Why do Cisco devices usually include IP-Base IOS instead of Universal or IP-Services?

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scharfshutze009

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I purchased about 12 refurbished Cisco switches so far, which include 3560's, 3560v2's, and 3750v2's and they all had an IP Base License or IOS instead of Universal or IP Services. My question is why? This has made it very difficult for me to get the IOS I need to do labs without being a Cisco partner or having a valid license for what I want to use or need to use. Yes you can do current labs with legacy IOSes if you know when to use legacy command, like VTP mode 2 instead of 3 if not other legacy commands, but it's a real hassle and probably not what Cisco intended even if it is possible except with IP Base IOSes. That is my problem to all the switches I bought came with IP Base IOSes and I can't do what I need to do with them even if I can update or upgrade the licence to IP services or better. What am I supposed to do about this though because I didn't think is it was possible to update or upgrade from IP Base to anything else directly and I used an alternate method.
 
I don't really understand your post/question...?

Cisco sells the switches with basic licensing. Advanced features requires purchasing the licensing capabilities - this includes L3 routing on switches.
 
Cmustang87 said:
I don't really understand your post/question...?

Cisco sells the switches with basic licensing. Advanced features requires purchasing the licensing capabilities - this includes L3 routing on switches.
Click to expand...

I didn't buy them from Cisco though I bought them refurbished from a Cisco partner.
 
1: Your "cisco partner" is not supposed to be selling Cisco items refurbished like that.
2: Cisco as a company is going to tell you to fuck off if you try to enlist their help because you do not have smartnet, they will not replace those items under the limited lifetime warranty because you were not the original purchaser of the switches.

When i ran into this our Cisco rep called this "cisco black market". They just laughed and sent a quote for a new 6509.


You are basically fucked unless you can find someone that has access to those IOS's that you need. The company you purchased them from "might" be able to get you a copy, but i doubt it.
 
thrash408 said:
1: Your "cisco partner" is not supposed to be selling Cisco items refurbished like that.
2: Cisco as a company is going to tell you to fuck off if you try to enlist their help because you do not have smartnet, they will not replace those items under the limited lifetime warranty because you were not the original purchaser of the switches.

When i ran into this our Cisco rep called this "cisco black market". They just laughed and sent a quote for a new 6509.


You are basically fucked unless you can find someone that has access to those IOS's that you need. The company you purchased them from "might" be able to get you a copy, but i doubt it.
Click to expand...

Thanks I knew there was a disadvantage to buying refurbished, which is why I never bought them before. However, it's all I can afford right now and I bought them through Newegg too. I was just wondering if I can contact the seller and have them upgrade the switches to IP Services or Universal from IP Base officially because I can't.
 
Not sure if they will or can do that. When i ran into this it wasn't about trying to get a specific IOS, it was a line card died in a 6500. When we called (it was covered in LLW), cisco would not honor it due to the fact the card had been registered to a different corporation.
 
thrash408 said:
Not sure if they will or can do that. When i ran into this it wasn't about trying to get a specific IOS, it was a line card died in a 6500. When we called (it was covered in LLW), cisco would not honor it due to the fact the card had been registered to a different corporation.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'm not sure what my situation is. I guess I should call Cisco or the seller.
 
scharfshutze009 said:
I purchased about 12 refurbished Cisco switches so far, which include 3560's, 3560v2's, and 3750v2's and they all had an IP Base License or IOS instead of Universal or IP Services. My question is why? This has made it very difficult for me to get the IOS I need to do labs without being a Cisco partner or having a valid license for what I want to use or need to use. Yes you can do current labs with legacy IOSes if you know when to use legacy command, like VTP mode 2 instead of 3 if not other legacy commands, but it's a real hassle and probably not what Cisco intended even if it is possible except with IP Base IOSes. That is my problem to all the switches I bought came with IP Base IOSes and I can't do what I need to do with them even if I can update or upgrade the licence to IP services or better. What am I supposed to do about this though because I didn't think is it was possible to update or upgrade from IP Base to anything else directly and I used an alternate method.
Click to expand...

