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What really constitutes a web server?

S

Strahan

n00b
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
47
I was reading a discussion on another forum and someone said they once ran a web server off of a router, to which another person replied:

"And no, you did not run a web server on an old router. I don't even know where to begin with this one. Routers have so little RAM the web server would not even be able to run, not to mention the CPUs are not designed for such things to be ran on them, usually they are hardware specific so not only would the code not even run but you would never get it to run.

Web servers use a LOT of RAM, and old routers have no more than 8-16MB of RAM, only newer ones have any more than that (and it's usually no more than 46MB or so). The web server couldn't even initiate with so little.

Not to mention the clock speed, older routers run anywhere from 20MHz to 70MHz. Only newer ones run higher, but even then only between 100MHz and 200MHz."


After some back and forth bickering, it was said (in reply to the quoted bit):


"So you're basically saying that if someone hosts a website on a small VPS using a web server software, and it only serves a few pages/handles a few hundred to a few thousand requests over a week or so, that it's not a web server?"

No, because they are using web server software, not displaying a .html document via http access.

Web server:
Client > website/IP > web server software > web pages

Not a web server:
Client > website/IP > publicly accessible .html file that displays a web page with links

You can host a website without server software.

IMO, if a piece of software listens for a network connection and responds to properly formatted requests and sends back HTML data, it's a web server. The web configuration ability inherent in most routers I would call a built in "web server". Sure, it's not a web server that you can put your own content on (unless you edit the firmware), but the firmware does contain a filesystem with pages that are served and the router runs code to handle the requests. I don't see how that functionality doesn't count as a web server.

...or am I off base and not understanding something?
 
Someone misunderstood what a web server is. The router does not *host* the web server, it is merely an appliance that sits between the machine running the web server and the internet/other network.

Some routers have a GUI 'web server' that is used for router management, but hosting web sites is the duty of a standard server/desktop machine, not the router.
 
It really depends. Technically your router does run a webserver (opening http://192.168.1.1 displays a web page that is served up by the router).

You can run a webserver on just about anything you want (desktop, raspberry_pi, cell phone...) For light traffic it will hold up just fine.

Now if you are trying to run a large, high-traffic, website you will need something more beefy.
 
The idea wasn't whether or not it's a good idea, rather whether or not it's valid to state that the router has what can be described as "web server" functionality in that it technically is a web server (it serves web content). My Netgear router, if you telnet to it on 80 and do a GET / HTTP/1.1 for example, has the following header:

HTTP/1.0 200 OK
Server: uhttpd/1.0.0
Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 00:41:30 GMT
Cache-Control: no-cache
Pragma: no-cache
Expires: 0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Connection: close

It said "uhttpd" server in there, which to me is pretty conclusive. Sure, it's not a web server you can use or would really want to, but it still has a web server in it by the common definition of one, wouldn't you say?
 
Yeah most routers these days could be classed as web servers. If something is running apatcheor similar software then it is a web server.
 
Dogs said:
Everybody in that thread is most likely an idiot. Just remove the memory of ever even reading that thread from your brain and move on with your life.
Click to expand...

++ The mine craft bit gave it away. It was funny to see fm87 get trolled, shame he was too dumb to take anything on board.

A webserver is anything that can respond to a http request, still pointless argument without context.
 
if you can connect to it via http and it is capable of serving html pages to you via http then as far as i'm concerned it's a webserver.
 
serpretetsky said:
if you can connect to it via http and it is capable of serving html pages to you via http then as far as i'm concerned it's a webserver.
Click to expand...

Pretty much this. Scale of the site doesn't enter into it. If it meets the above requirements, its a web server.
 
Todays routers are probably more powerful than the web servers the internet ran on in the mid 90's
 
serpretetsky said:
if you can connect to it via http and it is capable of serving html pages to you via http then as far as i'm concerned it's a webserver.
Click to expand...
I would argue that it's a web server if it's capable of responding to any HTTP request by sending any type of content. Some web servers may exist solely to send XML- or JSON-formatted data, for instance.

Naturally, any architecture capable of serving XML/JSON is probably also capable of sending HTML, so it's a bit of a moot distinction.
 
If a machine exists on a network that is capable of serving HTTP requests, but there is no one on the network and there will never be anyone to use it, is it a web server?
 
aL Mac said:
If a machine exists on a network that is capable of serving HTTP requests, but there is no one on the network and there will never be anyone to use it, is it a web server?
Click to expand...
Yes, and it may be the most stable and/or secure web server out there ;)
 
robvas said:
Todays routers are probably more powerful than the web servers the internet ran on in the mid 90's
Click to expand...
Not quite.
Strahan said:
What really constitutes a web server?
Click to expand...
It's pretty simple: any service (and the machine(s) hosting them) that listen for HTTP and/or HTTPS requests and respond to them directly. (A web proxy would respond to the requests indirectly.) I wouldn't expect to find a definition like this on a MineCraft forum, though.
 
Last edited:
Blackjack988 said:
Pretty much this. Scale of the site doesn't enter into it. If it meets the above requirements, its a web server.
Click to expand...

There are web servers out there running on C64's, TTL chips, 386/486's (I've been there). I believe some guy even did a wire wrap PC running as a web server. It doesn't take much for a very basic web server.

A router could easily do a simple web site. Most of them do, anyway.
 
A web server can response to http requests.

Honestly I think it is hilarious someone says a router is not a web server...just about every consumer router hosts a website for configuration....
 
opo0gn.jpg
 
Read the minecraft forum thread linked by the OP (curiosity, I guess). It's pretty clear that the fm87 poster has no clue what he is talking about. His arguments are suffering from a massive case of the 'no true scotsman' fallacy. Don't lose sleep over it.
 
Yea, that's why I stopped even trying. I figured nothing I can say would help. I could probably get a letter from Cisco's CTO stating their routers have web server capability and it would be explained away heh.

Being no expert myself though I figured I'd get an objective opinion on whether or not my assertions were actually valid. No sleep lost :)

Thanks for the opinions all.
 
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