Who has used bare metal restore programs for servers...input?

[YeOldeStonecat]

I've never used any bare metal restore for desktop or servers before....
I have one client, with a Small Business Server 2K3 Standard, it's been running on an old old Dell PowerEdge SC600 wannabe server...(was there before I took over as their IT). More like a glorified desktop, early Pentium 4, pair of IDE hard drives doing software RAID....all sorts of "yuck".

Client is a non-profit org, hardly much of an IT budget. They were donated a 3 year old HP Proliant ML350 G3. Xeon, 5x hot swap scuzzer drives on..oh, RAID 431 controller or something like that..pretty decent rig.

Due to the setup of this non-profit...a wide area network with lots of remote users, laptops, I really cannot do a server rebuild, and I think even the SwingIT migration kit would would be rather time consuming and troublesome...so I'm looking for options to make a quick transfer of this server to new physical hardware. I tried doing the VMWare server for Windows...with the "P to V" client...to pull the existing server into a virtual server. But it errors out all the time.

So has anyone had experiences to share with these bare metal restore dealios?

 

[SJConsultant]

We have used Acronis with Universal Restore to migrate physical to physical , physical to virtual, virtual to physical, etc. With the latest version of Acronis, they have the option to convert a TIB file into a Vmware or Microsoft Virtual machine file or you could use Vmware's P2V tool to convert the Tib to a Vmware machine.

The main sticking point of using these software products for migration to new hardware is getting the system booted to install the drivers for the new hardware which at times can be troublesome.

We've done P2V with Vmware quite a few times including SBS and never had problems with the process. I'd dare say that if your having problems P2V'ing, there may be underlying problems that may kill your chances of migrating from one hardware to another.

In fact, isn't the point of the Swing Migration to get away from problematic installs?

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Yeah I'm curious about how the bare metal restore functions when you're using completely different hardware. Such as in this case...an OS that's on a software RAID IDE setup, to hardware RAID. Guessing there may be a preinstall to shove the drivers in? But how can you plan that on the emergency disaster recovery?

Not sure what's causing the P2V to fail, I posted a while ago in the networking forum...she seemed to get around 30% or so..and then tank out.

I agree with your thoughts...if the P2V is failing...perhaps a bare metal restore would too.

They don't have the budget to pull a full SwingIT migration....budget is more a quick overnight thing, not a several weekend dealio.

 

[requiemnoise]

Moving to different hardware in NT based system is very difficult. For workstations, I had 95% success with Sysprep in the past. It removes HAL and replays the plug and play like a new machine. Servers can be very difficult, since Sysprep was designed for workstations. Since, this is a software raid, you got another headache to deal with. You have to break the software raid before imaging. If you are restoring from the tape, I usually do a fresh install and manually overwrite based on the date and time. Then, I compare the difference of registry from fresh and old only on the software key section, not hardware or the OS and restore from there. That is why monolithic kernels are very hard to manage or migrate. Having certain level HAL running at the lowest level is great for gamers, but for the enterprise, it is ridiculous.

 

[requiemnoise]

Oh, if you are only doing the Vmware migration, break the software raid before using the software migration tool.

 

[SJConsultant]

Yeah I'm curious about how the bare metal restore functions when you're using completely different hardware. Such as in this case...an OS that's on a software RAID IDE setup, to hardware RAID. Guessing there may be a preinstall to shove the drivers in? But how can you plan that on the emergency disaster recovery?

We've moved from Intel to AMD and back to Intel, single proce to dual proc and back, in my experience the most difficult issue will be when you go to boot a migrated Domain Controller. It may take 15 to 30 minutes before you get to a login screen since the "new" machine NICs are not correctly configured for the OS.

Not sure what's causing the P2V to fail, I posted a while ago in the networking forum...she seemed to get around 30% or so..and then tank out.

I agree with your thoughts...if the P2V is failing...perhaps a bare metal restore would too.

They don't have the budget to pull a full SwingIT migration....budget is more a quick overnight thing, not a several weekend dealio.

