Build Recommendations

[NExUS1g]

I want a system built around the Tempest 27" 2560x1440 monitor (unsure whether to go with glossy or matte, some recommendations would be helpful -- it'll be a room with well-controlled lighting). The reason for the choice is to have an IPS panel capable of supporting higher refresh rates from a local (nationally-speaking) and reputable business (to my experience, they've earned a pretty good rep). I'm open to other suggestions. I want to stick with 1440p, though. I'd prefer to also stick with a 16:10 aspect ratio.

I want to maintain a high frame rate in both games and while performing 3D editing. While the monitor may not achieve 120Hz when overclocking, that's the average frame rate I would like to shoot for in most current games. At the least, I would hope that minimum frame rates could generally stay above about 80 FPS. That's about the threshold that frame dropping from 120 FPS starts to become visible for me.

I would like to have two large drives not associated with the raid for backup and for recording my screen to. As well, I would like the "live" drives at up to 6 SSD's in a performance-based RAID setup (nothing's more uncomfortable than having someone waiting for a multi-GB poster to load -- and it'll be a bonus for negating game load times as well). I'm interested in using a PCIe controller as it's my understanding that on-board RAID controllers tend to be lacking bandwidth availability for that many drives in RAID. I'll need a bit of help on what RAID option is going to be best.



1) What will you be doing with this PC? Gaming? Photoshop? Web browsing? etc

Gaming, streaming (using hardware, not software), low-polygon 3D modeling, large-format image editing, drawing tablet, and all of the lesser things like web browsing and whatnot.

2) What's your budget? Are tax and shipping included?

Open.

3) Which country do you live in? If the U.S, please tell us the state and city if possible.

United States, Portland, Oregon.

4) What exact parts do you need for that budget? CPU, RAM, case, etc. The word "Everything" is not a valid answer. Please list out all the parts you'll need.

All inclusive.

5) If reusing any parts, what parts will you be reusing? Please be especially specific about the power supply. List make and model.

N/A

6) Will you be overclocking?

Yes.

7) What is the max resolution of your monitor? What size is it?

27" 2560x1440
http://overlordcomputer.com/collections/27-monitors/products/tempest-x270oc-glossy

8) When do you plan on building/buying the PC?

As soon as the build is finalized.

9) What features do you need in a motherboard? RAID? Firewire? Crossfire or SLI support? USB 3.0? SATA 6Gb/s? eSATA? Onboard video (as a backup or main GPU)? UEFI? etc.

SLI/Crossfire support, USB 3.0 (25+ watt for tablet power if possible), 6Gb SATA.

10) Do you already have a legit and reusable/transferable OS key/license? If yes, what OS? Is it 32bit or 64bit?

I have Windows 7 64-bit available to transfer to the new system. I'm open to consider newer versions if recommended.

 

[Dangman]

I would like to have two large drives not associated with the raid for backup and for recording my screen to..

RAID does not equal backup. If you want backup in the sense that your data is relatively safe from malicious or accidental infection, deletion, removal, or modification of your data, you're looking at a separate source such as an external hard drive, NAS, file server, cloud backup, etc. If you want redundancy in the sense that your data is available after a hard drive crash, then what you're describing is fine for that purpose. But it won't be backup.

I have Windows 7 64-bit available to transfer to the new system. I'm open to consider newer versions if recommended.

Which edition? Home Premium? Pro? Enterprise? Ultimate?

Off the top of my head, you're more or less looking at a X99 system with GYTX 970 SLI at a minimum. Maaybe GTX 980 SLI.

 

[NExUS1g]

RAID does not equal backup.

I said: "...two large drives not associated with the raid for backup..."

It's a dangling participle, so it understandably caused some confusion for you. One of the two large drives are for the backup (the other dedicated for video recording), not the RAID. I'm planning on having a Blu-Ray burner in the system for more permanent backups of very important items.

Which edition? Home Premium? Pro? Enterprise? Ultimate?

Windows 7 Home, for what it's worth.

 

[Dangman]

I said: "...two large drives not associated with the raid for backup..."

It's a dangling participle, so it understandably caused some confusion for you. One of the two large drives are for the backup (the other dedicated for video recording), not the RAID. I'm planning on having a Blu-Ray burner in the system for more permanent backups of very important items.

