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Windows 7 and Wide Gamut

M

Mastakill

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
188
Is the issue FINALLY solved or does it still display wrong colors?

I know a wide gamut screen with a 24bit LUT will never be able to perfectly display all colors of RBG, but is it at least possible in windows 7 to let it show almost correct colors?

with that i mean offcourse in all apps, games, movies, whatever, without shitting around with settings and profiles for each different app...

and if this is not known yet (because of missing functionality in current drivers or something), then do the experts on this forum expect it to become fixed in windows 7?

and then finally also a little extra off-topic question: how about the linux kernel? will that ever support wide gamut in it's core?
 
Mastakill said:
Is the issue FINALLY solved or does it still display wrong colors?

I know a wide gamut screen with a 24bit LUT will never be able to perfectly display all colors of RBG, but is it at least possible in windows 7 to let it show almost correct colors?
Click to expand...

Some time ago, I wrote a mail to the official windows7 dev. blog (http://blogs.msdn.com/e7/), hoping for confirmation of rumors..

answer was:
"We haven't announced a feature like this. Sorry."
 
But you can change the windows color profile already i saw somewhere. Als in vista and xp this would be possible...
 
mcclane said:
But you can change the windows color profile already i saw somewhere. Als in vista and xp this would be possible...
Click to expand...

But you need colour aware applications to take know what to do with the profile. Most apps are not colour aware at the moment.
 
Most likely with the use of hdmi (xvYCC) deepcolor or with Displayport we will seem proper support for 30bit,36bit and 48bit (10-bit,12-bit and 16-bit respectively as apposed to 8-bit>24bit color .)

Until this is inplace the wide gamut displays might not but supported fully. The upside to the WCS (Windows Color System) is Windows 7 beta seems to allow the changing of the systrem wide default color profile to be changed not just the device profile for the monitor.

This ,in theory, will let you see images that do not have a embeded profile, or seen in a non color aware program still show accurate color if you have a profile other than sRGB loaded.

Idealy I'd check this out for you all since I have the Windows 7 beta, but I do not currently have either a camera to take AdobeRGB images or a wide gamut display.

But by the way it is looks If you ahve the properprofiles in the system, WCS will handle the colors properly.

Right now the only videocards that do more than 8-bit color output are the AMD/ATI FireGl and the Nvidia Quatro ones that have Displayport support built in.

I do not think the cards that have HDMI currently support xvYCC (Deepcolor) as they seem to be "single_link" and only support up to 1920x1200@60hz 8-bit as a max.

I know that the wide gamut displays don't need either Displayport or HDMI with higher bit depths to function but the support of wide gamut will likely be tied into these since any content using a larger colorspace than sRGB is not going to be off of the web in a browser but can be from future games or videos.
 
undermined said:
Most likely with the use of hdmi (xvYCC) deepcolor or with Displayport we will seem proper support for 30bit,36bit and 48bit (10-bit,12-bit and 16-bit respectively as apposed to 8-bit>24bit color .)

Until this is inplace the wide gamut displays might not but supported fully.
Click to expand...

The real problem is, even when that is available - none of the today monitors support anything other than 8 bit (with the exception of very high end monitors which makes the nec 2490 look dirt cheap). Adding extra bits will be great for future displays being able to both utilize wide gamut and perhaps keeping true native sRGB.
But I can't understand why they'd force out wide gamut before displayport :(
Displayport is here on a few graphic cards and a few monitors but they prefer to just fuck up the market anyway, granted added extra bits will probably cost a penny or two extra when manufacturing so thats probably why...

So todays wide-gamut monitors are not going to benefit from displayport or greather than 24 bit accuracy, more than that the problem might get recognized and that support for todays monitors will come naturally when support for "real" wide-gamut displays is available.

I've tried to investigate this in Windows 7 but so far I only have it in a virtual machine which isn't exactly ideal for this and I'm locked out from a lot of settings since it can't recognize my monitor. I might give it a real try but I'm afraid that I lack the knowledge to do it well and I don't have a calibrator.


I've gotten the impression that at least some think that windows 7 does do what we want us to in this regard - but unfortunately from pretty unreliable sources and the problem is that WCS also exists Vista - but it doesn't work the way we want it to. Support for wide gamut displays etc. doesn't mean much if the implementation requires that all applications are color aware (like it is today).
 
I'm somewhat sceptical about all new improvements in Windows 7 and especially something useful like a total colour management.
Windows are mostly used by eneterprises and people, who do not care for colours much, so... but maybe Microsoft will make finally a worthy replacement for Windows XP :)
 
I've been running win7 for almost 2 weeks now and it is a good OS...granted my hardware has always been good enough to run vista properly. I loved XP and this is a worthy replacement. The new taskbar is superior to any front-line application management system ever. After install boot time was 30 seconds. After 2 weeks of heavy use and installation of various programs this installation hasnt become bloated. I disabled gui boot and now my time is 22.8s. I love it
 
I doubt that W7 will address this issue. The install base for wide gamut monitors is just too small. I base this off web traffic on a busy web site I manage and the number of the monitor resolutions (almost all wide gamut monitors are wide screen) the install base probably less than 1% of users.

I just don't think there is a real market for it, yet. Add that to the fact that the average user doesn't even realize there is a problem and think they are getting more colors when things get oversaturated and you have no market incentive for MS or for their partners to push for it.

Given that Apple's OS sets the curve on color management, I would expect to see it there first then give MS a couple of years to do a broken version of it. ;)
 
There will indeed be high color as well as high DPI support in W7 as per Microsoft, one of the major upgrades over Vista and they do indeed work and coordinate with hardware vendors after all . To put it shortly, it is planned with the wider introduction of Displayport this year since DVI is limited and won't work much on high color. Recent upgrade of Displayport has it at 3840x2160x30bppx60hz or 2560x1440x36bppx120hz

zyfuio.jpg


see also this presentation from MS
http://download.microsoft.com/download/5/E/6/5E66B27B-988B-4F50-AF3A-C2FF1E62180F/GRA-T583_WH08.pptx
 
brumwald said:
The real problem is, even when that is available - none of the today monitors support anything other than 8 bit (with the exception of very high end monitors which makes the nec 2490 look dirt cheap). Adding extra bits will be great for future displays being able to both utilize wide gamut and perhaps keeping true native sRGB.
Click to expand...

The Panasonic Plasmas support xvycc:extended colour space and Deep Colour: expanded number of bits/colour to cover the extended colour space.
These sets are capable of over 5000 shades per colour, over 12bits per colour.
 
just about every new lcd tv comes with 10 bits and 120hz and W7 support for high color is just meant to provide a top spec for manufacturers to develop their products on
 
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