too pretty..Ill just wait for this ..
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2340/2195219913_9dc3aa2607.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2340/2195219913_9dc3aa2607.jpg?v=0
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Apple Mac Book Air
- Thread starter TheSandman2236
- Start date
the other apple laptops do though. dont run a game on a macbook too long, it will start melting. literally.
DaCoOlNeSs
[H]ard|Gawd
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serious proof of this? I have played Rise of Nations at max everything for 12 hours straight and it hasn't even scorched a single place, let alone caught on fire. A little warm, but its a 1" thick laptop
Not hard to tell that this website is mostly filled with PC people who buy cheap-ass desktop and sometimes laptop systems. I'm not sure if any of you heard, but there are plenty of people who love ultraportable laptops. They often sacrifice many things you find on regular laptops (optical drives, ports, hard drive speed, processor speed/cores, etc), but in the end they get what they want....a well engineered, small light and highly portable fully capable machine. Apple has designed a thing of beauty here. Putting out a 13" laptop that is that small and compact is quite a feat of engineering.
"Way too expensive, way too fragile looking. I would cry if I paid that much for a notebook and it cracked in half in my backpack."
Fragile looking? WTF does how it looks have to do with how fragile it is? That's perhaps the worst argument I've heard about a computer product on any website ever. Way too expensive? You get quite a lot for the price. Ultraportable laptops from any other vendor aren't cheap. It might be expensive when compared with a cheap POS from Dell, but it's hardly without value. I'm sad to hear that you would cry at a computer. Somehow, I doubt that this is any less likely to break than the cheap POS that you would purchase otherwise.
"Its a thinner macbook. With a slow ass HDD and a non-user-replaceable battery costing $800 more than said macbook. WTF is the point?"
Who really cares that much about the hard drive? Faster hard drives create heat. This is a laptop less than an inch thick. I'm not sure if you looked at 10 year old laptops, but thinner laptops have been a design goal for quite a long time. Non user-replaceable battery? Not many people ever take out their batteries. Also, making a battery fit into a laptop that small is quite a challenge. Making it removable would have taken away from the design goal of being as small as possible. Ultraportables require tradeoffs. It might not be for you, but that does not mean that it is a bad product.
Have at the M1330. It certainly has value as well. To quote a review about it, "Dell says it's the thinnest 13.3-inch laptop in the world. It's also lighter than equivalent Apple MacBooks, and is arguably just as sexy."
I guess that thinnest title has been taken away from it.
"ive been looking around for a new laptop but i got to say this sure as hell isnt it, Its way too damn costly, and im prob gonna end up getting a new reg MacBook which is cheaper, much more powerful, full speed hard drive, all the ports i need, need i go on? If you ask me MacBook > MacBook Air and i also wanna say MacBook Air is a ghetto name..."
It's not way too damn costly for a premium laptop. Not by a long shot. Not everyone buys cheap POS's for their systems. It will also have a ton more resale that whatever cheapass plastic garbage laptop you'll find through whatever discount channel you use.
The regular Macbooks are ok. They are cheaper, but much more powerful? I doubt that. The full speed hard drive doesn't make that much of a difference. If you travel a lot and really value portability, the size and weight are a big differentiator. In terms of ports you need, if you need that many USB ports, just get a hub. What are they $20? If you want real portability, that's a sacrifice you make.
"No user replaceable battery - WTF mate? I take mine out most of the time so I don't waste charge cycles. I plug the battery in, close it, move it, plug it in, and pull the battery out before it starts charging (i have a 2-3 sec window)."
Well it's 3/4 of an inch thick and has 5 hours of battery life. Picture how difficult it is to make a battery to fit that case and give it that much life. It probably looks like a dinner plate. You might take yours out all of the time, but you are by far in the minority. It doesn't sound like you're someone who values portability given that your laptop is almost always plugged in.
"Underpowered, low on key features, overpriced, overhyped, and made for people that hang on Steve Job's every breath. I'm really tired of mediocre products coming out of Apple only to get praised as ground breaking and revolutionary. I'm not an idiot so I'll pass on this gem."
Underpowered? A 1.6 or 1.8 dual core Intel processor is slow? I don't think so. What key features that you'd expect on an ultraportable are missing on this? Overpriced? It's less than a MBP. Mediocre products from Apple? I guess you're talking about things like the iPod, iTunes and the iPhone. Have a quick look at Apple's stock price and market capitalization. Pretty interesting how they get where they are with such mediocre products. So anyone who buys an ultraportable is an idiot? Perhaps you might want to make a post titled that in this forum. I can see the flames coming already.
I realize that plenty of you don't get the idea of an ultraportable. It isn't as if Apple is replacing their entire product line with this. They brought in a product to replace the gap that was left by the 12" Powerbook. They've done a pretty killer job. It might not be for you, but keep in mind the market for this.
"Way too expensive, way too fragile looking. I would cry if I paid that much for a notebook and it cracked in half in my backpack."
Fragile looking? WTF does how it looks have to do with how fragile it is? That's perhaps the worst argument I've heard about a computer product on any website ever. Way too expensive? You get quite a lot for the price. Ultraportable laptops from any other vendor aren't cheap. It might be expensive when compared with a cheap POS from Dell, but it's hardly without value. I'm sad to hear that you would cry at a computer. Somehow, I doubt that this is any less likely to break than the cheap POS that you would purchase otherwise.
"Its a thinner macbook. With a slow ass HDD and a non-user-replaceable battery costing $800 more than said macbook. WTF is the point?"
