Bitcoin Discussion Thread

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If anything kills BTC, it's going to be the length of time it takes to buy or sell them. Having to wait 2 or 3 days isnt conducive to trading.
 
And it seems every bitcoin related site is being DDOSed. I cant get to my pool, MtGox, the bitcoin forums, etc.
 
ValeX said:
People all over the internet accept payments in paypal account balance rather than USD. Can you buy groceries with your paypal account balance? Hell no! Can you easily convert your paypal account balance to USD to buy groceries? Hell yes!

***Flash to the future*** People all over the internet accept payments in bitcoins rather than USD. Can you buy groceries with your bitcoins? Hell no! Can you easily convert your bitcoins to USD to buy groceries? Hell yes!

^^ If bitcoins replaced paypal as the standard internet currency, generally speaking, each bitcoin would be worth thousands of dollars based on current online sales volumes. The price is based on "how wonderful would it be to have x.xxxx% of the worlds online capital for yourself?" and "how much risk am I taking in predicting bitcoins will actually become the worlds online currency"...

Now sketch up a pros and cons list for paypal vs bitcoins and see which one will be the better currency for online use.

meme you're being silly :confused:
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Paypal is not currency, it's more or less an internet bank which does business in U.S. dollars (at least in the U.S.). It's not competing with dollars, any more than Wells Fargo or JP morgan chase are. You depost dollars into your paypal account, or allow paypal to take money directly from your bank account.

This is nothing at all like what bitcoin is or hopes to be.

You are correct that, if bitcoin replaced Paypal and hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions were being done every day with bitcoin, Bitcoins would be worth a very large amount of money each. As of now, probably $10,000 a day in actual buying and selling (not trading over mgtox) is done using bitcoin, which probably prices bitcoins at about 2 cents each.
 
Chihlidog said:
And it seems every bitcoin related site is being DDOSed. I cant get to my pool, MtGox, the bitcoin forums, etc.
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?

BTC Guild is fine, Deepbit too, the forums are probably overloaded right now with people trying to figure out what's going on, from the looks of it from one post someone dumped half a million bitcoins into the market, the ensuing clusterfuckery makes sense...
 
wol-va-rine said:
?

BTC Guild is fine, Deepbit too, the forums are probably overloaded right now with people trying to figure out what's going on, from the looks of it from one post someone dumped half a million bitcoins into the market, the ensuing clusterfuckery makes sense...
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I thought about that, but with my mining pool (a smaller, more obscure one) being so slow I sort of ruled it out. And really how many people care THAT much about bitcoins to rush to said sites? Surely a few thousand but not more, not enough to cause traffic to slow that much.
 
wol-va-rine said:
?

BTC Guild is fine, Deepbit too, the forums are probably overloaded right now with people trying to figure out what's going on, from the looks of it from one post someone dumped half a million bitcoins into the market, the ensuing clusterfuckery makes sense...
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Yacht condition invoked!
iBck1.jpg
 
meme said:
Paypal is not currency, it's more or less an internet bank which does business in U.S. dollars (at least in the U.S.). It's not competing with dollars, any more than Wells Fargo or JP morgan chase are. You depost dollars into your paypal account, or allow paypal to take money directly from your bank account.

This is nothing at all like what bitcoin is or hopes to be.

You are correct that, if bitcoin replaced Paypal and hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions were being done every day with bitcoin, Bitcoins would be worth a very large amount of money each. As of now, probably $10,000 a day in actual buying and selling (not trading over mgtox) is done using bitcoin, which probably prices bitcoins at about 2 cents each.
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you are overlooking that bitcoin is not just currency. it is also the payment processor.
 
It's not that the market crashed, just that someone is stupid enough to sell their coins at $0.01. Whoever's buy orders got filled at that price hit the jackpot.

EDIT: apparently someone got their account hacked and all the coins were put on the market at $0.01.
 
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wol-va-rine said:
I wouldn't mess with the voltage, from my experience most cards that can overclock well will do it on stock volts...

go into MSIafterburner.cfg and change these two lines to look exactly like this, then you will be able to OC/UC...

