Build for less than $1500?

[zyir]

Heya All...
It's time for me to upgrade my home systems since my current build (OLD - check my sig) will not play the latest games at decent framerates. Though, it'll still play most games without too much of a hit; Bioshock is pushing it a bit too much, but it plays Portal fine.

I'm wanting to build a much quieter system (no more jet engines in the living room), so I'll be purchasing a new case, power supply, and pretty much everything.
My budget is $3K, but for two identical systems: one for me, and one for the wife. So, the cost should be under $1500 for each.

To start:
Processor: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450
Video card: ATI Radeon HD 4870 (or 4850) - just one, not Crossfire
Memory: minimum of 2GB RAM (maybe 4GB if it can meet the budget)
Motherboard: Considering something with a P43 chipset since I'll just be using one vid card, or P35/P45.

I've been out of the hardware scene for a few years, so figured I'd post here for some advice.
Thanks in advance!

 

[timme]

Some hints for the directions of quiet and price efficient (and pretty ):

Case:
Antec P182 - one of the most minimalistic designs (especially for livingroom usage and wife acceptance factor), very silent, very comfortable to work with.

Mainboard:
Gigabyte P43 DS3-L - If you don't need raid or other special features, solid mainboard for a good price

Power supply:
Corsair HX520/HX620 - plenty of power, good quality, modular cables, silent

CPU Cooler:
Xigmatek S1283/Scythe Mugen/Scythe Ninja - Get decent heat sinks with 120mm fans with the option to change the fans, helps to reduce noise a lot

GPU:
It seems like the new ATI cards can run quite hot/loud, maybe consider Accelero S1 coolers if you want consistent silence

HDDs:
Western Digital 640GB AAKS or Samsung 320GB/640GB are some models that usually run fast and silent

You could use these and other hints to pre-configure a complete system in your shop of choice and post the list with prices here to get a first overview. I'm in the EU, so I can't tell much about prices.

 

[zyir]

Here's what I've come up with. All prices from Newegg, so far:

Case:
$149.99 - Antec P182

Power Supply:
$119.99 - CORSAIR CMPSU-520HX 520W

Motherboard:
I was kinda iffy on that Gigabyte board, so chose an Asus with RAID support...
$109.99 - ASUS P5QL-E

Video Card:
$404.98 - ASUS EAH4870, Bundled with Vista Home Premium OS (Newegg combo)

Memory:
$104.99 - G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR2 1066, Model F2-8500CL5D-4GBP
*Not sure if I'll stick with this choice. Reviews say this might OC easily, though.

Processor:
$329.99 - Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450

CPU Cooler:
$5.99 - Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound
$39.99 - Xigmatec HDT-RS1283
$6.99 - XIGMATEK ACK-I7751 Retention Bracket
*Not sure if I'll stick with this choice either. It's a heavy cooler just held in place by push-pins.

Hard Drive:
$89.99 - Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD6400AAKS 640GB

Optical Drive:
$26.49 - SAMSUNG SH-S203N 20X DVD±R DVD Burner with LightScribe

3.5" 'drive':
$29.99 - Rosewill RCR-FD200 All-in-one Card Reader with 1.44MB Floppy Drive

OS:
$ - Vista Home Premium (see above for 'combo' price)


Current subtotal with 3 day shipping: $1,438.89

Does anyone have any other suggestions? Quiter drives, better quality parts, etc?

 

[auburnu008]

Next week you should be able to get a q9550 for around the same price as a Q9445. There is going to be a price drop in the q9445 as well.

 

[timme]

CPU Cooler:
$5.99 - Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound
$39.99 - Xigmatec HDT-RS1283
$6.99 - XIGMATEK ACK-I7751 Retention Bracket
*Not sure if I'll stick with this choice either. It's a heavy cooler just held in place by push-pins.

Since you added the Retention Bracket it is held by a solid mainboard backplate, so you should be fine

I'm not sure, but I think you could chose cheaper RAM since the CPU won't OC high enough to come over 400FSB. (DDR2 800)

Besides that it looks really solid

 

[zaxour]

You forgot to mention what resolution displays you'll be gaming on - if you're going to be gaming at 1680x1050 or lower, I would say go with the 4850.

