any advice for your current setup since you haven't told us what video card you want to get.

With that said, a good quality 750W PSU with at least 60A on the +12V rail will be enough to cover many Crossfire/SLI setups. However we generally recommend 850W to 1000W for higher-end Crossfire/SLI setups.

Could use some help with anything else I need to know.

Virtually every thing you need to know about a PSU can be found in this link:
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1036

One example, about the only one I know, is that I'm probably gonna want an Active PSU.

Any half decent PSU will be have APFC or Active PFC. So that's pretty much a given these days unless you're just choosing shitty power supplies.

Thermaltake Toughpower XT TPX-775M
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153127

Some pluses are the 5 year warranty, the SLI/Crossfire certification, and the 775 wattage.

Decent choice at that $110 price. Any higher than that and it's tad of a ripoff. Quality and performance is below that of the 750TX V2 and 750HX however.

Rosewill BRONZE Series RBR1000-M
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182188

I don't trust Rosewill due to their past products. As such, one or more properly done PSU reviews will be needed by me before I even recommend a Rosewill PSU. Espeically considering that PSU is made by Sirfa, a company whose PSUs designs/models tend to be around the low-end. Granted Sirfa do make really good PSUs but those are somewhat rare and significantly higher priced.

COUGAR CMX 700
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817553003

Not that good of a PSU on account of its poor voltage regulation which means a very unstable PC:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cougar-CMX-700-W-Power-Supply-Review/1317

CORSAIR Professional Series HX750
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139010

Pretty much the highest quality out of all the choices so far.

XIGMATEK NRP-MC
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817815014

This one I'm unsure of. Need to do more research on this.

Thermaltake TR2 RX 750W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153136

Pretty shitty. Any Thermaltake PSU with the words "TR2" in is gonna be a piece of shit power supply. And that's backed up by a review:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermaltake-TR2-RX-750-W-Power-Supply-Review/902

I'm looking for a good, reliable PSU here that can serve me for a good 5 years or so.

Then go for either the Thermaltake XT 775W if you want modular cables at a loss of some quality or the non-modular but higher quality 750TX V2.

 

[Mr34727]

A few things-

Sorry for not seeing that you already had the psu and case. The case is not a bad buy, and I think you will be happy with it.

On the psu- I would buy the TX750 and return the Lepa. Go ahead and pick up the V2 as others have pointed out. Contact newegg and say you need to return the psu (live chat). Tell them you will be buying a different one from them because you doubt the stability of yours. They may be willing to waive the restocking fee (I just did this with a video card). If they won't, ask them if they will give you a gift card for the full amount then, because you love their company and will definitely buy the new psu from them.

One of these should work, and you should get your full amount back. Regarding shipping back to them- after the guy/girl finishes talking about the restocking fee, ask how you can get a UPS return shipping label. They will pay for return shipping (100% of the times that I have returned stuff).

Back to components-
If you won't OC, I might go with the intel 2400-
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/363?vs=102

The above site will help you compare different cpus and pick out benchmarks you think are most relevant to your usage scenarios.

 

[Mr34727]

Pulled a couple Intel combos to further confuse the selection process-

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.676009
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.674751

 

[DreamBliss]

I like that Gigabyte combo, even though I'm stuck with Nvidia if I want to try two cards in the future. The feature set and specs for it are very good. My question is this... How does an Intel i5 2.8ghz quad core stack up against an AMD Phenom 3.0ghz quad core?

The Biostar combo gets a big MEH... from me, but I did notice the Crossfire support. Which brings up another question... Which works better in an Intel setup - Nvidia or ATI?

Somehow I missed the review of the Cougar power supply. Maybe it was in the archives. I'll keep looking.

I might be able to increase my build price up another $20.00. Not much but that's still 20 bucks better than a grand.

I sent an e-mail to NewEgg politely explaining how I have been a loyal and good customer for a long time who has never abused or even used their RMA system and requesting that due to some inconsistencies with the Lepa if I could get a full refund sans restocking fee. I'll try the gift card idea of that fails.

Glad to hear the case I got was worth it. I should see it here tomorrow or the next day along with the TV and PSU.

