FrameBuffer
Limp Gawd
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Another 6 months before VEGA?
- Thread starter Spoonie_G
- Start date
http://www.pcworld.com/article/3153...ing-edge-hdr-monitors-even-more-glorious.html
http://www.pcgamer.com/amds-freesync-2-displays-will-require-low-latency-and-hdr-in-2017/
Freesync 2 monitors will require certain features to be mandatory over the old freesync which will drive up costs, its not just the certification process.
You get what you pay for.
Shintai
Supreme [H]ardness
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Exactly. But people should see it as a good think. Higher quality guaranteed.
StormClaw
Gawd
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TheLAWNoob
Limp Gawd
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If it releases upto Q1 2017, doesn't that mean they cam release earlier, but no later than Q1?
English is my second language, so you guys be the judge.
Shintai
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When companies uses H1 or H2 instead of Q1 or Q3 in PR, marketing and financial slides it pretty much is guaranteed to mean Q2 and Q4. And that's before any possible delays. You can look through Qualcomm, AMD, Intel, Nvidia, ARM, MediaTek etc and see the same pattern.
TheLAWNoob
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I wasn't talking about the actual release. I was being dense about the rumour the other guy quoted.
Spoonie_G
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I can't wait any longer. I'm ordering a GTX 1070 this thursday. I'm also downgrading to a 1440p monitor so the 1070 should be able to handle just about everything. I really wanted to see what AMD was going to do but I cannot wait another 4,5,6,7 months, not playing any games on my PC during that entire time. And the way it looks with Nvidia and Volta, AMD will always be 2-generations behind when it comes to the high-end. I'll revisit AMD in 3 or 4 years when the 1070 needs to be replaced. I really tried to hang in there but AMD left me no choice. 
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Ieldra
I Promise to RTFM
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I can't wait any longer. I'm ordering a GTX 1070 this thursday. I'm also downgrading to a 1440p monitor so the 1070 should be able to handle just about everything. I really wanted to see what AMD was going to do but I cannot wait another 4,5,6,7 months, not playing any games on my PC during that entire time. And the way it looks with Nvidia and Volta, AMD will always be 2-generations behind when it comes to the high-end. I'll revisit AMD in 3 or four years when the 1070 needs to be replaced. I really tried to hang in there but AMD left me no choice.
Wait for Polaris, wait for drivers, wait for Vega.
Tick tock
This is what has been happening for the past 2 generations. AMD is behind by 1 generation right now, and from 2 gens ago, its been getting worse. r3xx 6 months later and rebrand, Fiji, 9 months later than competition, Vega 1 year later, (we can kinda throw Polaris in there as a shining light and positive , but reality they only caught up to nV's last gen products on all metrics, so.......)
When ya start seeing a company that can't keep up with innovation or product cycles like this it has nothing to do with engineering capabilities, its all about money. AMD doesn't have enough to fuel their R&D keep up with nV right now. If it was just capabilities like a misstep on AMD's part, they would be able to correct that and come back strong within a generation.
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I can't wait any longer. I'm ordering a GTX 1070 this thursday. I'm also downgrading to a 1440p monitor so the 1070 should be able to handle just about everything. I really wanted to see what AMD was going to do but I cannot wait another 4,5,6,7 months, not playing any games on my PC during that entire time. And the way it looks with Nvidia and Volta, AMD will always be 2-generations behind when it comes to the high-end. I'll revisit AMD in 3 or four years when the 1070 needs to be replaced. I really tried to hang in there but AMD left me no choice.
Unless something is terribly wrong with a company, you should just order whatever is out at that time to suit your needs. No release date announced = vaporware. 1080ti is vaporware. Ryzen is vaporware. VEGA is vaporware. Intel new 6 and 8 core processors are vaporware.
With that said, no way in hell I would downgrade my monitor's resolution for a video card. Maybe choose a lower settings in game. I would hold off on the monitor purchase for now until you get the new card and really see how it performs. All the testing in the world goes out the window when it's you deciding what is best for you.
Spoonie_G
Limp Gawd
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I'm doing it because of the 60hz refresh rate that my monitor is limited to. My original plan last year was to get a 1440p 144hz monitor. Picked 4k 60hz over it and I'm regretting that decision.
Lowering the settings defeats the purpose of 4k to an extent.
I'll end up doing that anyway (wont be able to get the monitor for a few more weeks). But like I said before, I'm done with 60hz refresh rates on my gaming PC.
