Affordable Pelter Cooling

Well since you don't seem to believe anyone in these forums. Let's throw in some actual evidence. Through only a few minutes of searching I found that this is in actuality the 'MACS Air Condition Kooler'.

Read up some reviews on that :) Looks like they only changed in an attempt to shake off those reviews ;)
 
Lord Vicious said:
Not here to argue with you or playing with words. Please send me a link of a 4000+ CPU overclocked to FX-57 performance using a stock fan. I would be happy. By the way, this TEC is being air-cooled too. I have no problem with air-cooling. I just want to see a real life example.
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Who said anything about a stock cooler? If you read my post I said Thermalright XP/SI-120's and 90's

BTW: your TEC is aircooled, but the aircooling is not cooling your CPU, the TEC is.
 
Lord Vicious said:
Can you run full-load for 72 hours without overheating at that OC? Stock air-cooling can not achieve the rapid cooling as active cooling like TEC or water cooling can do.
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While I do not completely understand what you mean by 'rapid cooling', let me say this:
Using a Peltier (not Pelter, since I don't want my CPU to get pelted) element adds another heat source to your system. The element requires power to pump heat away from one side and to the other. The power consumes thus is added to the amount of heat that needs to be removed from the hot side of the peltier.

Unless you have a 'good' cooling solution on the hot peltier side, the effectiveness is going to be suboptimal. It may adversely affect your system by inceasing case temperatures, due to the added power dissipation inside of the case; instead of a 89W CPU, your HSF needs to cool a 89W CPU and a xxW peltier element. This is likely the case why many people use TECs with water-cooling.

 
CoW]8(0) said:
Well since you don't seem to believe anyone in these forums. Let's throw in some actual evidence. Through only a few minutes of searching I found that this is in actuality the 'MACS Air Condition Kooler'.

Read up some reviews on that :) Looks like they only changed in an attempt to shake off those reviews ;)
Click to expand...

Excuse the double post, but wow:
CONCLUSION

At £70, the MACS Kooler is expensive, especially as £20 will get you a much better HSF such as the Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 or Akasa AK913. Unless you're looking for an expensive space heater, we recommend leaving this product well alone.
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drizzt81 said:
While I do not completely understand what you mean by 'rapid cooling', let me say this:
Using a Peltier (not Pelter, since I don't want my CPU to get pelted) element adds another heat source to your system. The element requires power to pump heat away from one side and to the other. The power consumes thus is added to the amount of heat that needs to be removed from the hot side of the peltier.

Unless you have a 'good' cooling solution on the hot peltier side, the effectiveness is going to be suboptimal. It may adversely affect your system by inceasing case temperatures, due to the added power dissipation inside of the case; instead of a 89W CPU, your HSF needs to cool a 89W CPU and a xxW peltier element. This is likely the case why many people use TECs with water-cooling.

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I guess I must be very lucky to have my work alright. I had it since mid-October and it has been working great. I am happy with mine.
 
Hey Vicious, (sorry, can't bring myself to include the "lord")

I've learned a lot on various forums over the years by reading. READING. Take some time and read what others are achieving. There are many people on this forum who can offer you some very valuable advice. DFI Dashi is one of them.

I think most of us who have read this thread are in disbelief that you are even serious with your posts. If you want examples of good overclocks on air, use the search feature.

If you want a real world example, my 1.8ghz, 89w a64 2800+ newcastle runs at 278 x 9 all day long, Idles at 42c, loads around 55c @ 1.45v. This is done with an FX / X2 stock heatsink/fan combo I purchased on ebay for $20 shipped. I run the fan on the heatsink at 7v to keep noise down. :cool:

If I want to run at stock speeds I can drop the voltage to 1.1v and still be prime stable for days. This keeps my temps in the 30's.
 
sarbz said:
Hey Vicious, (sorry, can't bring myself to include the "lord")

I've learned a lot on various forums over the years by reading. READING. Take some time and read what others are achieving. There are many people on this forum who can offer you some very valuable advice. DFI Dashi is one of them.

I think most of us who have read this thread are in disbelief that you are even serious with your posts. If you want examples of good overclocks on air, use the search feature.

