AMD Introduces Mantle At GPU 14

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Part of the discussion today at AMD's GPU 14 Tech Day Event centered around Mantle, a low-level high-performance cross-platform console-style graphics API for the PC that was built by AMD in close collaboration with DICE. According to AMD, Mantle enables perfect parallel rendering that allows all eight CPU cores to be utilized simultaneously. AMD went on to say that, on Windows based PCs, the Frostbite 3 engine will render natively with Mantel instead of DirectX 11 on Radeon GPUs.
 
Now if only DICE could tell EA to go $%#%$ themselves.
 
next step is AMD only in the game no DX renderer at all have fun with that
 
Elios said:
next step is AMD only in the game no DX renderer at all have fun with that
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What? Spout shit out of the blue a lot do you? So this is the next step and they should really get prepared for it? lol..tool.
 
1/2 bent said:
What? Spout shit out of the blue a lot do you? So this is the next step and they should really get prepared for it? lol..tool.
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if you dont think AMD would love to have that happen your nuts
ill bet you 5 bucks that BF5 is AMD only
 
Elios said:
if you dont think AMD would love to have that happen your nuts
ill bet you 5 bucks that BF5 is AMD only
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That is never going to happen with the current market. NVIDIA still has the majority of the desktop PC GPU market. Games are a business, they are in it to make money. They won't cut off such a huge percentage of their audience.
 
Elios said:
on PC they wouldnt care
if they can make it the same API accross PS4, XB1, and PC
EA wouldnt give a damn at all
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Yes, they would. NVIDIA has 60% of the desktop GPU market. There are many games, like Battlefield, that will sell 1 million+ copies on the desktop. They won't cut off that huge of a target audience especially when it's really easy to write a DirectX renderer (which their engines already support).
 
Rizen said:
Yes, they would. NVIDIA has 60% of the desktop GPU market. There are many games, like Battlefield, that will sell 1 million+ copies on the desktop. They won't cut off that huge of a target audience especially when it's really easy to write a DirectX renderer (which their engines already support).
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PC sales are a fraction of console sales deal with it
 
Rizen said:
Yes, they would. NVIDIA has 60% of the desktop GPU market. There are many games, like Battlefield, that will sell 1 million+ copies on the desktop. They won't cut off that huge of a target audience especially when it's really easy to write a DirectX renderer (which their engines already support).
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You'd think, but I imagine it depends on the size of the bag of money they're presented with. There's no good reason that Titanfall isn't being released on PS4, while it's simultaneously released on 360, XBOne, and PC.
 
Elios said:
PC sales are a fraction of console sales deal with it
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That has nothing to do with your point whatsoever. Even if console sales outpace PC sales, the PC is still a huge and growing market. Companies don't ignore that. There are VERY few titles that are console exclusive, outside of some markets like JRPGs.
 
N2OInferno said:
You'd think, but I imagine it depends on the size of the bag of money they're presented with. There's no good reason that Titanfall isn't being released on PS4, while it's simultaneously released on 360, XBOne, and PC.
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Sure, but AMD isn't in a financial position to do that.
 
Rizen said:
That has nothing to do with your point whatsoever. Even if console sales outpace PC sales, the PC is still a huge and growing market. Companies don't ignore that. There are VERY few titles that are console exclusive, outside of some markets like JRPGs.
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AMD and NV will run this for all they can
both will try to get games that will only run one there hardware
NV will likely pull this same crap with Call of Duty since it run on UE which is already sided with them

PC sales are tiny compared to console sales
with AMD hardware in both the XB1 and PS4 all they have to do is get API running on that as well
then there is point in make even DX render ver since it would take more work to do that then just port the console game which in the case of XB1 is already running nearly windows code to start with
 
Rizen said:
Sure, but AMD isn't in a financial position to do that.
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2 years ago they wernt
they are IN EVERY LAST CONSOLE ON THE MARKET Wii U, XB1, PS4
if they get his API up and running on that hardware porting a game to PC using it would take almost no work at all
they are position to demand a lot of things now
 
Elios said:
2 years ago they wernt
they are IN EVERY LAST CONSOLE ON THE MARKET Wii U, XB1, PS4
if they get his API up and running on that hardware porting a game to PC using it would take almost no work at all
they are position to demand a lot of things now
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Their financials are awful.

Frankly I don't see how they could have even afforded this trip to Hawaii. They should have just filmed it in Sunnyvale using fake background scenery to make it look like Hawaii.

Don't be surprised if MS buys them out within two years.
 
