Rooms at Marriott Complete with Spying Devices

The problem with all these "conveniences" that get bestowed on us are that they are opt-out rather than opt-in.

Also, the level of data mining/sharing/selling by companies is disturbing. While I don't wear a tinfoil hat I realize anything that sends and receives data is an avenue for harvesting it - whether I've got anything I want to keep private or not.
 
Crackinjahcs said:
The problem with all these "conveniences" that get bestowed on us are that they are opt-out rather than opt-in.

Also, the level of data mining/sharing/selling by companies is disturbing. While I don't wear a tinfoil hat I realize anything that sends and receives data is an avenue for harvesting it - whether I've got anything I want to keep private or not.
Click to expand...

The reason for this actually has to do more with cost. What would an opt-in policy look like for Alexa? I thought about this as an option in my previous reply, but basically that means the hotel has to store all the Alexa's, grant them to those who want them when they check in, set them up, connect them, etc, then they would have to have people return them when they check out. Rinse repeat. That gives a much higher level for error, not to mention how much more work it puts on the employees at the hotel.
 
Billy the Dimwit said:
You should not be dissing financial or medical information in hotel, its not the time and place for it. Not that others knowing about you money/medical problems should bother you.
Whats someone going to do with a user name? Are you that paranoid that you have to hide user names from people?
If you have a problem backing up your options you should not voice them to begin with.
See above.
You should not get drunk in the first place.

No I don't a sheltered life. I been to 4 different countrys and travel out of state just about every weekend.
Click to expand...
Why shouldn't I discuss financial or medical information? Is there something wrong with someone's wife reminding her husband to take his blood pressure medication? Maybe someone mentioning that they're good to go because they popped a viagra earlier?
What's wrong with waking up in the morning, flipping on the TV to check the news real quick and commenting about stocks that you own?

As far as "backing up my opinions", apparently you really are sheltered. Maybe I don't want room service spitting in my food because I mentioned something about a politician or proposed bill that they don't like.
Maybe I don't want the hotel laundry service doing an even crappier job after I mention that they weren't that great to begin with.

"you should not get drunk in the first place" apparently you should leave that sheltered lifestyle you've been living. I don't give a crap if you've visited other countries. Are you 12 or something? Of course people get drunk and then hopefully just go back to their room without incident on vacation. wtf kind of moral judge are you to be telling other people what they should and shouldn't be doing, even if it's perfectly legal and normal?

Of course not all traveling done in hotels is about vacations, because if you had half a brain you'd realize that plenty of people travel due to BUSINESS and may end up on the phone or having a conversation with people in the room about business that they don't intend to get out. That could be anything from plans to an IPO to possible bankruptcy that you wouldn't necessarily want leaked early.

I guess you'd have nothing to hide if the only living you've ever done outside of your own home is waking up in the morning and watching power rangers on the hotel TV till your parents got up and you finally went out to do something.
 
Billy the Dimwit said:
You should not be dissing financial or medical information in hotel, its not the time and place for it. Not that others knowing about you money/medical problems should bother you.
Whats someone going to do with a user name? Are you that paranoid that you have to hide user names from people?
If you have a problem backing up your options you should not voice them to begin with.
See above.
You should not get drunk in the first place.

No I don't a sheltered life. I been to 4 different countrys and travel out of state just about every weekend.
Click to expand...

So next time I'm staying in a hotel with my wife and kids due to a hurricane evacuation or other disaster I won't discuss my financial situation or our medical needs because its not the time or place.
 
B00nie said:
Actually not. These devices have been found out listening you non-stop and accidentally sending commands even when you're not trying to. Only a Facebook loving moron would get one of these at home IMHO.
Click to expand...

At a motel no thanks but at home I love it! It's pretty damn easy to set it up on its own network with network monitoring to know what it's transmitting or if it sends any data outside of it being triggered by the keyword. I'm more paranoid about my cell phone than Alexa any day.
 
Rahh said:
At a motel no thanks but at home I love it! It's pretty damn easy to set it up on its own network with network monitoring to know what it's transmitting or if it sends any data outside of it being triggered by the keyword. I'm more paranoid about my cell phone than Alexa any day.
Click to expand...

Um, this begs to question: Do you like Facebook? :D
 
Billy the Dimwit said:
You should not be dissing financial or medical information in hotel, its not the time and place for it. Not that others knowing about you money/medical problems should bother you.
Whats someone going to do with a user name? Are you that paranoid that you have to hide user names from people?
If you have a problem backing up your options you should not voice them to begin with.
See above.
You should not get drunk in the first place.

