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X2 Build/memory question

L

LanceDiamond

Limp Gawd
Joined
Oct 11, 2005
Messages
361
I've read a lot of the information here and I want to build an AMD X2 soon and plan to OC. I think I understand most of the stuff - I've built more PCs than I've bought assembled, OC'd stuff in the past, Celeron 300a @ 450 and such. Actually I once ran an AMD 33Mhz 386 with a glass of water (water cooling circa 1990) on it @ 40mhz but I digress... :p

I am planning this:
Anten P180 case
OCZ 600W PSU (I like the adjustable voltage - I have a meter that measures to 5 decimal places, my voltages should be REAL tight!)
DFI LanParty SLI-DR
X2 4400 (I want the 1mb cache and this gets it and I think can be OC'd to 4800 specs?)
EVGA NVidia 7800GTX (the one that is stock OC'd - may go SLI later, thus the MB/PSU choices)
Zalman CNPS7700 cooler (XP90 instead? I actually can't remember right now why I wanted the Zalman instead of the XP90 lol...)

I want 2gb (2x1gb) of memory. What I dont understand is, do I need something other than PC3200?

I am thinking this memory:

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16820227210

It seems to have good timings and from the OCZ website, looks like it can take being over-volted a little if I need to. But do I need faster than PC3200 to get a 4400 running at say 2.4 or 2.5Ghz? I think my other memory options are Crucial or Mushkin. I actually have 1gb of PC3500 Mushkin in my current non-OC'd P4 (I didn't know what I was doing when I bought it lol) running at PC3200...

Ideas, thoughts, memory suggestions?

Thanks for all the great info here - I think I am close to knowing enough to not wind up with memory I don't need like I did when I built this P4 2 years ago! hehe
 
I just orderd this ram , it's not here yet so i can't tell you from my own experience how good it is but everyone especially (ef)eclipse thinks it's the best ram out. I hope he's right.
Click here

Good luck
 
I considered that memory too, but the OCZ has lower rated latency (3-4-4-8 versus 2-3-2-5 for the OCZ) and it's not clear to me that extra bandwidth is of greater benefit than lower latency.

Anand had an article some time ago about using the X2 with higher bandwidth memory:

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2469&p=8

The KEY part of the article I read in the "Final Words" section was this:

"These Athlon 64 and X2 cores that we have here today are far better suited for use with low latency and lower priced DDR400 than anything that offers higher bandwidth."

What I am thinking I'd shoot for is something where the RAM is running right near rated speed/latency - 200mhz - however I have to do the multis to get there. I bump the RAM a little - and the OCZ seems to be fine with higher voltages from what I've read - but I don't think I want to sacrifice latency to get more bandwidth based on that Anand article. I do realize that good PC4000 memory might make my OC a lot more flexible as I don't have to worry about keeping the memory at 200Mhz - I have at least 250Mhz to play with and likely more from bumping that memory past what it is rated at - but again, I am thinking lower latency PC3200 would be better than higher latency PC4000. And it doesn't look like it's too much of a problem to get the memory around 200Mhz by adjusting multis down if need be?

Did that make sense? Once I get my hands on a CPU, motherboard and some memory I am sure I can make more sense - just want to be sure I order the right stuff! :)

Thanks
 
Get the DDR 500. Somthing like Crucial Ballistix. I'm running 1:1 with my X2 right now. See Sig.
 
he wants LOW LATENCY...

I use a set of patriot LL modules... I got them pretty cheap before the other companies started making theirs. these are 2 3 2 5 stock... but do not overclock at all really.

But! I know OCZ has 2 3 2 5 sticks... and mushkin has 2 3 2 6 sticks I think.

Some people are able to actually run 2 2 2 5 with their OCZ LL sticks.

and I have heard some people running the ddr500 ballistix with low latency at ddr400. but I have these ballistix modules and I can tell you they are finiky as hell unless you have the right motherboard and are just looking to crank up the mhz, latency be damned.
 
I have the OCZ low latency PC3200, my system gets slightly better benches with less fsb and better ram latencies....hope that helps. I keep my ram at 200 (spec) with the tightest timings and I am better off than running it at CAS2.5 at higher speeds....
 
I've read up on Latency versus Bandwidth a bit more and I had thought I would go Low Latency, but now I think I'll go with the Ballistix PC4000.

To use a "cars on the highway" analogy, more bandwidth = more lanes and cars on the highway. Lower latency = cars moving faster. At some point (past PC3200) even though you have added more lanes to your highway, there aren't any more cars to put in those lanes due to whatever the bandwidth cap is. As far as I can tell from reading, there is some bandwidth limit with the X2 - the two cores seem to share the external memory bandwidth - but the limit seems to be well past PC3200.

It seems that the benefit of higher bandwidth (more lanes) becomes more pronounced as multi-tasking increases. I plan on running VirtualPC or VMWare occasionally - and VM apps are VERY multi-tasking focused. At some point the virtualization stuff will go into the OS - and there again, higher bandwidth will benefit.

Thanks for the excellent info here! :)
 
LanceDiamond said:
I've read up on Latency versus Bandwidth a bit more and I had thought I would go Low Latency, but now I think I'll go with the Ballistix PC4000.

To use a "cars on the highway" analogy, more bandwidth = more lanes and cars on the highway. Lower latency = cars moving faster. At some point (past PC3200) even though you have added more lanes to your highway, there aren't any more cars to put in those lanes due to whatever the bandwidth cap is. As far as I can tell from reading, there is some bandwidth limit with the X2 - the two cores seem to share the external memory bandwidth - but the limit seems to be well past PC3200.

It seems that the benefit of higher bandwidth (more lanes) becomes more pronounced as multi-tasking increases. I plan on running VirtualPC or VMWare occasionally - and VM apps are VERY multi-tasking focused. At some point the virtualization stuff will go into the OS - and there again, higher bandwidth will benefit.

Thanks for the excellent info here! :)
Click to expand...

You can't go wrong with Ballistix!!! I was able to push mine stable to 280mhz. ;)
 
LanceDiamond said:
I've read up on Latency versus Bandwidth a bit more and I had thought I would go Low Latency, but now I think I'll go with the Ballistix PC4000.

To use a "cars on the highway" analogy, more bandwidth = more lanes and cars on the highway. Lower latency = cars moving faster. At some point (past PC3200) even though you have added more lanes to your highway, there aren't any more cars to put in those lanes due to whatever the bandwidth cap is. As far as I can tell from reading, there is some bandwidth limit with the X2 - the two cores seem to share the external memory bandwidth - but the limit seems to be well past PC3200.
Click to expand...
good analogy, but there is a flaw. latency is not only dependant on timings, but mhz too. 3-3-3 at 280mhz is lower latency than 2-3-2 at 200mhz. you could get ocz EB too, which seems to be able to do 2.5-3-2 up to around 270-280mhz.

however, you are correct. ram speed barely effects performance. i advise good ram to overclockers who will enjoy pushing the stuff to the limit. if this is not something you will do, consider otherwise ;)
 
yeah ballistix rocks your socks if you have the right motherboard.
 
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