Blur Buster certified monitors

MistaSparkul

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I hope Blurbusters "Version 3.0" of their certified monitors will include backlight strobe + VRR options, like Asus's ELMB sync. Being stuck with fixed refresh rates for strobing is a bummer, even if the range for strobed VRR is rather narrow like only 120Hz-165Hz I'd still be plenty happy with that.
 

Chief Blur Buster

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I hope Blurbusters "Version 3.0" of their certified monitors will include backlight strobe + VRR options, like Asus's ELMB sync. Being stuck with fixed refresh rates for strobing is a bummer, even if the range for strobed VRR is rather narrow like only 120Hz-165Hz I'd still be plenty happy with that.

;)
It's on the roadmap (and early talks!) but it will be a while before I begin working with VRR strobe.

Don't wait for me during this generation cycle -- the complexity of making VRR strobe good, makes that one almost Valve Time stuff.

I did talk about its complexity back in ~2014 in an electronics hacking article. It will be very, very hard to Blur Busters certify VRR strobe because people want something different -- e.g. do they want the ELMB-SYNC devil-horn behavior to reduce flicker, or do they want a bit more flicker to have better single-strobe behavior through entire VRR range -- or new VRR-strobe algorithms. Then sometimes you want to widen/narrow the strobe range to avoid the varying-crosstalk problem, because of the varying GtGtime:RefreshTime ratio that is unfixable. So many Pandora Boxes. Ouch.

I have some new algorithms being brewed up, but there will always be tradeoffs for VRR strobe due to the diaometrically-opposed balances that occurs.

The trick is giving advanced users the choice to configure. Any vendor monitor will usually be more likely to be pass Blur Busters Approved if they support an optional strobe utility for an optional "Custom" strobe setting, with lots of adjustment settings, with additional adjustment settings for VRR strobe (adjusting the flicker-vs-singlestrobe tradeoffs). This applies to both fixed-Hz strobe and variable-Hz strobe: Letting users tweak VRR strobe in the future.

1618991063581.png


(Note for advanced users: Vertical Total reduces input lag via the Quick Frame Transport effect, while simultaneously giving more time for LCD GtG, reducing strobe crosstalk. Upcoming versions will autoconfigure Vertical Total. VT4500 for 60Hz is supported, and VT2500 for 120Hz is supported.)

P.S. Few know this yet, but an accidentally discovered benefit for non-strobing users: Lower gaming-console lag ... The panel has unusually low 60Hz and 120Hz input lag too, since this panel's LCD pixel row refresh capability is horizontal scanrate multisync. While not (currently) part of Blur Busters Approved, it's another benefit.

This means panel is able to accept the cable data realtime bufferlessly at virtually any Hz (well, very tiny scanline buffers for overdrive/color processing and DP/HDMI micropacket dejitter -- but no full refresh cycle buffers!), in a top-to-bottom refresh scanout synchronous to the signal's current refresh rate. I suspect this'd be the first desktop 240Hz IPS panel that can do it to achieve subrefresh latency at all lower Hz. The reviewers who test the input lag of this panel will probably end up posting the world's lowest 60Hz latency scores for any 240Hz IPS panel (up to this current date). I'd hope, as I was impressed at the panel's low latency at flexible Hz. Hopefully.

Very few 240Hz monitors (e.g. XG258) does this, and has extremely low lag at 60Hz and 120Hz. Also, PureXP+ supports single-strobe at 60Hz too.

This combo makes XG2431 a contender for those who want to use the same monitor for both consoles and PCs.
 
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Comixbooks

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I was looking for this monitor but it seems to be pretty new the older monitors are listed.
 

Armenius

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;)
It's on the roadmap (and early talks!) but it will be a while before I begin working with VRR strobe.

Don't wait for me during this generation cycle -- the complexity of making VRR strobe good, makes that one almost Valve Time stuff.

I did talk about its complexity back in ~2014 in an electronics hacking article. It will be very, very hard to Blur Busters certify VRR strobe because people want something different -- e.g. do they want the ELMB-SYNC devil-horn behavior to reduce flicker, or do they want a bit more flicker to have better single-strobe behavior through entire VRR range -- or new VRR-strobe algorithms. Then sometimes you want to widen/narrow the strobe range to avoid the varying-crosstalk problem, because of the varying GtGtime:RefreshTime ratio that is unfixable. So many Pandora Boxes. Ouch.

