W8 RTM Build Announcement Reportedly Coming in July

CommanderFrank

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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The announcement from Microsoft on the build of the Windows 8 RTM will be coming in mid to late July according to a leaked document from a Russian site Wzor. The Russian source puts the version in the 8500 build range which contradicts a Chinese report of the RTM being in the 8600 range.

Is it in the 8500 or 8600 class? That we do not know. But, there have now been several sources pointing towards a July sign-off which bodes well for the speculated October release date.
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I can't wait for Windows 8!

Just kidding, I can't most definitely wait...
 
Not really surprising, though I wonde if developers will be able to buy early access to that apps that launch with the store have been tested against the RTM build.
 
It does somewhat feel very rushed. From an early June Release Preview to RTM in July... I hope we don't see another Vista disaster with developers not given enough time to create apps and drivers for the OS.

At least I get to run it officially long term on my PC and enjoy it at long last!
 
SkribbelKat said:
Posting in eager anticipation of the arrival of one heatless-type person. :)
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Thanks for the lead in.;)

I welcome the arrival of Windows 8 simply because it will test if the concept of a hybrid tablet/desktop OS is viable. Yeah I know, Fisher-Price, it sucks, so forth and so on, but at least on x86, Windows 8 is the most flexible end user OS ever created. It's nearly 100% compatible with Windows 7 on both the hardware and software, once launched desktop applications work as they always way, navigation on the desktop through the task bar isn't different and with Metro apps (and indeed even some desktop apps) there's a good touch UI for the first time.

I understand that many feel that Metro is being forced, that desktops and tablets are completely separate things. But I simply do not see a viable future in the consumer world for Windows if it remains a keyboard and mouse centric OS. Thats not to say that desktops and keyboards and mice are going away but Windows has for 2 decades had a significant role in the computing experiences of average people. Should Microsoft simply give up in the consumer space and spend more and more effort on desktops and keyboards and mice that continue to have less and less relevance to consumers?

And no, the notion that if Metro were an option that everything would be great, that consumers would buy Windows 8 in droves because it worked just like Windows 7, well if they already have Windows 7 and would rather have iPads and tablets, why would turning off Metro make Windows 8 attractive to consumers.

Microsoft has a HUGE challenge here. Make Windows interesting and relevant to average people or see Windows displaced bit by bit overtime with phones and tablets that are simpler and more attractive to users. Maybe Windows 8 isn't that problem but I do give Microsoft credit in it's willingness to face a tremendous problem that Metro opponents don't seem to want to acknowledge exists.
 
Loaded the Windows 8 Release Preview on my main machine instead of Windows 7 for this rebuild and I'm enjoying the experience so far. They added some nifty features that caught my attention: mounting ISOs is possible, Flash and PDF support (with full indexing) is also included and I really like the new task manager. I'm getting used to the search functionality but so far it still feels like Windows 7 to me. I've noticed that the Aero Glass theme is still in the OS although there's no Flip-3D (I never used it), I'm confused because I thought they were removing Aero, or at least that's what I've been reading on the net.
 
tesfaye said:
Loaded the Windows 8 Release Preview on my main machine instead of Windows 7 for this rebuild and I'm enjoying the experience so far. They added some nifty features that caught my attention: mounting ISOs is possible, Flash and PDF support (with full indexing) is also included and I really like the new task manager. I'm getting used to the search functionality but so far it still feels like Windows 7 to me. I've noticed that the Aero Glass theme is still in the OS although there's no Flip-3D (I never used it), I'm confused because I thought they were removing Aero, or at least that's what I've been reading on the net.
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They're changing the theme a bit. The Desktop Window Manager (DWM) that powers Aero and makes the desktop hardware 3D accelerated is sticking around, but they're re-skinning it to match the metro interface.

By default, the taskbar will still be glass (and will automatically change color to match your current desktop wallpaper) and window frames will be clean, white, and square.