Who really cares that much about the hard drive? Faster hard drives create heat. This is a laptop less than an inch thick. I'm not sure if you looked at 10 year old laptops, but thinner laptops have been a design goal for quite a long time. Non user-replaceable battery? Not many people ever take out their batteries. Also, making a battery fit into a laptop that small is quite a challenge. Making it removable would have taken away from the design goal of being as small as possible. Ultraportables require tradeoffs. It might not be for you, but that does not mean that it is a bad product.
Have at the M1330. It certainly has value as well. To quote a review about it, "Dell says it's the thinnest 13.3-inch laptop in the world. It's also lighter than equivalent Apple MacBooks, and is arguably just as sexy."
I guess that thinnest title has been taken away from it.
"ive been looking around for a new laptop but i got to say this sure as hell isnt it, Its way too damn costly, and im prob gonna end up getting a new reg MacBook which is cheaper, much more powerful, full speed hard drive, all the ports i need, need i go on? If you ask me MacBook > MacBook Air and i also wanna say MacBook Air is a ghetto name..."
It's not way too damn costly for a premium laptop. Not by a long shot. Not everyone buys cheap POS's for their systems. It will also have a ton more resale that whatever cheapass plastic garbage laptop you'll find through whatever discount channel you use.
The regular Macbooks are ok. They are cheaper, but much more powerful? I doubt that. The full speed hard drive doesn't make that much of a difference. If you travel a lot and really value portability, the size and weight are a big differentiator. In terms of ports you need, if you need that many USB ports, just get a hub. What are they $20? If you want real portability, that's a sacrifice you make.
"No user replaceable battery - WTF mate? I take mine out most of the time so I don't waste charge cycles. I plug the battery in, close it, move it, plug it in, and pull the battery out before it starts charging (i have a 2-3 sec window)."
Well it's 3/4 of an inch thick and has 5 hours of battery life. Picture how difficult it is to make a battery to fit that case and give it that much life. It probably looks like a dinner plate. You might take yours out all of the time, but you are by far in the minority. It doesn't sound like you're someone who values portability given that your laptop is almost always plugged in.
"Underpowered, low on key features, overpriced, overhyped, and made for people that hang on Steve Job's every breath. I'm really tired of mediocre products coming out of Apple only to get praised as ground breaking and revolutionary. I'm not an idiot so I'll pass on this gem."
Underpowered? A 1.6 or 1.8 dual core Intel processor is slow? I don't think so. What key features that you'd expect on an ultraportable are missing on this? Overpriced? It's less than a MBP. Mediocre products from Apple? I guess you're talking about things like the iPod, iTunes and the iPhone. Have a quick look at Apple's stock price and market capitalization. Pretty interesting how they get where they are with such mediocre products.
So anyone who buys an ultraportable is an idiot? Perhaps you might want to make a post titled that in this forum. I can see the flames coming already.I realize that plenty of you don't get the idea of an ultraportable. It isn't as if Apple is replacing their entire product line with this. They brought in a product to replace the gap that was left by the 12" Powerbook. They've done a pretty killer job. It might not be for you, but keep in mind the market for this.
goodcooper
[H]F Junkie
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ok, this is normally where i'd knock on the apple fanboy... but he has some valid points....
my only response though... is
$1800 ?
is it competitive? maybe...
but it still isn't worth it for a computer...
and i'd probably buy a macbook over this...
i own a couple year old hp business model nc6000 updated a bit with 2gigs ddr and a faster 160GB hard disk (<- lol, i didn't pay much for it before upgrading, but it definitely isn't a POS... business laptops tend to be well built)... and if macbooks had pcimcia slots... i'd buy one TODAY... right now...
so yea, don't think you have to spend an assload of money to get a good computer, because that, mr. fanboy is the only part of your post that was truly "fanboyish"... the rest of the post looked somewhat logically written and thought out
my only response though... is
$1800 ?
is it competitive? maybe...
but it still isn't worth it for a computer...
and i'd probably buy a macbook over this...
i own a couple year old hp business model nc6000 updated a bit with 2gigs ddr and a faster 160GB hard disk (<- lol, i didn't pay much for it before upgrading, but it definitely isn't a POS... business laptops tend to be well built)... and if macbooks had pcimcia slots... i'd buy one TODAY... right now...
so yea, don't think you have to spend an assload of money to get a good computer, because that, mr. fanboy is the only part of your post that was truly "fanboyish"... the rest of the post looked somewhat logically written and thought out
I really think that this defines what a portable lightweight laptop should be. IMHO, a 10-year old laptop running linux with a wireless card is great for me. Weighs about 1.5 pounds and has a 1024 res. IMHO again, big things like video editing should be left to a desk and a real computer.
goodcooper,
It's pretty sad that you had to ruin a good post with the "Fanboy" and "Mr. Fanboy" stupidity. You essentially agreed with me except for the issue of price. I'm hardly a fanboy. I run XP, Server 2003 and OSX. I do own a mini, but spend most of my time dealing with XP and this post is being written from a machine running 2003 Enterprise. I tried running linux, but dear god...so not worth the hassle. I didn't post here from a fanboy perspective, but to be a counterpoint to what I saw as a great deal of poor information in the thread.
