I can really imagine that some people worked on this and will come up by 2025.... most of the prediction in that video took years or it failed to ever work at that driver level, the qualification of what is attempted confident level will not be communicated (if known at all by the low level leaker), some version of FSR achieved to do pretty much this.What about this then?
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$2,500 RTX-5090 ( 60% faster than 4090 )
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MistaSparkul
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Doesn't matter if what is rumored "eventually comes out after many years" because it did not launch when it was CLAIMED to launch. If I say bitcoin will reach $100,000 in 2024 but it does not happen until 2030, that doesn't make me right just because it did "eventually reached $100,000". The stuff that he claims is going to happen in a specific timeframe did NOT happen within that specified timeframe therefore he is WRONG.
Depends what one mean by here, it is made up bullshit (directly or by people making fun passing for Nvidia insider), versus actual solution being working that leak, expected to launch with Ampere that obviously no one know if it will work in time, not Nvidia themselves.
yes they are wrong, but if they were active actual project a nvidia (or on the actual roadmap) that low level nvidia saw, still interesting info.
Gideon
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Because if the halo card is 2,500, the 5080 is not going to be under 1,000. Thus massive price creep on the whole stack.
Sir Beregond
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Yep, he's wrong a lot but still presents himself with an air of smugness as if he's always right. It's extremely off-putting.
I'm torn on this one because I feel like gamers soundly rejected the 4080 at $1200. Sure some sold but it was not a popular card for the price. No where near as popular a seller as any previous 80 card from the past several generations. No one is interested in 2nd rate silicon and not even a Ti tier product at $1200. At least not yet. I don't think they'll try to do a 5080 over $999 so soon after having to do a price dropped 4080 Super. Now come 60-series time? Well that could be different. Seems we don't tolerate prices for a couple gens then magically its ok. Looking at you Turing.
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KazeoHin
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Audiophiles are just ONE example of a hobby where $2000 isn't THAT MUCH.
Motorcycles
Cars
RC Aviation
Film/Photography
Metal machining
landscaping
home improvement
Camping/4X4
Hunting
All of these Hobbies are ones where $2000 is a typical trip to their respective stores. Hell, I've seen toolboxes on sale for more than $2000 at the hardware store. Computers are a cheap, cheap hobby by comparison to ANY of the above listed hobbies. And for people affluent enough to be into the above, dropping, say, $5-6K on a top-end PC once every 4-6 years to play that new game that they want to play is NOTHING, it's an afterthought.
"What Graphics card do you want?"
"what's the best?"
"this one, its like, OVER $2000"
"oh, I'll buy that. My performance brakes cost twice that"
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DooKey
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I spend many dollars on ammo and guns every year. It's expensive. I'd say there are more of me that like guns than like halo GPU's.
Welcome to C[H]eapOCP.
KazeoHin
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Exactly. Guns are another hobby where $2K is a weekend.
At what point do we realize that image quality only gets so good and that we don't really care about the games or the details that go by our screen faster than our eyes can process, but we find ourselves in a cesspool of bragging rights about getting just a little bit more excess than our friends and brothers?
DooKey
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Does it really matter what others think?
p3sty
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if it has the same hwpr connector count me out
ManofGod
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What you do actually gets you out and enjoy real functional things. An expensive video card is not going to do that, ever.
MistaSparkul
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It does for me, all the time lol.
Gideon
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I love the fact were comparing the cost for car enthusiasts and video cards... I think most people expect the car parts to cost a ton more than a video card from the get go. However if that said car parts start costing lets say 60% more I can guarantee you that said enthusiast will start complaining about the high costs of their hobby. No one likes it when their hobby suddenly costs more. Some of you are trying way to hard to justify this possible price increase for Halo cards and rationalize it.
Looking at current newegg for a now old 4090, up too $2500 would not necessarily be that big of a price increase, $2000-2200 seem already a common price and you can see $2400-2700 price tag.
Not sure if there anything to justify, no one can possibly be at fault to sell the highest price they can a gaming anything (why and what else anyone should do ?) or justify doing so, it is about trying to predict the price tag
Not sure if there anything to justify, no one can possibly be at fault to sell the highest price they can a gaming anything (why and what else anyone should do ?) or justify doing so, it is about trying to predict the price tag
KickAssCop
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I doubt it will be 2500. Might be OK for 2000.
KazeoHin
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Justify? No, I hate it. But let's face it, Nvidia is testing just how much people are willing to pay for the fun shiny thing. And other hobbies show that they haven't even touched the limit. Other hobbies industries are already at their limit. If they increased prices by 60%, they'd lose more than 60% of their sales thus they'd lose money.
But if Nvidia jacks the price of the top tier by 60%, but every single card sells out... Why the fuck would they NOT jack the price up again and again until they find the limit?
p3sty
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Well if they made better games that warranted such a beast maybe but games are so bleh nowadays
ManofGod
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Gideon
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I just don't understand arguing in support of such a policy. They found my limit and I think quite a few others as well for the price of a halo card, which tends to raise the price on the non halo cards. The reason why you don't is you can cause permanent demand destruction as people remember being gouged.
