WC Worth it?

A

Alex41290

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Feb 20, 2004
Messages
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Hi all, I am wondering, with my setup, is watercooling worth it? Yes, I would overclock, and couldn't I just buy an adapter for future upgrades? I have been looking around and researching watercooling for like 4 months now, and I'm thinking Christmas for my WC setup...if you think its worth it. I might upgrade next year or something, so would the $200 price tag be worth it? I am getting new RAM (the mushkin) so i should be able to OC higher than now, cuz this sh!t is holding me back.

Well, I was looking at this setup:

Maze 4 w/ Copper Top
Maze 4 GPU Black
Black Ice Micro II Black (i want an 80mm one, but my case is gay: http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-146-001&depa=0 look at the pic of the back...the 80mm fan slots are offcentered...whoever designed this should be shot)
D4 12V Pump
7 Feet Clear Flex Tubing
DD 5.25" Res.
12 Hose Clamps

Is there a reason this is $271? or does this sound reasonable? Any suggestions for cheaper? I dont' really want a heatercore, cuz i can't fit it in my case, but if anyone has any other ideas, that would be awesome.

So, my questions: Is WC worth it for me? What parts should I get? Were the ones I picked good?


Thanks in advance,


alex
 
I've seen several cases with that stupid fan setup. One of the big case manufacturers must have come up with this abomination and companies are basing their cases on it.

Other than the Maze CPU block, your setup looks pretty good. Look into the Swiftech kit with a Radbox for performance that's probably as good as your setup, plus the block is better.
 
Unless you are willing to either cut your case a bit or just get a heater core (the heater core alone will probably save you almost $25 over anything from DD) You don't really need the GPU block, unless you plan to OC that too. And BTW - Why buy the Maze 4 block? The RBX or TDX blocks are much better, and don't cost that much more. You can just go to a pet store/aquarium store and buy a pump from there for $20 to $40 (That DD pump is about $75, isnt it?) Buy that tubing (or Tygon, but Tygon is more expensive), you could buy the cheap $.25/foot stuff at Home Depot/Lowes, but it doesn't flex NEARLY as much (Trust me on this one, I am using the cheap tubing....) You can buy a 4 pack of hose clamps at meijer for about $1.75, so save your money on the ones from DD. The bay res isn't the best idea either, they are WAY overpriced and can be a pain to install in smaller cases. You could get away fine with a piece of PVC pipe with a screw-on cap with barbs on either side. Save yourself the $25 :p

So if you went this route, you would be spending:
CPU block: $45-$50
GPU block (Optional): $40
Pump: $30
Tubing/Fittings: $10-$15
Heater core: $20
PVC res: $5

Total: $160 or so. You could buy used waterblocks and save yourself even more. My setup is made like that, and I got both my CPU and GPU waterblocks for $55 total (yes, that's for both of them). I got a Maxi-Jet pump for $20, tubing/fittings for $8 (used cheap tubing, had to buy fittings for my res), and PVC fittings for $5 (already have a few inches of pipe to use) - My whole setup cost around $100
 
I really like that budget WC setup, and will consider it in the future. I've already considered the Pet Store pumps, but the PVC pipe res is a great idea. Thanks.
 
Wow, maybe I could get watercooling before christmas :p...so, its more like $160? What kind of pump should I be looking for at a pet shop, like GPH and fittings...from what i've gathered, 1/2" is better. now, i might get the parts stretched out, is that okay? like, the blocks i might get at a later date. how did u get yours so cheap? is ebay okay for that? what kind of block should i be looking for? I think ~200 I could do soon, like in a month or 2, instead of like 3 months w/o my own money. so, i'm guessing by both of your posts, ur saying its worth it? also, what should i do about the dumbass 80mm setup? i have a pic that i put on geocities about how i was thinking about my setup. i could do w/o the NB cooler, and yes, i will be OCing my vid card. will i be seeing a huge boost from: volcano 11+ and Arctic Silencer Rev. 3? I mean, if not, its not worth it, but I could sell them on ebay and get more profit. As for the blocks again, what is the best value/performance and how much? I might as my mom for a trip to the pet store soon, but i only have like 30 bucks in my wallet :p, so i can get the tubing, pump, and clamps now, and i can get the res. and possibly the rad. and blocks later, maybe in a month. does this sound like a good idea?

the link for my geocities pic is here: http://www.geocities.com/alex41290/IMG_1038.JPG