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I can't wait any longer. I'm ordering a GTX 1070 this thursday. I'm also downgrading to a 1440p monitor so the 1070 should be able to handle just about everything. I really wanted to see what AMD was going to do but I cannot wait another 4,5,6,7 months, not playing any games on my PC during that entire time. And the way it looks with Nvidia and Volta, AMD will always be 2-generations behind when it comes to the high-end. I'll revisit AMD in 3 or four years when the 1070 needs to be replaced. I really tried to hang in there but AMD left me no choice.
the "waiting game" it's the worse PC game you can ever play. NEVER play it, because something "Great" are always coming around the corner in the next months... the earlier you make a purchase it's the earlier you can be enjoying games instead of waiting bored that's why you never see an NVidia guy complaining about a Titan Card, just buy whatever you need at the moment you need it.
Pieter3dnow
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I can't wait any longer. I'm ordering a GTX 1070 this thursday. I'm also downgrading to a 1440p monitor so the 1070 should be able to handle just about everything. I really wanted to see what AMD was going to do but I cannot wait another 4,5,6,7 months, not playing any games on my PC during that entire time. And the way it looks with Nvidia and Volta, AMD will always be 2-generations behind when it comes to the high-end. I'll revisit AMD in 3 or 4 years when the 1070 needs to be replaced. I really tried to hang in there but AMD left me no choice.
I never heard about not playing games for several months is that something you got advice from someone on this forum that you have to stop playing games?
I'm so wondering if you heard about last generation GTX 970 and you are expecting GTX 1070 to last you 3 years ?
Good luck with that one ..
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Spoonie_G
I would turn down things like AA first, and maybe some of those settings that make very little difference visually. They usually eat a ton of GPU power for little rewards and may get you to 60Hz. 120Hz is a lot more fluid, but you need to purchase the top of the line card every generation to have the slightest chance at running the current crop of games at much faster than say 75Hz. 120Hz is just brutal to achieve when thinking of ALL new games. Of course some will be much easier reach this plateau with. I learned that with my current 120Hz monitor.
What I would do is save to invest in a GSYNC or FreeSync monitor. Both of those give a better experience than turning down settings to hit 120hz in all games. Now combine a 120Hz+refresh rate with GSYNC or FreeSync and you've got a winner!
I'm not the type to do this, but many people like to switch from AMD to Nvidia and back to try new technology during the same product cycle. So even if you get a GTX 1070 and then decide that you want a VEGA card later, you can recoup most of your investment by offloading your card in the FS/FT section here or EBAY. There is always someone wanting a second card for Crossfire or SLi. Sometimes there are people just looking for an upgrade and would rather get it at a discount from a respected trader here. Some only buy last year's upper echelon tech.
That's how I bought my first water loop parts; from the FS/FT section. If I HAD to buy them separately, it would have never happened as I was panicked about what I really needed. The seller assured me that he had enough to do a loop to my liking, and even sent pics for noobs to help me along. Can't get that tech help from NewEgg or Amazon!
I would turn down things like AA first, and maybe some of those settings that make very little difference visually. They usually eat a ton of GPU power for little rewards and may get you to 60Hz. 120Hz is a lot more fluid, but you need to purchase the top of the line card every generation to have the slightest chance at running the current crop of games at much faster than say 75Hz. 120Hz is just brutal to achieve when thinking of ALL new games. Of course some will be much easier reach this plateau with. I learned that with my current 120Hz monitor.
What I would do is save to invest in a GSYNC or FreeSync monitor. Both of those give a better experience than turning down settings to hit 120hz in all games. Now combine a 120Hz+refresh rate with GSYNC or FreeSync and you've got a winner!
I'm not the type to do this, but many people like to switch from AMD to Nvidia and back to try new technology during the same product cycle. So even if you get a GTX 1070 and then decide that you want a VEGA card later, you can recoup most of your investment by offloading your card in the FS/FT section here or EBAY. There is always someone wanting a second card for Crossfire or SLi. Sometimes there are people just looking for an upgrade and would rather get it at a discount from a respected trader here. Some only buy last year's upper echelon tech.
That's how I bought my first water loop parts; from the FS/FT section. If I HAD to buy them separately, it would have never happened as I was panicked about what I really needed. The seller assured me that he had enough to do a loop to my liking, and even sent pics for noobs to help me along.