ManofGod
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I know this much, I was upgrading for almost 30 years straight but, with prices being what they are and performance not all that much better than previous years, I no longer bother, at all. I have a 6800XT and nothing out there would make me enjoy using my computer more at all but, perhaps in 2030, I will upgrade.
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StraferightDave
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I’m surprised at the logic my H folks are using here. First cars and computers are not even remotely comparable. Who goes and buys a 2000 dollar car part to last for a few years? People that will say “it will last 5-7 years” aren’t accounting for the actual spending habits of the buyers of 4090s. They upgrade each time an extra fps is theoretical. Let’s not swim in Egypt here.
Da Nile is a powerful tool. I think a fair comparison is looking at how much longer people will upgrade gpus like we used to upgrade phones. I used to love that new theoretical benchmark in phones. I couldn’t give a crap anymore. My 4090 runs everything fine at 4k. And a 4070ti and above runs the same at 2k. It’s getting pointless to justify buying this when games are barely pushing the envelope. The entire industry is trending to a subscription model once bandwidth becomes available just like blu rays are practically non existent. I think the enthusiast market will survive but these prices are not worth it.
I can live in my car but I can’t drive my house. People will go broke on cars. Not computers. Plus everyone with a mustache thinks it’s avant garde to mention graphics don’t matter these days so they are gonna hit a limit sooner than later before the economy crumbles down from companies who can’t keep holding the manipulation of their ai assisted algorithms pumping CSGO skins off the billions of children’s neurology permanently fried from being drip fed the most corrupt gaming strategies to non consenting minors. That economy alone is as big as any top 10 crypto player but with zero regulation and accountability. Then consider every studio and micro transaction game that hired consultants to spend half the games 100 million dollar development budget on manipulating player engagement and we don’t get a modern gaming crash but a major contributor to a global financial crisis. These exchanges wouldn’t have been possible without the forerunner nft markets I just mentioned along with 250k blue gems that pumped up ether and bitcoin which then return even greater amounts in other BS “virtual asset classes.” Gg.
Fin
Da Nile is a powerful tool. I think a fair comparison is looking at how much longer people will upgrade gpus like we used to upgrade phones. I used to love that new theoretical benchmark in phones. I couldn’t give a crap anymore. My 4090 runs everything fine at 4k. And a 4070ti and above runs the same at 2k. It’s getting pointless to justify buying this when games are barely pushing the envelope. The entire industry is trending to a subscription model once bandwidth becomes available just like blu rays are practically non existent. I think the enthusiast market will survive but these prices are not worth it.
I can live in my car but I can’t drive my house. People will go broke on cars. Not computers. Plus everyone with a mustache thinks it’s avant garde to mention graphics don’t matter these days so they are gonna hit a limit sooner than later before the economy crumbles down from companies who can’t keep holding the manipulation of their ai assisted algorithms pumping CSGO skins off the billions of children’s neurology permanently fried from being drip fed the most corrupt gaming strategies to non consenting minors. That economy alone is as big as any top 10 crypto player but with zero regulation and accountability. Then consider every studio and micro transaction game that hired consultants to spend half the games 100 million dollar development budget on manipulating player engagement and we don’t get a modern gaming crash but a major contributor to a global financial crisis. These exchanges wouldn’t have been possible without the forerunner nft markets I just mentioned along with 250k blue gems that pumped up ether and bitcoin which then return even greater amounts in other BS “virtual asset classes.” Gg.
Fin
MavericK
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You're not wrong, but gamers are not the ones selling these out. It's already been said, but it may be time to admit that nVidia is not a gaming company anymore. Hopefully the other two competitors can step up and actually give a crap about gamers.
here it was not a rumors, it is just 2 guys talking and saying they would not be surprised if the fancy expensive SKU reach $2500, which is barely a stretch looking at the current fancy 4090 price right now. Exactly like people on this forum speculating on price.
It’s not ideal but. As far as my hobbies are concerned, pc gaming ranks among the cheapest even with current and rumored pricing taken into account. Every desert trip I take with my toys is a 2k expenditure and that’s about 4x a year and doesn’t include the cost of the toys.
$1600-2500 every two or so years for something I’ll use almost daily is a bargain by comparison.
Beyond that, this rumored price is for a flagship product. If you’re only interested in PC gaming when you can have the best of the best for cheap, then yeah, probably best to direct your gaze at another hobby.
cesarioFL71
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I agree with you in spirit but the prices of these gpus combined with the lack of "new" AAA games that appeal to my personal tastes make it difficult to justify spending 2.5k. If there were some truly great AAA games that lit a fire under me I could see myself staying in the hobby as a true enthusiast, but guys like me in late 50's and early 60's are no longer the audience for modern games.
Eshelmen
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Considering AMD is apparently pulling out of the high end GPU tier, Nvidia can now charge whatever the hell they want. $2,500 seems low with how steep they can probably go.
I agree with you. I'm in my early 50's and modern games appeal less to me most of the time anymore, mainly due to the fact that most are geared for online multiplayer. I decided the 4090 is the end of the line for me for graphics cards. By the time it's no longer able to keep up I will probably will have lost interest in newer games altogether.
