AMD Ryzen Threadripper TIM Application

Discussion in 'Overclocking & Cooling' started by FrgMstr, Feb 19, 2018.

  1. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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  2. triwolf

    triwolf Gawd

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    This was a good experiment, I've not had a chance to work on Threadripper, this has good tips for applying paste for other multi-core designs too.
     
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  3. Batboy88

    Batboy88 Limp Gawd

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    editing or something hugely threaded....other than that I don't know there's stuff where it can't even get some of the higher frames. Idk their mining with it....
     
  4. Yiffy

    Yiffy [H]ard|Gawd

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    1. Diggin the Zer0 hoodie there.
    2. Got a kick out of how you emphasize the H in "white" and "whole"
    3. Great article. Made me rethink how I shouldn't half-ass my TIM application. Gonna use my wHole ass next time.
     
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  5. bigdogchris

    bigdogchris [H]ard as it Gets

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    Great vid. Didn't realize there was so many considerations when mounting one of those bigger chips.
     
  6. AthlonXP

    AthlonXP [H]ard as it Gets

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    Nice video, I actually used a similar method when installing my Threadripper setup and I was able to mount my TR4 cooler just fine with footprint coverage.
     
  7. Riccochet

    Riccochet Off Topic Award

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    Have you tried an "X" pattern of TIM going from center of all 4 dies?
     
  8. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    When it comes to AMD's Threadripper and applying the TIM, we have found it to be a totally different animal in terms of how we have applied TIM to smaller sized CPUs in the past. The old "dot in the center" application did not work well. The old "X across the IHS" did not work well. The old "coat the entire IHS" did not work well. The size of the Threadripper IHS does not play well with the way we have learned to apply the TIM in the past. However, a couple of those techniques used together are what we have found to be the answer.
     
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  9. Meeho

    Meeho [H]ardness Supreme

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    Why no temperature data to see the benefits and drawbacks of the different application methods you've tried?
     
  10. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    Sorry, I have not kept logs on that for the past 6 months.
     
  11. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    I apologize for the information that we have gleaned after hundreds of TR mounts is useless to you.
     
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  12. Solhokuten

    Solhokuten [H]ard|Gawd

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    Nice video. This info is good to know as I plan to go the Ryzen route for my next build.

    Every time I see a TIM application video I can't help but think of Futurama.
     
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  13. nightanole

    nightanole [H]ard|Gawd

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    Wonder how the old method of "take heat gun to heatsink+cpu to get to above 80c, then smear runny TIM" works.
     
  14. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    As noted in the video, it works, but heating it up from the inside works so much better. :)
     
  15. triwolf

    triwolf Gawd

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    The fact is it's a better way to apply TIM, your mileage will likely vary. It's good to know that there is a way to make it better, I'll take that over no knowledge any day.
     
  16. bigdogchris

    bigdogchris [H]ard as it Gets

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    Yeah, and while he may not have the temperatures written down, overtime as the process is developed you can be aware that the temps are getting better/worse after each attempt, slowly whittling away until you arrive at a good working solution.
     
  17. EdKiefer

    EdKiefer Limp Gawd

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    Kyle, great work on vids, they are a plus and always check them out even if I "think" I know what it's about.

    Q: With TR are the active dies and inactive dies always positioned same place in the package?
    I think this has been answered before, but I forget now.
     
  18. LazN

    LazN Limp Gawd

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    So umm, no summary of findings without watching the video? How about something written for those of us at work??
     
  19. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    You ask that and I am about to answer, and you have made me understand that I am using an assumption here. I will ask to make sure.
     
  20. Patricio

    Patricio n00b

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    Kyle, just noticed on the second application you fastened the inactive cores screws first rather than the actives, that was maybe one of the reasons why the application was not optimal :).
     
  21. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    IIRC I did not tighten those down first however. The mating footprint I got verifies this.
     
  22. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    This is what you get when your hold down springs are weak. This is on the Iceman TR4 water block. Immediately went to 85C+ and hard-locked.

    Mate spread with two dots.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018
  23. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    So going back on the Iceman TR4 Water Block, I went with a smooth single layer TIM spread. This is what I got. Not good at all.

    Mate IceMan TR4 Water Block-Single Layer Spread.jpg
     
  24. FeeNiX Rising

    FeeNiX Rising n00b

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    Thanks for this, it was really helpful! Can't wait to see the block results when you get to it!
     
  25. EdKiefer

    EdKiefer Limp Gawd

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    You would think it would of spread with that much paste, those springs must be real weaklings.
     
  26. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    Well, here's the Iceman TR4 problem....

    IMG_20180220_192336.jpg
     
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  27. EdKiefer

    EdKiefer Limp Gawd

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    Or needs lapping, that is the problem with such large surface area of these things.
    It needs to be perfectly flat.
     
  28. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    Too many good blocks on the market to purchase a project block for what these cost.
     
  29. rgMekanic

    rgMekanic [H]ard|News Staff Member

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    Lapping is to get rid of machining marks, I'd need to invest in a knee mill before I bothered to fix what looks like 3 thou of bow
     
  30. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    At least that is a testament to my l33t PK-1 spreading skills. ;)
     
  31. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    And this is what you get with the method shown after your TIM has had time to flow under temperature with a good block and a good mount. Just took this one off the bench.

    IMG_20180221_004256.jpg
     
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  32. EdKiefer

    EdKiefer Limp Gawd

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    Looks good, on the other block, from that pic IMO it wouldn't take much to make it flat as its problem is mainly on very edge, it "looks" to be like 0.005-0.007 range, but I could be wrong.

    I do agree water blocks are more mainstream now and there many options so just get a good one.
     
  33. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    This much TIM did not fill the gap well.

    IMG_20180220_200234.jpg
     
  34. FrgMstr

    FrgMstr Just Plain Mean Staff Member

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    AMD Engineering verified this morning that the active and inactive die placement is always in the same position on the Threadripper substrate. Thanks for making me check my assumption. Good information to KNOW.
     
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  35. noko

    noko [H]ardness Supreme

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    Having two dies under the lid does indeed make a big difference in how to spread or apply the TIM. I would not have thought of that, lately I've been getting lazy and doing an X with a little extra in the middle, the extra in the middle would be worthless, the X would probably get the die somewhat - meaning for TR that would not work well. What worked before may not work good with different configurations I see now. Great video and good information masterfully shown.
     
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  36. MV75

    MV75 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Great follow up video to the mounting. But I still have to say, this is 2018, is machining and manufacturing really worse than what we had in the late 90's? Dies and blocks should be flat these days.