You will be able to set your own custom color for the taskbar and mess with the color of the window frames as well.
 
dagamer34 said:
Not really surprising, though I wonde if developers will be able to buy early access to that apps that launch with the store have been tested against the RTM build.
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Yup, it's called an MSDN subscription. They'll get access to the RTM build before it's released to the general public (i.e. in stores).
 
Negative Decibel said:
feels strange not to care about new microsoft os. oh well.
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Ain't that the truth? Even Windows ME was somewhat anticipated. It didn't die a horrible death until at least 40 minutes after it's release :)

Sadly, the amount of time between Preview and RTM isn't even nearly enough to fix the Start Menu/Interface Fiasco, which shows just how little Microsoft gives a shit about what it's customers want/need/feel.

Maybe this is the gigantic flop that finally gets Ballmer fired and Microsoft back on track.
 
BTW... I remember way way back when ME was released, and it was looked at by the that wonderful show, "The Screen Savers" on TechTV. The segment on ME was responsible for Leo Laporte's biggest blooper ever on the show.

While discussing the problems he said something like "There's a lot of bad shit going on in there"

or something like that :)
 
Stimpy88 said:
Microsoft's big belly flop... Coming real soon!
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I don't think that many of us will be able to predict what the open market will do with Windows 8 once it goes on sale. Apple is their closest competitor and, unless something significant changes, Microsoft is positioning the new line of products as the closest thing to convergence between desktops, laptops, tablets, and phones the tech industry has seen.

If Intel would hurry up with Medfield's dual core successor, we might see x86 compatiable phones running a full desktop OS in the near future.
 
Win8 is a fail for the desktop. It may be a decent solution for a touchpad/tablet, but that is also greatly dependent on the hardware as well. A lot of moving parts Microsoft has to get right, or it will flop.
 
Monkey God said:
Win8 is a fail for the desktop.
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Really? It hasn't RTM'd yet, let alone had any time to compete in the market place. Your assessment is very inaccurate.

Monkey God said:
It may be a decent solution for a touchpad/tablet, but that is also greatly dependent on the hardware as well.
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Have you tried using the OS as a daily driver for a more than a couple of days? I think it's an excellent desktop solution. After actually using the OS and not just "looking" at it I don't find Metro to be as evil as a lot of people make it out to be. I'm performing the same actions to get things done, except that instead of a Start Menu, I pop in and out of the Start screen, and the response times feel the same with no perceivable lag at all. Starting my session in the Metro interface isn't so bad either, but I would like the option to change the behavior, even if I can't get rid of Metro altogether I would still like the option to be able to jump to the desktop after logging on.

Monkey God said:
A lot of moving parts Microsoft has to get right, or it will flop.
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Agreed. IMO, they are certainly on the right track and things are looking really good so far.
 
tesfaye said:
Really? It hasn't RTM'd yet, let alone had any time to compete in the market place. Your assessment is very inaccurate.
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My assessment is based on using it. It adds no value to me compared to the desktop from Windows 7. The interface is clunky and ugly as sin. More steps are required to do the simplest of tasks. I have no desire to turn my desktop into a "non-mobile" mobile phone or iPad.

Have you tried using the OS as a daily driver for a more than a couple of days? I think it's an excellent desktop solution. After actually using the OS and not just "looking" at it I don't find Metro to be as evil as a lot of people make it out to be. I'm performing the same actions to get things done, except that instead of a Start Menu, I pop in and out of the Start screen, and the response times feel the same with no perceivable lag at all. Starting my session in the Metro interface isn't so bad either, but I would like the option to change the behavior, even if I can't get rid of Metro altogether I would still like the option to be able to jump to the desktop after logging on.
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A few hours. I spent most of the time googling on how to do things that were not obvious. Not a good sign.
 
Monkey God said:
My assessment is based on using it. It adds no value to me compared to the desktop from Windows 7. The interface is clunky and ugly as sin. More steps are required to do the simplest of tasks. I have no desire to turn my desktop into a "non-mobile" mobile phone or iPad.