I have some new algorithms being brewed up, but there will always be tradeoffs for VRR strobe due to the diaometrically-opposed balances that occurs.

The trick is giving advanced users the choice to configure. Any vendor monitor will usually be more likely to be pass Blur Busters Approved if they support an optional strobe utility for an optional "Custom" strobe setting, with lots of adjustment settings, with additional adjustment settings for VRR strobe (adjusting the flicker-vs-singlestrobe tradeoffs). This applies to both fixed-Hz strobe and variable-Hz strobe: Letting users tweak VRR strobe in the future.

View attachment 349676

(Note for advanced users: Vertical Total reduces input lag via the Quick Frame Transport effect, while simultaneously giving more time for LCD GtG, reducing strobe crosstalk. Upcoming versions will autoconfigure Vertical Total. VT4500 for 60Hz is supported, and VT2500 for 120Hz is supported.)


P.S. Few know this yet, but an accidentally discovered benefit for non-strobing users: Lower gaming-console lag ... The panel has unusually low 60Hz and 120Hz input lag too, since this panel's LCD pixel row refresh capability is horizontal scanrate multisync. While not (currently) part of Blur Busters Approved, it's another benefit.

This means panel is able to accept the cable data realtime bufferlessly at virtually any Hz (well, very tiny scanline buffers for overdrive/color processing and DP/HDMI micropacket dejitter -- but no full refresh cycle buffers!), in a top-to-bottom refresh scanout synchronous to the signal's current refresh rate. I suspect this'd be the first desktop 240Hz IPS panel that can do it to achieve subrefresh latency at all lower Hz. The reviewers who test the input lag of this panel will probably end up posting the world's lowest 60Hz latency scores for any 240Hz IPS panel (up to this current date). I'd hope, as I was impressed at the panel's low latency at flexible Hz. Hopefully.

Very few 240Hz monitors (e.g. XG258) does this, and has extremely low lag at 60Hz and 120Hz. Also, PureXP+ supports single-strobe at 60Hz too.

This combo makes XG2431 a contender for those who want to use the same monitor for both consoles and PCs.
I'm not really a fan of strobing because it hurts my eyes, but I do see the benefit and wish I could play comfortably with it. The decrease in persistence really does make a LCD look like a CRT in terms of motion clarity. Do you think being able to tweak the strobe that I may be able to find a setting that would work for me?
 

Chief Blur Buster

Owner of BlurBusters
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I'm not really a fan of strobing because it hurts my eyes, but I do see the benefit and wish I could play comfortably with it. The decrease in persistence really does make a LCD look like a CRT in terms of motion clarity. Do you think being able to tweak the strobe that I may be able to find a setting that would work for me?
Did you get eyestrain from CRTs in the past?

First, it’s also useful to self-diagnose why you get eyestrain from strobing.
(A) Is eyestrain from flicker or
(B) Is eyestrain from mult-image artifacts?

1619126713121.png


Some people tell me their strobing eyestrain disappeared when they capped framerate=Hz (with VSYNC ON or with RTSS microsecond-precise cap). For people who get eyestrain from strobe jittering or multiple images, the fix is framerate=Hz. As long as it was about 120Hz-ish or higher (above flicker fusion threshold), most became more comfortable with strobing.

Strategically, for specific games, it can be actually favourable to lower the refresh rate, to eliminate the strobe jitterss / multi image effect, if you cannot get framerate=Hz at higher refresh rates. This assumes, of course, your eyestrain is from harsh jitters/multiple images, instead of eyestrain from flicker.

Everybody has different components of eyestrain sensitivities to strobe — for people who have more motionblur eyestrain than flicker eyestrain, strobing can actually reduce eyestrain for such individuals who have to look at moving imagery all day. So your mileage will vary (YMMV).

Some top players in use strobing in certain games (Rainbow Six) because that game benefits from strobing MUCH more than CS:GO.

We know professional players in esports don’t always use strobing. However, it can be strategic for certain games. Where motion blur reduction (via strobing) reduce human reaction time by more than 10ms (due to less motion blur fog slowing your reaction in more arena-style games). Human reaction time savings in arena-style games can be significantly greater than any tiny (~2ms) increases in input lag caused by strobing. Some champs are smart enough to optimize for total human-to-pixels lag.

InputLagChain_human.png

The human is an input lag component too, so one is optimizing for the ENTIRE lag chain from brain-to-pixels, not just button-to-pixels. Including your brain’s reaction time, reduced by less motion blur.

