Gates Unimpressed With The iPad

QHalo said:
This is pretty much the same conclusion I drew and the reason that I switched over. I've always wanted one but never gave it a fair shake. So now I am.
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I gave it a fair shake and went back...
 
I just don't see why I would switch to Mac even if I didn't game, especially if you don't have much experience with the OS.
 
kirbyrj said:
This is ultimately why I ended up giving up my Mac experiment. All the little freeware programs to do what I normally do would have cost me several hundred bucks for OSX versions. Where on Windows you have 5 or 6 different options, on OSX you have 1 maybe 2 and rarely are they free.
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Could you give me some examples? I recently went to a Mac and haven't had this issue (yet).
 
QHalo said:
This is pretty much the same conclusion I drew and the reason that I switched over. I've always wanted one but never gave it a fair shake. So now I am.
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I've always liked Mac laptops (not the expensive $2000 ones, but the ones in the $1000 range). They've been small, thin, light, and get good battery life compared to the competition, without using a stripped down or very low-clocked CPU. But their desktop offerings have always been either a bit too pricey or a bit to limited for my needs. But they really do have nice looking screens.

I'm just disappointed with the iPad. No usb or card reader is a huge disappointment, but I think Gates is right that the biggest disappointment is no pen input. A nice looking screen that large, and you can't even write on it? That's beyond stupid. What a huge cripple to a device that is very nearly approaching some good usability.
 
QHalo said:
Fair enough. I'm going to grab Parallels or Fusion to take care of some things I need from the Windows side for now.
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I used Bootcamp and WinXP. I didn't mind OSX. It was different, and I'm not against going back again at some point to play around some more. I essentially used it for surfing the web and working on office documents. So I figured I didn't need a $1000 laptop to do that when a $200 netbook works just as well ;). If I had a definite need for an OSX machine. I'd definitely use one again. I'm not a Windows zealot or against Apple or anything ;).
 
Chris_B said:
Outside of die hard apple freaks and jobs is anyone impressed with the ipad?
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Impressed....meh, kinda. I was going to buy an e-reader (i read 2-3 books a month) but with them at $300+ I was holding off. I know the iPad doesn't have flash spport, but I hear Hulu is working on a h.264 version for it....I dunno.

All the netbooks out there make me wanna puke, all the e-readers are too expensive for what they are, and laptops are way too heavy on the low end of things.

I guess it doesn't impress me enough to grab one at release, but a couple of months down the road after seeing what comes of it, then yeah.

Gates missed the ball with WinMo, that much is evident.
 
SirKronan said:
I've always liked Mac laptops (not the expensive $2000 ones, but the ones in the $1000 range). They've been small, thin, light, and get good battery life compared to the competition, without using a stripped down or very low-clocked CPU. But their desktop offerings have always been either a bit too pricey or a bit to limited for my needs. But they really do have nice looking screens.

I'm just disappointed with the iPad. No usb or card reader is a huge disappointment, but I think Gates is right that the biggest disappointment is no pen input. A nice looking screen that large, and you can't even write on it? That's beyond stupid. What a huge cripple to a device that is very nearly approaching some good usability.
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It just seemed a bit rushed to me. Seems as though they were just trying to get something out the door to compete and instead of competing they're just offering another weaker alternative. A really half-hearted attempt in my eyes. I'll still go down to the Apple store and look at one and play with it.

The thing that I see that it does for me is that, I'm an Internetwork Expert customer and having the ability to carry the audio on demand stuff as well as the workbooks to look over and also my Cisco Press PDF's all in one place would mighty nice. I carry enough items as it is to work each day and having one less device is always nice. I'm just not sure its enough of a reason for me just yet.
 
Parmenides said:
Gates said it needs a real keyboard? I thought Gates used to preach the death of the keyboard and the bright future of voice commands would kill the need for keys. I guess he changed his mind.
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I was wondering the same thing with all of his preaching of that cool Surface technology over the last few years. The iPad is basically a mainstream version of Surface that more people can afford and use, not a $10000+ tabletop or wall display made for businesses and kiosks.

That and you can use any BT keyboard with an iPad. Only thing you're missing out on is a mouse, but that's what the touchscreen is for.
 
Serpico said:
I was wondering the same thing with all of his preaching of that cool Surface technology over the last few years. The iPad is basically a mainstream version of Surface that more people can afford and use, not a $10000+ tabletop or wall display made for businesses and kiosks.