A few hours. I spent most of the time googling on how to do things that were not obvious. Not a good sign.
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Everything new has a learning curve. I remember fumbling around in Vista like an absolute idiot for a couple weeks until I got passably okay at finding my way around. A more significant change might require more significant investments in learning.
 
SkribbelKat said:
Everything new has a learning curve. I remember fumbling around in Vista like an absolute idiot for a couple weeks until I got passably okay at finding my way around. A more significant change might require more significant investments in learning.
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But this is not quite the difference between XP and Vista, this is more like the difference between Win7 and Windows 3.11.

Granted, once you get the Metro shit out of the way, the desktop experience is close to Win 7, and I think it also feels faster and more responsive in general, but without the Start Menu, I'm lost. And that's the rub. I'm sure Win 8 is going to be interesting on touch based hardware, but for a standard Desktop it's just complete shit.
 
SkribbelKat said:
Everything new has a learning curve. I remember fumbling around in Vista like an absolute idiot for a couple weeks until I got passably okay at finding my way around. A more significant change might require more significant investments in learning.
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I actually had a slight learning curve going from XP to 7 and had to rethink how I used certain aspects of the OS. It was worth it. I really like win 7 now. I can't wait to grab a surface pro to try windows 8.

I mentioned this in a previous thread but you can try out windows 8 on a desktop and tablet at the same time with one install. The software is called Splashtop Metro Win8 Testbed (or something close to it). You can setup a windows 8 machine, VM or physical. Install this software on that machine and your tablet (iPad or Droid). You connect to the windows installation via wifi and it is basically remote desktop but with all the touch functionality enabled. The lag is minimal and its cool to play around with.
 
SkribbelKat said:
Everything new has a learning curve. I remember fumbling around in Vista like an absolute idiot for a couple weeks until I got passably okay at finding my way around. A more significant change might require more significant investments in learning.
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I don't mind a learning curve, if there's a benefit at the end of it. Like I said, I see W8 doing well on surface, if the hardware is solid. I see no benefit to the desktop to make me want to go through a learning curve.
 
heatlesssun said:
I understand that many feel that Metro is being forced, that desktops and tablets are completely separate things. But I simply do not see a viable future in the consumer world for Windows if it remains a keyboard and mouse centric OS. Thats not to say that desktops and keyboards and mice are going away but Windows has for 2 decades had a significant role in the computing experiences of average people. Should Microsoft simply give up in the consumer space and spend more and more effort on desktops and keyboards and mice that continue to have less and less relevance to consumers?
Click to expand...

Even apple is smart enough to keep iOS and OS X separate.

Microsoft could have taken the same route, and made their Tablet OS an extension of Windows Phone... but no one gives a shit about Windows Phone. So instead they take the only thing they have left that people care about it (desktop OS) and try to make it more like their failed windows phone OS so they can backdoor more people into using that terrible interface.

I agree completely that Microsoft does need to focus on tablets and touch. They can't ignore the market, and I WANT to see Microsoft succeed in this area so x86 has a future. That is part of the reason why I hate metro so much.

What I can't understand is why Microsoft, with all of the resources at it's disposal, can't design an Interface that actually gives people what they want and actually listen to user feedback. They should have embraced their desktop heritage and made a UI that was both touch friendly and a intuitive evolution of their existing interface at the same time.

This "Let's toss everything in the trash and start over; don't worry, you'll get used to it eventually!" approach just isn't going to work. People are going to "get used to it" by tossing Microsoft in the trash, and if they have to get used to a new OS anyway, it's probably going to be iOS.

The only real question left is: After metro fails, will Microsoft still have enough momentum for a 2nd chance or will this (ironically) be the final push that weans people off of Microsoft for good?
 