One has to decide whether a specific game has strobe benefits that reduce the overall human reaction time. Fast-continually-running-around (not sniper camping) arena style games are one example that strobing benefits more than other types of games.

CS:GO players don’t turn on strobing as often (except some do for aim stabilizing, but not everyone needs that). It is known that snipers tend to not benefit as much from strobing. It is observed CS:GO does not benefit as much from strobing because it’s not a continuous-movement-mandatory arena style game.
 
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Armenius

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Did you get eyestrain from CRTs in the past?

First, it’s also useful to self-diagnose why you get eyestrain from strobing.
(A) Is eyestrain from flicker or
(B) Is eyestrain from mult-image artifacts?

View attachment 350136

Some people tell me their strobing eyestrain disappeared when they capped framerate=Hz (with VSYNC ON or with RTSS microsecond-precise cap). For people who get eyestrain from strobe jittering or multiple images, the fix is framerate=Hz. As long as it was about 120Hz-ish or higher (above flicker fusion threshold), most became more comfortable with strobing.

Some top players in use strobing in certain games (Rainbow Six) because that game benefits from strobing MUCH more than CS:GO.

We know esports don’t always use strobing, sometimes strobing reduce human reaction time by more than 10ms (due to less motion blur fog slowing your reaction in more arena-style games). Human reaction time savings in arena-style games can be significantly greater than any tiny (~2ms) increases in input lag caused by strobing. Some champs are smart enough to optimize for total human-to-pixels lag.

CS:GO players don’t turn on strobing as often because CS:GO does not benefit as much from strobing because it’s not a continuous-movement-mandatory Quake Arena style game.
I don't recall having an issue with CRT monitors, but I have had issues with LED backlit displays that use PWM dimming. My old Samsung TV had a low frequency PWM which prevented me from playing any games on it for more than half an hour or so. If I recall correctly I was initially testing ULMB with 60 FPS content at 60 Hz refresh rate. At the time I did it because I didn't have the hardware to hold 120 FPS for 120 Hz. I played around with the pulse width setting on the monitor, but it didn't really improve much. I could certainly give it another go since my hardware is powerful now to cap some games at 120 FPS.
 

Chief Blur Buster

Owner of BlurBusters
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Messages
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I don't recall having an issue with CRT monitors, but I have had issues with LED backlit displays that use PWM dimming. My old Samsung TV had a low frequency PWM which prevented me from playing any games on it for more than half an hour or so. If I recall correctly I was initially testing ULMB with 60 FPS content at 60 Hz refresh rate. At the time I did it because I didn't have the hardware to hold 120 FPS for 120 Hz. I played around with the pulse width setting on the monitor, but it didn't really improve much. I could certainly give it another go since my hardware is powerful now to cap some games at 120 FPS.
Pulse width does not affect the multi image effect. Instead, you must adjust your refresh rate and frame rate, until they sufficiently converge.

Pulse width is useful for reducing motion blur but it’s really 0.5ms MPRT vs 1.0ms MPRT versus 2.0ms MPRT, which is tiny differences compared to the original Hz (120Hz nonstrobed = guaranteed minimum 8.3ms MPRT(100%) worth of motion blur).

If you want to adjust pulse width, please test www.testufo.com/photo at a minimum of 2000 or 3000 pixels/sec. That’s the only time you can see MPRT differences 0.5ms vs 1.0ms vs 2.0ms. It does not affect the jittering or multi-image effect of unsynchronized “framerate ≠ Hz” strobing, one of the potential sources of strobing eyestrain.

The good news is strobing is optional, is highly tunable, and you have many options to optimize strobing on the XG2431 to fit your unique needs.

If you have access to another strobed monitor, try testing framerate=Hz to determine if your strobing eyestrain sensitivity is flicker-derived or jitters/multimage-derived. Lower Hz (but not too low) until framerate=Hz.

Others are not eyestrain sensitive to strobing and can just use VSYNC OFF uncapped framerates with strobing.

Also, it helps strobe jitters to try raising your mouse poll rate to about 2000-4000Hz to reduce strobe jitters a little bit. Oversampling your mouse Hz beyond display Hz is one good method to reduce strobe jitters a little for unsynchronized strobe motion. Few mice can do this, i.e. Razer 8000 Hz Viper. Be noted older games such as CS:GO isn’t always mouse high-Hz friendly.
 
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