Given that you agree with everything I said, you might want to save casting stones. My comments were not made out of any loyalty to a computer hardware/software vendor. I just understand the Apple and ultraportable marketplace. The laptop is not cheap, but it is hardly a huge amount to pay given other models in the subnotebook market. It's also quite a unique machine. Why would anyone think that the thinnest notebook on the planet would be cheap? The toughest notebook on the planet certainly isn't, so why would the thinnest. Add in the usual things that people forget such as the value of iLife and higher resale value and the price you end up with isn't that much.
You are corrent in that you don't have to spend an assload of money to get a good computer. But then again, I'm not going to be lugging my desktop onto a plane with me. We're not talking your average computer here or even your average notebook. We're talking ultraportables.
It's pretty sad that you had to ruin a good post with the "Fanboy" and "Mr. Fanboy" stupidity. You essentially agreed with me except for the issue of price. I'm hardly a fanboy. I run XP, Server 2003 and OSX. I do own a mini, but spend most of my time dealing with XP and this post is being written from a machine running 2003 Enterprise. I tried running linux, but dear god...so not worth the hassle. I didn't post here from a fanboy perspective, but to be a counterpoint to what I saw as a great deal of poor information in the thread.
Given that you agree with everything I said, you might want to save casting stones. My comments were not made out of any loyalty to a computer hardware/software vendor. I just understand the Apple and ultraportable marketplace. The laptop is not cheap, but it is hardly a huge amount to pay given other models in the subnotebook market. It's also quite a unique machine. Why would anyone think that the thinnest notebook on the planet would be cheap? The toughest notebook on the planet certainly isn't, so why would the thinnest. Add in the usual things that people forget such as the value of iLife and higher resale value and the price you end up with isn't that much.
You are corrent in that you don't have to spend an assload of money to get a good computer. But then again, I'm not going to be lugging my desktop onto a plane with me.
We're not talking your average computer here or even your average notebook. We're talking ultraportables.batteriesnotincluded
[H]ard|Gawd
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- 1,195
I still call their thinnest notebook comment into question. measuring at the thinnest point isn't exactly indicative of the machine's actual size. As has been established, there are thinner laptops out there at its thickest point.
I routinely spend anywhere between $2300-3400 on my primary laptop systems. this Ultraportable is certainly less than that, so I cannot complain about it.
The biggest problem is not what it lacks compared to larger systems as an ultraportable, but what it lacks against other ultraportables.
That's a 4 year old Toshiba. The Macbook Air is .04" thicker, 1 lb heavier, but suffers at the loss of multiple usb ports (2 is the minimum any machine should have), a card reader, removable battery, docking station port, and more...it may have a nicer screen and a nicer keyboard (I'd still probably take a Thinkpad X series over it), but for a system that is larger and weighs more than a long-since-outdated machine, it's rather disappointing to see what features it's missing.
Also, speaking of the R100, the 1.8" drives are fucking turtles. A backup of computers, each around 3gb in data, took 8 minutes on a 2.5" 7200rpm, 12 minutes on a 2.5" 5400rpm, and damned near an hour on the 1.8" 4200rpm. All were doing writes to a USB 2.0 DVD burner.
I was looking forward to the Macbook Air as a chance to try out OSX. I was looking for a small laptop to replace an HP NC4000 I had been using as a carputer. But, I was looking for something with power and capability. I was given a slimmed down machine that was streamlined to do minimal things very well, but at the cost of any of the flexibility I could find in the PC market's offerings. Yes, it likely has a better screen and better processor than most comparably sized ultraportables, but it's basically cut off from the outside world.
There is a strong market for ultraportable machines outside of the US. Toshiba's RX1 weighs less than 2 lbs, has a DVD drive, SSD or a 120gb hdd. PCMCIA. Gigabit Ethernet. Modem. 3 USB. Yes, it's .25" thicker.
If thin is your thing, go for it. But if functionality is your thing, you'd be better off looking elsewhere.
I routinely spend anywhere between $2300-3400 on my primary laptop systems. this Ultraportable is certainly less than that, so I cannot complain about it.
The biggest problem is not what it lacks compared to larger systems as an ultraportable, but what it lacks against other ultraportables.
That's a 4 year old Toshiba. The Macbook Air is .04" thicker, 1 lb heavier, but suffers at the loss of multiple usb ports (2 is the minimum any machine should have), a card reader, removable battery, docking station port, and more...it may have a nicer screen and a nicer keyboard (I'd still probably take a Thinkpad X series over it), but for a system that is larger and weighs more than a long-since-outdated machine, it's rather disappointing to see what features it's missing.
Also, speaking of the R100, the 1.8" drives are fucking turtles. A backup of computers, each around 3gb in data, took 8 minutes on a 2.5" 7200rpm, 12 minutes on a 2.5" 5400rpm, and damned near an hour on the 1.8" 4200rpm. All were doing writes to a USB 2.0 DVD burner.
I was looking forward to the Macbook Air as a chance to try out OSX. I was looking for a small laptop to replace an HP NC4000 I had been using as a carputer. But, I was looking for something with power and capability. I was given a slimmed down machine that was streamlined to do minimal things very well, but at the cost of any of the flexibility I could find in the PC market's offerings. Yes, it likely has a better screen and better processor than most comparably sized ultraportables, but it's basically cut off from the outside world.
There is a strong market for ultraportable machines outside of the US. Toshiba's RX1 weighs less than 2 lbs, has a DVD drive, SSD or a 120gb hdd. PCMCIA. Gigabit Ethernet. Modem. 3 USB. Yes, it's .25" thicker.