GotNoRice said:
What I can't understand is why Microsoft, with all of the resources at it's disposal, can't design an Interface that actually gives people what they want and actually listen to user feedback. They should have embraced their desktop heritage and made a UI that was both touch friendly and a intuitive evolution of their existing interface at the same time.
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How do you know they didn't? Do you have access to their internal feedback system? Or are you basing your opinion on what YOU wanted?
 
XamediX said:
I actually had a slight learning curve going from XP to 7 and had to rethink how I used certain aspects of the OS. It was worth it. I really like win 7 now. I can't wait to grab a surface pro to try windows 8.

I mentioned this in a previous thread but you can try out windows 8 on a desktop and tablet at the same time with one install. The software is called Splashtop Metro Win8 Testbed (or something close to it). You can setup a windows 8 machine, VM or physical. Install this software on that machine and your tablet (iPad or Droid). You connect to the windows installation via wifi and it is basically remote desktop but with all the touch functionality enabled. The lag is minimal and its cool to play around with.
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Really? That'd actually be fun to mess around with since I don't have a touch-enabled PC around that I can use for Win8 and there's some finger gymnastics necessary on a non-multitouch trackpad to get around the OS since I don't have all the hotkey and keyboard shortcuts in my head yet.
 
Microsoft is very desperate. Clearly.

Obviously, their logic is, if we force users into W8, release Windows 8 phones and Tablets at the same time, we win.

What they haven't factored in is how much Windows 8 phones suck, the UI, along with W8. They've dumbed everything down to a ridicules level. I really love my Google Galaxy Nexus Prime and I like that it isn't simplistic.

Anyways, I've already started talking shit on W8 whenever the subject comes up. Have been talking shit on the phones much longer.

The only way I use W8 is if they strip that stupid ass block UI away and let me get back to icons, the start menu and file management. They can keep all the ugly green and orange blocks for themselves.
 
I didn't care much for Metro UI to start with. Loved it on the phone, etc..., but it does take a while to get used to. I missed the Start button after being so accustomed to it being there. It's one of those things like driving a manual transmission for so long then going to an automatic. You're still looking for that thing that isn't there. For most, it does make it easier, it's just the transition that is hard. That was my only complaint.

Yes, the dual UI's are weird and there are a few things that need polished, but nothing that would make me turn down the OS.

Regardless of your thoughts on the new UI, it's going to be fun to watch and see how it plays out in the hands of the mass consumer. No one really knows if it's going to be a flop or not. You can guess and have a good chance of being right (either way, 50%) and claim "Told you so", but it's still going to be fun to check it out.
 
Will windows 8 be a bigger fail than windows me on the desktop? anyone placing bets?
 
XamediX said:
How do you know they didn't? Do you have access to their internal feedback system? Or are you basing your opinion on what YOU wanted?
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I do desktop troubleshooting and support, and while I might not know exactly what people want, I know enough about the typical computer user to know that Metro isn't it.

I also couldn't care less about their "internal feedback system", a system which, if it exists at all, has apparently failed.

The "external feedback system" (internet) has spoken and there is a consensus - Windows 8 and Metro sucks.
 
GotNoRice said:
Even apple is smart enough to keep iOS and OS X separate.

Microsoft could have taken the same route, and made their Tablet OS an extension of Windows Phone... but no one gives a shit about Windows Phone. So instead they take the only thing they have left that people care about it (desktop OS) and try to make it more like their failed windows phone OS so they can backdoor more people into using that terrible interface.

I agree completely that Microsoft does need to focus on tablets and touch. They can't ignore the market, and I WANT to see Microsoft succeed in this area so x86 has a future. That is part of the reason why I hate metro so much.

What I can't understand is why Microsoft, with all of the resources at it's disposal, can't design an Interface that actually gives people what they want and actually listen to user feedback. They should have embraced their desktop heritage and made a UI that was both touch friendly and a intuitive evolution of their existing interface at the same time.