Can't get that tech help from NewEgg or Amazon!I can't wait any longer. I'm ordering a GTX 1070 this thursday. I'm also downgrading to a 1440p monitor so the 1070 should be able to handle just about everything. I really wanted to see what AMD was going to do but I cannot wait another 4,5,6,7 months, not playing any games on my PC during that entire time. And the way it looks with Nvidia and Volta, AMD will always be 2-generations behind when it comes to the high-end. I'll revisit AMD in 3 or 4 years when the 1070 needs to be replaced. I really tried to hang in there but AMD left me no choice.
I would hold off the 1440p monitor until it becomes more clear what is happening with HDR and PC gaming, unless happy to potentially upgrade the monitor again by end of year.
I think you have some tough decisions to make on how to proceed on this tbh, I would just buy the 1070 try with 4k 1st using various settings (an easy one is to minimal AA) and then certain other options with regards to post processing such as the more advanced shadows and do you really need such as HBAO and equivalent at 4k *shrug*.
If you are still unhappy then need to decide if buy 1440p now or later and see the trend towards HDR.
Cheers
Spoonie_G
Limp Gawd
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No. I actually advised myself. What a concept.
Folks are still gaming happily with a 970. Which came out over 3 years ago. That kinda moots your point. Get over yourself.
Spoonie_G
Limp Gawd
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Thanks... I'll see what happens with HDR. But some folks here think its a crime to wait. Lol!
According to Steam, 90%+ of the gamers out there (including myself) are running 1080P and under. Obviously most of those people couldn't care less whether or not AMD has a $1,000+ equivalent to whatever Nvidia is offering at the time. As long there is competition at $500 and under we're perfectly happy.
And what makes you sure the first Volta is going to be 1k? The biggest bracket and most cards sold is the performance bracket, which has been nV's launch GPU's since Maxwell, the gtx 970, gtx 980, gtx 1070 and the gtx 1080, so Volta will be launched with the performance bracket again what ever its called its going to be a xx70 and xx80 in the performance bracket.
Hypothetical here, if Volta's performance bracket has the same performance increase as Pascal from Maxwell, that's what 30% performance increase from the overclocked cards? So a Volta xx70 card will be the same performance as a Titan X Pascal at $450 bucks?
I have no idea what Volta's performance level is going to be. What I'm saying is that the overwhelming majority of gamers out there don't care about the very expensive high end/bleeding edge performance category. AMD doesn't need to match Nvidia in those categories in order to sell cards.
Yeah and look at what has happened to their marketshare and their profits when they haven't...........
You want to see AMD just go belly up? Cause Polaris didn't do anything for their bottom line even though they sold more units then previous quarters.
You were talking about sub $500 cards now when I mention the xx70 is in that category and that particular segment is the highest volume segment which also gives high margins, which over all gives most profits when looking at bottom line.
Your argument of going lower then that, is the same marketing snafu that AMD gave with the TAM, the TAM is not mainstream and lower, its the performance segment which accounts for more market share % (which means more units being sold also) than then mainstream and value segments combined.
Edit and if history has told us anything, if any company can't compete in the majority of the market, they don't sell. We saw AMD's small strategy before, it did not work, the only time it worked is when they had performance and other metrics close to and or combination of performance and other metrics better then the competition. So no just by addressing the mainstream and lower market segments doesn't work, because the scalability of tech from top to bottom, the ability to put in R&D dollars doesn't shift when looking at what market a company is going if. Cost of R&D doesn't change the only thing that changes is bringing a bigger product out (cost of manufacturing) but that will be offset by the increased price of the product.
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Spoonie_G
Limp Gawd
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Spoonie_G
I would turn down things like AA first, and maybe some of those settings that make very little difference visually. They usually eat a ton of GPU power for little rewards and may get you to 60Hz. 120Hz is a lot more fluid, but you need to purchase the top of the line card every generation to have the slightest chance at running the current crop of games at much faster than say 75Hz. 120Hz is just brutal to achieve when thinking of ALL new games. Of course some will be much easier reach this plateau with. I learned that with my current 120Hz monitor.
What I would do is save to invest in a GSYNC or FreeSync monitor. Both of those give a better experience than turning down settings to hit 120hz in all games. Now combine a 120Hz+refresh rate with GSYNC or FreeSync and you've got a winner!
I'm not the type to do this, but many people like to switch from AMD to Nvidia and back to try new technology during the same product cycle. So even if you get a GTX 1070 and then decide that you want a VEGA card later, you can recoup most of your investment by offloading your card in the FS/FT section here or EBAY. There is always someone wanting a second card for Crossfire or SLi. Sometimes there are people just looking for an upgrade and would rather get it at a discount from a respected trader here. Some only buy last year's upper echelon tech.