Also, you may want to consider just getting a q6600 and giving it a mild overclock. You'll save $130 and have pretty much the same performance.

 

[Dangman]

With the Q9450, you don't need overclock capable RAM. This DDR2 1000 RAM will be more than enough for overclocking with the Q9450:
G.SKILL F2-8000CL5D-4GBPQ 2 x 2GB DDR2 1000 RAM - $85

Some math:
Stated FSB/4 = Actual FSB
Multiplier x Actual FSB = CPU Speed
1:1 Ratio: 2 x Actual FSB = RAM Speed
1:1 Ratio: FSB = 1/2 RAM speed

Q9450:
Multi x Actual FSB, Stated FSB, RAM Speed = Clock Speed
8 × 333Mhz = 2.6Ghz, DDR2-667 <<== Stock speeds
8 × 400Mhz = 3.2Ghz, DDR2-800 <<== Easy OC
8 × 450Mhz = 3.6Ghz, DDR2-900 <<== Good OC
8 × 500Mhz = 4.0Ghz, DDR2-1000 <<== Excellent OC

Definitely get the bracket. It'll be much easier to install than the push-pins and will yield lower temps too. Ditch the AS5 though. The TIM that comes with the Xigmatek is just as a good as the AS5.

Some motherboard recommendations:
Gigabyte GA-EP43-DS3L Intel P43 Motherboard - $96
MSI P45 Neo3-FR Intel P45 Motherboard - $120
Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3R Intel P45 Motherboard - $145
Asus P5Q Pro Intel P45 Motherboard - $150
DFI Lanparty DK X38-T2R Intel X38 Motherboard - $185
Gigabyte GA-X48-DS4 Intel X48 Motherboard - $225

Just to help you out: All of these motherboards have PCI-E 2.0 which may be useful for future GPU upgrades. If you don't need RAID, more than 6 SATA ports and only need semi-decent overclocking, check out the DS3L. If you need 8 SATA ports, RAID, 4 PCI slots, and legacy ports, then get the Neo3-Fr. If you don't need more than 6 SATA ports but want RAID, firewire, a second PCI-E x16 port, a second gigabit port, support for 16GB of RAM, optional eSATA, and high overclocks, then get the DS3R. If you like the DS3R but need 8 SATA ports, want an onboard pre-installed fast booting Linux setup or don't need a second gigabit port, get the Asus P5Q Pro. If you want Crossfire with full x16/x16 bandwidth, get the Lanparty DK X38.

If you don't really need modular cables, I recommend getting in on this excellent deal for a quality 750W PSU:
Corsair 750TX 750W PSU - $98

And as been asked before, what size montiors do you and your wife have?

 

[zyir]

You forgot to mention what resolution displays you'll be gaming on - if you're going to be gaming at 1680x1050 or lower, I would say go with the 4850.
Also, you may want to consider just getting a q6600 and giving it a mild overclock. You'll save $130 and have pretty much the same performance.

I plan to game at 1680x1050, but I'd like the PC to last as long as my 2600+ has held out. So, to "future-proof" it, I'll likely get the Q9550 with next week's price drop. Also, the ATI 4870 should last us at least a couple years, I hope.

 

[zyir]

And as been asked before, what size montiors do you and your wife have?

Sorry... The monitor is in the sig, LG L227WTG-PF. It's a 22" 16:10 widescreen.

Thanks to everyone for all the great feedback!
Any additional advice is definitely welcome, too.

 

[timme]

I had horrible thermal compound with my Xigmatek, although thats over here in Europe. (the white stuff that looks/feels like lime mixed with water)

 

[engiNURD]

I had horrible thermal compound with my Xigmatek, although thats over here in Europe. (the white stuff that looks/feels like lime mixed with water)

What were your temps with it? .. and what are your temps now?

 

[timme]

What were your temps with it? .. and what are your temps now?

It went straight to the bin since I didn't want to mess around with it. I used AS5.

Even if the stuff performs good, I definately prefer thermal compound that comes in a syringe for clean usage

 

[engiNURD]

It went straight to the bin since I didn't want to mess around with it. I used AS5.

http://timeinfeldt.com/img/wlp.jpg

Even if the stuff performs good, I definately prefer thermal compound that comes in a syringe for clean usage

You didn't even give it a chance before you said it was horrible? tsk tsk. It actually does perform pretty well, from what I've heard. Clean usage? you cut a corner of the bag and it comes out as if from a syringe - end result is the same.