^^^don't worry about the cable management, i'll get to that some time :p^^^

oh, i was thinking, instead: pump > cpu > gpu > res > rad > pump is that okay? or should i switch the res and rad?

thanks a ton for the help, and sorry for the insane number of questions. we are learning in journalism class not to ask multi-step questions, but screw that, this isn't a newspaper :p...


thanks again, and thanks in advance for the next suggestions...


alex
 
Tubing layouts are a lot easier drawn than implemented. Keep that in mind, you'll probably have to make changes to your design when you get the tubing and blocks.
 
so i'm looking in the general area of $50 for the pump + clamps + tubing, am I correct? any suggestions for the heatercore/rad? also, the res? or do I not need one? I was thinking maybe put the radiator in the top or something, i can plan it out in photshop or something, and I know it will be a tough job, but my dad's pretty good with stuff like that, so I'm sure he can help. okay, i still have some unanswered questions in my prev. post, so if you wouldn't mind...thanks!
 
general consensus suggests that you swap your CPU Bloc and your Rad though I'm not sure it makes a big difference, I think it is kind of important to have your res just before the pump. If the layout works for you try ...

Res->Pump->Rad->CPU->GPU->Back to Res
 
It's best to have the res before the pump. Other than that, it doesn't matter.
 
Pet store aquarium pumps - Via Aqua 1300 or maxi Jet 900 or thereabouts. Both can take the 1/2 barbs easy. Theres prob quite a few others. those are just the ones I have seen in use or seen articles about.

I just got a Via Aqua 1300. They can be found online for under $20.00 . Its 110v but you can pick up a 110v/12v converter from Radioshack for about 5-6 bucks.
 
can you point me into the direction of the Via Aqua 1300 for under $20? I found it for $23...oh, and one quick thing, i found a freakin cheap ($25) CPU block at D-Tek, should i buy it?: http://www.dtekcustoms.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=22&strVarSel=126,25&strCompare=

also, i did a custom thing on dangerden, again, and I put this in:

Custom Kit: AMD, TDX, Lucite, 1/2 OD, Pro BLACK, Eheim 1048, 7 ft CF60, Round Res, Stainless Steel, 12 Hose Clamps' priced at $192.45

Is that a good deal? i'm loving that $25 block, I might just buy it now while its still in stock/cheap, if you guys think its good.


thanks,


alex

EDIT: so, so far, i have this:

Via Aqua 1300 - ~$20
D-Tek Spir@l Waterblock - ~$25
tubing, clamps, etc. - ~$10
Rad. - ? I was thinking a single 120mm, and I could mount it at the top of my case
Res. - Do I really need it? I don't want a t-line, the concept doesn't work in my mind :p...I was thinking a PVC res like you said before, but any commercial stuff?
GPU block - not sure about this...anything cheap? like $30 ish?

that's all i can think of...any more suggestions? thanks!
 
The dd pump is a class above the cheap pumps you're being quoted here. The DD blocks will reduce your flow rate by about 50%, so if you start with 2 gpm instead of 5 gpm you're not seeing much flow. In regards to your cooler problem, you case has 5 5.25 bays. Can't you use 2 or 3 of those to fit in a heatercore and blow out of the top of the machine? The cooling power of a 77 boneville core with 2 slow 120 mm fans is amazing.
 
I'm confused...put the heatercore in the 5 1/4 bays, and channel the air out the top? that doesn't make sense...eh, well...but the DD pump is also $75, and right now, that's a lot...I might wait for christmas, but that's a ways away...thanks for the suggestions, though...


alex
 
Alex41290 said:
I'm confused...put the heatercore in the 5 1/4 bays, and channel the air out the top? that doesn't make sense...
Click to expand...

it's a pretty common setup actually. look around at some wc projects here.
 
well, it blows, i have no money :p (what a surprise) so it looks like i'm waiting till christmas :'(...so, any new blocks or pumps that are coming out soon that seem really good? sorry to have posted this now, i was just hoping i could get mucho dolares right now or soon, but if i have any monetary breakthroughs, i will let you all know so i can pursue the art of watercooling...at lunch, my friends laughed at me when i said i was saving up for watercooling...i need computer geek friends :p
 
1.jpg


That is my setup, and it's a very simple and effective layout. When I filled it, I just propped the blocks up with various objects, poured coolant into the res, turned the pump on, and kept pouring coolant into the res until the water level stopped going down. Let it run for a few minutes, then come back and top it off again - some air bubbles will be stuck in the rad after filling with water, so give it time and a little movement and those bubbles should come right out.