Elios said:
on PC they wouldnt care
if they can make it the same API accross PS4, XB1, and PC
EA wouldnt give a damn at all
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Yes, Microsoft will really allow something something other than DirectX on the XBONE. Best mushroom hallucination I've heard all day.

Elios said:
2 years ago they wernt
they are IN EVERY LAST CONSOLE ON THE MARKET Wii U, XB1, PS4
if they get his API up and running on that hardware porting a game to PC using it would take almost no work at all they are position to demand a lot of things now
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AMD making custom silicon for both consoles at near zero profit mainly for the PR propaganda value doesn't put them in any commanding market position, sorry.
 
Elios said:
2 years ago they wernt
they are IN EVERY LAST CONSOLE ON THE MARKET Wii U, XB1, PS4
if they get his API up and running on that hardware porting a game to PC using it would take almost no work at all
they are position to demand a lot of things now
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Console margins are low. Yes it's a big win for them in a number of ways but not necessarily financially just yet.

And yes, the reasons you are upset are the exact reasons I am excited. Faster, cleaner PC titles that work well on any platform? That's great news.

However it has yet to be confirmed if Mantle will be used on consoles. It doesn't sound like it is yet, and may or may not ever be used for console development. So, it may just amount to a faster API on PC. If that is the case then NVIDIA will surely counter it.
 
Rizen said:
However it has yet to be confirmed if Mantle will be used on consoles. It doesn't sound like it is yet, and may or may not ever be used for console development. So, it may just amount to a faster API on PC. If that is the case then NVIDIA will surely counter it.
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It will never see the light of day on either console. on XBONE your choices are DirectX, DirectX, DirectX and on PS4 your choice is OpenGL. With AMD's focus of mandingo being brand lock-in on the PC -- a platform where users still have a choice of video card brand -- I dont see how making it run on either console platform benefits them in any way, other than - again - PR value.
 
DPI said:
It will never see the light of day on either console. on XBONE your choices are DirectX, DirectX, DirectX and on PS4 your choice is OpenGL. With AMD's focus of mandingo being brand lock-in on the PC -- a platform where users still have a choice of video card brand -- I dont see how making it run on either console platform benefits them in any way, other than - again - PR value.
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The DirectX choice on MS's part is understandable but I don't see what Sony would gain by locking developers into OpenGL. It hasn't really been clarified either way, so we'll have to wait.

And no AMD wouldn't necessarily benefit by console developers using Mantle, but the developers would likely appreciate being able to write a renderer for all platforms in a single API.
 
Elios said:
on PC they wouldnt care
if they can make it the same API accross PS4, XB1, and PC
EA wouldnt give a damn at all
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Or more likely EA would develop a robust engine with two two paths but certain features only being active on AMD hardware.

They won't arbitrarily kill off a segment of their customer base, that would make no sense.
 
Spidey329 said:
Or more likely EA would develop a robust engine with two two paths but certain features only being active on AMD hardware.

They won't arbitrarily kill off a segment of their customer base, that would make no sense.
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like EA having always on DRM? cutting off there customer base....
again on PC EA could give a fuck if AMD throws money at them and makes porting the game take less time and cost less
 
jwcalla said:
Their financials are awful.

Frankly I don't see how they could have even afforded this trip to Hawaii. They should have just filmed it in Sunnyvale using fake background scenery to make it look like Hawaii.

Don't be surprised if MS buys them out within two years.
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Smack :eek:
 
DPI said:
Yes, Microsoft will really allow something something other than DirectX on the XBONE. Best mushroom hallucination I've heard all day.



AMD making custom silicon for both consoles at near zero profit mainly for the PR propaganda value doesn't put them in any commanding market position, sorry.
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The amount of ignorant that can be contained in a single post is truly astounding. AMD is selling complete chips to the console makers and getting paid in full for every single one of them as they are the only ones (besides intel) with a license to manufacture x86 chips.
 
Lorien said:
The amount of ignorant that can be contained in a single post is truly astounding. AMD is selling complete chips to the console makers and getting paid in full for every single one of them as they are the only ones (besides intel) with a license to manufacture x86 chips.
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He didn't question whether AMD was being "paid in full", he stated that they weren't making any profit.

Nobody here knows how much profit, if any, AMD will be making on a console sale. We'll have to wait for SEC filings for that information. But it's likely to be slim.
 
The only good outcome that may come out of this is another death blow to MS dependance if mantle works on linux.
 
This is really cool, and probably quite a good move for AMD.