That and you can use any BT keyboard with an iPad. Only thing you're missing out on is a mouse, but that's what the touchscreen is for.
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BT keyboard good to know. Sometimes it's just easier to use the mouse if you're editing text. I can move the mouse faster than I can move my finger ;).
 
But seriously...if this thing came with some kind of standup docking station that I could use to edit text, along with the book reader functions, it would be great for a college student. As long as you could take notes using a keyboard/mouse combo with a little portable stand.
 
kirbyrj said:
But seriously...if this thing came with some kind of standup docking station that I could use to edit text, along with the book reader functions, it would be great for a college student. As long as you could take notes using a keyboard/mouse combo with a little portable stand.
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They're selling exactly that as well...
 
kirbyrj said:
BT keyboard good to know. Sometimes it's just easier to use the mouse if you're editing text. I can move the mouse faster than I can move my finger ;).
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There is also a keyboard/dock accessory for the iPad, but I'm not so impressed by that given the price. The advantage is that it will charge the iPad and hold it up at a nice viewing angle, the downside is that a nice BT keyboard costs just as much and you can use it on other devices.
 
Serpico said:
There is also a keyboard/dock accessory for the iPad, but I'm not so impressed by that given the price. The advantage is that it will charge the iPad and hold it up at a nice viewing angle, the downside is that a nice BT keyboard costs just as much and you can use it on other devices.
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You don't have a pic for that do you?
 
Definitely seems like the plain dock and a regular BT keyboard are the way to go. Seems like they just "glued" an Apple BT keyboard and the dock together :).
 
kirbyrj said:
Definitely seems like the plain dock and a regular BT keyboard are the way to go. Seems like they just "glued" an Apple BT keyboard and the dock together :).
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I agree, that seems like the best solution. You can even use the case as a stand if you'd like. The keyboard dock is very functionally limited and many people already have BT keyboards that they use with other devices (I have one for my PS3 and living room), so...
 
Bluetooth keyboard + iPod cable (who doesn't have one of these already?) + document stand. Cheaper than the iPad dock and the doc stand can double as, well, a doc stand. It's win-win!
 
kirbyrj said:
I'm still holding out for mouse support, but we'll see.
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Travel time from going from the keyboard to the screen to "click" something would be an annoyance. It's much more natural for us to just reach over for the mouse real quick.
 
phide said:
The hardware itself is unimpressive (although the A4 chip and the display are both positive points). The OS is unimpressive. What makes the iPod touch worthwhile is the sheer number of really solid apps available, and hopefully this is the case for the iPad as well. The apps are what transform a very generic (if even sub-par) piece of hardware into something that people can really use.

I look at the iPad and see potential -- I don't see a particularly great piece of hardware and certainly not something worth buying just for the apps it ships with.
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Too bad existing apps have to be re-written to scale properly! I'm not sure it'll achieve the kind of sales numbers needed to grab developer's attention.

I agree that as impressive (or unimpressive) as the hardware may be on any of these devices, it's obviously only half the equation... But personally I think the iPad was just a massive cash-in marketing move on Apple's part. I don't think this is the device they wanted to bring to the market, but this is the device they could bring to market now in order to beat others to the punch at a lower price point (more expensive than a netbook, cheaper than a traditional tablet or high-end laptop). It's basically a gamble, if they came out with a $1,000 full-featured tablet it was just definitely gonna be another one in a long run of niche products that don't meet expectations (as far as sales numbers).

This way it has a chance of selling enough to really entrench the idea in people's minds, even if it doesn't necessarily appeal to enthusiasts. I'm skeptic it'll pan out like that, but we'll see... I don't think anyone can really sell the type of ideal tablet device that people like us want today, not for $500... Not with a stylus input, and/or a camera, and/or more expansion ports (HDMI, SD slot, etc), and/or Flash support. For $700-800, maybe. The iPad is still overpriced at $500+ tho. ;)

QHalo said:
It just seemed a bit rushed to me. Seems as though they were just trying to get something out the door to compete and instead of competing they're just offering another weaker alternative. A really half-hearted attempt in my eyes. I'll still go down to the Apple store and look at one and play with it.
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That's exactly what I'm saying. It's ironic they're bagging on netbooks when it faces many of the same limitations (in some cases, a lot more of them)... For me, if I upgrade my netbook I'm grabbing a 11.6-13" CULV laptop ($500-800) that will do a ton more than an iPad... But even in it's current state I can see there's a market for a simpler device like the iPad, I just don't think it's anywhere near as big a market as they'd like it to be, not unless the price comes down by $200 or so.
 