If thin is your thing, go for it. But if functionality is your thing, you'd be better off looking elsewhere.
goodcooper
[H]F Junkie
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- Nov 4, 2005
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- 9,771
goodcooper,
It's pretty sad that you had to ruin a good post with the "Fanboy" and "Mr. Fanboy" stupidity. You essentially agreed with me except for the issue of price. I'm hardly a fanboy. I run XP, Server 2003 and OSX. I do own a mini, but spend most of my time dealing with XP and this post is being written from a machine running 2003 Enterprise. I tried running linux, but dear god...so not worth the hassle. I didn't post here from a fanboy perspective, but to be a counterpoint to what I saw as a great deal of poor information in the thread.
Given that you agree with everything I said, you might want to save casting stones. My comments were not made out of any loyalty to a computer hardware/software vendor. I just understand the Apple and ultraportable marketplace. The laptop is not cheap, but it is hardly a huge amount to pay given other models in the subnotebook market. It's also quite a unique machine. Why would anyone think that the thinnest notebook on the planet would be cheap? The toughest notebook on the planet certainly isn't, so why would the thinnest. Add in the usual things that people forget such as the value of iLife and higher resale value and the price you end up with isn't that much.
You are corrent in that you don't have to spend an assload of money to get a good computer. But then again, I'm not going to be lugging my desktop onto a plane with me.
i'm just going off of this statement general:
general said:
you've got to admit that sounds elitist and JUST like an apple zealot who will buy the next big thing no matter the cost...
... once you start attacking pretty much any other ultraportable BESIDES the one in question (branded by apple)... you start coming off as a dweeb...
seriously if that line and
general said:
and then
general said:
at the beginning was left out... you could have just ended this thread right there...
raffle @ "PC people"
fanboy
Mediocre products....the last generation mp3 line is a perfect example. Compared to other players on the market they were very mediocre in performance, price, and features....popularity doesn't make something a stellar product. I'll bring up the appleTV's overwhelming success later. As far as stock price is concerned....come talk to me when they capture anything more than a pathetic percentage of the total computer marketshare and we'll start discussing what actually sells computers for Apple. Finally, I don't care what processor is in this laptop, as long as the HDD is as pathetic as the one they're offering the fastest processor in the world isn't going to help it.Underpowered? A 1.6 or 1.8 dual core Intel processor is slow? I don't think so. What key features that you'd expect on an ultraportable are missing on this? Overpriced? It's less than a MBP. Mediocre products from Apple? I guess you're talking about things like the iPod, iTunes and the iPhone. Have a quick look at Apple's stock price and market capitalization. Pretty interesting how they get where they are with such mediocre products.
You'd like to know what key features are missing? How about another USB port for starters. For a computer void of an optical drive flash drives become very important all of the sudden. Lets just hope you don't have to, oh I don't know, access LAN at the same time or use a mouse, hard drive, optical drive, or a host of other USB peripherals
The macbook pro is one of the best laptops out there....the featureless Air has a long way to reach even the bottom of it's class IMO.
Most ultraportables I've seen are UNDER 13 inches. The Mac Book Air IS 13 inches. I know people are talking about the screen size, but has anyone stopped and realized that the little thinness gained doesn't put it ahead of anything else.
What I'm trying to say, is that the design is just a squished regular ultra portable. It's not very special at all.
And plus, they're measuring from the thinnest point. The thinnest point doesn't even house any silicon, it's just the battery. All they're doing is measuring it from where the skinny part of the battery is. It's really a cheap marketing ploy if you ask me.
And now I'm hearing that at the thickest part of the mac book air is not the thinnest of all ultraportable's thickest places?
It's just utterly annoying that Apple can release a mediocre product into a market that's been ill performing for years, only to be greeted by getting a ton of attention. It's not revolutionary or anything. It's just a squished ultraportable that loses it's thickness advantage by being an extra inch wider.
And honestly, I can buy like 3 EEE pcs for the same price as a mac book air with the hard drive, and the EEE has more ports and more functionality.
What I'm trying to say, is that the design is just a squished regular ultra portable. It's not very special at all.
And plus, they're measuring from the thinnest point. The thinnest point doesn't even house any silicon, it's just the battery. All they're doing is measuring it from where the skinny part of the battery is. It's really a cheap marketing ploy if you ask me.
And now I'm hearing that at the thickest part of the mac book air is not the thinnest of all ultraportable's thickest places?
It's just utterly annoying that Apple can release a mediocre product into a market that's been ill performing for years, only to be greeted by getting a ton of attention. It's not revolutionary or anything. It's just a squished ultraportable that loses it's thickness advantage by being an extra inch wider.
And honestly, I can buy like 3 EEE pcs for the same price as a mac book air with the hard drive, and the EEE has more ports and more functionality.
the air is NOT an ultraportable.
here is a size comparison i posted in the mac forum. the thickness on these is at the thickest point
http://www.sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/9273-MacBook-Air-vs-Sony-TZ-vs-EEE
here is a size comparison i posted in the mac forum. the thickness on these is at the thickest point
http://www.sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/9273-MacBook-Air-vs-Sony-TZ-vs-EEE
they call it an ultraportable, and it's the same size as an average legal brief, and weighs what the ultraportables weigh.
"you've got to admit that sounds elitist and JUST like an apple zealot who will buy the next big thing no matter the cost...