That's how I bought my first water loop parts; from the FS/FT section. If I HAD to buy them separately, it would have never happened as I was panicked about what I really needed. The seller assured me that he had enough to do a loop to my liking, and even sent pics for noobs to help me along.
Thanks
Formula.350
[H]ard|Gawd
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I am, for what it's worth
However, I'm sitting on an A8-3850, that was paired with two HD 5770s up until Nov '15 when FO4 came out and I had picked up an R9 390... So I indeed have patience, probably more than the next dozen or so people do. lol
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I already have a RX 480 paired with my FX-9370. Just waiting for Ryzen to launch and I'm set. Don't know if I'm going Intel or AMD on the CPU front yet. Waiting for gaming benchmarks.
VEGA? I might do a second PC and get a VEGA card if it is decent. I'm in no rush unless I can convince myself to get a new monitor or TV. Leaning towards a 55" 4K HDR TV. At least 43".
VEGA? I might do a second PC and get a VEGA card if it is decent. I'm in no rush unless I can convince myself to get a new monitor or TV. Leaning towards a 55" 4K HDR TV. At least 43".
Seems like some here think you can't play games unless you have the latest generation and some even the highest current card. I still play on a HDTV in the living room with a 290 just fine at 1080p. Let see if last generation was so good at playing games (everyone was pumping to get those 980's and 980Ti's, some Fiji lovers etc.) now those cards are incapable of playing games? Really?
Then I find it a little bit funny folks telling others not to wait but Volta is around the corner to wait for vice getting Vega. We have never ending reasons it seems to always be unhappy with what we have and push for that extra few fps that in reality may mean absolutely nothing other then a number. Or IQ settings that you need a magnifying glass to see the difference or performance robbing settings that blurs the whole screen 
.
1070 is a great card at a reasonable price and will play most games rather well. So is a 980Ti and a number of other cards. I just recommend you just play games and not idolize graphic cards - you will know when you need to really upgrade.
Then you can be a hobbyist, like me, who like to tinker and have fun but it is not a real necessity or a big need but a choice. So best not fool ourselves thinking you will be so unhappy unless you have the latest and greatest or can't play games when in reality cards of 10 years ago were playing games with the same mentality as today with just as much enjoyment and enthusiasm and always wanting more. Not to say you should settle for a 10 year old card, just prospective.
Then I find it a little bit funny folks telling others not to wait but Volta is around the corner to wait for vice getting Vega
. We have never ending reasons it seems to always be unhappy with what we have and push for that extra few fps that in reality may mean absolutely nothing other then a number. Or IQ settings that you need a magnifying glass to see the difference or performance robbing settings that blurs the whole screen 
.1070 is a great card at a reasonable price and will play most games rather well. So is a 980Ti and a number of other cards. I just recommend you just play games and not idolize graphic cards - you will know when you need to really upgrade.
Then you can be a hobbyist, like me, who like to tinker and have fun but it is not a real necessity or a big need but a choice. So best not fool ourselves thinking you will be so unhappy unless you have the latest and greatest or can't play games when in reality cards of 10 years ago were playing games with the same mentality as today with just as much enjoyment and enthusiasm and always wanting more. Not to say you should settle for a 10 year old card, just prospective.
dragonstongue
2[H]4U
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as far as Vega AMD were not wanting to rush it out the door, they actually pushed the launch ahead of where they wanted it which was supposed to be more toward end of 2017 into 2018 to be before Volta launch, Nvidia released Pascal at higher than expected performance levels, so AMD/RTG decided to push ahead the launch of Vega sooner than expected(also supposedly of very good performance/yields etc) and will have more or less also pushed forward launch of its successor sooner as well.
Pscal may have allowed Nv to ramp up crazy clock speeds but per mm^2 Polaris is still more efficient for power being used and die area. anyways, yes it "sucks" but could suck far more if they didnt do great job as engineers and team or Vega would not be being released "this early" and/or Samsung/GF maybe they cant ramp clocks to quite the same level no, but they are also cramming more "under the hood" then Pascal/TSMC is doing, so it seems to be a case of "to do this, means we do that" type thing.