Impulse said:
Too bad existing apps have to be re-written to scale properly! I'm not sure it'll achieve the kind of sales numbers needed to grab developer's attention.
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I haven't taken a look at the new SDK yet, but I have a feeling that porting apps over to the ipad isn't going to be particularly difficult if their goal is only taking advantage of the extra screen realestate (no extra features over the iphone/itouch version)... it's easy money for them.

I don't know, I'm pretty convinced that this thing will be a huge hit for apple, like it or hate it. I'm willing to bet that a good majority of iphone and itouch users are atleast interested in getting one. Seems like a great device for old people too lol my grandmother would probably welcome something like this over her desktop :D
 
bill gates- "my god, we didnt aim high enough after seeing the iphone"

bill gates- "win7 mobile will have less funtionality then the other major mobile os's, even our own previous version"

something doesnt make sense.....
 
AFAIK Gates doesn't have any say whatsoever into what goes into WinMo anymore ('least not in an official capacity), so his thoughts on the matter could be construed as those of an objective third party at this point. Heck maybe he was silently voicing his concern w/the direction WinMo is going in...

dr.stevil said:
I don't know, I'm pretty convinced that this thing will be a huge hit for apple, like it or hate it. I'm willing to bet that a good majority of iphone and itouch users are atleast interested in getting one. Seems like a great device for old people too lol my grandmother would probably welcome something like this over her desktop
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Oh I recognize there's definitely a market for this kind of simplified tablet-like device... I'm just not sure it's as large as some people would like to believe... 'Least not for the iPad itself. Hell I wouldn't mind if it explodes on the scene and forces more competition, wouldn't mind it at all, but I'm just not seeing it. I actually own an iPod touch myself, very happy with it (paid $280 for a 2nd gen 16GB) even tho I recognize it's probably overpriced... However I think the iPad is overpriced to a degree that actually prices it out of some of the markets in which it would work best.

Your own example is one such scenario imo, would your grandmother pay $500 for a tablet-like device she can't use to print the photos her grandchildren send her? (or to send the photos she herself takes?) She could buy a full featured laptop for the same amount of money... And if she already owns a regular laptop/desktop to do that, is she just the sort of wealthy consumer that would spend $500 on a couch/lounge device? See where I'm going?

There's definitely people out there that fit that description (young or old), I just don't think they're the same kind of mass market that's made the iPhone a success (or even the iPod touch).
 
the only good thing coming out of apple is the Mac OSX, once it opens it up legally, Apple branded pc's are dead.
 
Impulse said:
Heck maybe he was silently voicing his concern w/the direction WinMo is going in...
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i really hope so. if these rumors of what win7 will be are true, then microsoft deserves to be completely shelled out of the mobile market altogether. no multitasking and basically a web-based os? fuck you microsoft, we want windows 7 on our phones, not microsoft iphone os.
 
When it comes to tablet computing, right now, nothing is coming close to the new HP TouchSmart tm2. This this is BEYOND incredible. The more I play with it the more impressed I am. Hell, I've been playing Mass Effect 2 on this thing! And while the performance is very medicore, its more than playable for me, definately good enough to kill an hour at the air port.

Then when you're done with that, flip the screen over and start working on math home work, read Kindle and other format PC books, or just surf the web on a nice 12.1" 1280x800 multi-touch screen. 5 to 7 hours of batter life, a keyboard and web cam built in.

And its not a whole lot more money than an iPad, unless you go all out with 8GB of RAM or an SSD. The prices are changing all the time as HP runs different deals constantly but this thing just embarrasses an iPad.

Now the iPad is much lighter at 1.5 versus 4.5 pounds for sure (no keyboard, smaller screen and on pen) and would probably be a better run and go device for eReading, but a true general purpose mobile computing device its already IMHO been COMPLETELY out classed.