... once you start attacking pretty much any other ultraportable BESIDES the one in question (branded by apple)... you start coming off as a dweeb...
seriously if that line and"
Elitist? So if I said that the 787 is the single best aircraft designed and produced in 50 years does that make me an elitist and should I assume that you would assume that I own one? Not everyone who holds an opinion does so out of some emotional attachment to their purchase. I debate with people around bluray and HD DVD and own neither. Hopefully that doesn't make me an elitist as well. I didn't attack any other ultraportables. The person who was making that remark was talking about buying the cheapest model laptop possible. This would not include any other similar device.
Please save the personal insults. One person posting out of 30 provides a counterpoint and I have to put up with that bullshit? Please focus on the argument at hand. When you do that, as you have admitted, you pretty much agree with me with the exception of price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by general
It might be expensive when compared with a cheap POS from Dell
and then
Yes, it is and I stand by that. People comparing a high end laptop with the cheapest available option is not a valid comparison. Would you be saying the same thing if someone had brought up a $300 cheapo box and compared it with something from Alienware?
Quote:
Originally Posted by general
Not hard to tell that this website is mostly filled with PC people who buy cheap-ass desktop and sometimes laptop systems.
at the beginning was left out... you could have just ended this thread right there...
No, it gave a good idea that my post was going to contrast what everyone else had been saying. I also stand by those remarks. Plenty of people who don't understand laptops or Apple's marketplace were jumping in with their opinions.
"
You'd like to know what key features are missing? How about another USB port for starters. For a computer void of an optical drive flash drives become very important all of the sudden. Lets just hope you don't have to, oh I don't know, access LAN at the same time or use a mouse, hard drive, optical drive, or a host of other USB peripherals"
How many USB devices do you hook up while using your laptop remotely? I travel quite a bit and the only other thing that I have in my carrying case is a power cable and a USB drive. The latter often gets left home. Apple isn't putting this forward as a laptop replacement. In case you wanted to use it at home in a more desktop environment, there are these wonderful things called USB hubs. They can power many many devices.
... once you start attacking pretty much any other ultraportable BESIDES the one in question (branded by apple)... you start coming off as a dweeb...
seriously if that line and"
Elitist? So if I said that the 787 is the single best aircraft designed and produced in 50 years does that make me an elitist and should I assume that you would assume that I own one? Not everyone who holds an opinion does so out of some emotional attachment to their purchase. I debate with people around bluray and HD DVD and own neither. Hopefully that doesn't make me an elitist as well. I didn't attack any other ultraportables. The person who was making that remark was talking about buying the cheapest model laptop possible. This would not include any other similar device.
Please save the personal insults. One person posting out of 30 provides a counterpoint and I have to put up with that bullshit? Please focus on the argument at hand. When you do that, as you have admitted, you pretty much agree with me with the exception of price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by general
It might be expensive when compared with a cheap POS from Dell
and then
Yes, it is and I stand by that. People comparing a high end laptop with the cheapest available option is not a valid comparison. Would you be saying the same thing if someone had brought up a $300 cheapo box and compared it with something from Alienware?
Quote:
Originally Posted by general
Not hard to tell that this website is mostly filled with PC people who buy cheap-ass desktop and sometimes laptop systems.
at the beginning was left out... you could have just ended this thread right there...
No, it gave a good idea that my post was going to contrast what everyone else had been saying. I also stand by those remarks. Plenty of people who don't understand laptops or Apple's marketplace were jumping in with their opinions.
"
You'd like to know what key features are missing? How about another USB port for starters. For a computer void of an optical drive flash drives become very important all of the sudden. Lets just hope you don't have to, oh I don't know, access LAN at the same time or use a mouse, hard drive, optical drive, or a host of other USB peripherals"
How many USB devices do you hook up while using your laptop remotely? I travel quite a bit and the only other thing that I have in my carrying case is a power cable and a USB drive. The latter often gets left home. Apple isn't putting this forward as a laptop replacement.
In case you wanted to use it at home in a more desktop environment, there are these wonderful things called USB hubs. They can power many many devices.i took some time to compare the air with its competition....
check the table:
http://steve8.selfip.info
not sure the policy on linking.. but there's no ads wher ei put the table.... not making any money or what-not...
check the table:
http://steve8.selfip.info
not sure the policy on linking.. but there's no ads wher ei put the table.... not making any money or what-not...
theDreamer
2[H]4U
- Joined
- Oct 11, 2006
- Messages
- 2,513
Can you highlight who has the "best" in each category so it is easy to identify, thanks.
It looks like a great little chart, would help in figuring out which one I want.
lol. you fit the apple user mentioned in the news forum.
people who buy an air will be doing it completely as a fashion statement. an "im better than you because i have teh shiny."
and some people are not worth arguing with. apple zealots remind me of religious zealots. if their diety proclaimed that the sky does not look blue during the day, well have fun trying to convince them otherwise. they ignore evidence, insult you, and wont look up and see things as they are.
people who buy an air will be doing it completely as a fashion statement. an "im better than you because i have teh shiny."
and some people are not worth arguing with. apple zealots remind me of religious zealots. if their diety proclaimed that the sky does not look blue during the day, well have fun trying to convince them otherwise. they ignore evidence, insult you, and wont look up and see things as they are.
Hahaha, whatever floats your boat man. It's impossible to get through to Apple zealots and at some point you have to simply give up and let them believe the sky isn't blue as Matyr pointed out. Everyone here has valid arguments that you refuse to acknowledge or simply go around in circles and contradict yourself. Your statements of it being far from slow but then arguing that the slow hard drive is necessary for heat management all the while failing to realize that in doing so you've argued both for and against our points about speed. I prefer a portable laptop which doesn't require a zillion accessories to make it functional thus making it less than portable.....all to keep up with features similarly priced and sized laptops don't require. I enjoy grabbing my laptop and motoring...you apparently enjoy lugging around a case full of external CD drives, lan adapters, usb splitters, etc, etc. It's clear which members here truly care if their laptops are functional and which members only care about what other people think of them as they whip out their shiny shiny. Keep telling yourself I have no argument...