[ATIADLHAL]
UnofficialOverclockingEULA = I confirm that I am aware of unofficial overclocking limitations and fully understand that MSI will not provide me any support on it
UnofficialOverclockingMode = 1

then to underclock the mem slide the mem all the way to the left (as low as it will go), apply, then close afterburner, open afterburner again and you will be able to underclock even more if needed...

*sometimes when you reopen afterburner the mem will say 1000 (or whatever the stock value is), don't be fooled, if you move it even just a little the lower mem clocks will start showing...
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Awesome, it works!

I have managed to get the mem down to 400mhz, though it seems that it would easily go even lower than that (although I'm not completely sure that I want to yet)

Does anyone know how high a card like this could go on the core without upping the voltage (in my particular case, where my mem is at 400mhz and might be downclocked further). So far I got it to run 20mhz higher - now at 850- but I'm a bit scarred to increase the clock without upping the voltage.

(sorry for butting in with a technical question that should normally be discussed in the video card forum, but I feel that, since I'm also dealing with downclocking the memory, which is usually a bad idea, this is a special case that's more related to bitcoin mining, rather than gaming and whatever else gaming video cards are used for)
 
Outcold said:
Looks like MtGox is completely down now...
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And tradehill is crazy slow. It's either DDoS, or those sites cant handle high-volume trading traffic. Neither is good but if bitcoin is ever really going to take off, I sure hope it's DDoS.
 
-Slacker- said:
Awesome, it works!

I have managed to get the mem down to 400mhz, though it seems that it would easily go even lower than that (although I'm not completely sure that I want to yet)

Does anyone know how high a card like this could go on the core without upping the voltage (in my particular case, where my mem is at 400mhz and might be downclocked further). So far I got it to run 20mhz higher - now at 850- but I'm a bit scarred to increase the clock without upping the voltage.

(sorry for butting in with a technical question that should normally be discussed in the video card forum, but I feel that, since I'm also dealing with downclocking the memory, which is usually a bad idea, this is a special case that's more related to bitcoin mining, rather than gaming and whatever else gaming video cards are used for)
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just OC the core to find where it freezes/reboots and then clock down from there, a lot of people (myself included) get their best hash rates at a 3 to 1 ration (core/mem)...

at least that's what I do...

5850: 933/311
6850: 960/320
 
And here's another case where someone's account was compromised... Looks like Mtgox will be down for a while with all those rollbacks
 
burningrave101 said:
Mt Gox looks to be rolling back all the affected trades that happened in result to the hacked account selling bitcoins at $.01 earlier today.

https://support.mtgox.com/entries/2...ell-off-due-to-a-compromised-account-rollback
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It appears, based on various info out there (people using bitcoin block explorer to look at actual bitcoin transactions) that someone sold 432,000 bitcoins all at once. Which means that an MTGOX account with 432,000 bitcoins was hacked. That is obviously going to be the largest bitcoin holder in the world, and based on other recent stories, this means that someone hacked into mtgox and got all of the client passwords, and just attacked the biggest account first.

It also looks like the guy who sold those 432,000 bitcoins at once bought most of them back himself, at 1 cent a piece. So that was the 250,000 bitcoins that were bought for a penny.

Mtgox is going to reverse all the transactions, except of course for the ones who already withdraw all their bitcoins before mtgox went down.

Massive clusterfuck. If you've got an account on mtgox, at the very least you should change your password.
 
LightningCrash said:
No, that's not the only thing it can mean. You should read the link you quoted.
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According to what I'm seeing out there on other forums, someone stole the entire hashed password file on mtgox, then offered it for sale online. Someone managed to brute force the password of 432,000 bitcoin account holder.

It may be that, due to the way mtgox is set up (I'm not sure about this, maybe some of you can answer this), the hacker couldn't withdraw the 432,000 coins himself, as they'd have gone to the wallet of the original account holder, so instead he sold them all on the market himself so that 250,000 of them would end up in his account (bought for 1 cent each). Does that make sense based on how mtgox is set up?
 
meme said:
According to what I'm seeing out there on other forums, someone stole the entire hashed password file on mtgox, then offered it for sale online. Someone managed to brute force the password of 432,000 bitcoin account holder.