Anyways, they are on schedule/ahead of schedule and Ryzen AKA Zen and Vega have met or exceeded all their "milestones" now, hopefully it wont be a case of recent media event saying "RX 480 was the first $200 VR capable card for the masses" when Lisa Su would have been far more "truthful" to state "around $200 USD" slap on an extra ~$40 for CAD minimum not counting tax ofc...I am hoping at very least they revise their cooler to make it at least decent reference style for a change, I quite like blowerstyle so card blows its own heat out, but lacking heatpipes and not made "easier" to clean is not a good thing
Pscal may have allowed Nv to ramp up crazy clock speeds but per mm^2 Polaris is still more efficient for power being used and die area. anyways, yes it "sucks" but could suck far more if they didnt do great job as engineers and team or Vega would not be being released "this early" and/or Samsung/GF maybe they cant ramp clocks to quite the same level no, but they are also cramming more "under the hood" then Pascal/TSMC is doing, so it seems to be a case of "to do this, means we do that" type thing.
Anyways, they are on schedule/ahead of schedule and Ryzen AKA Zen and Vega have met or exceeded all their "milestones" now, hopefully it wont be a case of recent media event saying "RX 480 was the first $200 VR capable card for the masses" when Lisa Su would have been far more "truthful" to state "around $200 USD" slap on an extra ~$40 for CAD minimum not counting tax ofc...I am hoping at very least they revise their cooler to make it at least decent reference style for a change, I quite like blowerstyle so card blows its own heat out, but lacking heatpipes and not made "easier" to clean is not a good thing
Recommend you update your Sig for those 480's. I see you still touting that 990 FX Saber R1, what a fantastic motherboard that has been! Too bad it does not look like ASUS has anything on the high end yet for RyZen.
I am looking for Vega replacement for my Nano to up the performance for 4K, but mostly to have some fun tinkering.
As for CPU, I am not sure either, RyZen with anemic PCIe lanes or exorbitant Intell socket 2077, Skylake X, with at least a 3-5 year usable platform. Going to have to check out the Xeon processors more as well..
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aren't these features mainly for HDR? and freesync in window mode?
Since I already have a decent CPU/GPU combination I'm not in a hurry to replace my current system soon so I am willing to wait for Ryzen and Vega to come out and see if AMD/RTG is ready to compete head-to-head with Intel and nVidia across the entire performance spectrum again.
Don't wait for the next best thing because by the time you get it, you will probably wait for the next best thing after that. Buy what you are comfortable with and enjoy it. I mean you cal always sell GPUs here in the forum quick and take a little cut and upgrade. Thats what I do. I may take a 50 dollar to 100 dollar loss on mid to highend gpu but it allows me to enjoy. Many trust worthy buyers here in the forums, I have never had an issue.
Mandatory for FS2 monitors only, i thought FS1 was going to stay around as a lower tier option? Which i think is a smart move to capture both the budget and enthusiast markets
OR
Turn down settings or reduce resolution. Scaling on the Nano 4K to 1440P is perfect using GPU scaler and you still get FreeSync with smoothness in game play. If you are talking lower end cards then FreeSync is needed more for smooth game play, while yes LFC makes it nicer if you can use it.
Even a Rx 460 could make use of a 1080p FreeSync monitor and improve the gaming experience. FreeSync is especially great for gamers on a budget. You do not need a high end graphics card to get great benefits from it.
thats actually a good thing. Lot of monitors were coming out with shitty ranges! I think controlling LFC is a good thing. I would rather pay a little more for that.
You might as well wait and pick up the ridiculous 4K HDR 144Hz GSync monitor demoed at CES a little while back. That seems to be the shit for a long while yet.
Also to those who think that QA and verification adds a couple of cents to the final product is delusional. Even with software QA cost can be as high as 50% of the total cost of development. I highly doubt hardware QA costs will be any lower, unless they cut corners. Also if you provide licensing then you'll have to pick up some of the support costs as well.
You need to take a step back and realize that the spending habits of the members of hardware junkie sites like [H] do not reflect in any way whatsoever the spending habits of the general public. Nearly every person here has significantly higher system specs than the average gamer. You may as well read through a Ferrari forum and conclude that the average consumer spends at least $200,000 on their car.
The cost of R&D certainly does change depending on the product. Do you honestly believe it costs just as much to design the 601 mm², 12 billion transistor Titan X as the 232 mm², 5.7 billion RX 480? Come on.
As far as "want to see AMD just go belly up", somehow AMD stock rose 280% in 2016 even without releasing their own version of a "Titan". They're certainly doing a lot better than they have in quite a while. Right now I'd say they're doing what they should be doing. And that's concentrating on getting out products that the majority of the population wants to buy.
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