People looking to buy ultra portables don't need, or use, all the stuff you do. two totally different markets.
These are people that carry theirs for more miles in a year than you may see in a lifetime.
I personally agree with you on what ~I~ would buy: that's why I don't own, nor will I own, an Air. but, I know the kind of people that WILL buy one, and purely for the functionality as well.
darkangelamd
Limp Gawd
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2004
- Messages
- 280
I'm using a one spindle ultraportable right now, and I've had a ultra portable with a 1.8", it's too slow. It was also novelty thin, which is impressive for about 2 months, then the usability starts getting to you,. I'll take .3" thicker to not have to sit there while it tries to load a large word document. That and the non user replaceable battery are the two killers for this, imho. Maybe a couple more usb ports would be nice, but not a deal breaker.
the fact that it weighs 3 lbs and is the size of a legal brief?
the macbook and air are two totally different markets. and yes, this niche market ~does~ exist.
"people who buy an air will be doing it completely as a fashion statement. an "im better than you because i have teh shiny."
Every single person who buys a MBA will do for these reasons? Care to quantify how you know this swami? There are plenty of people why people buy small and light laptops. Not all of them have to do with vanity. I have flown with someone with a M2010 laptop,so by using the logic I'm reading here he was lugging around that behemoth purely to make himself look better to the people at the airport. Portable computing is a functional thing. There certainly is visual appeal to the MBA, but to say that anyone who buys one does so solely as a fashion statement seems rather difficult to prove.
"Your statements of it being far from slow but then arguing that the slow hard drive is necessary for heat management all the while failing to realize that in doing so you've argued both for and against our points about speed. I prefer a portable laptop which doesn't require a zillion accessories to make it functional thus making it less than portable.....all to keep up with features similarly priced and sized laptops don't require. I enjoy grabbing my laptop and motoring...you apparently enjoy lugging around a case full of external CD drives, lan adapters, usb splitters, etc, etc. It's clear which members here truly care if their laptops are functional and which members only care about what other people think of them as they whip out their shiny shiny. Keep telling yourself I have no argument..."
I'm not sure what arguments you are or are not talking about here, so it's hard to respond to whatever vague statement you were trying to make. I'm glad you that you have a clear preference on your laptop. Were there to be a thread with ill-thought one sided arguments against the type of laptops you prefer I'd be posting there as well. Who knows, people might be mistakenly trying to mistake my advocating an argument as being a zealot as well. Some people can actually think for themselves and aren't tied to decisions and can have opinions on any number of things. To assume that I'm writing this post on a Mac would be mistaken. You can both save the zealot bullshit for where it actually applies. Someone making a well informed counterargument doesn't mean that it is a clear indication of someone's buying patterns.
In terms of lugging around your shit, I've been living in a hotel for two weeks. I have 1/3M+ air miles banked currently, and have gold status at two hotel chains. I'm willing to bet I know worlds more about what dragging stuff around means. Currently, the only 'accessories' I have brought with me for this trip (lying a hotel bed as I write this) are a USB cable for a phone and an occasionally used USB key. Of course, I use a docking station at home to give more USB connections since I use a printer, mouse, keyboard, external hard drive and also still need the USB phone cable. Of course, none of that comes with me, having one USB port, really wouldn't be an issue for me.
What many people are missing here is that just because this device is not for them, it doesn't mean that it is an inherently bad machine. It's made for a specific market and in its own way is very innovative.
Every single person who buys a MBA will do for these reasons? Care to quantify how you know this swami? There are plenty of people why people buy small and light laptops. Not all of them have to do with vanity. I have flown with someone with a M2010 laptop,so by using the logic I'm reading here he was lugging around that behemoth purely to make himself look better to the people at the airport. Portable computing is a functional thing. There certainly is visual appeal to the MBA, but to say that anyone who buys one does so solely as a fashion statement seems rather difficult to prove.
"Your statements of it being far from slow but then arguing that the slow hard drive is necessary for heat management all the while failing to realize that in doing so you've argued both for and against our points about speed. I prefer a portable laptop which doesn't require a zillion accessories to make it functional thus making it less than portable.....all to keep up with features similarly priced and sized laptops don't require. I enjoy grabbing my laptop and motoring...you apparently enjoy lugging around a case full of external CD drives, lan adapters, usb splitters, etc, etc. It's clear which members here truly care if their laptops are functional and which members only care about what other people think of them as they whip out their shiny shiny. Keep telling yourself I have no argument..."
I'm not sure what arguments you are or are not talking about here, so it's hard to respond to whatever vague statement you were trying to make. I'm glad you that you have a clear preference on your laptop. Were there to be a thread with ill-thought one sided arguments against the type of laptops you prefer I'd be posting there as well. Who knows, people might be mistakenly trying to mistake my advocating an argument as being a zealot as well. Some people can actually think for themselves and aren't tied to decisions and can have opinions on any number of things. To assume that I'm writing this post on a Mac would be mistaken. You can both save the zealot bullshit for where it actually applies. Someone making a well informed counterargument doesn't mean that it is a clear indication of someone's buying patterns.
