Windows 10 vs. Windows 8.1 vs. Windows 7 Performance

Ranulfo said:
Win10 and its free upgrade proves the old maxim, you get what you pay for. With all the data tracking, you are the product.
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Almost all of the data collection is tied to features and all but the basic telemetry can be turned off. Not really sure how an anonymous list of apps that run and basic crash data turn a Windows 10 user into the product.
 
Definitely use 10 if using a touch screen device otherwise 8.1 is more baked.
 
mi7chy said:
Definitely use 10 if using a touch screen device otherwise 8.1 is more baked.
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There are those who would argue exactly the opposite. With Version 1511 I'm pretty happy with touch in 10 though having things like volume and brightness is something I do miss a bit.
 
heatlesssun said:
Almost all of the data collection is tied to features and all but the basic telemetry can be turned off. Not really sure how an anonymous list of apps that run and basic crash data turn a Windows 10 user into the product.
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"Anonymous list of apps and basic crash data" = your speculation. Because Microsoft has not put in writing what EXACTLY gets collected. And MY speculation is they seem to be avoiding documenting what exactly gets collected at every setting, to avoid locking themselves into a position and to keep the blank check blank so they could change it anytime and without notice - read the EULA.

P.S. no offense but the way some people kneejerk-defend this data collection bullshit in 10, you'd think their MSFT stocks depended on it.
 
DPI said:
"Anonymous list of apps and basic crash data" = your speculation. Because Microsoft has not put in writing what EXACTLY gets collected. And MY speculation is they seem to be avoiding documenting what exactly gets collected at every setting, to avoid locking themselves into a position and to keep the blank check blank so they could change it anytime and without notice - read the EULA.

P.S. no offense but the way some people kneejerk-defend this data collection bullshit in 10, you'd think their MSFT stocks depended on it.
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Not sure where this comes from but Microsoft provides a lot of detail on what and when they collect data and the purpose. The basic telemetry for instance. They know what software is installed, hardware configuration and they get basic crash reports without the memory dump.

If something nefarious is going on it should only be a matter of time before it's discovered. Some disaster must be on the horizon. In any case this subject has become nearly useless to discuss because the anti-Microsoft crowd is just going to make up whatever and ignore the larger issue of privacy and security and ignore that most people are already sharing tons of personal data. As though somehow by simply not using Windows 10 people are "safe".
 
heatlesssun said:
Not sure where this comes from but Microsoft provides a lot of detail on what and when they collect data and the purpose. The basic telemetry for instance. They know what software is installed, hardware configuration and they get basic crash reports without the memory dump.

If something nefarious is going on it should only be a matter of time before it's discovered. Some disaster must be on the horizon. In any case this subject has become nearly useless to discuss because the anti-Microsoft crowd is just going to make up whatever and ignore the larger issue of privacy and security and ignore that most people are already sharing tons of personal data. As though somehow by simply not using Windows 10 people are "safe".
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Red herrings aside about "google totally does it too so just let it happen on your PC", and "you haven't proven that its nefarious", the bottom line is people want an OFF switch. This is very simple.

It's not about whether its nefarious or benign data being collected. Irrelevant. I don't care if its just crash report data and that's it, I want the option to turn it off on principle. Disabling CEIP was always a choice that respected the customer in prior Microsoft products. No reason not to give the customer the choice now, regardless of "hurr Google & Facebook duz it too"
 
BTW, gimme a break on the "anti-Microsoft" crowd. I realize they're an irritant to the people shipping 24/7 with their MSFT stocks depending on it, but if these so-called anti-Microsoft people are really so anti-Microsoft, why are they running MIcrosoft software, let alone for 25+ years?

Back to the straw man drawing board?
 
DPI said:
BTW, gimme a break on the "anti-Microsoft" crowd. I realize they're an irritant to the people shipping 24/7 with their MSFT stocks depending on it, but if these so-called anti-Microsoft people are really so anti-Microsoft, why are they running MIcrosoft software, let alone for 25+ years?

Back to the straw man drawing board?
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Again, this subject just goes nowhere fast. I've never argued against being able to turn off the basic telemetry. I just think the issue gets overhyped and is pretty much of no relevance to the average person. How can it be this mega important thing and have no consequences to a persons privacy? Not every issue needs to be dialed to 10.
 
heatlesssun said:
Again, this subject just goes nowhere fast. I've never argued against being able to turn off the basic telemetry. I just think the issue gets overhyped and is pretty much of no relevance to the average person. How can it be this mega important thing and have no consequences to a persons privacy? Not every issue needs to be dialed to 10.
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The Privacy issue isn't "every issue". And yes it needs to be dialed to 10, because it's the only way Microsoft ever bothers to pull their heads out and change anything. If I recall you downplayed the backlash against the start screen in 8, too. Funny pattern.
 