No I don't a sheltered life. I been to 4 different countrys and travel out of state just about every weekend.
Click to expand...

When you get old enough to have a job and hopefully one where you get to travel, you will end up in hotels often. This is usually when you and your co-worker/boss will discuss work items be it new ventures or quality/production schedules or problems and this is all information that isn't supposed to be broadcasted.

Also telling people "you shouldn't get drunk" when it is perfectly legal and fine for adults to do and as long as they are responsible, who cares?

Hotels often promote business travel and honeymoons/romance get aways. This comes with an expectation of privacy by default.
 
NoOther said:
The reason for this actually has to do more with cost. What would an opt-in policy look like for Alexa? I thought about this as an option in my previous reply, but basically that means the hotel has to store all the Alexa's, grant them to those who want them when they check in, set them up, connect them, etc, then they would have to have people return them when they check out. Rinse repeat. That gives a much higher level for error, not to mention how much more work it puts on the employees at the hotel.
Click to expand...

I agree. Efficiency, profit, and marketing are primary decision making factors - and most decisions are made with a lack of malevolence.

My post was more a function of the state of our society regarding who owns a person's "data," who has the rights to harvest and distribute it, and most important, how much control we have over those rights.
 
Crackinjahcs said:
I agree. Efficiency, profit, and marketing are primary decision making factors - and most decisions are made with a lack of malevolence.

My post was more a function of the state of our society regarding who owns a person's "data," who has the rights to harvest and distribute it, and most important, how much control we have over those rights.
Click to expand...

I agree to a large extent with respect to data collection. There definitely needs to be some policies put in place. There are a lot of changes that need to be made in general with respect to technology and information today. Likely we won't get adequate changes for at least another decade or so.
 
Unplug it and stick it in the fridge (just in case). Problem solved. OTOH, I feel sorry for anybody that can't afford to stay at a nicer hotel than Marriott.
 
Billy the Dimwit said:
You should not be dissing financial or medical information in hotel, its not the time and place for it. Not that others knowing about you money/medical problems should bother you.
Whats someone going to do with a user name? Are you that paranoid that you have to hide user names from people?
If you have a problem backing up your options you should not voice them to begin with.
See above.
You should not get drunk in the first place.

No I don't a sheltered life. I been to 4 different countrys and travel out of state just about every weekend.
Click to expand...

SO like that time I was traveling with my family, and my mother wound up hospitalized, we should have traveled back home t6o discuss all pertinent medical stuff, THEN back to the hospital several states away.

Got it, you're a fucktard. Duly noted.
 
PaulP said:
Unplug it and stick it in the fridge (just in case). Problem solved. OTOH, I feel sorry for anybody that can't afford to stay at a nicer hotel than Marriott.
Click to expand...

Maybe, I have stayed at Marriott a few times the last few years and it was pretty nice.
 
NoOther said:
Maybe, I have stayed at Marriott a few times the last few years and it was pretty nice.
Click to expand...

The company i work for usually uses holiday inn express, so I won't really ever worry about this anyways haha. Lucky to have working lamps in the room.
 
kju1 said:
...that doesnt stop it from listening to you with the microphone. Even if it doesnt send the data to amazon during that time that doesnt prevent someone from hacking the device and setting it to be "muted" but always listening and sending the stream to someone else...
Click to expand...
What's easier. Seamlessly hacking an echo or discretely dropping a small device where no one is looking. You can get a Esp8266 off ebay and microphone for under $5 and another $5 for a power supply if you can't parasite a voltage source in the room like the TV or cable box's USB port. The pool of people that could do the latter is millions. Don't think millions can hack an echo.

Or if you're lazy: https://spyassociates.com/best-selling-hidden-cameras

seriously, the lengths people go to in order to nope out of buying an echo.
 
Sweetie! I asked you to put the coke on the bedside table! I don't want to have to walk all the way over to the desk.

Calling 9-1-1
 
If any of you have a phone, do you power it off all the time to stop anyone from spying on you? Yes alexa could be used to spy could be hacked, I get that. However she is also very useful and a hotel is a great place for her. For instance you could try to figure out how the hotel alarm clock work, you could look around for the light switch or you could say alexa turn off the lights, alexa set an alarm for 6 am.
 
darckhart said:
It's always a bit insano to me how companies rush out to integrate other company's tech assuming that everyone wants it, eg, ipod connectors in cars back in the day instead of usb. Then when Ford and Acer recently announced they were bundling alexa with all their stuff, I knew it would start rolling out everywhere.