If it's a quick overnight thing, then what you can do is:

1. Use the latest version of Acronis and grab an image of their current system
2. In your office at your leisure, try converting the TIB image using either Acronis or Vmware P2V tool to Vmware on the destination machine.
3. Once you have it converted, then you can figure out what you'll need in terms of drivers, reconfiguration, etc.
4. Document, document document,
5. On a scheduled weekend, perform your actual migration.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

Oh, if you are only doing the Vmware migration, break the software raid before using the software migration tool.

<===Doesn't know much about VMWare, but perhaps that was tanking the P2V? I could always break the mirror and try that again.

 

[requiemnoise]

We've moved from Intel to AMD and back to Intel, single proce to dual proc and back, in my experience the most difficult issue will be when you go to boot a migrated Domain Controller. It may take 15 to 30 minutes before you get to a login screen since the "new" machine NICs are not correctly configured for the OS.

If this is a domain controller, he is better off adding a temporarily new nic during the migration and move the nic to the new and change the nic once he is on the new machine. There will be a less conflict between SID to NIC. However, the main issue is the storage controller if this is a HARD metal migration. The best thing to do is make sure the old machine has the drivers for the new storage controller. This can get tricky based on the manufactures. Since, the OS will not query the main controller during the boot cycle in Monolithic kernel in order to boot faster. If the OS no longer knows its controller, it will query if it is a generic controller. That means the drivers have to be in the cab database. One way out of this is insert the drivers on the SP driver cab, not the main driver cab.

Anyway, good luck. I never do a overnight server migration during the weekdays. It is too much stress.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

We've moved from Intel to AMD and back to Intel, single proce to dual proc and back, in my experience the most difficult issue will be when you go to boot a migrated Domain Controller. It may take 15 to 30 minutes before you get to a login screen since the "new" machine NICs are not correctly configured for the OS..

Yeah I figure the first bootup will take a while...the usual "I can't find DNS" stuff.

Guess I'm wicked curious on how it handles the hardware part....going from IDE to a SmartArray SCSI RAID controller..I'd expect a nice stop 7b early in the boot.

Good thought about giving Acronis a try, I think I forgot seeing somewhere that VMWare had the ability to pull in a VM from an Acronis image.

 

[YeOldeStonecat]

I never do a overnight server migration during the weekdays. It is too much stress.

Yah same here....when I said overnight..I didn't mean a weekday. //knock on wood....haven't had a server job tank on me, but I still want some "wiggle room" if one does, so a client isn't out of production, so I usually tackle one of these on a Fri-Sat.

 

[SJConsultant]

If this is a domain controller, he is better off adding a temporarily new nic during the migration and move the nic to the new and change the nic once he is on the new machine.

If he migrates to VMware (which BTW is how I was suggesting in my post) a temporary NIC will be a moot point.

There will be a less conflict between SID to NIC.

SID to NIC? Care to elaborate on that? Never heard of that one.

Good thought about giving Acronis a try, I think I forgot seeing somewhere that VMWare had the ability to pull in a VM from an Acronis image.

Yes, Vmware's P2V tool will create a virtual machine from an Acronis TIB file. The machine can be ported to Vmware Workstation, Server, even ESX.

More recently, Acronis included the ability to port from a backup image to either Vmware or Microsoft Virtual PC/Server formats.

 

[requiemnoise]

Yeah I figure the first bootup will take a while...the usual "I can't find DNS" stuff.

Guess I'm wicked curious on how it handles the hardware part....going from IDE to a SmartArray SCSI RAID controller..I'd expect a nice stop 7b early in the boot.

Good thought about giving Acronis a try, I think I forgot seeing somewhere that VMWare had the ability to pull in a VM from an Acronis image.

You don't want to use Acronis for moving to different machine unless it has been Syspreped. You want to use direct RAW imaging if sometype of conversion must take place. Something like dd. Qemu virtual machine has a tool to read and convert raw image to whatever you want, but it has to be a pure RAW image. However, Vmware converter can take care of all these issues.

There are many ways, but non of them will be smooth and easy.