I'm leaning towards a future SLI setup, but I will then as now search for the bargains, not get the latest and greatest. If I was to guess I would say that I would get an SLI setup in the next two years and probably use this year's tech for it as those higher price boards should be lower then. So 256 bit, DDR3, SLI support - basically the video cards you can get now for anywhere from $150.00 - $250.00+.

For the current build I'm leaning towards a non-SLI (unless I can find one dirt cheap) 64 - 128 bit board, DDR3, DirectX 11 with HDMI out for the TV to use as my monitor.

Any PSU I get will have to be able to handle a set of current-gen 256 bit video cards. For the first few years of its life things will be easy for this PSU, as I will not be using a powerful video card unless I find a couple hundred bucks lying on the side of the road tomorrow

If I missed anything let me know. Thanks for the information, updates, and your continuing help -
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

I like that Gigabyte combo, even though I'm stuck with Nvidia if I want to try two cards in the future.

You're not stuck with Nvidia: AMD's Crossfire tech is free and open to use. As such, virtually any motherboard with two PCI-E x16 slots will support Crossfire unless the motherboard specifically locks them out (i.e old old Nvidia motherboards). Also, it says Crossfire supported right there in the motherboards's webpage:
http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=3852#sp

The feature set and specs for it are very good. My question is this... How does an Intel i5 2.8ghz quad core stack up against an AMD Phenom 3.0ghz quad core?

The Intel will outperform it by quite a large margin. In fact, the Core i5 2300 outperforms the 3.6Ghz Phenom II by about 10% to 30% depending on the game. As for transcoding and photoshop use, the Core i3 2300 is roughly 5% to 15% faster than a 3.6Ghz Phenom II depending on the transcoding app and photoshop usage. So yeah, the Intel Core i3 2300 will definitely outperform the 3Ghz Phenom II by quite a large margin.

Which works better in an Intel setup - Nvidia or ATI?

Pretty much the same.

If I was to guess I would say that I would get an SLI setup in the next two years and probably use this year's tech for it as those higher price boards should be lower then.

Actually no. What many video card makers are doing nowadays is introducing a faster card at roughly the same price as an older and slower card. Only occasionally will the older card drop in price. But often times that drop in price will last for a short time before either the newer cards gets cheaper or the older cards get even more expensive. Plus there may be weird situations that may further push the prices of older cards even higher. I.e the whole Bit-coining phenomenom that's currently increasing the prices of even used HD 58xx series video cards or the increase in price for Nvidia's 9600GSO cards after it was discovered that they were extremely good for Folding@Home.

Any PSU I get will have to be able to handle a set of current-gen 256 bit video cards.

That doesn't mean anything. The memory bandwidth doesn't indicate power usage at all. Case in point: The GTS 250 and the HD 6970 2GB video cards are both 256bit cards. But the HD 6970 easily uses 2-3 times the power of the GTS 250. So memory bandwidth alone doesn't tell how much power the GPU will be using.

Just to cover 80% of the setups you'll possible have, just go for a solid 750W PSU with at least 60A on the +12V rail as I noted earlier.

 

[DreamBliss]

OK gotcha.

Just read the PSU thread and have a question... How do I take that knowledge, plug it into NewEgg, and find a good PSU? I will do as you said and will look for minimum 750w with 60A on the +12v rail but using NewEgg's system how do I figure this out, or do I have to wade through a few hundred PSUs and read each one's specs?

OK so here's a for example:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371020

This is an Atec with Continuous Power rated at 550w. There are 5 12v rails, from 12v to 12v4. 12v1-12v4 are rated at 20A for a total, if added together (which I still don't entirely understand exactly how to do) 80A, The 21v rail is 0.8a. Now is this really 40A because you can only add two at a time together, or what?

Once I get this I should be able to find a PSU.

Sucks to hear that about the video cards. So to solve this issue and keep it simple... I need a PSU that can handle a current average SLI setup, with three settings in mind, above average, average, and below average. The monster 2 and 3 slot cards that can take any current DirectX11 game at its highest settings and make it its bitch all by itself is above average. The quiet, hard working card that can handle the most hardware intensive game at a reasonable speed by itself, but which certainly benefits from a twin in another slot, is average. Below average are any cards that absolutely have to be hooked up in SLI just to launch a modern game off the ground. Hope this makes it easier. If I need specific examples I'll work on researching video cards when I get done with PSUs.