This "Let's toss everything in the trash and start over; don't worry, you'll get used to it eventually!" approach just isn't going to work. People are going to "get used to it" by tossing Microsoft in the trash, and if they have to get used to a new OS anyway, it's probably going to be iOS.

The only real question left is: After metro fails, will Microsoft still have enough momentum for a 2nd chance or will this (ironically) be the final push that weans people off of Microsoft for good?
Click to expand...

I share your sentiments, with the exception of some of the doom and gloom as Microsoft has survived OS failures in the past. The problem is that they're trying to ram a desktop OS into mobile devices, which has never worked. It's like they learned nothing from iOS and Android. You need a custom OS designed from the ground up for mobile devices.
 
GotNoRice said:
I do desktop troubleshooting and support, and while I might not know exactly what people want, I know enough about the typical computer user to know that Metro isn't it.

I also couldn't care less about their "internal feedback system", a system which, if it exists at all, has apparently failed.

The "external feedback system" (internet) has spoken and there is a consensus - Windows 8 and Metro sucks.
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A very vocal element is making quite a few waves about the interface changes. Microsoft isn't ignoring those outcries, but they are working on an interface they feel will work for the "silent majority" of computer users.

If you poke in at the dev blogs for Windows 8, they explain in vague terms how their feedback system collects metrics from opt-in users and how the interpert the feedback. As far as I've read, every design change they've implement has taken into consideration measured user interaction from a large number of customers and the overall goal of building a touch-friendly GUI. They're betting the proverbial farm on this release and we won't know how it will be accepted by the masses until it goes on sale, but I don't think they're taking any risks without being confidant that there will be a reward in the form of profits at the other end.
 
Cmdrmonkey said:
I share your sentiments, with the exception of some of the doom and gloom as Microsoft has survived OS failures in the past. The problem is that they're trying to ram a desktop OS into mobile devices, which has never worked. It's like they learned nothing from iOS and Android. You need a custom OS designed from the ground up for mobile devices.
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I believe they feel that we're at a point where convergence is a realistic possiblity. Just because something hasn't worked in the past doesn't mean that the goal cannot be obtained now. I look forward to the day when I can carry a device in my pocket that can be dropped into a dock or just tossed on an inductive charger at my desk that transitions at that point from being a phone to a desktop PC in a seamless manner.
 
SkribbelKat said:
A very vocal element is making quite a few waves about the interface changes. Microsoft isn't ignoring those outcries, but they are working on an interface they feel will work for the "silent majority" of computer users.

If you poke in at the dev blogs for Windows 8, they explain in vague terms how their feedback system collects metrics from opt-in users and how the interpert the feedback. As far as I've read, every design change they've implement has taken into consideration measured user interaction from a large number of customers and the overall goal of building a touch-friendly GUI. They're betting the proverbial farm on this release and we won't know how it will be accepted by the masses until it goes on sale, but I don't think they're taking any risks without being confidant that there will be a reward in the form of profits at the other end.
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What he said. ^ People love to confuse the vocal minority with the majority.
 
SkribbelKat said:
A very vocal element is making quite a few waves about the interface changes. Microsoft isn't ignoring those outcries, but they are working on an interface they feel will work for the "silent majority" of computer users.

If you poke in at the dev blogs for Windows 8, they explain in vague terms how their feedback system collects metrics from opt-in users and how the interpert the feedback. As far as I've read, every design change they've implement has taken into consideration measured user interaction from a large number of customers and the overall goal of building a touch-friendly GUI. They're betting the proverbial farm on this release and we won't know how it will be accepted by the masses until it goes on sale, but I don't think they're taking any risks without being confidant that there will be a reward in the form of profits at the other end.
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Or Microsoft has surrounded itself with "Yes" men, and is completely out of touch with what normal people want.
 
Take the ribbon for instance, I have yet to meet a person in the real world who doesn't hate it and long for Office 2003 with its drop down menus with words. Yet, Microsoft seems to think people love the ribbon, and now they're making it an integral part of their OS.
 
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