 

[requiemnoise]

If he migrates to VMware (which BTW is how I was suggesting in my post) a temporary NIC will be a moot point..

I was giving him few options if the virtualization wasn't an option.

SID to NIC? Care to elaborate on that? Never heard of that one.

It is just a nature of Domain Controller for NT system. Other machines will seek out that NIC. Devices in the domain have a machine SID. There are other SIDs but we don't need to go into it here.

Yes, Vmware's P2V tool will create a virtual machine from an Acronis TIB file. The machine can be ported to Vmware Workstation, Server, even ESX.

I didn't know that was a new feature in Vmware converter. I always used the Qemeu's feature or the live migration.

If you change your mind, and becomes the HARD metal migration to a different machine. There is a BARTPE tool that able to inject drivers to a cab using a livexp cd. I just can't remember that app's name.

 

[SJConsultant]

You don't want to use Acronis for moving to different machine unless it has been Syspreped.

Acronis has a Universal Restore which will take care of HAL, disk, and driver updates.

We've used it plenty of times to know that it works without sysprepping.

 

[SJConsultant]

It is just a nature of Domain Controller for NT system. Other machines will seek out that NIC. Devices in the domain have a machine SID. There are other SIDs but we don't need to go into it here.

Well if its a problem that will come up in a migration, please elaborate since it is pertinent to the topic. I've never heard of "SID to NIC" issues, nor run into any problems.

So if you've got information, please post it here so that others may learn.

 

[ilmickeyli]

Is Server 08 DC edition the only one I wont have activation issues with?

I tried to go P2V and put them on my ESX box (for DR) -- but couldnt boot the machines due to activation. (Running 03 std and enterprise)

I really dont want to have to iron out a "gold image" on 08 DC, and install everything else.. But I don't know what else to do

Really want this DR plan in stone so my arse is covered..

 

[requiemnoise]

Well if its a problem that will come up in a migration, please elaborate since it is pertinent to the topic. I've never heard of "SID to NIC" issues, nor run into any problems.

So if you've got information, please post it here so that others may learn.

He can create a new sid later, but it is more to do with a licensing in DC. Since, licensing is usually maintained by the DC. He can always manually adjust SID and readjust his licensing later. I didn't indicate the machine will crash due to a missing NIC.

There are various SIDs. I can't really listed them all here based on my memory, but certain SIDs are associated actual hardware description of the machine such as Incoming Forest Trust Builders and Terminal Server License Servers.

 

[requiemnoise]

Acronis has a Universal Restore which will take care of HAL, disk, and driver updates.

We've used it plenty of times to know that it works without sysprepping.

I didn't tried this app before. It looks interesting. I always tried to look for a free solution. More money in the pocket or less money to beg to do a project.

 

[SJConsultant]

He can create a new sid later, but it is more to do with a licensing in DC. Since, licensing is usually maintained by the DC. He can always manually adjust SID and readjust his licensing later. I didn't indicate the machine will crash due to a missing NIC.

There are various SIDs. I can't really listed them all here based on my memory, but certain SIDs are associated actual hardware description of the machine such as Incoming Forest Trust Builders and Terminal Server License Servers.

The more information you put here, the more I'm inclined to see that you really don't know what your talking about. Never have I read anything about "Sid to NIC" problems as you indicated earlier, now your talking about adjusting SIDs and Licensing which I've again never heard of in doing migrations except in the case of preventing duplicate SIDs when cloning.

But please, post links to where someone may be able to read about these "issues".

 

[requiemnoise]

The more information you put here, the more I'm inclined to see that you really don't know what your talking about. Never have I read anything about "Sid to NIC" problems as you indicated earlier, now your talking about adjusting SIDs and Licensing which I've again never heard of in doing migrations except in the case of preventing duplicate SIDs when cloning.

But please, post links to where someone may be able to read about these "issues".

This is the reason, I get agitated by this site. You want me to spend my time go through my books and scan the pages for you? I believe it was on "Microsoft Windows Server 2003 Inside Out." I will also look for links if the TIME allows. Fact that you weren't least a bit concerned about his mass controller migration, I wonder about you too.