http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-102-397&depa=0 $459 right now, comes with VIVO functionaltiy and of course 16 pipelines at 500/500. Curious to know when/if HardOCP plans to do a X800XT vs 6800 GT review.
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X800XT available now at Newegg
- Thread starter MFZ
- Start date
No use closing the barn door after the cow has gotten out. This XT part was the part actually meant to be battling the ultra while the xt pe one was supposed to fight off the ultra extreme,which is as much vaporware as the xtpe is. However since the scenario changed now they are trying to position this card against the GT, still, a whole lot of people already made their choice, this card is about 50 bucks more expensive, and its all far too close to the next refresh to really make a difference. Still,might be a good choice for the people who do not care for SM3, OpenGL games or a simple functional driver set that doesnt take half your system ram to run. 
I doubt however,that any website will do a GT vs XT comparison, given that the x800 Pro was/is GT's true competitor, at least untill its price drops. And obviously when it does, so will the pro's,and so will the gt's,as new refreshes will be out.
My 0.2
I doubt however,that any website will do a GT vs XT comparison, given that the x800 Pro was/is GT's true competitor, at least untill its price drops. And obviously when it does, so will the pro's,and so will the gt's,as new refreshes will be out.
My 0.2
quicksilverXP
Gawd
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Whoever would do a comparison between the GT and the new X800XT lacks any form of business sense. I 'm pretty sure no esteemed site, such as Hard or Anandtech, would do it For one, ATI is extremely late in the game, offering the X800XT before the PE shows lack of product development (in this case with Newegg that is.... I'm hoping ATI refutes me by releasing the PE in mass availabilty before the XT, but I doubt that'll happen) as the PE was supposed to come out long before the regular X800XT for AGP was fathomed. Many GTs can be had for less than 399 now and they are mass produced. Its only a matter of time when ATI BEGINS to release their X800XT series... and by then Nvidia will have lowered their GT prices. Still though, 459 dollars for an MSRP of 399 is probably indicative of the price gouging that will probably happen once other sites attain X800XTs... since ATI just can't meet yields. Maybe they should've prolonged product development and kept to their original plan of only 12 pipelines? At least we would have a next gen ATI card.
CrimandEvil
Dick with a heart of gold
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It's about damn time ATi started to fill in it's product line but it sort of feels "alittle too late" but I'll wait for the reviews.
It should stack up like this:
6800 Ultra Extreme - X800 XTPE
6800 Ultra - X800 XT
6800 GT - X800 Pro
6800 - ?
So you shouldn't compare the XT to the GT since it won't be very fair to ATi.
Anandtech has/is doing it like that. It confused the hell out of me since ATi didn't have an AGP X800 XT at the time of many of those reviews. The newest ones don't have the XT in it.quicksilverXP said:
It should stack up like this:
6800 Ultra Extreme - X800 XTPE
6800 Ultra - X800 XT
6800 GT - X800 Pro
6800 - ?
So you shouldn't compare the XT to the GT since it won't be very fair to ATi.
quicksilverXP said:
Exactly...One could go as far as to say that the X800 XT was always meant to compete with the Ultra, but ATi realized that the Ultra was faster so they made the XT PE just to have higher numbers at benchmarks and such, even though it realized that it wouldn't be able to mass produce it since the 520mhz core was rare to come by. So once the initial numbers were out and the PE was already stablished by the press as Ultra's competition, they release this and hope that people that have been trying to get the PE will buy it and settle for less speed.
Heh, I wouldnt be surprised if they changed their speech now and claim that the PE was a limited series and do indeed discontinue it. It would be the right thing to do. IMO it's better than to claim to have a product that costumers cant really get a hold of.
