Breaking my own promises...

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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Sep 9, 2011
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500
I said I would never build another PC and here is am, breaking my own rules.. Let me explain.

A friend of mine traded me two 1070 Ti's for an R610 server I had. So i am sitting here, starring at two minty cards and having a real hard debate if I should sell them or build a rig...

I already have the cards obviously. I have a beef cake PSU and I have a case..

It's been a while since I last inquired about the latest tech and jargon so I am out of the loop on motherboards and what's what today.

Can someone recommend for me an Intel based Motherboard, CPU and Memory combo? I will be purchasing from Newegg since I have their CC and get 12 months no interest to pay back.

Are/is the Intel 300 series chipset motherboards the latest on the block? Just to mention, I do NOT plan or care to overclock so that is not a choosing factor.
 
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Keljian

Gawd
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Nov 7, 2006
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834
What is your workload? When do you intend to upgrade/supersede it?

I rather like my setup

Gigabyte z390 Aorus Ultra
i7-9700k
32gig Gskill trident DDR4/3200
Noctua D15

But it is overkill for some things.
 
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PhaseNoise

2[H]4U
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^. K makes solid recommendations.

As K says, it could be overkill for your needs, that's a pretty high end setup.

If you'd like to shave some bucks off that, you could easily go to a 8700k, and 3200 memory without a significant hit for most cases (especially gaming). You could go down the stack on GB's motherboard offerings too of course. The "what is the difference between X and Y" gets irritating on all motherboard mfg sites, unfortunately. Get a name brand's high tier offering, and you're not likely to have problems as long as it has the I/O you require. Unless you're going for serious overclocking, you're not likely to notice a difference in motherboards beyond their I/O options.

I'd personally modulate the cpu cooler to say "D15S". The S model has more accommodations to other components (the offset design dodges nearby PCIE slots and the cutout fits taller RAM better), and doesn't give up much in cooling. It's still a beast of a cooler.
 

geok1ng

2[H]4U
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SLi is dead, so consider selling 1 VGA an keeping the other.

At today's prices, i would most likely build a X79 system:

Mobos are dirt cheap and can still be found new.
Last chipset with cheap DDR3. looking right, brand new memory in package can still be found.
Bargain bin Xeon CPUs are available, like 8c16t e5-2687w for the NO-OC promise , or the unlocked E5-1650 6c12t.

X79 can get you a 95th percentile gaming/prosumer system for less than $400. if going all bells and whistles with xeon E5 v2 CPUs and high end X79 mobos, total build cost will be much cheaper than a DD4 build.
 

Keljian

Gawd
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At today's prices, i would most likely build a X79 system:


X79 can get you a 95th percentile gaming/prosumer system for less than $400. if going all bells and whistles with xeon E5 v2 CPUs and high end X79 mobos, total build cost will be much cheaper than a DD4 build.

No, definitely not, no AVX2 for a start. Minimum I would consider as decent is haswell these days, even that won’t get 95 percentile

https://techreport.com/review/34205/checking-in-on-intel-core-i7-5775c-for-gaming-in-2018

This shows broadwell results, even with the extra L3 it isn’t a miracle chip
 
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geok1ng

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better than 95% of the gaming machines out there for sure. and value competition for a 9700k, especially if one will not OC.
weeks ago there were dozes of e5 2697 v2 12c/24t on ebay hoving the $275 price point, not ES chips, but retail parts.
the chips i suggested are $100-$130
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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Wow this is all good info guys, exactly why I came to you guys.

it is really possible to game on a Xeon? I've always been under the notion that Xeon wasn't good for gaming.
 

geok1ng

2[H]4U
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it is really possible to game on a Xeon?
Since at least Skulltrail in 2008.
On X58: 6c/12t Xeons, capable of BCLK OC. prices star at $15 6c/12t.
On x79: e5-1600 chips are multiplier unlocked, e5-2600 are multi locked. Prices range from $60 to $320, from 4c8t to 12c/24t.
On both: ECC DDR3 is cheaper than plain DDR3, which in turn is cheaper than DDR4. As the video shows, X79 is quad channel, in-game latency is better than on a 9900k.

Point is to find a good mobo: X58 mobos are not cheap, good X79 are expensive, and news ones are chinese made.
On a weaker mobo, v2 xeons might be preferable, because they use less power clock for clock.

i do believe that PC builds should match price/performance tiers.
If on uses a 2080ti, a X79 build should use a high end x79 mobo with the best single socket CPU, E5-1680 v2 ~$230.
A mid range GPU like 1070ti could be paired with a mid range 1650v2 ~$100.
 