 

[zyir]

Heh... Either way, I'm getting the Artic Silver compound.

Updated my list, and made it a "Wish List" on Newegg...
At the moment it totals at over $1700, but with next week's price drops it should be below $1500 again.

I don't know a lot about cases and "silent" parts... Do you folks have any additional recommendations for a semi-quiet system (other than vid card, I know the 4870 is a bit loud)?

Thanks!

 

[legendz411]

Heh... Either way, I'm getting the Artic Silver compound.

Updated my list, and made it a "Wish List" on Newegg...
At the moment it totals at over $1700, but with next week's price drops it should be below $1500 again.

I don't know a lot about cases and "silent" parts... Do you folks have any additional recommendations for a semi-quiet system (other than vid card, I know the 4870 is a bit loud)?

Thanks!

rofl, you have like 9 of everything!

haha Send a PC my way!

 

[timme]

With the parts on your wish list, you won't have problems with noise. The video card will turn up a bit while gaming, but that is being compensated by the gaming sound via headset/speakers.

The fans that come with the P182 aren't perfect, but they are adjustable in three settings. On the lowest setting, they provide good cooling while running very silent. All parts with air cooling (CPU, Case, PSU) have 120mm fans that move enough air without spinning too fast, thus keeping noise down. As said before, the video card is the only thing that _could_ get a bit louder, but nothing I would get worried about.

Plus, the case you chose has silicone grommets for the HDD and PSU cages, so vibration noise is not a factor.

I find it really hard to not sound like a cheesy salesperson, but the Antec cases really do solve quite a lot of noise problems up front.

In short: if you stick with that configuration, the system(s) will most likely run very silent.

 

[engiNURD]

...
The fans that come with the P182 aren't perfect, but they are adjustable in three settings. On the lowest setting, they provide good cooling while running very silent. All parts with air cooling (CPU, Case, PSU) have 120mm fans that move enough air without spinning too fast, thus keeping noise down. As said before, the video card is the only thing that _could_ get a bit louder, but nothing I would get worried about.
....
In short: if you stick with that configuration, the system(s) will most likely run very silent.

I know... I'm nitpicking... but still...

Yes, the P182 is a great case for quiet computing, but it is not silent. The Tri-Cool fans that come with the case are far from silent, and even on low, they do not provide good cooling -- adequate, yes, but thats not good, just good enough. If you want better cooling and less noise, pickup 5x $4 Yate Loon 120mm fans from jab-tech.com, medium speed.

There's a difference between quiet and silent; and yes, the dBA level to differentiate between the two is very subjective. Silent means you can not hear anything at all, while quiet typically means something is audible, but barely.

 

[timme]

I know... I'm nitpicking... but still...

That's what a forum is for

But as you said, it comes down to the personal definition of quiet and silent. You can hear the TriCools at low setting, although the "air flow" kind of sound is usually less annoying than high-frequency screaming of HDDs or other stuff. Some people can live with it, some can't.

But since we are talking about 6-10 fans here, I would definately try the TriCools first.

 

[zyir]

rofl, you have like 9 of everything!
haha Send a PC my way!

Odd... I only added one of every component to the Wish List, but somehow it showed 9 or 10 of each item.
I've corrected it, and the cost is below $1700 now.
Should be well below $1500 by the end of the month... Yay!

 

[Dangman]

If you want better cooling and less noise, pickup 5x $4 Yate Loon 120mm fans from jab-tech.com, medium speed.

But since we are talking about 6-10 fans here, I would definately try the TriCools first.

Enginurd mentions 5 fans, Timme mentions 6-10 fans and yet the the P182 comes with only four official spots for fans (the unofficial fifth fan spot is in front of the lower hard drive bay)

Anyway, the fans that Enginurd mention only costs $3.60. So 4-5 of those fans will only cost around $15 to $18.

And I concur with Enginurd about the Antec Tri-Cool fans. The Yate Loon fans mentioned earlier is just as quiet as the Antec Tri-Cool fans on low yet matches the airflow of the Tri-Cools on high.