DX11's multi-threaded rendering had mega hype behind it... but was ultimately an optional feature despite utterly killer potential. I have no idea what exactly went wrong, but neither IHV has solid support for it (and they didn't have to), and it's probably one of the bigger problems with PC.

Modern API's can be much faster than DX9, but the render thread is still exceedingly heavyweight... certainly a nicer situation on consoles where you'd likely have a bunch of threads of whatever nomming on this stuff. Intel's single threaded performance is naturally good here for games -- I wonder if that'll change up somewhat now?

chris719 said:
Glide 2.0?

Everything truly is cyclical...
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We'll see, but it's definitely interesting.
 
jwcalla said:
He didn't question whether AMD was being "paid in full", he stated that they weren't making any profit.

Nobody here knows how much profit, if any, AMD will be making on a console sale. We'll have to wait for SEC filings for that information. But it's likely to be slim.
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Now this is a reasonable post, though I would take a wait and see attitude towards their profit margins instead of assuming they are thin.
 
With all things gaming I am sure the problem will be a lot of developers will not use this technology because it will not be backwards compatible or cross platform compatible in some way. And if NVidia cards cannot take advantage of this API that is going to be a problem. So like lots of special features, PhysX etc... Its likely to just be a feature of select games.
 
rudy said:
With all things gaming I am sure the problem will be a lot of developers will not use this technology because it will not be backwards compatible or cross platform compatible in some way. And if NVidia cards cannot take advantage of this API that is going to be a problem. So like lots of special features, PhysX etc... Its likely to just be a feature of select games.
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"We've been told at the GPU14 Tech Day event that the Mantle API is open, so theoretically Nvidia could purpose the technology in their GPUs."

This is what i want to see.

http://www.techspot.com/news/54134-amd-launches-mantle-api-to-optimize-pc-gpu-performance.html
 
can we have glide 1.0 emulation with it? i loved the blurry, low-res mess from back then.
 
There's no doubt that AMD are intending to use the market penetration they have gained from being in all the consoles to full effect, if that translates into real performance advantages on the pc for AMD hardware we may well see a large change in the vendor profile of pc hardware to the point that AMD exclusive games do become a reality, don't forget this is just the start, the next gen consoles haven't even been released yet and of course the pc game sales only represent a small portion of the total cross platform sales....I doubt developers would be concerned about Nvidias diminishing share of an already small part of the total cross platform market considering the how much easier and cheaper it would be for them to just develop for Mantle.
 
technogiant said:
There's no doubt that AMD are intending to use the market penetration they have gained from being in all the consoles to full effect, if that translates into real performance advantages on the pc for AMD hardware we may well see a large change in the vendor profile of pc hardware to the point that AMD exclusive games do become a reality, don't forget this is just the start, the next gen consoles haven't even been released yet and of course the pc game sales only represent a small portion of the total cross platform sales....I doubt developers would be concerned about Nvidias diminishing share of an already small part of the total cross platform market considering the how much easier and cheaper it would be for them to just develop for Mantle.
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not sure how you're making the connection that being a component supplier for two consoles is market penetration that will translate into performance advantages on pc. they're a component supplier that built custom silicon to spec for MS & Sony at razor thin margin, thats it. ms & sony call the shots for their consoles, not their component suppliers.

that said, any innovation is better than no innovation and AMD mankle is encouraging from that standpoint but i wonder if there efforts aren't misplaced given we may be in the calm before the storm of a movement toward OpenGL. I'm glad to see DirectX getting the shiv in any case and despite being team green for ten years would gladly switch to team red for a generation if it causes MS one night of lost sleep.
 
D1RTYD1Z619 said:
I refuse to give those dickheads anymore of my money for a broken ass product.
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I agree,

But considering PS4 is basically exactly what AMD has wanted for the PC for a long time now I'd bet my ass we will eventually see a situation where a AMD CPU, GPU, and Memory with this new API serves as a new method for performance improves that can't be done on Nvidia or Intel CPU's.

Considering the history as long as you only use one AMD GPU they may finally see the same performance Intel/Nvidia users have had for years now.

I'd also be rolling on the floor if nvidia still has better performance.
 
temujin987 said:
can we have glide 1.0 emulation with it? i loved the blurry, low-res mess from back then.
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There was a time, maybe 15 years ago that 800x600 was just as "high resolution" as todays 1920x1080 is (there was 1600x1200 for years on CRT which may translate to todays 2560x1600, but back then no cards could handle that kind of resolution).

Remember even S-VGA was "Super" at one time :D
 
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