In terms of lugging around your shit, I've been living in a hotel for two weeks. I have 1/3M+ air miles banked currently, and have gold status at two hotel chains. I'm willing to bet I know worlds more about what dragging stuff around means. Currently, the only 'accessories' I have brought with me for this trip (lying a hotel bed as I write this) are a USB cable for a phone and an occasionally used USB key. Of course, I use a docking station at home to give more USB connections since I use a printer, mouse, keyboard, external hard drive and also still need the USB phone cable. Of course, none of that comes with me, having one USB port, really wouldn't be an issue for me.
What many people are missing here is that just because this device is not for them, it doesn't mean that it is an inherently bad machine. It's made for a specific market and in its own way is very innovative.
the fact that it weighs 3 lbs and is the size of a legal brief?
the macbook and air are two totally different markets. and yes, this niche market ~does~ exist.
the only difference in dimension between the macbook and mba are height and weight. is shorter battery life, less power, and less expansion worth 2 pounds, 200 dollars, and .22 inches at its thickest point?
The niche is an impulse buyer the disregards functionality and focuses purely on design. Carrying a macbook for a normal person is like a fashionable socialite carrying their mba and one of those 1 liter fiji bottles...
batteriesnotincluded
[H]ard|Gawd
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2007
- Messages
- 1,195
Thinkpad will do it better.
It's giving up .2" in height. It's shaving off a pound though with its 3 cell battery, and has removable batteries that will knock it up to the Macbook Air's weight.
But, 3 USB, expresscard, built in DVD, WiFi, Ethernet, docking station.
And sexy as hell.
This is what the Air should have been.
Looks like I'm selling my T60 & DV9000...this is exactly the laptop I've been waiting for.
It's giving up .2" in height. It's shaving off a pound though with its 3 cell battery, and has removable batteries that will knock it up to the Macbook Air's weight.
But, 3 USB, expresscard, built in DVD, WiFi, Ethernet, docking station.
And sexy as hell.
This is what the Air should have been.
Looks like I'm selling my T60 & DV9000...this is exactly the laptop I've been waiting for.
For some people, yes!
Both of my last bosses didn't care about battery life, power, expansion, etc. They needed email, word, ppt, a VPN, wireless, and as light as possible. That's all. The niche is people that are constantly on the go and don't want to carry much at all. The first time I showed one of them my macbook, the FIRST thing he commented on was "It's really heavy". He liked it, but it was way too heavy for anything he wanted to carry all the time.
Both companies I worked at bought people ultra portables.
half a pound, but mighty impressive. If they get it out and it matches those specs, they'll have apple beat.
TechieSooner
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2007
- Messages
- 7,601
I think this is the most accurate assesment of this product.
IMO Apple was scrambling to come up with something fantastic to release, and it was released immature. They should had let all the speculation alone, waited until next year, and released something more "finished", with more time invested into it.
Yes, but (as the good Toshiba example) there are 5 year old notebooks out there that are just as thin, that manage to have all the hardware you still need (multiple USB ports, optical drives, etc).
Ditto. The ONLY notebook I'd buy right now is an ultraportable. I was really hoping the Air would deliver, I would've tried the Mac OS again because of it! However it just failed to impress me. More than anything it made me even more pissed off at Apple marketing: The rest of the world measures notebooks by the thickest point, Apple measures by the thinnest and calls it the "worlds thinnest", which is plain bull. I suppose some people won't mind, but I sure as hell hate false advertising like that.
2 would have been understandable (and acceptable), to me at least.
This isn't much of a big deal to me. However considering the current state of batteries, the fact they die over time and not being able to replace it is a major PITA.
Hit the nail on the head!
Again- traveling businessmen return to the office. They need a dock or SOMETHING- which the Air doesn't provide.
But wait, it is as easy as downloading a movie from iTunes...
Oh that's right, it'll take you 4 hours to do so....
Wow- what is this???
Personally not a gigantic fan of IBMs, but what is it?
Exactly. And generally, who are these people? Travelers, mainly.
Who does more traveling on a day to day basis? Businessmen.
This simply won't cut it for a businessman going through the airport or whatnot.
I think it's use at home/personal would be great. However, once more- the market is more aimed to traveling folks.
Apple, IMO, kinda miss-missed their audience on this deal.
This was done years ago. Apple is simply removing some pieces and repackaging it in an aluminum shell, in order to taper down the front end of it. Now it is suddenly revolutionary?
I agree here. Although I'd take a different approach and say all notebooks are fragile to start with... nothing out of the ordinary.
Expensive is understandable- all are. And the traveling CEO really doesn't give a crap about price...
Uh, 4200RPM? That's slow as molasses. Everything else in this world has at least been moved up to a 5600RPM standard. Even 7200RPMs are making their way into notebooks.
4200 is too slow.
Your statement is ignorant, you must admit. It's the same as saying "Who cares about speed?"...
I'm sure 100% of the world would agree with me that a faster hard drive is better.
They exist. Apple simply didn't include one. No if's, and's, or but's about it.
You, sir... have no idea what you are talking about.
Well, that's convenient.
Exactly. I've heard this argument quite a bit lately, and what folks fail to understand is market share and stock price are two totally different things (especially considering stock price comprises of ALL their products, not just their computers).
In today's modern age, 90% of the world won't use the full extent of the processors in computers.
The real slowdowns come with your hard drive and insufficient RAM.
I'd personally get a Macbook Pro before an Air.
Macbook Pro is still pretty portable (something I must hand Apple- their computers are always quite thin- understandable considering they dictate what is installed inside of them).