It boggles my mind that apparently all it takes to put a listening device in everyone's home is to call it an Echo and give it some convenient features like turning on things with voice command. I know some people are cool with that and embrace new convenient things. I just hate when everyone else's stupid is forced upon me as well.

Unfortunately, I travel a lot and have built up Marriott loyalty/rewads, so I hope there's an option to get a room without Alexa. And if not and I am staying at a Marriott, then I'll unplug it. I guess I'm glad Marriott rewards merged with SPG and RC now because I can start using those instead...
Click to expand...

Ya I know all it takes to put a listening device on every human is to make a phone smart
 
rudy said:
If any of you have a phone, do you power it off all the time to stop anyone from spying on you? Yes alexa could be used to spy could be hacked, I get that. However she is also very useful and a hotel is a great place for her. For instance you could try to figure out how the hotel alarm clock work, you could look around for the light switch or you could say alexa turn off the lights, alexa set an alarm for 6 am.
Click to expand...

The difference for me, is that I've heard plenty of reports of Alexa doing odd things, sending contacts to random people, recording conversations, etc. If people are making phones do that, I haven't read about it yet at least. Also, my phone is my alarm clock. To hell with an actual alarm clock. :D

I do agree that there could be uses. Especially for the lonely business man. :p Alexa, order me a 5'8" Swedish escort please. :D
 
rudy said:
If any of you have a phone, do you power it off all the time to stop anyone from spying on you? Yes alexa could be used to spy could be hacked, I get that. However she is also very useful and a hotel is a great place for her. For instance you could try to figure out how the hotel alarm clock work, you could look around for the light switch or you could say alexa turn off the lights, alexa set an alarm for 6 am.
Click to expand...

The main difference in this case is I usually have control of my phone at all times. I have no control of the Hotel's devices before I stay there, so I have no idea what has happened to them, nor did I set them up, nor do I have privileges to them other than as a guest. But sure your grand oversimplification and comparison is spot on! :rolleyes:
 
J3RK said:
The difference for me, is that I've heard plenty of reports of Alexa doing odd things, sending contacts to random people, recording conversations, etc. If people are making phones do that, I haven't read about it yet at least. Also, my phone is my alarm clock. To hell with an actual alarm clock. :D

I do agree that there could be uses. Especially for the lonely business man. :p Alexa, order me a 5'8" Swedish escort please. :D
Click to expand...

Yes there have been some cases recently, however it is not like we have not seen cases for other devices too. For instance the Xbone Kinect was pretty much killed by the timing of the Snowden leaks, those leaks revealed a lot about what and how the government was listening to anything and everything. prior to that the CIA completely took over the Iraqi phone network. They could do everything, listen when phones weren't on, send texts, etc. Recently I had a conversation with some friends, during the conversation some details came up about a relationship, one of the girls at the table told us later that siri autocompleted a search with information contained in that conversations that would have been pretty much impossible to happen by accident as those details were very specific.

To me you have to decide what you believe. I think if we are rational and honest to ourselves we go down one of 2 paths. 1 we lock out all electronic devices with microphones, turn them off, don't use them don't buy them etc.... Or 2 we accept and use them for their advantages and just try to push for laws and policies about how their data is to be used. Any in between where you try to rationalize why one device is OK, and the other is not ends up being cognitive dissidence. Which is fine, we can all do that, cognitive dissidence is a common human trait, however your just making your own life harder and stressing yourself out with no practical outcome.