My pump is 160GPH, although I am looking at getting the pump 2 models up (I have the Maxi-jet 600, I am looking at the Maxi-jet 1200, 295GPH). I got my pump not intending to get a GPU block, but got a great deal so I couldn't pass it up.

For the heater core, just go look on ebay for something that you like size wize, get the model number, and head over to Autozone or Napa and pick it up. Most cores can be found for around $20. If the core you buy doesn't have the right size inlet/outlet, either cut the barbs off close to the core with a hacksaw and JB weld fittings on, stick the core in a bucket of water (to prevent melting the solder and ruining the core) and torch off those pipes and solder in your own, or just boil the end of the tubing and stretch it over the pipe and clamp it down.

That spir@l block is OK, but you can buy a good used block for that price. All depends on what you want to do there. GPU blocks aren't necessary, but the loudest thing in my case before watercooling was my video card's tiny whiney little fan, so watercooling the GPU will definately get more noise out.

For the res, just try to find a friend that has some pipe in his garage or something, because most places sell it by 10ft sections. Get a screw on PVC cap and a plug for the other end (I used a $.50 test plug, it's a thin piece of plastic that goes flush into the bottom of the pipe) and seal it up good. Drill some holes in the side (or wherever your preferred place of putting them is), whip out your sealant of choice (I used JB weld because it was all that I had and theres no way in hell anything is gonna leak through JB weld :D ) and screw the barbs in. Quick, cheap, effective res.

If you have any more questions on my "budget" setup, just ask :)
 
Thanks a ton Grizzy, you've been a tremendous help. Where could I get used blocks? I looked on Ebay, and couldn't find anything, so if you could point me in the direction, that would be great. I am looking at maybe getting a new case now instead because my NZXT Guardian (i'm almost embarassed to say it :p) blows pretty bad...i posted in the case modding section, so that's taken care of. If I can find an equally good setup for $100 or if you could point me in the direction (equal to or better than yours) i will look into it instead of a case, and get the case later, because $100 is a lot more reasonable than $270 (my DD custom "attempt"). I can wait for a GPU cooler because I have an Arctic Silencer Rev. 3, and its quiet. The loudest thing in my case right now is my side 80mm fan, but that's with my volcano 11+ on high...i run it on med. So, I would love it if you could help me pick out a budget WCing setup with maybe some used blocks and maybe a cheap pump. Would I be looking at like $20 for a heatercore at Autozone? If so, I'll check it out, but which heatercores should I be looking at? I heard about a 77' chevette core i think, so if you could point that out to me too. A cheap (inexpensive, not crappy) pump would be awesome too. Tubing is pretty cheap, and I think my dad has some PVC piping around the house somewhere, or I can convince him that "we need it" :p.

Again, thanks a lot, and sorry for the long post...



alex
 
For the waterblocks, start putting up "WTB:" threads on various forums, and you will find something eventually. For the heater core, there are a ton of models at Autozone for like $17-$18. Measure the width of your case (or wherever you are putting/mounting it) and go on Ebay and search for heater cores. Keep looking until you find one that's close to your dimensions, and write down the model number. Go to www.autozone.com and see if they carry it, and see how much it costs. Keep doing this until you find one you like.

Pumps:

Model 1200, bottom of the pump list

Danner pumps, get model 2 or higher

Quiet One pumps, any of these will work
 
The Maxi-Jet is the best, it looks like to me, at least price/performance wise. Well, would it be a better idea to get WCing now, or get a new case now and get WCing later? I'm just debating, because a case will be cheaper. Any specific forums to post on?

thanks a bunch, i'll go get some money now :p....

any other suggestions would be great, thanks
 
I need to get some JBWeld, it sounds like the duct tape of glues from what I read.
 
thewhiteguy said:
I need to get some JBWeld, it sounds like the duct tape of glues from what I read.
Click to expand...

When it dries, it's almost as hard as steel - you can grind it, file it, whatever. It's basically a cold weld that permenantly bonds just about anything together.