Once again I appreciate the help. I'm starting to lean towards an Intel build now. I think I saw a 3.0ghz quad core combo at $306.00 so I'll compare that to the other one.
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

OK gotcha.

Just read the PSU thread and have a question... How do I take that knowledge, plug it into NewEgg, and find a good PSU? I will do as you said and will look for minimum 750w with 60A on the +12v rail but using NewEgg's system how do I figure this out, or do I have to wade through a few hundred PSUs and read each one's specs?

Pretty much gotta wade through.

OK so here's a for example:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371020

This is an Atec with Continuous Power rated at 550w. There are 5 12v rails, from 12v to 12v4. 12v1-12v4 are rated at 20A for a total, if added together (which I still don't entirely understand exactly how to do) 80A, The 21v rail is 0.8a. Now is this really 40A because you can only add two at a time together, or what?

No. As shown clearly on the PSU label, the max load for all four +12V rails is 45A. It's the second sentence below the PSU power chart. You determine the amperage on the +12V rails by first finding out what's the total combined, max load, combined or max wattage set aside for the +12V rails/section alone. Then divide that total by 12 and you get how much amps the PSU has on the +12V rail.

That's the correct way to find out how much amps a power supply has. Don't add up the amps on the +12V rail to figure out the amperage. Doesn't work that way. If the total combined or max wattage can't be found on the power supply, check the manufacturer's site page for that PSU for that info. If the manufacturer doesn't provide that information, it's generally a good sign for you to drop that power supply from consideration.

In this case, Antec already tells you how many amperage there is total on the +12V rail to save you some time from not doing the math. If you want to know the wattage available on the +12V rail, it's simple really: Just multiple the total amerpage on the +12V rail by 12 and you get the total wattage available on the +12V rail. So in this case, that Antec has 540W available on the +12V rail or 45A.

 

[DreamBliss]

OK, thanks.

Looks like the only competitor at NewEgg with the Corsair is this KingWin:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817121068

So I could get the better rated but lower wattage Corsair or pap a few bucks more and get a 1000 KingWin. Checking Tiger now, leaning towards the Corsair.
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

That Kingwin is an ok PSU:
http://hardocp.com/article/2009/11/04/kingwin_lz1000_1000w_power_supply_review/

But I'd rather go Corsair for the higher quality and excellent customer support.

 

[Mr34727]

+1 for corsair support. The one time I had to use them, it was as good as RMA'ing a WD harddrive (ridiculously easy and fast).

When I get home today I'll see what other parts I can find for you, but I would +1 everything Danny has said above. With the corsairs, they plainly state a single 12v rail- no math, no load balancing 4 different 12v rails, just plug sh*t in and it works.

 

[DreamBliss]

OK I have ordered my RAM, PSU and the glasses I need for eye strain. I know I'll regret it if I don't order them so I'm just going to dive in and get everything. Go ahead and criticize:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139010
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231427
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16868998059

Now I could have gotten a Ripjaw 1333 set with latency at 8 and timing of 8-8-8-24 but I was hoping that despite the higher latency and timings getting the 1600 set would be better. Sticking with a mere four gigs for now - can get a better set later.
- Deathbliss

 

[DreamBliss]

Got the case (man that sucker is HEAVY - good sign I think), PSU and TV today. I set the case aside, got an RMA arrangement and shipping set up for the PSU, and will soon be setting up and testing the TV. Well at least for Xbox 360 and PS3 usage as I only have an RGB out on my laptop so I don't think the results will be very good.

I won't be at this topic much for a day or two. You're probably wondering why I spent that $70.00 on the glasses when it means I'm gonna have to make up the money next month to get everything. Well I got one of my headaches again that feels like someone is trying to stab my eyes out with something large and pointy. Looking at the screen just brings pain shooting up my ocular nerves. I've been wanting those glasses for a while since they are supposed to help with this. Anyhow I'm gonna keep away from the computer and seriously limit my testing time on the TV so I can recover. Usually takes a day or two...

While I'm away could someone tell me what the cheapest, highest quality and best protection surge suppressor (NOT JUST A SIMPLE POWER STRIP) would be for my shiny new computer? I know the PSU has a bunch of protections built in but I'm taking no chances here. Dunno anymore about surge suppressors than I did about PSUs.