I personally choose to accept this reality of life, in exchange for the chance that someone will hear about my small penis I get to turn the lights on without getting out of bed. I get to have access to Hard forum from my bed. Does shit happen, why yes it does, I understand the fear, but shit happens every day on the road too you get in the car and risk your life every time, someone else might just swerve across the road and hit you. Benefits out weight the consequences cause I bet most of you drive, and once again the chances of you getting in an accident are likely far higher than someone finding out about your embarrassing date. Ultimately at the end of the day try it out. I was skeptical about Alexa because I have seen so many products not live up but amazon is making that useful, real useful and their open nature is similar to how google won with android. My dad is a home remodeler and he estimated in a house it would cost about $2000 to put in a 4 way light in a room, wires had to be fished etc... Throw in Alexa and a single light smart light switch, now you can turn the light on from all 3 doors and any point in the room for less than $100. This is efficiency, it makes your life better, faster, cheaper. If you want to throw that all out on the off chance that someone will hack it, well that's your business, I and others will keep it growing cause its worth it to us.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rahh
like this
rudy said:
I personally choose to accept this reality of life, in exchange for the chance that someone will hear about my small penis I get to turn the lights on without getting out of bed. I get to have access to Hard forum from my bed. Does shit happen, why yes it does, I understand the fear, but shit happens every day on the road too you get in the car and risk your life every time, someone else might just swerve across the road and hit you. Benefits out weight the consequences cause I bet most of you drive, and once again the chances of you getting in an accident are likely far higher than someone finding out about your embarrassing date. Ultimately at the end of the day try it out. I was skeptical about Alexa because I have seen so many products not live up but amazon is making that useful, real useful and their open nature is similar to how google won with android. My dad is a home remodeler and he estimated in a house it would cost about $2000 to put in a 4 way light in a room, wires had to be fished etc... Throw in Alexa and a single light smart light switch, now you can turn the light on from all 3 doors and any point in the room for less than $100. This is efficiency, it makes your life better, faster, cheaper. If you want to throw that all out on the off chance that someone will hack it, well that's your business, I and others will keep it growing cause its worth it to us.
Click to expand...

I use alexa and smarthings. The problem is if the service is down or an internet connection is down. Now you can't control your lights except manually cutting their power. This needs to migrate toward offline processing for it to have a long lasting place in houses other than cheap addons. I know voice is a lot of processing but people don't like things that don't work if internet goes down.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rahh
like this
NoOther said:
The main difference in this case is I usually have control of my phone at all times. I have no control of the Hotel's devices before I stay there, so I have no idea what has happened to them, nor did I set them up, nor do I have privileges to them other than as a guest. But sure your grand oversimplification and comparison is spot on! :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Well you being a hard forum member probably have android with a custom ROM, and you probably know every line of code or can verify it that deals with the microphone, maybe you even removed the microphone from the phone as you only use it for texting and wouldn't risk the government hearing you. However most normal people and myself included get updates from the company / carrier and we have no control over closed source software running our smart phones largely from apple and Samsung. So we don't know any more about what our phone can do or who can hack it than we know about an echo in a hotel room. So to us simple minded folks it is pretty rational to accept the risk in exchange for the benefits.

Lets ask another question how many people unplug the phone in the hotel you know the dumb phone? Isnt it also possible that that phone could be hacked or altered? How about just sticking a small spy camera or microphone in the room? Sure you might be in control of your phone, but you aren't in control of the entire hotel room. Maybe if it worries you so much you should never stay in hotels and should instead purchase an RV that is always in your control all the time. Once again this just doesn't seem like its worth your time. The far easier and less stressful way to live life is to enjoy the advantages of the technology. Now if you happen to be doing something very sensitivity or illegal then yes you should probably be careful, encrypt everything, if you have a lot of money in a hotel safe be discreet, unplug the echo, don't talk loudly so the neighbors or people in the hall can hear it, inspect the room. Never know what the hotel staff have done or placed in there.
 
Darunion said:
I use alexa and smarthings. The problem is if the service is down or an internet connection is down. Now you can't control your lights except manually cutting their power. This needs to migrate toward offline processing for it to have a long lasting place in houses other than cheap addons. I know voice is a lot of processing but people don't like things that don't work if internet goes down.
Click to expand...

I agree with you 100% and it is obviously the biggest flaw with Alexa. This was the same issue people had with Xbone when they tried to do always connected. If amazon fixes this they are probably going to completely own the market. I will point out though for the uninitiated that even if Alexa goes down typically there is a work around so long as you have power. In my cases the apps that each device used still worked without internet. Also with lights you can switch the power off, to turn them off and on to turn them on. Obviously these are not ideal for if you have less tech savvy members of your home its too complicated for them to know which device is controlled by which app, alternatively if you jump into one ecosystem, say phillips hue, then you lose a lot of the purchasing power and flexibility that Alexa open nature brings. IE I have 4 different brands of smart plugs automating all different products. I purchased 3 simply cause they were incredible deals, the 4th was something no major brand offered. So ultimately the worse case if you lose internet what happens is you just go back to living life like you did before, which is manual control.