Now, I've used just about everything out there.
Windows, Mac OS, *nix distros, you name it.
Mac has it's audience (IMO personal use), yet just offers too little for too much. The security issues that seem to be cropping up (and not being fixed) begin to worry me about the Mac platform in general
batteriesnotincluded
[H]ard|Gawd
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2007
- Messages
- 1,195
I stand corrected. Could have sworn I read the Air was 3.5 lbs.
Just have to say that thinkpad looks so sexy. I love thinkpads and one that small with all those features would be awesome!
Lenovo/Thinkpad also has one of the best R&D teams in laptops IMO and they make things that just work. If you have owned a thinkpad you know what I mean. Even down to things like how their batteries report all the information to their special software so instead of reading voltages from the system side, they can read voltages and give very accurate runtimes right out of the batteries! Sounds like a small thing (which it is) but it shows to what a level they go to provide integration of all the components.
and to those saying $1700 is not much for a laptop and we buy budget laptops is an idiot. A budget laptop is sub-$800 or so these days. Very powerful machines are in the $800 - $1200 range and even more powerful ones just a bit more than that.
My T61 was only $1300 and is more powerful than most other laptops on the market today. It also is small, well built, and has pretty much every feature you can think of.
Yes, a few years back to get a good machine you had to speed $2000+, but these days prices are falling on technology (like they always do) and $1000 gets you WAY more than a budget machine.
Lenovo/Thinkpad also has one of the best R&D teams in laptops IMO and they make things that just work. If you have owned a thinkpad you know what I mean. Even down to things like how their batteries report all the information to their special software so instead of reading voltages from the system side, they can read voltages and give very accurate runtimes right out of the batteries! Sounds like a small thing (which it is) but it shows to what a level they go to provide integration of all the components.
and to those saying $1700 is not much for a laptop and we buy budget laptops is an idiot. A budget laptop is sub-$800 or so these days. Very powerful machines are in the $800 - $1200 range and even more powerful ones just a bit more than that.
My T61 was only $1300 and is more powerful than most other laptops on the market today. It also is small, well built, and has pretty much every feature you can think of.
Yes, a few years back to get a good machine you had to speed $2000+, but these days prices are falling on technology (like they always do) and $1000 gets you WAY more than a budget machine.
I'd say the Air is a lot like many Apple systems -- it's doing something we'll probably all accept while from now, but possibly too early.
The storage will get faster and bigger even as it gets cheaper; don't be surprised if there's a 128GB SSD option several months from now at similar pricing. And later revisions might add wide-area wireless, too. Don't be surprised if a 2010 MacBook Pro costs $1299 with a much faster CPU and tons more storage.
I'm not buying in for this first generation, but it may simply a given before too long.
The storage will get faster and bigger even as it gets cheaper; don't be surprised if there's a 128GB SSD option several months from now at similar pricing. And later revisions might add wide-area wireless, too. Don't be surprised if a 2010 MacBook Pro costs $1299 with a much faster CPU and tons more storage.
I'm not buying in for this first generation, but it may simply a given before too long.
kleptophobiac
Supreme [H]ardness
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2001
- Messages
- 7,839
Read the paper on Nature Nanotech. The associate professor doing the research only has preliminary results, not packaged product. Don't expect this stuff to hit the market for another 3-4 years. I'm an undergrad at Stanford with a particular interest in battery technology (I lead the solar car team and worked for Tesla Motors) and have contacted him about it. He seems optimistic about the technology, but realistic gains in first generations of products may be around 3-4x the gravimetric energy density of current lithium cobalt oxide batteries. There is, of course, going to be packaging overhead with the 18650 style cans most laptop batteries use regardless of the anode structure.
Finally, I'm concerned with their cycle life. We'll just have to wait and see on that one.
insanarchist
[H]ard|Gawd
- Joined
- Sep 3, 2004
- Messages
- 1,387
Agreed, which supports my argument that the thing's out too early. In 2-3 years, we'll have way faster 1.8" drives (and/or cheaper solid state drives), hopefully much better battery life, and hopefully something along the lines of a sort of "wireless firewire" (excuse the humorous oxymoron
) or super-fast bluetooth that, imho, has been a long time coming.I am very pleased with the macbook air.
I use it for reading, writing, photo-viewing and internet.
It is my first mac after 20 years with PCs.
I needed 3 days to get used to it, but now everything works perfect.
I bought an access point to get wireless connection to my router.
The air is the first computer that can replace my daily newspaper.
I even use it at the toilet.
It's the computer with the best usability i have ever seen.
A replacable battery would make this beauty perfect.
I use it for reading, writing, photo-viewing and internet.
It is my first mac after 20 years with PCs.
I needed 3 days to get used to it, but now everything works perfect.
I bought an access point to get wireless connection to my router.
The air is the first computer that can replace my daily newspaper.
I even use it at the toilet.
It's the computer with the best usability i have ever seen.
A replacable battery would make this beauty perfect.
heatlesssun
Extremely [H]
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2005
- Messages
- 44,154
What's even more usable on the toilet is a Tablet!
I don't understand why the supposedly trailblazing Apple hasn't released one after 6 years on Windows machines with this capability and the hardware to go with it.I do like the Air, its nice and light for sure. I do wish PC makers were more stylish. But the battery thing is kind of an issue for me, as well as the optical drive. I play a LOT of DVD's on my tablet and while ripping is always an option, just being able to pop in a disc with an external drive is nice.