Thanks - I'll be in later with the results of my testing - probably tomorrow or Sunday.
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

OK I have ordered my RAM, PSU and the glasses I need for eye strain. I know I'll regret it if I don't order them so I'm just going to dive in and get everything. Go ahead and criticize:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231427

Now I could have gotten a Ripjaw 1333 set with latency at 8 and timing of 8-8-8-24 but I was hoping that despite the higher latency and timings getting the 1600 set would be better. Sticking with a mere four gigs for now - can get a better set later.
- Deathbliss

The performance is gonna be the same actually between the two sets. Intel's Sandy Bridge isn't that sensitive to RAM timings or RAM speed.As such, you could have gone with either CAS 7 RAM or DDR3 2133 RAM and the performance still would have been the same.

However I still wouldn't have gotten the 2x2GB RAM set since that limits you to 12GB of RAM later on without replacing the 2x2GB RAM set. I would stuck with a single 4GB RAM stick since that allows for 16GB of RAM later on.

 

[Mr34727]

The performance is gonna be the same actually between the two sets. Intel's Sandy Bridge isn't that sensitive to RAM timings or RAM speed.As such, you could have gone with either CAS 7 RAM or DDR3 2133 RAM and the performance still would have been the same.

However I still wouldn't have gotten the 2x2GB RAM set since that limits you to 12GB of RAM later on without replacing the 2x2GB RAM set. I would stuck with a single 4GB RAM stick since that allows for 16GB of RAM later on.

Usually I am right on point with you Danny, but I am not sure I would recommend the same here. I seem to recall a few benchmarks supporting the worth of running a dual channel ram setup- is this not the case for gaming? Personally, I would have gone with the 2x2gb kit instead of the 4gb stick for reasons-

a) dual channel as stated above
b) hard to find matches later down the road
c) will the lifespan of this build really see the need for more than 8gb of ram? Sure, more is almost always better, but I would think 4GB would be fine for the next year, and an upgrade to 8GB in a year will last another one (at least)

 

[Dangman]

At most, the increase in performance is about 5% under the most ideal of conditions. Considering the OP's usage scenario, 16GB of RAM would be a good step up over 12GB and an early 5% "under the most ideal conditions" performance increase.

 

[DreamBliss]

OK I'm back but only for a second or two...

I guess I hope that 4 gig dual channel will suffice for now, and maybe in another year or two I can replace it with an 8 gig set. Then I could either use the 4 gigs I will have had previously in the other slots or sell them and get another set of 8. Just depends on future finances. RAM is easy to plug in, take out, and plug in again. I had to go with what I could afford and that's what I did. I'm sure 4 gigs will be more than enough for anything I will be doing for the next year or so. Heck I'll just put an 8 gig dual channel set of something really cool like the Snipers or the special Patriot set on my birthday and Christmas list this year - why not? Whose parents can't afford a $60.00 - $80.00 present?

Update on the Vizio.... That TV freakin' rocks right now! First thing I did is play Wipeout in 1080p on my PS3 and no slowdown, no washed out colors, almost too much black levels and nothing wrong with the whites. Running the PS3 on HDMI. Noticeable difference when I tested out my 360 though, which is in component or progressive video or whatever the heck you call it. Things looked kinda reddish and not bright enough. I went into the TV's Advanced menu and Picture settings and fiddled around. Turns out that turning off the Ambient Light Sensor made the 360 look almost as good as the PS3! Played UT3 with 14 bots on Deimos - one of the most graphically intensive levels, again no slowdown, no lag, no issues whatsoever. Played a little Half Life 2. Checked out Valhalla on Halo 3. So far the TV is a BIG pass! Well test more on the PC when it is built.

Only a few minor gripes... I noticed the picture looks smoother, not sharper. This is just the transition to an LED-LCD set from my old Panasonic CRT 27" TV though. I also noticed in some movies that the picture was a little dull but this is simply the settings and I don't need eye bleeding color and contrast to watch a movie. I think it also has to do with the source or the photography used because I just watched Hunter Prey (using the set doesn't aggravate my eyes thank goodness!) and it looked amazing. Probably should try Enterprise next as it was filmed using HD cameras. Finally there's a wonderful touch on the front of the TV, the glowing words, "VIZIO" which turn white when you turn it on and turn orange when off. Gonna be hard to sleep with those words floating out at me in the darkness...