But as that third device that sits on a coffee table or an eReader or a touch enabled/accelerometer gaming device the iPad has a lot of promise. I't's going to sell well I think but it's going to be a bit muted until the price comes to down to <$300 I think.
 
krupted said:
i really hope so. if these rumors of what win7 will be are true, then microsoft deserves to be completely shelled out of the mobile market altogether. no multitasking and basically a web-based os? fuck you microsoft, we want windows 7 on our phones, not microsoft iphone os.
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I think that there are going to be different phones with varying degrees of flexibility. People bitch and complain about WinMo 6.x in part because it IS complicated. Look at the iPhone. Looked down and simple works for the VAST majority of people.

Know there are going to be people that need and want more and there's simply too much Windows CE heritage to simply lock it down the next Windows Mobile and walk away. For most people a locked down Zune Phone is perfect. That's going to be the the wife's next phone. I'll of course want something more open.
 
WinMo 6.5.3 is the first WinMo that isn't half bad. It's not necessarily the flexibility or whatever, it's just that it runs terrible on all the hardware it is meant to run on.

If there's anything MS should learn from Apple it's that your OS needs to take advantage of the specific hardware you're working with. For 90% of the public that will actually use it, it doesn't matter if the hardware sucks (and with Apple it usually does), as long as the OS is pretty and runs smoothly.

Like I said...It took MS up to 6.5.3 to finally get their act together at least a little bit. Too bad all the carriers are all over the place in implementing it (hacked HTC Titan FTW :D ).
 
gar818 said:
the only good thing coming out of apple is the Mac OSX, once it opens it up legally, Apple branded pc's are dead.
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People actually like the hardware, I certainly do. Even if I was only running Windows on a notebook it would still be on a Macbook Pro.
 
Serpico said:
People actually like the hardware, I certainly do. Even if I was only running Windows on a notebook it would still be on a Macbook Pro.
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The MBP is nice but there are some very good devices from PC OEMs these days. Hell my tm2 12.1" Tablet PC for the same price as a 13" MBP can game better and it a tablet PC to boot. Metal chasis, battery life, weight and screen resolution the same. The MBP is thinner overall but of course isn't tablet capable. HP, Sony and Dell have all released some VERY impressive machines as of late.
 
MBP's are impressive from a build quality standpoint, and as far as battery life (if paired w/Mac OS and you happen to leave it semi-idle for long stretches)... Other than that, meh. You always pay thru the nose w/Apple and your choices are always more limited. They've relegated themselves to their current role w/their laptops and desktops, I think the iPad serves that same niche market, but not much else (at it's current price, and w/it's current feature set).
 
heatlesssun said:
The MBP is nice but there are some very good devices from PC OEMs these days. Hell my tm2 12.1" Tablet PC for the same price as a 13" MBP can game better and it a tablet PC to boot. Metal chasis, battery life, weight and screen resolution the same. The MBP is thinner overall but of course isn't tablet capable.
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How did you equip it? The Top CPU option I see for the tm2 is 1.6Ghz, while the MBP starts at 2.26 GHz. Even the base non pro macbook has a 2.26 GHz core 2 duo.

I also note in the 12"-14.9" category on the HP site that the Tm2 is their lowest rated laptop.
 
I agree with gates as a full fledged input method anything touch based is going to be lacking.
 
Snowdog said:
How did you equip it? The Top CPU option I see for the tm2 is 1.6Ghz, while the MBP starts at 2.26 GHz. Even the base non pro macbook has a 2.26 GHz core 2 duo.

I also note in the 12"-14.9" category on the HP site that the Tm2 is their lowest rated laptop.
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As for the tm2 reviews if you look carefully I don't think that many of the older ones were actually tm2 reviews, the machine has only been available for less than a month. All of the newer ones that actually mention the tm2 by name are excellent.

Yes the MBP currently uses a regular Core 2 Duo, the tm2 uses the CD2 CULV because of the thermals, CULVs use less power and generate much less heat than a standard CD2. So in CPU intensive tasks the MBP will be a bit faster. However the tm2 has a dedicated GPU option so gaming on tm2 will overall be faster.

I've play a couple hours of Mass Effect 2 on the tm2 and while its far from a premium expense many will find it playable. At default settings which have only one option turned down from maximum setting and at native 1280x800 resolution I'm getting 24 FPS. That's very playable for ME 2. I don't think the MBP can do that with the 9400m GPU.
 
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