But like Timme said, try the Antec fans and if they're not to your liking, buy the Yate Loons.

 

[timme]

Enginurd mentions 5 fans, Timme mentions 6-10 fans and yet the the P182 comes with only four official spots for fans (the unofficial fifth fan spot is in front of the lower hard drive bay)

Rear, top, PSU/HDD area, thats 3 as a minimum.
Replace HSF, add optional fan at GPU height/upper hdd cage, thats 5.

Two identical systems zyir wants to build, thats 6-10 fans

 

[Dangman]

Rear, top, PSU/HDD area, thats 3 as a minimum.
Replace HSF, add optional fan at GPU height/upper hdd cage, thats 5.

Two identical systems zyir wants to build, thats 6-10 fans

Ahh gotcha.

 

[engiNURD]

... the P182 comes with only four official spots for fans (the unofficial fifth fan spot is in front of the lower hard drive bay)...

Unofficial? The case comes with brackets for it. That makes it official in my book! lol

I agree, try them out first, and if you don't like 'em, ditch 'em for some Yate Loons. The good thing is, if he's buying around 10 fans, he'll get a slight discount from jab-tech.com.

 

[zyir]

Looks like I'll try it with the stock fans first, then.

One more question...
Would that case remain relatively quiet with the front door removed?
We have desks with a spot for the PC that requires us to remove the door so we can access the drives. Similar to this one, though our desks are larger it has the same "dock" for the PC in the center: http://www.nextag.com/O-Sullivan-AxentByO-sullivan-511131313/prices-html

Everyone has been very helpful!

 

[GJSNeptune]

What about using Vista x64 instead?

 

[monkeybiziu]

I suggest you check out the rig in my sig. Total cost: <$900, pre-rebate. It might fit what you're looking for.

 

[zyir]

What about using Vista x64 instead?

I hadn't considered it, or even looked into it. What are the advantages/disadvantages of using 64bit instead of 32bit?

 

[engiNURD]

Yes, it will be quiet, but obviously not as quiet as it could be. You can't leave the door on and just open it when needed?

I hadn't considered it, or even looked into it. What are the advantages/disadvantages of using 64bit instead of 32bit?

The main advantage is you'll be able to use all 4GB of your RAM.

 

[GJSNeptune]

64bit theoretically processes instructions and such twice as fast as 32bit.

 

[zyir]

Ok... Before I bite the bullet and get the systems, here's what I have so far. Let me know what you folks think...
The price dropped today on the Q9550.

Prices from Newegg...

Case:
$139.99 - Antec P182 Gun Metal Black
Power supply:
$119.99 - CORSAIR CMPSU-520HX 520W
Motherboard (preferrably a P43 chipset since I only plan to use one vid card, P45 is also an option):
$109.99 - ASUS P5QL-E (I'm also considering the P5Q-E ... I like the onboard eSATA port)
Processor (price dropped today ... Yay!):
$339.99 - Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550
Heat sink:
$36.99 - XIGMATEK HDT-S1283
$6.99 - XIGMATEK ACK-I7751 Retention Bracket
Memory:
$84.99 - G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1000
Video card:
$284.99 - VisionTek 900244 Radeon HD 4870 512MB
Hard disk drive:
$84.99 - Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD6400AAKS 640GB
Optical drive:
$24.99 - SAMSUNG 22X DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-S223F
Card reader / floppy:
$29.99 - Rosewill RCR-FD200 All-in-one USB 2.0 Black 3.5" Card Reader with 1.44MB Floppy Drive
Operating system:
$109.99 - Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit
SATA to IDE converter (to use with current 320GB IDE drive, may just get a USB drive enclosure instead):
$19.99 - Rosewill RC-204 IDE to SATA Mini Vertical Bridge (for IDE device)

Total: $1,393.87

Though, I'm also considering a "boutique" shop. If they'd be able to build a similar system for less than $1500.

 

[Dangman]

I recommend saving $60 and get the Q9450 instead:
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450 CPU - $280

The .5 multiplier and 166Mhz increase in speed is not worth $60 IMO. And if you buy from the Microcenter link, you might as well save another $30 and pick up the OS from there:
Windows Vista Home Premium 64bit SP1 OEM - $80

Also, it is more cost-effective getting a USB drive enclosure instead. You get a ton of flexibiity as a result. Don't spend the money on an adaptor. Though you probably don't need to use a USB enclosure at all since many motherboards these days come with at least one IDE port.