The downside: it takes forever to dry (16 hours I believe)
 
haha, soundes like the shiz :p...

but yeah, my case is pretty fugly...its not bad if you don't look at the front :p

i'll look into a case as well as watercooling, maybe, so i could get both, just hafta get more money...

i'll try those forums, grizzy, thanks a bunch.

if anyone has any personal experiences with anything that they would like to share, like what are really good blocks and such, I would appreciate it!


alex
 
DryFire said:
I'd love to see the p-q curves of those pumps, but they seem to add a decent amount of heat to the system
Click to expand...

p-q curves

Quietone pumps are not as quiet as you might think. I had a 1200 for a while, and it was quite a bit louder than my current MCP650. Actually, I think it's still on a shelf somewhere, if anyone wants it.

miro
 
miro said:
p-q curves

Quietone pumps are not as quiet as you might think. I had a 1200 for a while, and it was quite a bit louder than my current MCP650. Actually, I think it's still on a shelf somewhere, if anyone wants it.

miro
Click to expand...

Actually, if the price is right, I may take it (assuming Alex doesn't, of course) - With the addition of my GPU block, my temps have gone up several degrees and I am guessing my pump didn't like the new block's flow design :p I don't really care if it's silent, as I will either be gaming or have music playing the whole time I am on my computer anyway :D

Email me pics/price [email protected] or catch me on AIM "scipio2005"
 
well, if you want it, you can take it...but is the pump you have now any good? cuz, if you don't want it....:p


wlel, keep all the suggestions coming, i want to know what's the best option and how to get it!
 
Alex41290 said:
well, if you want it, you can take it...but is the pump you have now any good? cuz, if you don't want it....:p


wlel, keep all the suggestions coming, i want to know what's the best option and how to get it!
Click to expand...

it's OK for one block, but it's not putting out much flow with 2 blocks and a larger heater core.
 
oh, well, maybe that's not a good idea...well, for now, i'm looking around, so if you want his pump, you can take it...i'm not in the market right now, though if i could get it really cheap, i might just get it now...but its up to you...

i'll browse around some forums in their "buy" sections and see if i can find anything.
 
Grizzy, in your case, what Heate Core did you end up using? The ones I find on eBay seem a lot more expensive than $20.
 
I didn't read everyone's posts, but I don't think only getting an 80mm radiator will suffice for a good watercooling setup.
 
Chicken Penni Pasta said:
I didn't read everyone's posts, but I don't think only getting an 80mm radiator will suffice for a good watercooling setup.
Click to expand...

:rolleyes:

Read the thread before you make comments like that, it's been discussed in detail already.
 
Well, after searching through my case, i found a place to mount a radiator, and i think it should be sufficient. I will photoshop the pic and put in a "rad" (a crappy colored rectangle :p) and tell me what you think as in difficulty and location...

i will edit in a minute or two with my idea]

EDIT: voila, my (crappy) rendition of my rad placement, and there will be a blowhole cut on the top of the case to house it...

http://www.geocities.com/alex41290/radsetup.JPG
 
so is that not a good idea? i guess i could make it external...i'm actually gonna make money today! i'm helpin my dad around the house, so i'm hoping to get a large sum of money :p ($100 ish) but i doubt that will happen...$50 will probly be the max, but if i do get my total up to $100, i might be able to convince my dad to pay for half and get the DD kit, but if anyone has any other ideas to get it cheaper, cuz if i could get it to like $150, then a new case might work too...

any suggestions for what to do would be awesome!

Thanks again Grizzy for all ur posting, you have been a tremendous help!
 
miro said:
p-q curves

Quietone pumps are not as quiet as you might think. I had a 1200 for a while, and it was quite a bit louder than my current MCP650. Actually, I think it's still on a shelf somewhere, if anyone wants it.

miro
Click to expand...

Alex and whoever else was interested, how's $25 shipped? I'm not sure when I could ship it though. I'm at college, and the pump's at home. I'll probably go home next weekend, but that means you'd have to wait a week for shipping. :p
 
well, i'm looking at that Via Aqua 1300 for $20, so, Grizzy, you can have it if you want it...
 
miro said:
Alex and whoever else was interested, how's $25 shipped? I'm not sure when I could ship it though. I'm at college, and the pump's at home. I'll probably go home next weekend, but that means you'd have to wait a week for shipping. :p
Click to expand...

Why exactly did you put this pump on the shelf? Is it loud? Anything wrong with it?


Alex - The Via pump is decent, although many people have leaking problems with it, and a loud humming sound. The leaking can be fixed with silicone sealant around the impeller housing, and the humming can be fixed by a drop of super glue to disable the pump's safety feature, which allows the impeller to stay motionless while the motor spins, preventing the pump from killing itself. Both easy fixes, but still wanted to give you the heads up if you go that direction.
 
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