If you want a real world example, my 1.8ghz, 89w a64 2800+ newcastle runs at 278 x 9 all day long, Idles at 42c, loads around 55c @ 1.45v. This is done with an FX / X2 stock heatsink/fan combo I purchased on ebay for $20 shipped. I run the fan on the heatsink at 7v to keep noise down. :cool:

If I want to run at stock speeds I can drop the voltage to 1.1v and still be prime stable for days. This keeps my temps in the 30's.
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Thank you for your valuable input. Please correct me if I am wrong. Do you have your HT at 3 and memory settings at 3-4-4-8? How much performance gain do you get with this setting as oppose stock setting? Thank you in advance for your answer.
 
http://www.custompc.co.uk/custompc/reviews/76628/macs-air-condition-kooler.html

Verdict: Unless you're looking for an expensive space heater, we recommend leaving this product well alone




http://www.viperlair.com/reviews/cooling/misc/ma7121/p2.shtml

With words like "thermoelectric cooling", and "air-conditioning" on a box of a CPU cooler, I was expecting some great things from the MACS cooler. The product will look good for those of you interested in LEDs and animated icons, as well as quiet cooling (the MACS is not quite silent, but it isn't disruptive either), but in terms of performance, the MACS fails to deliver.

As mentioned earlier, the idle performance is close to 10°C than AMD's stock cooler, but considering most of us do more than just turning on a PC and taking a vacation for half a year, we just cannot recommend this product to our readers. Considering the cost of this product, we suggest looking into a performance air cooler for half the price.
 
Lord Vicious said:
Thank you for your valuable input. Please correct me if I am wrong. Do you have your HT at 3x and memory settings at 3-4-4-8? How much performance gain do you get with this setting as oppose stock setting? Thank you in advance for your answer.
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You are wrong. partially. My HTT is set to 3x, and my ram is running at 2.5-3-3-8 @ ~208mhz (3:4). CPU is at 278x9.

With these speeds, my system scores a 347(single proc. rendering) with cinebench. It renders the test image in 75.9 seconds.

At stock speeds (200x9, 1:1, HTT 4x) my system scores a 252, rendering the image in 104.6 seconds.

That's a huge gain. I model & render a lot of images, and I'm improving my rendering time by 38%. That could mean an hour or two(or more) for some renders.

Anyway, I use air. It's stable. It was a $130 chip when I bought it, running at a 39% OC. And the hsf cost me $20.
 
sarbz said:
You are wrong. partially. My HTT is set to 3x, and my ram is running at 2.5-3-3-8 @ ~208mhz (3:4). CPU is at 278x9.

With these speeds, my system scores a 347(single proc. rendering) with cinebench. It renders the test image in 75.9 seconds.

At stock speeds (200x9, 1:1, HTT 4x) my system scores a 252, rendering the image in 104.6 seconds.

That's a huge gain. I model & render a lot of images, and I'm improving my rendering time by 38%. That could mean an hour or two(or more) for some renders.

Anyway, I use air. It's stable. It was a $130 chip when I bought it, running at a 39% OC. And the hsf cost me $20.
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Thank you for the info. What is your 3Dmark2005 score?
 
6598 right now. I've yet to finish tweaking my video card. I achieved a 6995 with an x800xt AIW in this same system. Hopefully I can come close to that with this x850pro.

But 3dmark05 depends on the GPU more than the CPU.
 
sarbz said:
6598 right now. I've yet to finish tweaking my video card. I achieved a 6995 with an x800xt AIW in this same system. Hopefully I can come close to that with this x850pro.

But 3dmark05 depends on the GPU more than the CPU.
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Cool. It is funny how this turns out to be. I just came on to share my experience and I almost got run out of the town. :)
 
Lord Vicious said:
Cool. It is funny how this turns out to be. I just came on to share my experience and I almost got run out of the town. :)
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We're not running you out of town. We're initiating you :p
 
Lord Vicious said:
Cool. It is funny how this turns out to be. I just came on to share my experience and I almost got run out of the town. :)
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the goal was not to run you out of town, it was to inform you.

the temps that you are getting with that very expensive cooler are not any better than those that you should expect from a good aftermarket air cooler, without a pelt. they are, in point of fact, somewhat worse than a top-end air cooler with a reasonable fan and good case airflow should give you.

it takes a while to tick off enough people to get run out of town. you have not been a member long enough to do so. learn from hatebot's example and keep you questions realistic and informed. i wasn't happy to chase away one of the few other canadians around here, but he was an idiot and posted absurd ideas, and then refused to learn when people attempted to tell him why the proposed idea was flawed. he has not posted around here for quite some time, and the extreme and watercooling forums are cleaner for it.
 