CrimandEvil
Dick with a heart of gold
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Or they could just do what NV did with the Ultra Extreme.Andromeda said:
(Which is what they should have done from the beginning )fallguy said:
LOL you wish! Its not gonna happen... you can find the GT for less than 400 nowadays, and if ATI indeed gives this card the MRSP of 400, I can see a lot of angry x800 pro owners switching over to nvidia. Imagine this: You got a x800pro yesterday for 400, today they announce a superior product for the same price...what would you do? personally I'd call them an unstable company and never buy from them again. Even because this couldn't even be considered a refresh...just a really bad marketing move.
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MFZ said:
funny thing is a majority of the people bitching about this card have a 6800GT lol...looks like a good card, but to me a 6800NU is a steal of a deal
DASHlT
One could just as easily say the 6800 UE was announced as a counter to the XT PE. Fact is the PE is more readily available than a 6800 UE (nvidias top part that I don't think anyone owns) and the 6800 U hasn't exactly been easy to come by either. The only thing nVidia has had going for it is the 6800 GT, THAT IS IT. True ATi was stupid not to release the X800 XT sooner at a reasonable price but they are doing it now and I can almost guarantee that once supply reaches retail the MSRP will hit $399 or close to it. Keep in mind these cards that are for sale right now do offer VIVO functionality, something very few GTs (if any) do and early samples seem to have 1.6ns memory. No doubt as B3D speculated, they may add 2.0ns ram to them to cut the price down as production continues and maybe even remove VIVO functionality. BTW Toms Hardware already has the X800 XT in one of their reviews and it beats the stock 6800 GT in D3D games (esp. JO and BF:V) and is only slower in D3/COD (no surprise there).
Andromeda said:
Its called market progress, genius. X800 Pro is now an old card given that it was released in May so the X800 XT is a natural if not late progression. No reason for Pro owners to be upset, they were early buyers that chose that card even over a 6800 GT. If they do switch it would most likely be to an X800 XT. Its not hard to sell off an X800 and get back most of your cash. I've sold an X800 VIVO and got back what I paid for it. Like I said, look at all the negative posts in here and you see one common thing between most of them: they are 6800 GT owners--being insecure of your purchase is sad.
Andromeda said:
CrimandEvil
Dick with a heart of gold
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So the X800 XT is a refresh of the Pro? LOL
Why do you keep say the XT is stacked against the GT? Thats just ridiculous.
LOLWhy do you keep say the XT is stacked against the GT? Thats just ridiculous.
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CrimandEvil said:So the X800 XT is a refresh of the Pro?
Just use your head man, ATI knows the X800pro isnt as good as the 6800GT, also the X800pro has been out awhile now, So its time to release a new card...low and behold the X800XT to compete with the 6800GT. Are ATI owners of the X800pro will be pissed...of course, but its been what 3-4-5 months since the X800pro has been out? it will drop in price and the X800XT will take over the $400 range.
DASHlT
CrimandEvil said:So the X800 XT is a refresh of the Pro?
Why do you keep say the XT is stacked against the GT? Thats just ridiculous.
Because both are each companies 2nd tier part and they are 16 pipelines.
And no its not a refresh of the Pro, where did I say it was? I said it was a natural but late progression of what ATi should have done. The price is only high right now because the card is brand new, there's no doubt it will fall near the GT level. Even now for the extra cash it does offer VIVO which no doubt adds to its price. Lets see what happens in the next few weeks as newer XT's hit the retail channel.CrimandEvil
Dick with a heart of gold
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That doesn't make sense when viewed thru their product line up. What takes on the Ultra? What takes on the Ultra Extreme?
Everyone was talking about how the XTPE was positioned to take on the UE (both equally vaporware), so what happens with the other match ups? Doesn't make sense.
I'd say the X800 Pro VIVO (16 pipes) is a better replacement for the 12 pipe Pro and it can actually match the GT too.
Everyone was talking about how the XTPE was positioned to take on the UE (both equally vaporware), so what happens with the other match ups? Doesn't make sense.
I'd say the X800 Pro VIVO (16 pipes) is a better replacement for the 12 pipe Pro and it can actually match the GT too.