BTW one of my favorite advantages to these new smart devices is that they keep time from the internet. it used to be my smart timers that control my poison dart frog vivariums would have to have their time reset every time they lost power, either cause of a storm, or a breaker switch. Now when the power comes back, they gather their time from the internet, and get back on schedule when the next event triggers, no more me running around setting the time. In fact its so great I now don't even give 1 shit about stupid clocks on devices like ovens and microwaves, when they lose time they can stay broke not worth my time to fix them.
 
To be clear, I'm not all that worried about it. I'll still point those sorts of things out though. I'm also not very consistent about which things bother me, and which things don't. I'll happily admit that. Alexa is an easy target for jokes though.

I also agree that offline, or semi-offline functionality would be highly useful.
 
d3athf1sh said:
so

what happens when it's not a tabletop device but built into the room somewhere? idk phone,tv,ceiling??
Click to expand...
My 9mm will have an accidental discharge, is what happens. :punch:

Just kidding. :D

Stabbing it with an ice pick is cheaper, quieter, and it's an easier tool to transport and dispose of. (y)
 
rudy said:
Well you being a hard forum member probably have android with a custom ROM, and you probably know every line of code or can verify it that deals with the microphone, maybe you even removed the microphone from the phone as you only use it for texting and wouldn't risk the government hearing you. However most normal people and myself included get updates from the company / carrier and we have no control over closed source software running our smart phones largely from apple and Samsung. So we don't know any more about what our phone can do or who can hack it than we know about an echo in a hotel room. So to us simple minded folks it is pretty rational to accept the risk in exchange for the benefits.

Lets ask another question how many people unplug the phone in the hotel you know the dumb phone? Isnt it also possible that that phone could be hacked or altered? How about just sticking a small spy camera or microphone in the room? Sure you might be in control of your phone, but you aren't in control of the entire hotel room. Maybe if it worries you so much you should never stay in hotels and should instead purchase an RV that is always in your control all the time. Once again this just doesn't seem like its worth your time. The far easier and less stressful way to live life is to enjoy the advantages of the technology. Now if you happen to be doing something very sensitivity or illegal then yes you should probably be careful, encrypt everything, if you have a lot of money in a hotel safe be discreet, unplug the echo, don't talk loudly so the neighbors or people in the hall can hear it, inspect the room. Never know what the hotel staff have done or placed in there.
Click to expand...

Physical control of the device. But yes to a few of those assumptions. Your other explanations do not make the analogy any better, they only make it worse. You could worry about all that other stuff, or you could just care about the device that is known to have issues and is probably easily unplugged.
 
pcgeekesq said:
My 9mm will have an accidental discharge, is what happens. :punch:

Just kidding. :D

Stabbing it with an ice pick is cheaper, quieter, and it's an easier tool to transport and dispose of. (y)
Click to expand...

but then you don't get to watch tv!?
 
d3athf1sh said:
but then you don't get to watch tv!?
Click to expand...

TV is for squares and suckers! Since we're talking about dystopian hotels, might as well just pop some dex, put the trodes on, and punch in on that brand new Ono Sendai!
 
I guess I missed the memo where someone proved echo is actually listening back to the mothership without using the wake word intentionally or at least accidenitally. There was a "skill" caught and removed that recorded for an excessive time, but you had to add said skill yourself and deliberately initiate it.

I don't understand the emotional shift in people's mind vs. a phone or cheap spy device anyone can place. Can't wrap my head around the distinction. Some people just feel awkward talking to a device or don't want to pay for it so they look for any reason to nope out of buying one rather than admit their uncomfortable or too cheap to use such a device. Does the fact it talks back change people opinions of its capability like it can suddenly think and judge you. I have yet to see the article that proves its in continuous contact with the mothership unprompted. I have seen articles about phone microphones being remotely activated and phones beaming so much data back to so many motherships all the time no on can make sense of it.

I always wondered why google was late with voice interaction on a large scale. I think they probably knew people got easily freaked and that's not conducive to their data mining which requires a false sense of security and why the phone sits ther seemingly quiet when it's actually screaming its head off to the world.
 
Voice control is the future. Looking forward to more integration. This does not bother me one bit.

As usual, some people never accept technology. Some had to be dragged into it kicking and screaming. And then the rest accepts it and look forward to the benefit it will bring. The reactions are the exact reason why we have the Second Amendment and why it is always defended vigorously.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top