Megadeth_Guy01 said:
Yes yes, and also trying to help you learn about cooling and what kind does what, etc.
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Cool. I hope I am initiated, haha. I wish you guys can have one of this and play with it. Maybe you will have a different opinion. Maybe not...
 
Lord Vicious said:
How about your DDR setting and HT setting? Are you telling me your HT setting is at 250 X 5 X 2 = 2500 MHz? By the way, your 3000+ Venice should run cooler anyway because the thermal power on it is only 67W. The 4000+ runs at 89W. Thus temperature difference.
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Everything's in my signature down below. Regardless... That temp is mad hot for any modern chip.
 
One question for you guys. As I read the review here: http://www.ap0calypse.com/showthread.php?t=2304 It talks about using the thermalright XP/SI-90 and 120 coolers, as one of you have recommended. The result were 30 C and 39 C idle/full load. However, the load test was done for only 2 mins. In addition, the testing ambient temperature is at only 22.5 to 23 C, which is quite cool even for an office environment. Most household would have a higher temerature, unless you live in a cooler climate. Again, I am not argueing here, I want to learn. This result is tested on 3200+ overclocked from 2.0 G to 2.4 G. I have checked around and found that temperature on the air-cooling is a constant temperature over the ambient temperature. If this is the case, keeping everything the same, but moving the ambient temperature to 28 C, there will be a gain of 5 C in the result, which will yield 35 C and 44 C respectively. Please let me know what you guys think.

BTW, In order to understand this better, I took out my 4000+ and placed a dual core 4600+, which runs at 2.4G with thermal power of 110W. I changed the setting in bios so no overclocking is done. I checked the temperature and I got 31 C at idle and 39 C running serious sam demo at an ambient temperature of 28 to 29 C.
 
It seems like you are looking for a definative answer as to which types of coolers are the best and will achieve the greatest performance.

You won't find anything. Some coolers are known to be better than others, but results vary. Everyone has different cases, fans, airflow, motherboards, proccessors, ambient room temps, etc. And some people are more comfortable with higher temps than others.

Just read different reviews, read the threads here that deal with it, and come to your own conclusion.
 
sarbz said:
It seems like you are looking for a definative answer as to which types of coolers are the best and will achieve the greatest performance.

You won't find anything. Some coolers are known to be better than others, but results vary. Everyone has different cases, fans, airflow, motherboards, proccessors, ambient room temps, etc. And some people are more comfortable with higher temps than others.

Just read different reviews, read the threads here that deal with it, and come to your own conclusion.
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Cool. I just want to gather your opinions because it seems that the best answer to any questions is to hear from all different point of views. And, sometimes, like you said, under different situtations, different answers for the same question.
 
Jonsey said:
You can find direct comparisons of all popular HSF units here:

http://overclockers.com/articles373/p4sum.asp

Note they have a testing methodology and results are directly comparible, and independent of outside factors, such as ambient air temp.
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Thank you. The article is a good read and it confirms some of the questions that I had, like the fact that air cooling is dependent on the case/ambient temp.
 
Lord Vicious said:
Thank you. The article is a good read and it confirms some of the questions that I had, like the fact that air cooling is dependent on the case/ambient temp.
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Every cooling method is dependent on ambient temp; air, water, TEC, even phase-change.
 
Jonsey said:
Every cooling method is dependent on ambient temp; air, water, TEC, even phase-change.
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Yes. However, some more then the others. I think a combination of the cooling solution can achieve less ambient temp dependency.
 
Or more accurately, an ambient temp/cpu temp ratio closer to 1 with the most efficiency...
 
CoW]8(0) said:
Or more accurately, an ambient temp/cpu temp ratio closer to 1 with the most efficiency...
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yes yes, indeed. After reading many of the review, I see that there are great discrepencies in results, and many are due to the different ambient temp.
 
Well unless you use phase cooling where ambient temp is not as important since the temps are so low anyways, everything is dependent on ambient temp..aircoolers more than watercoolers.
From what I have seen, the xp90 or 120 is currently the top end air coolers. They even rival some of the better watercoolers.
The others are right, the TEC cooler posted sounds like more hype than actual performance. I ventured into the lands of peltiers a long while ago...I found out to my dismay that in order for peltiers to work properly, it takes a lot of work, power and cooling the hot side to adequately cool modern day cpus.
 
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