120hz monitors?

M

McG2k1

Limp Gawd
Joined
Aug 6, 2006
Messages
404
Are there any 120hz LCD monitors in the 24" range yet? Seems like there should be but I haven't been able to find any.
 
Nope, CRT can do 120Hz but thats it.
The 100/120Hz LCD TVs do not accept 120Hz input, they have their own method of adding frames to makes 120Hz from 60Hz.
The reason being that LCD panels operate at 60Hz.
 
LCD would benefit from 120Hz input

However, TVs use motion interpolation and motion compensation to convert 24, 25, 30, 50 and 60fps to 100/120fps.

If you like more info, have a go at reading my guide
 
Until digital display signalling and cabling changes to meet this need, 120hz LCD monitors will not be around any time soon.

It's the limited bandwidth of digital connections that does not allow this to be common place. With analog you were limited (usually) to the monitor's internal bandwidth/pixel clock, but with DVI, you are limited by the speed of the connection.

You may one day see 1920x1200x75hz or something like that, but don't expect to see 120hz until there is something like "triple-link" DVI (which I'm just using as a hypothetical example). In fact it used to be (before reduced CVT blanking) that 1920x1080p needed a dual-link DVI.

I don't know about display port, but do we need yet another connection standard? I kinda wish it would just go away. I like being able to cross-use monitors and HD tvs.

Regards,

10e
 
10e said:
Until digital display signalling and cabling changes to meet this need, 120hz LCD monitors will not be around any time soon.

It's the limited bandwidth of digital connections that does not allow this to be common place. With analog you were limited (usually) to the monitor's internal bandwidth/pixel clock, but with DVI, you are limited by the speed of the connection.

You may one day see 1920x1200x75hz or something like that, but don't expect to see 120hz until there is something like "triple-link" DVI (which I'm just using as a hypothetical example). In fact it used to be (before reduced CVT blanking) that 1920x1080p needed a dual-link DVI.

I don't know about display port, but do we need yet another connection standard? I kinda wish it would just go away. I like being able to cross-use monitors and HD tvs.

Regards,

10e
Click to expand...

it shouldn't be hard for them to come up with a new higher bandwidth cable.... i don't understand why it hasn't been done... 60hz sucks
 
natty said:
it shouldn't be hard for them to come up with a new higher bandwidth cable.... i don't understand why it hasn't been done... 60hz sucks
Click to expand...


Displayport is higher bandwidth. It also redefines the signal schema for more color bits. You know so the signal can catch up with the newer wide gamut displays.

120 Hz is not necessary for LCD displays, because the pixels never turn off. The virtical scan rate is much harder to see if the pixels do not go dark in between scans. Who knows about OLED?

The reason for 120 Hz LCD TVs is to smooth mothion and reduce blurr. Most movies are shot in what is known as 1080p24. With only 24 frames per second. A 60 Hz TV has to do what is know as 3:2 pulldown; where one frame is repeated twice and the next is repeated 3 times giving 60 frames per second. 3:2 pulldown can give rise to uneven motion, what is known as judder. If you repeat each frame 5 times you get 120 Hz and smooth motion.

Motion processing produceses 120 Hz by adding interpolated frames between a 60 Hz signal. This is entended to reduce blur by updating the pixels more rapidly.

LCD has pretty much hit the wall as far as pixel response time, so it will take a new tech to get back to CRT performance, without the size and weight limitations. I think that is what we all really want.

Dave
 
Every time I sit down at my bro's computer with his CRT running at 85Hz I'm blown away by the smoothness and responsiveness of his mouse.

Not only that, but he can play games on his PC with VSync turned off and the tearing is hardly noticeable at all.

To me, the 60Hz limitation of current LCD technology is one of it's biggest issues, and I CAN'T WAIT to see new flat panel technology that can handle 120Hz.
 
Well flat panel technology is already out there that is 120hz. It is just getting the bandwidth of 120hz.
 
I'm reviving this thread because goddammit it's been a year-plus and all we have are two models which are both fairly crappy by all accounts for anything other than 3D-gaming :mad:
 
Its all about where the moneys at. The benefit for the average consumer to have a 120hz monitor is fairly minor. And it costs a lot more to produce.
 