Still technically wouldn't be a backup since that hard drive is a part of the PC itself. You technically have a copy but it wouldn't be considered safe and therefore a backup.

Windows 7 Home, for what it's worth.

You're more than likely going to have to upgrade to Windows 8.1 as Windows 7 Home Premium has an artificial RAM limit of 16GB of RAM. X99 can go up to 64GB of RAM.

 

[NExUS1g]

Still technically wouldn't be a backup since that hard drive is a part of the PC itself. You technically have a copy but it wouldn't be considered safe and therefore a backup.

I never said they had to be internal storage -- or on-site; just what I wanted them for. Well, this last statement is true for the interim backup drive. The dedicated drive for video recording would be internal.

You're more than likely going to have to upgrade to Windows 8.1 as Windows 7 Home Premium has an artificial RAM limit of 16GB of RAM. X99 can go up to 64GB of RAM.

Alright. I've no issue with upgrading. I might as well since I'm building a new rig. Have you or are you beta testing Windows 10? Will it be worth it in your opinion to get it on release?

Regarding the RAM, I'm going to be running a significantly fast RAID and the 3D modeling will be for gaming (that is low polygon/low texture). Will I really find much use for more than 16GB?

 

[Dangman]

I never said they had to be internal storage -- or on-site; just what I wanted them for. Well, this last statement is true for the interim backup drive. The dedicated drive for video recording would be internal.

Gotcha.

Alright. I've no issue with upgrading. I might as well since I'm building a new rig. Have you or are you beta testing Windows 10? Will it be worth it in your opinion to get it on release?

I have been testing Windows 10 on my HTPC. It's definitely better than Windows 8.1 that's for sure. In fact, Windows 10 will be free for certain Windows 7 SP1 and 8.1 users:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2873...a-free-upgrade-for-windows-7-and-8-users.html

So what you could do is start with 16GB of RAM and stick with Windows 7 HP for now and then upgrade to more RAM when Windows 10 comes around.

Regarding the RAM, I'm going to be running a significantly fast RAID and the 3D modeling will be for gaming (that is low polygon/low texture). Will I really find much use for more than 16GB?

Yes.

So here's a prelim build without the storage hardware (I recommend hitting up the Data Storage subforum for more advice on that aspect):
$389 - Intel Core i7-5820K CPU
$250 - Asus X99-A Intel X99 ATX Motherboard
$181 - Crucial BLS2K8G4D240FSA Ballistix Sport 2 x 8GB DDR4 2400 RAM
$1100 - 2 x eVGA 04G-P4-1982-KR Superclocked GTX 980 4GB PCI-E Video Card
$170 - Seasonic Platinum SS-860XP2 860W Modular PSU
$50 - Cooler Master Seidon 120V Liquid Cooling System
---
Total: $2140 plus tax and shipping.

For the cases, I recommend the following:
$100 - Phanteks “Enthoo Pro Series“ Black ATX Case
$110 - Thermaltake Core V5 Black ATX Case
$110 - Corsair Vengeance Series C70 Gunmetal Black ATX Case
$115 - Corsair Carbide Series 500R ATX Case
$116 - Thermaltake Chaser A71 Full Tower ATX Case
$120 - Corsair Graphite Series 730T ATX Case
$120 - Corsair Obsidian Series 450D ATX Case
$120 - NZXT Phantom PHAN-001BK Black Full Tower ATX Case
$120 - NZXT Phantom PHAN-001WT White Full Tower ATX Case
$133 - NZXT Phantom 530 Black Full Tower ATX Case
$130 - Corsair Graphite Series 600TM ATX Case
$140 - Corsair Obsidian Series 750D ATX Case
$150 - Corsair Obsidian Series 650D ATX Case
$152 - Corsair Special Edition White Graphite Series 600T ATX Case
$150 - NZXT Phantom 630 White Windowed Full Tower ATX Case
$158 - NZXT Phantom 630 Gunmetal Full Tower ATX Case
$170 - Thermaltake Urban T81 Full Tower ATX Case
$190 - Corsair Graphite Series 760T ATX Case
197 - Corsair Graphite Black ATX Full Tower 780T
208 - Corsair Graphite White ATX Full Tower 780T
$240 - Silverstone FT02B-USB3.0 ATX Case

 

[NExUS1g]

The 2400 MHz DDR4 is running at 16 CAS. That's a latency of ~6.7 ms per address strobe. From what I recall, DDR3 2400 MHz was running at CL11 for a latency of ~4.6 ms. What will be the cumulative effect of the lowered latency on system performance?