Also, ditch the P5QL-E. It and the the P5Q has the 24Pin connector in a pretty stupid place IMO (close to the middle of the motheboard). That will lead to airflow and cablemanagement problems with the P182 case. So I recommend getting one of these other motherboards instead:
Gigabyte GA-EP43-DS3L Intel P43 Motherboard - $90
MSI P45 Neo3-FR Intel P45 Motherboard - $107
Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3R Intel P45 Motherboard - $130
Asus P5Q Pro Intel P45 Motherboard - $140
DFI Lanparty DK X38-T2R Intel X38 Motherboard - $180
Asus P5E Deluxe Intel X48 Motherboard - $220
Gigabyte GA-X48-DS4 Intel X48 Motherboard - $225

Just to help you out: All of these motherboards have PCI-E 2.0 which may be useful for future GPU upgrades. If you don't need RAID, more than 6 SATA ports and only need semi-decent overclocking, check out the DS3L. If you need 8 SATA ports, RAID, 4 PCI slots, and legacy ports, then get the Neo3-Fr. If you don't need more than 6 SATA ports but want RAID, firewire, a second PCI-E x16 port, a second gigabit port, support for 16GB of RAM, optional eSATA, x8/x8 Crossfire, and high overclocks, then get the DS3R. If you like the DS3R but need 8 SATA ports, want an onboard pre-installed fast booting Linux setup, only need support for 8GB of RAM and don't need a second gigabit port, get the Asus P5Q Pro. If you want Crossfire with full x16/x16 bandwidth, get the Lanparty DK X38. If you have cash to burn and don't give a damn about getting the most value for your money, get the Asus or Gigabyte X48 motherboards. Do note that the Asus website can be slow sometimes.

And no, most likely you won't find a decent boutique shop that will build a similar system for less than $1500. $1700 maybe but not less than that.

 

[tiraides]

To save money on parts, get the Antec P182 and the Corsair HX520 at Buy.com. If you're getting the HD4870, I recommend getting either the Silverstone ST60F or the Corsair HX620 instead.

Danny said everything else that I was going to say, so listen to him.

 

[Zero82z]

If you're getting the HD4870, I recommend getting either the Silverstone ST60F or the Corsair HX620 instead.

That's unnecessary. His system under full load with a 4870 will use 300W at most, so the HX520 will be plenty. Even the 450VX would be able to handle his system with ease, although the modular cables of the HX make it more convenient to work with.

 

[tiraides]

In the case of the power supply, I'd rather be safe (and have a bit more power than necessary) than sorry. The ST60F costs around the same as the HX520W yet it generates a bit more power (especially in the 12V rail).

 

[Zero82z]

In the case of the power supply, I'd rather be safe (and have a bit more power than necessary) than sorry. The ST60F costs around the same as the HX520W yet it generates a bit more power (especially in the 12V rail).

Considering the prices, that's fair enough. If the Silverstone was more expensive though, it would be pointless. Another thing to note is that the Corsair is modular.

 

[tiraides]

I have the ST60F, and I can vouch that it's modular.

 

[Zero82z]

I have the ST60F, and I can vouch that it's modular.

Ah, sorry about that. From the pictures on Newegg it looked like a regular model, but I looked at the larger versions and it is indeed a modular PSU.

 

[zyir]

Welp... I ordered the wife and I a couple of new PCs from a boutique shop; I chose Ava Direct, since they're highly rated and have some of the best configuration options I've seen on a website.
I figured that it was worth the extra bit of cash to get the computers pre-built, pre-tested, and with a three year warranty. Though, I did skimp a little on some things, just to keep the cost below $1500 per system...