The TV box arrived damaged in one corner and it cracked the foam inside. However the foam did its job and protected the TV. The TV came out of the box looking like it was brand new - replete with that thin plastic they spread all over new electronics to protect it form dust, scratches and fingerprints. I peeled all that off after I had the TV set up. The stand install instructions were useless because part of the stand was already installed to the back. But I'm smart and I figured out to take the screws from the bottom, put the base on, screw the screw back in, and then add the weird middle screw with a metal wire attached. I also didn't tighten anything down more that single finger single hand tightness - a lot of give here and you have to be careful. The set came with the remote, batteries, instruction book (an actual book all in English mind you), power cord, base, screw and once of those nice eyeglass cleaning cloths for the screen. The only evidence I have the set was ever used by anyone else at all were some fingerprints on the metal in the battery compartment.

Overall the TV seems very well constructed, its picture is far superior to my CRT HD set, the remote feels kind of light but the buttons feel right when pressed. The weird thing, and this is a tip I provide to anyone else making a similar transition to HD LED-LCD or LCDs, and that is the the face size of my 32" set is actually smaller than the face of my 27" CRT! Of course the CRT had speakers to each side. Also the vertical size is about the same. Only the width area is larger. So if you are replacing a CRT set with any version of an HD LCD set you should get the next size up from what you current have to have a similar viewing experience on screen. So for 27" go for 32", and for 32" go for 36". Don't go to the same size LCD set because the vertical size will be smaller and it will seem to you that you have less screen size, when in reality the extra size is expanding more horizontally then vertically

Not using the sound. There are a lot of configuration options for it though. Some complaints out there about Vizio speakers so keep that in mind in case you don't happen to have a nice, if old, DD 5.1 setup and receiver like I do. But can you honestly expect good sounds out of shallow (2" at best), small magnet speakers? I may not know much about computers but I know this about speakers... The deeper the cone, the better the material, and the bigger the magnet the better the sound. End of story. Of course someday someone will invent new tech that will change this but as far as I know these rules still apply. Solution? Get a receiver and spend less on computer parts! Get a good, high-quality one too with full-sized speakers if they even still sell anything like this anymore. Sony, Yamaha, and JVC were some of the best brands back when I got my setup. If you're using your net set as a monitor like me then you won't have any problems. Be sure to turn off the set's speakers!

Anyhow now that I see how the screen works on one of these I wonder why we don't see more offline split-screen multilayer games with the ability to divide the screen vertically, because that would give two players a LOT of room to play with!

Now I just need to find someone in my area to come over and play a little CODMW, Halow 3, UT3 or Far Cry IP with me Anyone out there live in Washington?

OK I gotta go. Turing the computer of until Monday. See you guys later!
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

OK I'm back but only for a second or two...

I guess I hope that 4 gig dual channel will suffice for now, and maybe in another year or two I can replace it with an 8 gig set. Then I could either use the 4 gigs I will have had previously in the other slots or sell them and get another set of 8. Just depends on future finances. RAM is easy to plug in, take out, and plug in again. I had to go with what I could afford and that's what I did. I'm sure 4 gigs will be more than enough for anything I will be doing for the next year or so. Heck I'll just put an 8 gig dual channel set of something really cool like the Snipers or the special Patriot set on my birthday and Christmas list this year - why not? Whose parents can't afford a $60.00 - $80.00 present?

I highly highly recommend getting as much RAM as possible ASAP since RAM prices will rise over the next year or two after the next few months:
http://hardocp.com/news/2011/07/16/dram_prices_drop_even_further

 

[DreamBliss]

Well I'm back. Been through hell the last few days - SERIOUS migraines, dizziness, eye ache, etc. NOT fun, not at all.

Got my MadCatz/Gunnar COD Black Ops glasses in today. Been using them. Too early to write a review yet but here are my initial impressions. I'll write a full review at NewEgg, maybe even a video review at my YouTube site, later:
http://www.youtube.com/user/Deathbliss?feature=mhum

OK so you have to get used to orange. EVERYTHING looks orange, and if you use an orange or yellow light this effect will be enhanced. Not orange like a really bad fake tan though. Just an orange tint to everything.