Well, older Cisco switches don't have a "Universal IOS". That's a relatively new concept. Your 3560's probably don't. And yes, Cisco moved to a license (file) model because it was easy to download whatever IOS you wanted. Features were on the honor system. Those days are gone now.

You could technically upgrade the 3560 to IP Services with just a different IOS, but it wouldn't be legit.
 
scharfshutze009 said:
I purchased about 12 refurbished Cisco switches so far, which include 3560's, 3560v2's, and 3750v2's and they all had an IP Base License or IOS instead of Universal or IP Services. My question is why? This has made it very difficult for me to get the IOS I need to do labs without being a Cisco partner or having a valid license for what I want to use or need to use. Yes you can do current labs with legacy IOSes if you know when to use legacy command, like VTP mode 2 instead of 3 if not other legacy commands, but it's a real hassle and probably not what Cisco intended even if it is possible except with IP Base IOSes. That is my problem to all the switches I bought came with IP Base IOSes and I can't do what I need to do with them even if I can update or upgrade the licence to IP services or better. What am I supposed to do about this though because I didn't think is it was possible to update or upgrade from IP Base to anything else directly and I used an alternate method.
Click to expand...

As others have already said and pointed out, there are disadvantages to buying used Cisco equipment. What they havent mentioned is the advantage of lower cost. Here's the thing and I can tell you this since my company purchases Cisco equipment from a Legit Cisco Authorized seller. Unless you you are the original owner ( or part of a company that is the owner) of the equipment that you are trying to get TAC support, IOS upgrades, support, or anything else related to the equipment you have then you are SOL. I don't mean to harsh, but also being a person that buys used Cisco equipment for my own purposes I know how it feels. Especially since where I work I do have Cisco equipment that I currently have SMARTNet support on. I have close to 48Us worth of equipment at my home that is all Used for my Cisco Cert labs I cant get one lick of support, downloads, or even ask an official Cisco Engineer a question about since I am not the original owner even though I have TAC support and SMARTNet for my work devices.

Cisco's official word on their used equipment is that there is no such thing as used equipment or "grey market". grey market is where you can buy used equipment and still get support or software patches for equipment. Used Cisco equipment is more of a "Black Market" with shades of grey since its not too hard to find used equipment for sale. If you ever read the agreement terms when you buy New Cisco equipment from an authorized seller such as CDW or Ingram-Micro, it tells you that the licenses are non-transferable and you are not allowed to re-sell their equipment without their explicit authorization ( which you wont get) and that you are in violation of the agreement if you do. So basically the only legal way for all companies that buy new Cisco equipment and you want to replace the aging devices 5-10 years down the line you must return it to Cisco, destroy it, or keep it. That includes the company I work for as well. You could give it away and not violate the re-selling rule they have, but technically the software on the device is not valid since its not transferable. The same goes for their APs, Phones, HWIC cards, DSP modules, Memory, Compact flash storage, ISM Modules, and AIM cards.

I can also tell you that if you attempt to contact the seller and ask if they can upgrade the IOS to something newer or the iP Services version, they will most likely tell you they cant. 2 years ago I bought a used Cisco 3750G-24PS-E switch for $800 for my home lab. Expensive as hell, but I wanted the PoE and the IP Services IOS feature-set.

Sorry for the long reply, but I am on both sides of the CIsco wall and can see both sides of it. The main reason people dont like Cisco is because of the price and the non-transferable polices. The main reason people like Cisco is because all their equipment runs like tanks and you hardly see them die. There is still a 1721 and 2621XM router at my office that they purchased new long before I was there that still works to this day. Its part of the little lab I built now since they are no longer mainstreamers.
 
And Thats why there is an big marked for "pirated" IOS's, I to have the issue with my Cisco lab setup.
 
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