The other question I have is if 860 watts will be enough power to support overvolting the CPU and GPUs, running/charging peripherals like memory card reader and providing full power to a tablet as well as the large number of drives I'm going to be using.

 

[Dangman]

The 2400 MHz DDR4 is running at 16 CAS. That's a latency of ~6.7 ms per address strobe. From what I recall, DDR3 2400 MHz was running at CL11 for a latency of ~4.6 ms. What will be the cumulative effect of the lowered latency on system performance?

In real world apps and games? Nothing noticeable.

The other question I have is if 860 watts will be enough power to support overvolting the CPU and GPUs, running/charging peripherals like memory card reader and providing full power to a tablet as well as the large number of drives I'm going to be using.

Should be enough. HardOCP's test setup with a massive overclocked 4.8Ghz Core i7 3770K with two overclocked GTX 980 cards used up around 589W:
http://www.hardocp.com/article/2014...980_sli_overclocked_gpu_review/6#.VOVXe_nF-0c

With that said, by large number of hard drives, are you talking about the large number of SSDs or actual mechnical hard drives? If the latter, exactly how many? If the former, really doesn't matter as SSDs don't use that much power. Same for the card reader and tablets. It's really the CPU, GPUs, and large number of mechanical drives (anything higher than 8) that would be of actual concern in terms of power usage.

 

[NExUS1g]

With that said, by large number of hard drives, are you talking about the large number of SSDs or actual mechnical hard drives? If the latter, exactly how many?

The large number of SSDs (I'll just have one platter internally). It's my understanding that SSDs "sip" power relative to a platter drive, but I'm not sure by how much there is an improvement in power consumption exactly.

 

[Dangman]

The large number of SSDs (I'll just have one platter internally). It's my understanding that SSDs "sip" power relative to a platter drive, but I'm not sure by how much there is an improvement in power consumption exactly.

Under MAX load, the Samsung 850 Pro 1TB SSD uses 3.3W with idle being .4W. Under max load, the Western Digital 3TB Red drive can hit 21W with idle being 2.7W. So basically 5 to 7 SSDs can use the same amount as power as a single hard drive.

EDIT: With that said, the eVGA SuperNOVA 1000G2 1000W PSU is available for like $4 less if you're really worried about power and don't mind the noise level increase:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00CGYCNG2/?tag=extension-kb-20

 

[NExUS1g]

In real world apps and games? Nothing noticeable.

More of a curious question than anything else, but what are the actual numbers behind that? Let's say, I load a 1 MB image from the hard drive. What would be the math behind the difference from request to display due to CL?

I would presume (from my limited understanding) that each bit from the image map would be read from the hard drive, placed in primary memory, then read from primary memory and placed directly to the image buffer on the VRAM. I would suspect also that each strobe is 1 bit of information (1 or 0). So...

1 MB * 8 bits per byte = 8 Mb.
8 Mb * 6.7 ms = 53.6 ms to write 1 MB to the RAM
8 Mb * 6.7 ms = 53.6 ms to read 1 MB from the RAM

So, 107.2 ms time spent reading to and writing from the RAM 2400 MHz @ CL16.

Or...

8 Mb * 4.6 ms = 36.8 ms to write 1 MB to the RAM
8 Mb * 4.6 ms = 36.8 ms to read 1 MB from the RAM

So, 73.6 ms of time spent reading to and writing from the RAM in the case of 2400 MHz @ CL11.

(For simplicity, I'm ignoring file headers and all of that and just saying that 1 bit simply corresponds to 1 element of the image itself.)

Now provided I have all that basic math (and logic) right, how does it all translate into the 4th dimension when I'm working on an image with constant RAM calls being made over time as I'm actively manipulating a model or image?

I hope my question is as clear for you as it is in my head.