Next up be prepared to blink a lot or have eyedrops handy. This might just be the initial adjustment phase like you go through when you get prescription glasses. But your eyes will be dry at first!

Speaking of prescriptions... If you happen to wear glasses that are prescribed to you you can wear the gaming glasses over them, but for me at least there's a weird, stomach churning blur effect when you scroll up and down a page or see any other rapid movements on screen. So if you're as blind as a mole with your prescription specs then you can't go the cheap route - you have to get a prescription pair of Gunnars from their site.

The MadCatz name has always, to me at least, been synonymous with cheapy imitation stuff that usually works well but is constructed in a flimsy manner. Well unfortunately the glasses, at least the MadCatz set, can be described like that. First off the case you get barely fits the glasses and you can't close it. Second the cheapy case I got from WalMart with my prescription glasses was of better build than the case they give you for the glasses. The glasses themselves feel flimsy, are extremely light and bendable, and I assume will not take much abuse. So smacking yourself on the forehead after an extremely embarrassing defeat may wipe the suckers out. The same could be said if you leave them on the chair when you get up to get a beer or a slize of pizza then sit back down on top of them. To help them survive you must handle them with care, and be EXTREMELY careful with where you put them!

On the plus side the cool dog tag style memory card (unfortunately only 1 gig in size) in its shiny, and heavy, metal case is the perfect item to peacock with. For those who don't know what that means, use your imagination. So now I have some gamer bling that actually looks cool, and would be a practical item to have hanging around my neck when out playing my ahem... OTHER game...

Also the I assume microfiber slipcase is REALLY nice and an extra nice touch. You can put your glasses in it and keep them clean from dust and whatnot.

Finally the little logo on the case, glasses, and memory card is pretty cool.

So far none of the strange issues have happened to me that others have mentioned. No inreased redness in the eye, no itching or burning, the normally stabbing pain I experience through my eyes is a dull throb and I assume even that will go away once I have fully recovered from the last few days.

On a final note I also received my PSU and memory sticks today. Nice of NewEgg to place an extremely heavy PSU on top of the bubble envelope in which they placed the memory sticks :/

My goal is to purchase either the video card or the CPU once I receive my $100.00 refund for the Lepa which I have returned.

More updates to come -
- Deathbliss

 

[TASL]

I highly highly recommend getting as much RAM as possible ASAP since RAM prices will rise over the next year or two after the next few months:
http://hardocp.com/news/2011/07/16/d...p_even_further

^^ This.

 

[DreamBliss]

Minor update...

I should be able to tack at least another $100.00 to the PC build by the end of the week. I got a job and if I can hold out all week I should make somewhere the the vicinity of $400.00. So far I have made somewhere around $75.00. I'm going to get a bike with my $100.00 PSU refund when it comes through, removing that from the build final price, but almost everything I earn tomorrow, and everything I earn starting Wednesday, can be added to the PC build fund. Of course I won't know anything until I have been paid. If I earn enough I will go for the Intel build. I'm sticking with the RAM I got and will be looking for the best 500gig or 1 terabyte drives (by this I mean most reliable). I would like 2-4 500gig or 1-2 terabyte drives. I'm avoiding SSD for now. I will get a 460 NVIDIA card.

In a week or so I will come in with my prospects and let you guys tear them apart If I earn enough I'll even buy a video camera and do a whole unboxing and PC tutorial thing which I'll put up on my YouTube site. Good video camera/tripod suggestions would be appreciated. This will only happen if I manage to get through this week, and they (the owners) keep me through the next, and somehow, by some miracle I make it through that week too.

So that's the plan -
- Deathbliss

 

[DreamBliss]

Dumb question here... Which is better: More cores (6 VS 4) or greater speed (3.0GHz VS 3.5 GHz)?

Phenom II 6 core 3.0GHz combo:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.691298

VS

Phenom II 4 core 3.5GHz combo:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.691290

Starting my shopping again. Finished my 48 hour work week yesterday. EVERY joint and muscle is sore, and I'm better cooked than your Sunday roast, but I have an extra $415.00 for the build. Gonna piss some people off though... I'm leaning back towards AMD right now because I save a LOT of money and get future upgrade capability. Sticking with Nvidia for the video card right now. Will start ordering stuff this week. Will post the things I'm thinking about buying before I do.