The restriction of 1920*1200@60Hz is a result of LVDS bandwidth limitations. Displayport is a new higher bandwidth VESA standard that designates both an external interface and an internal interface that is intended to replace LVDS. In this case it appears that merely having a monitor equipped with a Displayport connector will not permit the panel to be driven at higher frequencies and bit depths. Panel manufacturers must implement Displayport as a replacement of LVDS in their new products in order to achieve these capabilities.

daveswantek said:
The reason for 120 Hz LCD TVs is to smooth mothion and reduce blurr. Most movies are shot in what is known as 1080p24. With only 24 frames per second. A 60 Hz TV has to do what is know as 3:2 pulldown; where one frame is repeated twice and the next is repeated 3 times giving 60 frames per second. 3:2 pulldown can give rise to uneven motion, what is known as judder.
Click to expand...

This is true, but as a compromise I happen to think that the 24->60 pulldown is very effective.

daveswantek said:
Motion processing produceses 120 Hz by adding interpolated frames between a 60 Hz signal. This is entended to reduce blur by updating the pixels more rapidly.
Click to expand...

Apparently some recent TVs will accept a 24Hz source input and render it correctly at 120Hz without motion-compensated frame interpolation.
 
1920x1200 @ 120Hz certainly possible with DL-DVI or DP ports..

However, the pixels on the IPS and PVA panels right now are still not fast enough. Only TN panels are fast enough... We may soon see 1920x1080p @ 120Hz TN monitors soon (Unlikely for a 1920x1200).
 
Does Displayport have the bandwidth to do 2560x1600 @ 120hz with 32 bit color??
 
Askanison2 said:
1920x1200 @ 120Hz certainly possible with DL-DVI or DP ports..

However, the pixels on the IPS and PVA panels right now are still not fast enough. Only TN panels are fast enough... We may soon see 1920x1080p @ 120Hz TN monitors soon (Unlikely for a 1920x1200).
Click to expand...


How come some TVs have a stated response time of 1 or 3ms? I'm not talking about tiny TN TVs but large, normal TVs based on IPS or PVA. Sure, that's the fastest they can go, other transitions might take a lot longer but it's the same for computer displays and their specification sheets...
Is it just plain bull or are the TV-sets in a higher development stage?
 
Askanison2 said:
1920x1200 @ 120Hz certainly possible with DL-DVI or DP ports..

However, the pixels on the IPS and PVA panels right now are still not fast enough. Only TN panels are fast enough... We may soon see 1920x1080p @ 120Hz TN monitors soon (Unlikely for a 1920x1200).
Click to expand...

That doesn't sound right given all of the IPS and PVA 120Hz TV panels. (I know, unfortunately, the TVs are 60Hz externally, but still true 120Hz panels internally I believe, even if that bandwidth is not accessible...)
 
Dual Link DVI can handle 1920x1200@120 Hz and the latest revision of DP handles 2560x1600@120 Hz.
They do at least sport the required bandwidth.
 
brumwald said:
Dual Link DVI can handle 1920x1200@120 Hz and the latest revision of DP handles 2560x1600@120 Hz.
They do at least sport the required bandwidth.
Click to expand...

Where did you hear that DP handles 2560x1600 at 120Hz? The displayport.org site doesn't seem to know that, and my math in this post shows 2560x1600@120Hz bandwidth exceeds Displayport 4 pairs maximum speed.
 
Iam still waiting for a 24inch 120hz i hear they will be out next year.The viewsonic 22inch 120hz is not a bad price.
 
evilsofa said:
Where did you hear that DP handles 2560x1600 at 120Hz? The displayport.org site doesn't seem to know that, and my math in this post shows 2560x1600@120Hz bandwidth exceeds Displayport 4 pairs maximum speed.
Click to expand...

Displayport 1.2 has doubled the data per lane.
I.e. it has the bandwitdh for 2560x1600@120 Hz. Or four (daisy chained) 1920x1200@60 Hz or why not one 1920x1200@240 Hz per output (with only two DP connectors you could drive eight 1920x1200@60 Hz monitors :) (if it were up to only DP, the hardware must be able to drive that many pixels etc.)).

Many sites reports that it will handle four daisy chained 1920x1200@60 Hz but the bandwidth should be able to handle six, don't know about the overhead for DP packets though.
 
Last edited:
daveswantek said:
LCD has pretty much hit the wall as far as pixel response time, so it will take a new tech to get back to CRT performance, without the size and weight limitations. I think that is what we all really want.

Dave
Click to expand...

What about Plasma? They are currently limited to 60hz input as well, are they hindered by the technology behind Plasma?
 
As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top