 

[Dangman]

I may be Asian but math was never my strong point. To be honest, the exact math and technical aspects are generally items I don't dive into. I just look at the results and draw conclusions from there. But let's provide some data: From what we know now, Haswell with DDR4 3200 isn't all that much different from DDR4 2133 in most real world apps and games:
http://anandtech.com/show/8959/ddr4...-3200-with-gskill-corsair-adata-and-crucial/4

What we can draw from the above is that a 1GHz frequency increase isn't enough to provide noticeable real world performance differences. A few more articles:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/memory/display/haswell-ddr3_6.html#sect0
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Adobe-Photoshop-CS6-Memory-Optimization-182/
http://anandtech.com/show/7364/memory-scaling-on-haswell/3

With that said, it's all moot considering that the X99 platform only supports DDR4 RAM. In addition, the lowest CAS available for DDR4 2400 (CAS 12) as of this this post costs $272. Even from the few situations where the lower CAS might help, it's not worth an extra $90.

 

[NExUS1g]

No worries at all. I believed you. Like I said, it was just pretty much a curious question more than anything else. I'm always looking to learn more and have a deeper understanding of all kinds of things.

 

[Koween]

I suggest a different cooler, though. I've just finished a build with a seidon 120v2 and the result was 60deg C at idle on a 4690k i5. The stock screws/mounting were not providing enough clamping. I've installed a few Corsair H series coolers (and own a H100) and have never had a problem like that. I don't think that using washers to reach acceptable levels of performance is something you'd like to do in this build.

 

[Dangman]

I suggest a different cooler, though. I've just finished a build with a seidon 120v2 and the result was 60deg C at idle on a 4690k i5. The stock screws/mounting were not providing enough clamping. I've installed a few Corsair H series coolers (and own a H100) and have never had a problem like that. I don't think that using washers to reach acceptable levels of performance is something you'd like to do in this build.

Are you sure yours wasn't defective? I haven't seen that issue myself with the Seidon or the Coolermaster Hyper 212+ or 212 Evo HSF. They use very similar mounting brackets. Now the main reason why I recommend the Seidon is because it outperform far more expensive Corsair CLCs (or at the least matched it):
http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2744&page=5

Also, Newegg's price for the Seidon 120V has jumped up significantly. Get it from Amazon.com:
http://www.ausa.org/publications/ilw/Documents/TB_The_Squad_web.pdf

EDIT: Doh! Here's the correct link:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FFCB0BG/?tag=extension-kb-20

 

[Deleted member 88227]

I suggest a different cooler, though. I've just finished a build with a seidon 120v2 and the result was 60deg C at idle on a 4690k i5. The stock screws/mounting were not providing enough clamping. I've installed a few Corsair H series coolers (and own a H100) and have never had a problem like that. I don't think that using washers to reach acceptable levels of performance is something you'd like to do in this build.

60C while idle on a 4690k w/ SEidon 120v2? I think you did something wrong.

I have mine overclocked to 4.3Ghz on the stock cooler and I reach ~65C while playing Supreme Commander...

I think you're doing something wrong man. Might want to check your mounting techniques and/or thermal compound applying technique.

 

[Deleted member 88227]

Dangman, that's not an amazon link... Haha!

 

[Dangman]

Doh!

 

[Koween]

As I said, the stock mounting system was crap. It put almost no pressure whatsoever. I had to use four 2mm washers, because I could see that it was loose without them. I've installed numerous coolers on different systems but this one was clearly badly made. Maybe the cpu/mobo combo resulted in the cpu being lower than expected, or maybe the quality control wasn't that good at CoolerMaster. I suppose you get what you pay for.
Anyway - I wouldn't recommend a questionable component like that in a build as expensive as this.

 

[Dangman]

As I said, the stock mounting system was crap. It put almost no pressure whatsoever. I had to use four 2mm washers, because I could see that it was loose without them. I've installed numerous coolers on different systems but this one was clearly badly made. Maybe the cpu/mobo combo resulted in the cpu being lower than expected, or maybe the quality control wasn't that good at CoolerMaster. I suppose you get what you pay for.
Anyway - I wouldn't recommend a questionable component like that in a build as expensive as this.

If the OP does decide to take your advice over the advice of two other people in this thread, the cheapest but good quality liquid cooling HSF that has a decent mounting setup AND that cools as well if not better than the Seidon 120V is this:
$90 - Corsair H80i CLC