Would appreciate your help on this core VS speed thing -
- Deathbliss

 

[DreamBliss]

OK, looking at this video card, need to make a decision by tonight:

ZOTAC ZT-40408-10P
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500202

 

[Dangman]

Dumb question here... Which is better: More cores (6 VS 4) or greater speed (3.0GHz VS 3.5 GHz)?

Phenom II 6 core 3.0GHz combo:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.691298

VS

Phenom II 4 core 3.5GHz combo:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.691290

Several issues here:
- Those combo deals expire tonight or approximately 7 to 8 hours from this post.

- You're going with the wrong AMD CPUs as those particular AMD CPUs are so priced at a point where it effectively negates AMD's decent price to performance ratio. These two combo deals would be more in line with AMD's primary advantage:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.691286
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.691289

- To answer your question: Depends on the usage. For video editing, definitely more cores. For gaming, definitely higher clock speed. For extensive multi-tasking, definitely multiple cores.

Gonna piss some people off though... I'm leaning back towards AMD right now because I save a LOT of money and get future upgrade capability.

You save money now but you're gonna end up spending more money overall. Think about it: Right now, the current rumored pricing for the AMD 8 Core CPUs is around $320. Considering your usage scenario, that's the type of CPU you should be getting. But note the total costs: If you go with the AMD Phenom II 955, it costs about $103 to $120 now. Upgrading to the AMD 8 Core CPUs will cost around $320. So you would be spending a total of $420 to $440 on the CPU alone. Compare that to spending only $190 to $220 on a single Intel Core i5 CPU. And again, we don't know just how well AMD's new Bulldozer CPUs will perform.

OK, looking at this video card, need to make a decision by tonight:

ZOTAC ZT-40408-10P
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500202

Not worth it IMO. I don't trust ZOTAC myself. And that Zotac is a bad buy considering that you can get a GTX 460 from a far far far more reputable manfacturer for the same cost:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130566

 

[DreamBliss]

OK, thanks for the input!

I was under the (most likely wrong) impression that Zotac was an underdog quality manufacturer like Patriot when they first started making memory years ago, and that EVGA is just cheap crap. I mean look at the feedback for most EVGA cards VS the feedback for the Zotacs. Any reputable reviews for either of these cards and their manufacturers?

One more thing about the EVGA you suggested... It has a mini-HDMI. That means I'll need some sort of special cable or adapter to hook it to a full HDMI TV, right?

I don't care about future costs because guess what? I may not have any money on the future, or I may have just enough for a small processor upgrade (the Bulldozers will be better than the Phenoms - we can be pretty sure of that), or I might be insanely rich and in that case I could afford a new Intel setup, with whatever new stuff they have at the point.

Here's the thing to keep in mind... I get an AM3+ board and processor now for $300.00 or so, tack on an additional $200.00 at most for a new processor 2 or 3 years down the road, for a total of $500.00. Or I buy an equivalent Intel mobo and processor for $400.00 or so, and in 2-3 years I have to spend another $400.00 for a new mobo and Intel processor, for a total of $800.00. AMD might not be as fast or as good for my needs, but it's TONS better than what I have now, and I doubt I will have many problems with an AMD setup.

Well this is how I see it anyway. I will research the EVGA and Zotac cards tonight. Any users of either of these video cards on the Nvidia side, and what do you have to say about it?

Still need some video camera suggestions if anyone has any thoughts.
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

I was under the (most likely wrong) impression that Zotac was an underdog quality manufacturer like Patriot when they first started making memory years ago, and that EVGA is just cheap crap. I mean look at the feedback for most EVGA cards VS the feedback for the Zotacs. Any reputable reviews for either of these cards and their manufacturers?

LOL! You definitely got it the other way around. In any case, I based my impressions/thoughts on ZOTAC and eVGA just from reading a ton of threads throughout the forums. Not to mention their history: ZOTAC is a relatively new entrant to the computer hardware world. eVGA has been in the market for a long time and is well regarded as a top-tier Nvidia manufacturer.

One more thing about the EVGA you suggested... It has a mini-HDMI. That means I'll need some sort of special cable or adapter to hook it to a full HDMI TV, right?