DPI said:
The Privacy issue isn't "every issue". And yes it needs to be dialed to 10, because it's the only way Microsoft ever bothers to pull their heads out and change anything. If I recall you downplayed the backlash against the start screen in 8, too. Funny pattern.
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So over hype everything that you think is wrong? And I long said that the Start Screen should be resizable but I didn't think it made Windows 8.x impossible to use on a non-touch device. Just because I don't over hype everything doesn't mean I don't see issues.

In the case of the telemetry some make it sound as if by using Windows 10 people will get their bank accounts drained and arrested by the NSA. It's getting dialed by some to 100 who were never this vocal about privacy before.
 
LOL @ heatlesssun! The NSA doesn't arrest people and Microsoft is data mining Windows 10 in order to have a more Google-like ability to see what users are doing with their computers so they can more effectively make money off of them. Sure they'll assist governments and junk at investigating people by making sure there's law enforcement access to the contents and activity of their computers, but that's been going on forever and is 100% okay since we need that level of access to catch criminals and put them in jail for their drug habits, speaking out against their government, or downloading nude photos from the internet. The scary part isn't that. It's just that Microsoft is now trying to be a "me too" data miner like Alphabet/Google or Facebook and that means their monetary earning model is something they're trying to change to match up with the new world of computing with highly visible, collectable activity.
 
If Microsoft is truly keeping the Windows 10 name and brand for a good while coming, I wonder about usefulness talking about "Windows 10 performance" and not Windows 10 1511 performance. That doesn't roll off the tongue like Windows 8.1 does though. Given that Windows 10 1511 was just released (and even Windows 10 generally), it's great to see performance is similar to prior versions. I'm not sure this was always the case in past versions of Windows near the RTM release. I enjoyed the TechSpot coverage. I didn't take issue with the NVMe usage but was glad they came back and also tested with SATA SSD. Great work!

I guess this is also me expressing confusion on what exactly Windows 10 1511 is. I don't think Microsoft has helped the matter. It doesn't seem like it is comparable to past Windows terminology, like Windows 7 SP1, Windows 8/8.1, Windows 8.1 Update, Update Rollup 1, etc. The closest I can think of is the Linux rolling release distributions. I'm not thinking Ubuntu or Debian either. Is it more like maybe Arch Linux?
 
ManofGod said:
That is not correct at all. You are confusing sleep mode with fast / hybrid boot mode. Fast boot fully powers the computer off 100%.
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Tell that to my toshiba laptop. I sure as hell don't hit sleep mode when shutting it down and leaving it for a month or two (or six), yet its using up battery power far more than it should if it was truly "off". I should pull the battery out from the laptop itself too test the battery levels after a month.

As for security/tracking issues in win10, if they were honest they would make it far far easier to turn this stuff off than they do.

Youtube personality and former MS employee on how to turn stuff off in win 10:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1kGMCfb2xw
 
ccman said:
I guess this is also me expressing confusion on what exactly Windows 10 1511 is. I don't think Microsoft has helped the matter. It doesn't seem like it is comparable to past Windows terminology, like Windows 7 SP1, Windows 8/8.1, Windows 8.1 Update, Update Rollup 1, etc. The closest I can think of is the Linux rolling release distributions. I'm not thinking Ubuntu or Debian either. Is it more like maybe Arch Linux?
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"1511" is simply the year and month abbreviated - 15 = 2015, 11 = November. Windows 10 1511 was code-named Threshold 2 but they don't seem to be using even that as an official title.
 
evilsofa said:
"1511" is simply the year and month abbreviated - 15 = 2015, 11 = November. Windows 10 1511 was code-named Threshold 2 but they don't seem to be using even that as an official title.
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I guess specifically my question is: is this a new version/release or just an update/service pack? If this wasn't the new Windows as a Service model, would this just be an update rollup, an Update, a service pack, a dot release, or a full release?

My experience was it acted like a Windows 8 to 8.1 style upgrade (multiple reboots, OOBE, re-introduction to Windows), but since the version number is 10.0.10586 up from 10.0.10240, the version number is like the Windows 8.1 Update from Windows 8.1.
 
ccman said:
I guess specifically my question is: is this a new version/release or just an update/service pack? If this wasn't the new Windows as a Service model, would this just be an update rollup, an Update, a service pack, a dot release, or a full release?
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It was released as a new ISO, and it also pushed out to Windows Update as a full OS upgrade. I guess you could call it a "service pack" if you long for some kind of parallel to older Windows releases.
 
evilsofa said:
"1511" is simply the year and month abbreviated - 15 = 2015, 11 = November. Windows 10 1511 was code-named Threshold 2 but they don't seem to be using even that as an official title.
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Thanks, I did not realize that before. I wonder if that is what they are going to go forward with even though it is not official? On another note, I have been using Windows 10 as my host OS since mind June and am really enjoying it. I like that it is faster than previous operating systems.
 
ccman said:
I guess specifically my question is: is this a new version/release or just an update/service pack? If this wasn't the new Windows as a Service model, would this just be an update rollup, an Update, a service pack, a dot release, or a full release?