CrimandEvil said:
Who says their has to be an exact 1:1 matchup? The X800 XT PE was made to counter the 6800 U, not the UE which I don't think anyone has. You can find lots of people with an X800 XT PE so they're not "equally vaporware" except if you have nvidia !!!!!! goggles on. Here's how I see it:
6800 U vs X800 XT PE
6800 GT vs X800 XT (esp. once the initial price gouging goes down)
6800 vs X800 Pro (maybe but I still see the Pro being priced higher)
We'll have to wait and see what ATi does with the Pro. I think its pretty apparent they're going to shift it away from the $399 market but where they're going to price it is anyones guess. BTW was the 6800 UE ever an official nVidia product? I remember reading it was left up to board vendors to make that card by basically overclocking good core samples at a very premium price.
CrimandEvil
Dick with a heart of gold
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You said it here:MFZ said:
Using that logic what would a 9800 XT be? A "Progression of the 9800 Pro" or a refresh?
Believe that if you will but maybe you should complain to ATi since their the ones not sending out the XTPE. Anyways I don't understand why you feel so insecure with your ATi purchase to make such a statement
Yes they both are, I don't know why you even mention it.
Just as many people own UE as those who own XTPEs.
Funny since I know of a few places that have some Ultras but all the XTPEs are close to non existent.
Hell I'm just glad that both companies are offer some competitive parts (unlike the whole FX debacle).
If you wanted only pro ATi responses you should have posted this over at Rage3d or at the very least in the ATi subforum here. It's sad that you characterise anyone that disagrees with you as an "6800 GT owner," it makes you look childish. No one has bashed/flamed ATi so I don't understand some of your responses.
Please leave your fanatism at the door when entering [H]ardforum.
As for your line up, it doesn't make sense unless (in your words) you have !!!!!! goggles on. If thats the line up it just shows that ATi is disorganised and can't release a competitive product to NV's. It shows panic and a lack of confidence in their own products.
CrimandEvil said:You said it here:
Using that logic what would a 9800 XT be? A "Progression of the 9800 Pro" or a refresh?
X800 Pro owners would have nothing to complain about because this card has been released several months later. Its not like they bought their card last month and now all of a sudden the X800 XT is available. Not only that, but there were speculations of a X800 "GT" type of card long ago.
Ok that's just stupid, I'm not bashing a product release so I fail to see what it has to do with "insecure".
Just as many people own UE as those who own XTPEs.
Really, show me at least 1 person that you know who owns one. I can show you 10 that own an XT PE. Oh and to be clear, I'm not saying XT PE's were or are easy to find, but rather I've seen more people with one than a 6800 UE.
Doesn't sound like you're glad to me.
If you wanted only pro ATi responses you should have posted this over at Rage3d or at the very least in the ATi subforum here. It's sad that you characterise anyone that disagrees with you as an "6800 GT owner," it makes you look childish. No one has bashed/flamed ATi so I don't understand some of your responses.
I didn't expect pro-anything responses, this was a thread about product availability but of course it is 6800 GT owners mainly that came in and posted negative responses. Another member here confirms it so like I said, maybe it stems from insecurity over a video card which is sad.
The fact is this card should have been introduced 4-5 months ago to compete against the GT. However, ATi chose to use the Pro instead and this card seems more like a late entry than anything else so call it what you will. The point is its here now and can be purchased and will likely fall into the GT price range.
BTW if it were a lack of confidence in their product, I doubt they would have waited so long to introduce it, I think it was due more to greed on their part which I don't particularly like. They filled all their OEM orders first and now are giving enthusiasts their left-overs. Even so, people that waited this long can at least finally get one and hence the pt of this thread.
Im very happy with my XT-PE, and im happy with my 6800GT/OC, but the only game that the 6800GT runs as good and better then my XT-PE is Doom3, Try to play the new Medal Of Honor Demo thats out, Graphics Maxxed out on my XT-PE 1600X1200 6AA/16Anis, on the same setup and a 6800GT at Ultra levels you cant even use AA without it chopping occasionally.