It may be that, due to the way mtgox is set up (I'm not sure about this, maybe some of you can answer this), the hacker couldn't withdraw the 432,000 coins himself, as they'd have gone to the wallet of the original account holder, so instead he sold them all on the market himself so that 250,000 of them would end up in his account (bought for 1 cent each). Does that make sense based on how mtgox is set up?
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From what I saw they only managed to make away with $1k from the account but this kind of manipulation could have made them a lot of money in other accounts.
 
infect0 said:
From what I saw they only managed to make away with $1k from the account but this kind of manipulation could have made them a lot of money in other accounts.
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Yes, they ony got away with $1000 in cash, as that's all you can withdraw from mtgox per day per account.

But how many Bitcoins did the hacker get away with? You can withdraw as many of those as you want.
 
infect0 said:
From what I saw they only managed to make away with $1k from the account but this kind of manipulation could have made them a lot of money in other accounts.
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We will have to see how effective their rollback is... can only imagine people who were caught in the middle would withdraw their accounts... dunno how that would work. Bites if you have an account there,

Really does feel like the digital wild west for sure... anything goes... brings out every hacker from their hidden nook & crannies so to speak. Can only imagine digital "wanted" posters, digital nicknames...

Also really, really interesting to observe academically!
 
meme said:
Yes, they ony got away with $1000 in cash, as that's all you can withdraw from mtgox per day per account.

But how many Bitcoins did the hacker get away with? You can withdraw as many of those as you want.
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The MtGox main page says only $1,000 worth can be withdrawn daily.

MtGox said:
The $1000/day withdraw limit was active for this account and the hacker could only get out with $1000 worth of coins.
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The main concern from users right now seems to be how the rollback will work for those who bought low and then withdrew all of their coins.
 
meme said:
Yes, they ony got away with $1000 in cash, as that's all you can withdraw from mtgox per day per account.

But how many Bitcoins did the hacker get away with? You can withdraw as many of those as you want.
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I understand what you are saying, crash the market and then withdraw x BTC which are now worth $.01 instead of $17. From what i read thought only $1k of BTC was withdrawn which leads me to assume we are not talking about withdraws at $0.01.
 
I hate to say it, but Im honestly surprised this hasnt completely tanked the market temporarily. I'm glad I didnt have a MtGox account.
 
meme said:
Blockexplorer is down, like mtgox and many other sites right now.
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This address received large sums of BTC from many different addresses all at one time a week ago. That BTC was then transfered to MtGox and dumped on the market immediately.
 
These password hashes are a fucking joke. My account is on there but luckily I used a separate password for bitcoin than everything else.
 
computerpro3 said:
These password hashes are a fucking joke. My account is on there but luckily I used a separate password for bitcoin than everything else.
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lemme guess: MD5 (common)
I think on the password hashes that have been used on projects I've been a part of are usually either SHA-2 or Whirlpool.
 
kirtar said:
lemme guess: MD5 (common)
I think on the password hashes that have been used on projects I've been a part of are usually either SHA-2 or Whirlpool.
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That was used on about 400 out of 60,000 from what Ive been led to believe, and the rest are fairly secure.
 
Honestly, I'm hoping a massive selloff will occur. Think about it. Bitcoins are bitcoins, no matter where it happens. If people start selling and the price tanks, you can purchase at mtgox for dirt cheap and then sit low.

The question is, how do I get funds in position to take advantage of it? mtgox is down so I can't initiate a transfer. I have $150 in dwolla, but that's not much plus it will take a day or so to show up in mtgox I think.

To those of you saying "it hasn't crashed the market," it probably HAS and you just don't know about it because the exchanges are shut down. I'll bet my life we see single digits when trading resumes.
 
[deleted, old]

really with all the hacks of everyone nowadays electronic currency is not looking too good
 
Yeah, they are PLACING the bitcoin at $17.5.

That is NOT market value. As soon as trades start, that will plummet.
 
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