ManofGod
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$2500 is not a hobby price whatsoever, that is a price for a professional level card that makes you money. The reality is, Nv has decided to take their pro pricing and slap on a gamer nameplate.
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Any time a hot new GPU is released, I look at what else I could buy in IRL instead. Probably why I'm stuck at a 2080Ti. Not that I'd buy it cause I need other stuff (like house things) but @ $2500, that's H&K Mark 23 territory. Then I come to my senses and say I could be earning a bunch of interest while rates are high and don't buy anything. haha
They will charge what fools are willing to pay. Imagine back in 2001 if you invested $350 in NVDA instead of buying that shiny new (then) Geforce3! :-P
Plenty of folks with a 4090 that own it for hobby purposes. That Trend will continue with 5090. You can call it what you want but plenty of folks with enough disposable income who are willing to spend it, will own a 5090 to fulfill a hobby.
Sir Beregond
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Unless they want to bring back Titan branding or similar, they still have to straddle what the enthusiast gamer/hobbyist will pay with what the prosumer will pay for a GeForce branded card. If I had to guess, the $1999 price point will probably be that sweet spot before some prospective 90-card buyers say it's too much from the gaming/hobby space. I was thinking of buying a 5090 if it was still under $2k, but if it's $2500, that's enough of a difference that I'm not willing to pay for gaming/hobby purposes which would instead make me look at what the 5080 or maybe a 5080 Ti is. Though given how AD102 is, I wonder if we'll even have 80 Ti cards in future gens. 4090 seems to be them throwing the consumer market a bone with silicon that can otherwise be used for much higher cost AI/workstation/server products. There's a reason they didn't further dilute that silicon into another even lower cost "4080 Ti".
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Furious_Styles
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From what I'm gathering in this thread we would have people justify a $10,000 halo card as "just another hobby purchase" because you can amortize that over 52 weeks. It's really pretty cheap if you think about it!
xDiVolatilX
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Right now. I have reached that point. Lol. My competitive shooters play at 600fps lol. Almost all my single player games can hit 144 with a small tweak here or there which isn't very noticable. Anything otherwise means the game itself is poorly optimized so throwing more money at it doesn't pay. It's like chasing your own tail. You'll never catch it. Even if you think you can, you can't
I think it will depend on the genre, realistic game can loose clarity of gaming element and for anything violent some distance created by unrealistic graphic can be a plus.
Obviously having Pixar level rendering for non photo realistic affair can still be really hard to render, but for many game a simple astheatic can be a plus.
For something like Detroit becoming human, movie quality during real time gameplay could be a plus, but the moment with reach perfect fidelity, the brain will stop register that it is looking at synthetic image and being impressed by the graphics, I imagine that it happen really fast and now like when we watch movie being fidel to reality will not be talked about, how good artistically (set, costume, lighting choice, composition, etc... like movies) will become what we talk about.
They're still a giant amount of room.
Obviously having Pixar level rendering for non photo realistic affair can still be really hard to render, but for many game a simple astheatic can be a plus.
For something like Detroit becoming human, movie quality during real time gameplay could be a plus, but the moment with reach perfect fidelity, the brain will stop register that it is looking at synthetic image and being impressed by the graphics, I imagine that it happen really fast and now like when we watch movie being fidel to reality will not be talked about, how good artistically (set, costume, lighting choice, composition, etc... like movies) will become what we talk about.
They're still a giant amount of room.
Eshelmen
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Well good luck with that. lol
Not sure what is being said here by justify if market condition make a $10,000 halo card for gaming possible and people ask how it can be, some people will explain how it happen yes, like they would for $10,000 epyc cpus, $10,000 pro GPU, $10,000 television/watch/skies/bike/bows.
Does halo product price matter, at all ? For many what happen in the $300-600 will be what is interesting, and those that love Halo product type they probably love that they are pushed to ridiculous level and company care about them so much right now.
Does halo product price matter, at all ? For many what happen in the $300-600 will be what is interesting, and those that love Halo product type they probably love that they are pushed to ridiculous level and company care about them so much right now.
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MistaSparkul
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88.8% of AD102 (4090) vs 97.6% of GA102 (3090), on similar memory bandwith with DDR7 not ready:
Around 65% faster, in the low end of that 60%-80% expectation.
Lovelace power-core scaling is not that good, but a 97.6% activated AD102 would probably reach that 70% higher performance, Lovelace ended up not pushed at all and with no memory bandiwth increase, lot of product getting the 18176 core good chips sold at much higher pricing than the 4090.
Was it designed to be a 18xxx core-550watt model at some point at time that looked to be 60-80% above the 3090-3090TI, maybe.
The 380mm lovelace (4080) ended up easily higher than that 60%-80% boost from the 392mm Ampere.
Unlike Ampere->Lovelace, I doubt they will achieve this kind of boost while reducing the die and memory bus, the boost solely from how much better of a node they upgrade too should be much smaller this time.
Reading now the idea that they would have any issue reaching RDNA 3 raster performance.... they were able to pretty much do it with a "4070" (would have been one if they were pushed to do so)
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