Actually I think NV didnt plan the GT at all, untill the last minute. At least that was the rumor at the time. The 6800NU was to compete with the X800 Pro. I dont have any factual proof of this, just remember reading about it at the time from a few places.
The XT is going to be a good card, and even better when you can get it for $400. There really isnt a choice when trying to decide between the GT and Pro, if they are close to the same price. The GT I believe is an overall better card. The XT could very well be better than the GT in most games, we'll have to wait and see.
The XT is going to be a good card, and even better when you can get it for $400. There really isnt a choice when trying to decide between the GT and Pro, if they are close to the same price. The GT I believe is an overall better card. The XT could very well be better than the GT in most games, we'll have to wait and see.
I noticed it was OEM. At beyond3d (where the first news of the X800XT was that I saw) they made it sound like this is a card offered only by Sapphire. Supposedly the X800XT is the same thing as a X800 Pro Vivo... a 16 pipe card with 1.6 ns ram that couldn't cut the mustard at XTPE speeds. I haven't even heard this is an official ATI part. Just Sapphire seeing people enabling the extra 4 pipes on the pro vivo's and realizing they could enable them stock and charge a premium. Whatever the case maybe, it's a positive development for us as consumers. I would rather have an X800 XT 500/500 in hand than two XTPE's on backorder.
Actually Connect3D also has the XT so its not exclusive to Sapphire. I'm pretty sure all 3rd party board vendors will have an XT variant.
Jonsey said:I noticed it was OEM. At beyond3d (where the first news of the X800XT was that I saw) they made it sound like this is a card offered only by Sapphire. Supposedly the X800XT is the same thing as a X800 Pro Vivo... a 16 pipe card with 1.6 ns ram that couldn't cut the mustard at XTPE speeds. I haven't even heard this is an official ATI part. Just Sapphire seeing people enabling the extra 4 pipes on the pro vivo's and realizing they could enable them stock and charge a premium. Whatever the case maybe, it's a positive development for us as consumers. I would rather have an X800 XT 500/500 in hand than two XTPE's on backorder.
retardedchicken
2[H]4U
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i hope the xt is made to counter the 6800gt, i dont have an ati card now but i want to see them stay up with Nvidia so there is competition
people who buy the x800pros usually get the vivos to softmod anyhow(which is probably the only reason an educated buyer would get them) and if they just blindly get an x800pro(non vivo), well then they deserve to lose out of future performance
its good to see some of ati's higher cards are emerging out of the abyss now
people who buy the x800pros usually get the vivos to softmod anyhow(which is probably the only reason an educated buyer would get them) and if they just blindly get an x800pro(non vivo), well then they deserve to lose out of future performance
its good to see some of ati's higher cards are emerging out of the abyss now
WuTangClam
Limp Gawd
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I get the feeling that we're going to be seeing XTs from all the companies that have manufactured VIVOs in the past.
Apologenetic
Limp Gawd
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Quote: noticed it was OEM. At beyond3d (where the first news of the X800XT was that I saw) they made it sound like this is a card offered only by Sapphire.
BTW Visiontek also has one out, I ordered it 3 weeks ago before any knew (including me)there was a difference between the XT/XTPE and it still not delivered
BTW Visiontek also has one out, I ordered it 3 weeks ago before any knew (including me)there was a difference between the XT/XTPE and it still not delivered
More info on the topic (someone brought up OEMs, so I thoguht that this would be related)
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20040911023955.html
I'm just happy the prices are going down
Honestly, I don't think anyone would notice such a slight increase in clock speeds (between XT and XT-PE).
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/display/20040911023955.html
I'm just happy the prices are going down
Honestly, I don't think anyone would notice such a slight increase in clock speeds (between XT and XT-PE).
chuckm1020
[H]ard|Gawd
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i think its just weird how the radoen x800xt agp is $450 and the radeon x800xt pci express is at $700.