Here's what I'll be getting:

+ CUSTOM COMPUTER, Core™2 DDR2 Performance Series System 2
# ANTEC, Performance One P180 Silver Mid Tower Computer Case, ATX, 450W PSU
# ASUS, P5Q Pro, LGA775, Intel® P45, 1600MHz FSB, DDR2-1200 16GB /4, PCIe x16 CF /2, SATA 3.0 Gbit/s RAID 5 /8, HDA, GbLAN, FW /2, ATX, Retail
# INTEL, Core™ 2 Quad Q9550 Quad-Core 2.83GHz, 1333MHz FSB, 12MB (2 x 6MB) L2 Cache, 45nm, 95W, EM64T EIST VT XD, Retail
# XIGMATEK, HDT-S1283 CPU Cooling Fan/Heatsink, Socket 775/754/939/940/AM2, 120mm Fan, Copper/Aluminum, Retail
# G.SKILL, 4GB (2 x 2GB) PC2-6400 DDR2 800MHz CL5 (5-5-5-15) SDRAM DIMM, Non-ECC
# VISIONTEK, Radeon® HD 4870 750MHz, 512MB GDDR5 1800Mhz, PCIe x16 CrossFire, DVI /2, Retail
# WESTERN DIGITAL, 640GB WD Caviar® SE16 (WD6400AAKS), SATA 3 Gb/s, 7200-RPM, 16MB cache
# RAID, No RAID, Independent HDD Drives
# SAMSUNG, Super-WriteMaster™ SH-S223 Black 22x DVD±R/RW Dual-Layer Burner, SATA, w/ Software, OEM
# MICROSOFT, Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit Edition w/ SP1, OEM
# WARRANTY, Silver Warranty Package (3 Year Limited Parts, 3 Year Labor Warranty)


Thanks to everyone for all the great input!
This will be the first PC I've gotten in the last fifteen years that I haven't built myself. I guess I'm just gettin' lazy in my old age.
... and, yes, I do still use my old "clackety" keyboard, AT with a PS2 adapter.

 

[engiNURD]

Nice... post some pics!

 

[Anchen]

Welp... I ordered the wife and I a couple of new PCs from a boutique shop; I chose Ava Direct, since they're highly rated and have some of the best configuration options I've seen on a website.
I figured that it was worth the extra bit of cash to get the computers pre-built, pre-tested, and with a three year warranty. Though, I did skimp a little on some things, just to keep the cost below $1500 per system...

Here's what I'll be getting:

+ CUSTOM COMPUTER, Core™2 DDR2 Performance Series System 2
# ANTEC, Performance One P180 Silver Mid Tower Computer Case, ATX, 450W PSU
# ASUS, P5Q Pro, LGA775, Intel® P45, 1600MHz FSB, DDR2-1200 16GB /4, PCIe x16 CF /2, SATA 3.0 Gbit/s RAID 5 /8, HDA, GbLAN, FW /2, ATX, Retail
# INTEL, Core™ 2 Quad Q9550 Quad-Core 2.83GHz, 1333MHz FSB, 12MB (2 x 6MB) L2 Cache, 45nm, 95W, EM64T EIST VT XD, Retail
# XIGMATEK, HDT-S1283 CPU Cooling Fan/Heatsink, Socket 775/754/939/940/AM2, 120mm Fan, Copper/Aluminum, Retail
# G.SKILL, 4GB (2 x 2GB) PC2-6400 DDR2 800MHz CL5 (5-5-5-15) SDRAM DIMM, Non-ECC
# VISIONTEK, Radeon® HD 4870 750MHz, 512MB GDDR5 1800Mhz, PCIe x16 CrossFire, DVI /2, Retail
# WESTERN DIGITAL, 640GB WD Caviar® SE16 (WD6400AAKS), SATA 3 Gb/s, 7200-RPM, 16MB cache
# RAID, No RAID, Independent HDD Drives
# SAMSUNG, Super-WriteMaster™ SH-S223 Black 22x DVD±R/RW Dual-Layer Burner, SATA, w/ Software, OEM
# MICROSOFT, Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit Edition w/ SP1, OEM
# WARRANTY, Silver Warranty Package (3 Year Limited Parts, 3 Year Labor Warranty)


Thanks to everyone for all the great input!
This will be the first PC I've gotten in the last fifteen years that I haven't built myself. I guess I'm just gettin' lazy in my old age.
... and, yes, I do still use my old "clackety" keyboard, AT with a PS2 adapter.

Just curious, what's the PSU they are including in that case?