Correct.

Here's the thing to keep in mind... I get an AM3+ board and processor now for $300.00 or so, tack on an additional $200.00 at most for a new processor 2 or 3 years down the road, for a total of $500.00. Or I buy an equivalent Intel mobo and processor for $400.00 or so, and in 2-3 years I have to spend another $400.00 for a new mobo and Intel processor, for a total of $800.00.

Key problem with your AMD CPU upgrade "example": There's no guarantee that AMD will be sticking with the same socket 2-3 years from now.

AMD might not be as fast or as good for my needs, but it's TONS better than what I have now, and I doubt I will have many problems with an AMD setup.

Fair enough. At least choose the right AMD CPUs man.

 

[DreamBliss]

This card worth anything?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130646&Tpk=evga gtx 465

Also which of the cards on this page is the best (reliability, features, connectivity, etc.)?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...SpeTabStoreType=&AdvancedSearch=1&srchInDesc=

I will see if I can find it on NewEgg, but what type of cord exactly am I looking for to go from HDMI to mini-HDMI?
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

This card worth anything?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130646&Tpk=evga gtx 465

Nope. It's recertified, OOS, and it wasn't all that great to begin with.

Also which of the cards on this page is the best (reliability, features, connectivity, etc.)?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...SpeTabStoreType=&AdvancedSearch=1&srchInDesc=

Such an odd way to select video cards:
Asus GTX 460 for $165 shipped
EVGA GTX 560 for $190 shipped

I will see if I can find it on NewEgg, but what type of cord exactly am I looking for to go from HDMI to mini-HDMI?
- Deathbliss

A mini-HDMI to HDMI adapter.

 

[DreamBliss]

OK based on your recommendations and my searching up to this point here are the final contenders for my video card choice. I may also post this reply with a poll elsewhere in the forums. I can not afford to screw up my choice here! I don't care about cost or anything related to that. These are all within my price range. They have the best ratings and features (clock, cores, memory, speed, etc). They also all support DirectX 11 and SLI. All I need to know is which one will be the best performer and most reliable card. Specifically I would like users of these cards, or similar cards from the same manufacturers, to come forward and share their experiences. I'm also looking for reputable reviews or alternative cards I may have missed you feel I should look at.

Here we go:
ZOTAC ZT-40406-10P GeForce GTX 460
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500182
- 2 gigs of memory

ASUS ENGTX560 DCII OC/2DI/1GD5 GeForce GTX 560
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121446
- Excellent cooling tech

EVGA 01G-P3-1466-KR GeForce GTX 560
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130685

EVGA SuperClocked 01G-P3-1461-KR GeForce GTX 560
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130661

MSI N560GTX-M2D1GD5 GeForce GTX 560
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127592

Palit NE5X56T01102-1140F GeForce GTX 560 Ti
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814261100
- 384 cores
- Best connectivity

PNY VCGGTX560TXPB-OC-BDL GeForce GTX 560 Ti
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133384
- 384 cores
- Free HDMI cable
- Lifetime Warranty

PNY VCGGTX560XPB GeForce GTX 560
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133397

As you can see my goal price is $150.00, with a limit of $230.00. If you know of any other cards that fall into the price range that you would recommend, and by that I mean a card that you would personally buy and use instead (you gotta stand behind your recommendations!) please post a link. I stick with Amazon. NewEgg, and Tiger Direct, so if you find a good deal for one of these cards, or one you recommend, let me know!

Thank you for your continuing help!
- Deathbliss

 

[Dangman]

Just go for the EVGA SuperClocked 01G-P3-1461-KR GeForce GTX 560 card. It's the best choice out of all those cards from a price to performance standpoint as well as warranty and customer support.

 

[DreamBliss]

Well I agree with your thoughts here, but at my other thread I have votes for the Asus and the PNY Ti model. So I will weigh all of these tonight, check prices at Tiger, and make a decision.

Curious here... Why not go for a refurb of one of these cards if I find one? I mean it worked for me with my TV, and I got something for half what I would have paid normally. Ditto the Open Box models. Anything here I should be aware of? I would think I should avoid the Open Box stuff. but the refurbs should be as good or better than new, right?
- Deathbliss