Keljian

Gawd
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Counterpoint;

An x79 won’t have mod cons, no usb3.1, no usb c or thunderbolt. No NVME support.

As this is primarily a gaming system I still say haswell is he oldest generation I would consider. Still get to use ddr3 if that is your thing.
 

Keljian

Gawd
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https://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/2258?vs=2427

The best comparison I can find, as Xeon benchmarks in games specifically are few and far between (for obvious reasons).

Essentially the blue bar is the 9700k, the orange is the xeon, which is very close in performance to the one recommended by geoking.

Performance wise, the 9700k is about twice and sometimes three times as fast.
 
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geok1ng

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https://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/2258?vs=2427

The best comparison I can find, as Xeon benchmarks in games specifically are few and far between (for obvious reasons).

Essentially the blue bar is the 9970k, the orange is the xeon, which is very close in performance to the one recommended by geoking.

Performance wise, the 9970k is about twice and sometimes three times as fast.
loved you reply. totally on topic, compared a 4c8t non-oced xeon to a 8c8t i7. to make matters worst, its a 32nm sandy bridge, when we are discussing 22nm Ivy bridge EP.

No NVME support.
google it. nvme> pcie adapters + UEFI bios mod. even my X58 can run NVME drives.
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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Looking at the newer Z370 or H370, is there a reason I would pick the Z? I would like to use one graphics card, the 1070, and an M.2 SSD. Would I lose or gain anything by getting the Z370 over the H370? One has 24 PCI-E lanes and the other has 20. What am I missing here?

THIS board has three M.2 slots for on board SSD's. I like this since I don't like using SATA drives. Will having each one occupied with an SSD affect the graphics cards speed? Mainly asking because I don't understand how the X16 lanes are divided out.
 
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Keljian

Gawd
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I would go the Z390 over the H370 or z370.

Z over H because Z allows faster memory (memory speeds above 2666mhz)
390 over 370 because the newer boards have better VRMs which imo is necessary for the i7-9700k/i9-9900k chips

The only thing having M2 slots occupied will do is limit the number of SATA ports available

My choice (if money is not tight) is the gigabyte z390 aorus ultra. Per earlier post. It has 3 NVME/M2 slots.

The elite and the pro wifi are also good boards
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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To be honest, I don't use more than 3 or 4 USB ports at a time and USB 3.0 is just fine, I don't care much for faster. All my media and music is on another server and it comes to my machine via gigabit which is plenty fast.

I like the Z390 and to be honest, money isn't an issue. I don't plan on blowing the budget on a CPU though. If I were to get the Z390, what would be a good recommendation for a CPU.
 

Keljian

Gawd
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ok there are 3 cpus I'd suggest for a z390

a. i7-8700k (6c12t)
b. i7-9700k (8c8t)
c. i9-9900k (8c16t)

8700k is a good general purpose cpu. Sort of middle of the road for the high end.
9700k is faster in games and single threaded software generally speaking
9900k is the top of the line for desktops

I went with the best I could afford, which was the 9700k. Processors are expensive here.

If you can find a deal, I'd go with C, but if that will blow your budget, I'd look at A and B in the context of what you're running on the computer.

You will need a solid heatsink for any of these. I recommend the Noctua D15s as PhaseNoise suggested.
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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So far, I have the Z390 Aorus Ultra and the i7-8700 on the shopping list. I don't think I need the K version since I don't plan to do any overclocking. Looking at memory now..
 

Keljian

Gawd
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Gskill trident 3200

get the K even if not overclocking, it has a higher default turbo clock.
 

Keljian

Gawd
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why 3200+?

Because 3000-3200 seems to be the optimal performance wise, and you're not really pushing the processor to reach that.
 

Keljian

Gawd
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That memory will do it.

I personally think you should sell both and get a 1080ti, or 2080 - I don't like SLI.
 

geok1ng

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https://www.microcenter.com/product...-gigabyte-b450m-ds3h-cpu---motherboard-bundle

Same price as some of the stuff you quoted, full warranty, 8c/16t and a lot faster.
good price, but as the video i posted showed, the X79 Xeons have lower lag and OC better. it all depends on which x79 mobo one gets and at what price point. do not forget DDR4 prices.

I personally think you should sell both and get a 1080ti
i second that notion.
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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Do you guys think the 2070 is significantly better card vs the 1070 ti that I have?
 

ReaperX22

Gawd
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Do you guys think the 2070 is significantly better card vs the 1070 ti that I have?
Not hugely. It's better by ~15-20% but if you were to sell the 1070 ti's I'd consider a 1080 Ti (faster than an RTX 2070) or RTX 2080. A used 1080 Ti will give you the best bang/buck. Would likely work out cheaper perhaps if you sell both 70 ti's?
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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Well, one is sold. I'm hanging onto the other unless it sells but I'm starting to wonder if its worth selling. Doesn't seem like i'll get much more with a 1080 Ti.. I don't even see the 1080 Ti's on newegg anymore..