My experience was it acted like a Windows 8 to 8.1 style upgrade (multiple reboots, OOBE, re-introduction to Windows), but since the version number is 10.0.10586 up from 10.0.10240, the version number is like the Windows 8.1 Update from Windows 8.1.
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This is where Microsoft marketing fails, as usual, with their naming. If you look on windows.com, there's no mention at all of the 1511 update. When I look up info on Redstone, it's reported as being the code name for the "next big update for Windows 10 after Threshold 2", so presumably it, too, will be officially nameless. Contrast that with the way Apple does its major updates for Mac OS X, by having official names like Yosemite and El Capitan; they can market the hell out of inspiring names like those.
 
ManofGod said:
Thanks, I did not realize that before. I wonder if that is what they are going to go forward with even though it is not official? On another note, I have been using Windows 10 as my host OS since mind June and am really enjoying it. I like that it is faster than previous operating systems.
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It is not faster than Win8, it is faster than Win7.
 
16GB here so wouldn't know. Got any benchmarks to prove it? I've seen other benchmarks and Win10 was not faster than Win8.
 
rezerekted said:
16GB here so wouldn't know. Got any benchmarks to prove it? I've seen other benchmarks and Win10 was not faster than Win8.
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Nope, doubt you'd see anything on the web for cheap tablets either. My anecdotal experience shows them loading my excel documents much faster.
 
evilsofa said:
This is where Microsoft marketing fails, as usual, with their naming. If you look on windows.com, there's no mention at all of the 1511 update. When I look up info on Redstone, it's reported as being the code name for the "next big update for Windows 10 after Threshold 2", so presumably it, too, will be officially nameless. Contrast that with the way Apple does its major updates for Mac OS X, by having official names like Yosemite and El Capitan; they can market the hell out of inspiring names like those.
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Apple can market them because there's been differences that are noticeable in almost every update. (code names wasn't mentioned until 10.2) It can be argued that Threshold 2 is the equivalent of 10.1 where really the only things that changed were things that helped performance a little or added things that should have been in 10.0.

It's extremely likely that Redstone won't be ready until late next summer, there's plenty of time to hype it up when they know more about what will be ready for it.
 
evilsofa said:
This is where Microsoft marketing fails, as usual, with their naming. If you look on windows.com, there's no mention at all of the 1511 update. When I look up info on Redstone, it's reported as being the code name for the "next big update for Windows 10 after Threshold 2", so presumably it, too, will be officially nameless. Contrast that with the way Apple does its major updates for Mac OS X, by having official names like Yosemite and El Capitan; they can market the hell out of inspiring names like those.
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Agreed.

I also get conflicting feelings about Microsoft's aims. They seem to want users not have to think about updates, along then lines of in ChromeOS, I couldn't tell you the last time my Chromebook updated (apparently I can if I enter dev mode). My Kindle Fire lets me know when updates have occurred through the notification area (it probably restarted on its own), but updates get applied on their own without my intervention. On the other hand, the Upgrade to Windows 10 1511, 10586 wasn't that. It took you through multiple reboots, the progress dashboard circles, and reintroduced Windows 10 to me (I'm putting aside that some settings changed due to a bug and CPU-Z was reportedly uninstalled). The messaging I heard from Microsoft was also that Windows 10 is now enterprise ready with this update and that those that are waiting for "SP1" can move forward. If they are adding featured along the way, then updates do matter to some extent.

I can't think of an operating system currently that handles things the way Windows 10 does. Microsoft is carving a new path. I don't have experience with Android, but the platform fragmentation and stories I've read indicate that Google, the service provider, the phone manufacturer, and the end user all can stop an update. With iOS, you have to pick to install updates and Agree to the license agreement before the update runs. I've tried the setting to auto-update, but updates still require my intervention in my experience. Mac OS X requires user intervention (click Install or Install All). To my knowledge, Apple hasn't forced their updates. Linux varies with the distribution.

So the messaging I get is that Microsoft doesn't want you to have to think updates. Except if you're a user of previous versions of Windows: you need to know about all the features you're missing. Except if you're a Windows 10 user: you need to know about the new features that were added and need to be re-introduced to Windows. (iOS does the reintroduction thing too with major updates).
 
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