Seems to me like gamers got the shaft big time. All the cards were snatched up early on by crypto miners and nothing was left for the casual gamer. Nvidia didn't care, they were making their money and now that its all played out, crypto isnt viable anymore, they suddenly drop the RTX 20 which seems to be no better than the 1080ti.. This is why I stopped building computers from the get go..
 
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Mr. Bluntman

[H]ardness Supreme
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Jun 25, 2007
Messages
6,408
SLi is dead, so consider selling 1 VGA an keeping the other.

At today's prices, i would most likely build a X79 system:

Mobos are dirt cheap and can still be found new.
Last chipset with cheap DDR3. looking right, brand new memory in package can still be found.
Bargain bin Xeon CPUs are available, like 8c16t e5-2687w for the NO-OC promise , or the unlocked E5-1650 6c12t.

X79 can get you a 95th percentile gaming/prosumer system for less than $400. if going all bells and whistles with xeon E5 v2 CPUs and high end X79 mobos, total build cost will be much cheaper than a DD4 build.
No, definitely not, no AVX2 for a start. Minimum I would consider as decent is haswell these days, even that won’t get 95 percentile

https://techreport.com/review/34205/checking-in-on-intel-core-i7-5775c-for-gaming-in-2018

This shows broadwell results, even with the extra L3 it isn’t a miracle chip
+1 for Haswell-E. Cost me almost $625 used all said and done to upgrade from a 2600 non-K last year, but that was with a $220 memory kit at sort of the height of DRAM price gouging.
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
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Messages
500
Ok so here is what I have in my waste bin, ready to buy;

Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Ultra https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813145090&ignorebbr=1
CPU: Intel i7 8700 https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117826&ignorebbr=1
RAM: GSkill TridentZ 32Gb DDR4 3200 https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820232413&ignorebbr=1
GPU: EVGA RTX 2080 FTW3 Ultra https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814487414&ignorebbr=1 (Debating getting the Gigabyte Aorus 2080)
SSD: Gigabyte Aorus M.2 512Gb https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?item=N82E16820009007

Total is gonna run me around $1600.

I will recycle my SeaSonic 1kw Platinum PSU and my LianLi PC-V33 case.

Anyone see anything I can alter or anything that would clash?
 

ReaperX22

Gawd
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What's the 32GB for? Probably my only gripe. If you don't really need 32gb, save the case and drop to 16. Consider upping the SSD to 1TB instead?

Also I know everyone advocated for Z390 board.. But I personally see pretty minimal point grabbing a Z390 board with a non-k CPU. Sure it gives you extra features, but what for if you won't utilise most of them? The difference between 2666mhz RAM and 3200 for Intel is far less pronounced than it is for AMD performance wise..
 

Keljian

Gawd
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834
Z390 for the vrms and longevity.

Samsung evo plus would be my preference over the gigabyte ssd, the aorus board already has heat sinks on it for that
 

M3Roc

Limp Gawd
Joined
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Messages
500
What's the 32GB for? Probably my only gripe. If you don't really need 32gb, save the case and drop to 16. Consider upping the SSD to 1TB instead?

Also I know everyone advocated for Z390 board.. But I personally see pretty minimal point grabbing a Z390 board with a non-k CPU. Sure it gives you extra features, but what for if you won't utilise most of them? The difference between 2666mhz RAM and 3200 for Intel is far less pronounced than it is for AMD performance wise..
32Gb is for some of the rendering and 3D design I do on occasion. In my past experience, I've never complained about having more than enough RAM. I also run VM sometimes.

The Z390 is for longevity. I build a new machine once every 6 to 8 years so I want it to be worth it for me in the long run. I also don't generally sell my old hardware, I hang onto it so it may come into use in the late future.

Z390 for the vrms and longevity.

Samsung evo plus would be my preference over the gigabyte ssd, the aorus board already has heat sinks on it for that
Speed wise, the Gigabyte and Samsung are on par. I have two EVO drives in my current machine that I plan to move. I will however be buying the WD Black M.2 1Tb drives in the future, two of them. So the compliment will be one Gigabyte 512gb drive for my OS and Software and two Tb drives for storage. I don't plan on using SATA drives, I don't like them. That's also why I chose this board. I wish they would place three or four more M.2 slots on the back of the board.

__

So really, other than what was mentioned above, there is no real reason not to buy what I have on the list? Can anyone tell me, does Gigabyte have a workstation type board?
 
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