ViewSonic VP2770: 2560x1440 Semi-Glossy PLS

Discussion in 'Displays' started by NCX, Dec 6, 2012.

  1. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    IMO it is the best choice out of the Dell U2713HM (bleeding, anti-glare cross hatching, burn-in, higher input lag), Asus PB278Q (bleeding, PWM flicker, higher input lag) and Samsung S27A850D (bleeding, high default gamma, higher input lag) and is worth the extra money.

    It has a 7ms signal delay according to PRAD! This puts it ahead of the Eizo CG275W (9ms), CrossOver 2720MDP (12ms) and Samusng S27A850D (13.6ms), Dell U2713HM (15ms) and Asus PB278Q (17.8ms). Usually multi-input 2560x1440 displays have at least 1 frame of input lag (17ms) PRAD's review is available in German here.

    Reviews:
    NCX's Written Review
    http://www.prad.de/new/monitore/test/2013/test-viewsonic-vp2770-led.html
    http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/vp2770-led-s27b970d-review,3426.html
    http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/viewsonic_vp2770-led.htm
    http://v6.erenumerique.fr/viewsonic...e_resolution_democratique-article-4304-1.html
    http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/monitors/377770/viewsonic-vp2770-led

    +No PWM dimming
    +Excellent Factory Calibrated Colours
    +Semi-Glossy Coating
    +Fast overshoot free response times when using the Standard Setting
    +Very low input lag
    ? Make sure to set the Overdrive setting to Advanced for better motion performance
    -Has dead/stuck pixel issues
    -Light bleeding

    These settings are for 140cd/m2 brightness, 6500k color temperature and 2.2 gamma:

    Brightness: 26
    Contrast: 70 (default)
    Red: 100
    Green: 96
    Blue: 93

    Manual Image Adjust Menu>Response Time>Advanced

    Viewsonic VP2770 ICC Profile

    Use Color Sustainer to force games to use ICC profiles
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2014
  2. Drags

    Drags Gawd

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    out of interest have you ever seen Prad's input lag method explained in any detail, short of them just saying they are using an oscilloscope?

    i know about the big article they published about measurement techniques, written by Thomas Thiemann who makes the SMTT tools. However, that was using a 130,000 Euro piece of kit, some very complicated and lengthily process, and Thomas obviously doesn't do their testing for their reviews or anything. Speaking with him in the past there is no indication of the actual method they are now using, how it works or anything - just they are using an oscilloscope.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2012
  3. livefastdieyoung

    livefastdieyoung Limp Gawd

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    tft central got 20ms more. they also use smtt 2.0 - i have to wonder why their measurements are this far off.
     
  4. Sailor_Moon

    Sailor_Moon Gawd

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    It's of course no secret but you should contact Erich Roos – who is in charge of the oscilloscope measurements – directly to get some details. He can answer questions regarding the procedure surely better than I.

    http://www.prad.de/new/start/impressum.html

    Keep in mind that the measurement value is the "pure" input lag without consideration of response time .
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2012
  5. Drags

    Drags Gawd

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    thanks Denis, might do that out of interest.

    7ms signal processing lag then, that makes more sense :) can you confirm what overall "display lag" was calculated as once element of response time was also included?
     
  6. Sailor_Moon

    Sailor_Moon Gawd

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    Yes: 12.4 ms (I think regarding Ultra Fast).
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2012
  7. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    From my understanding pixel response times and signal processing are separate. If this were not true then the VA panels with 25ms+ total latency would feel laggy, but they don't because they have such low processing delays.

    The Viewsonic's Ultra Fast mode overshoots significantly, not sure why they did not test the middle overdrive setting....

    Many of TFT Central's SMT Tool measurements have been way off, even compared to other people who use the SMT Tool, not sure why
     
  8. Peat Moss

    Peat Moss Limp Gawd

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    We won't know about backlight bleeding until people get a hold of it and make their reports here or elsewhere. The Asus PB278Q still beats the Viewsonic in black depth and contrast ratio. If PWM flicker doesn't bother someone, and they're not a gamer, the Asus is still the better buy, imo.
     
  9. Tych-0

    Tych-0 Gawd

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    Hmm, if this display has significantly less input lag than my 2711 it might be worth a look. I'm gonna keep my eye on this one I think.
     
  10. dparm

    dparm Limp Gawd

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    Really considering and the Sammy S27A850D. MacMall has the Sammy on sale for $749, and everyone is asking $799 for the Viewsonic. TFT's review of the 2770 shows virtually identical specs to the Sammy, whereas the Asus PB278Q offers better contrast and black level for less money, albeit with slightly worse color accuracy.

    Did anyone end up buying the 2770 yet?
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2012
  11. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Get the viewsonic if you are sensitive to LED PWM dimming or the Asus if you are not. The Asus's colour accuracy is good enough to put it on the same level as the others.
     
  12. bigsnyder

    bigsnyder Gawd

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    How is Viewsonic's build quality these days? I haven't bought a new Viewsonic since the peak of the CRT days.
     
  13. Rob.

    Rob. Limp Gawd

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    These LED monitors seem to be pretty much all the same quality these days.
    I can never change from my Fw900 CRT to any LED. :p
     
  14. dparm

    dparm Limp Gawd

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    I don't think I agree, Rob. Some of the reviews I see talk about really lousy stands, plastic housings that make noise as they heat up, or just bad ergonomics.
     
  15. Ktf Fang

    Ktf Fang [H]Lite

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    according to tftcentral:

    http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/viewsonic_vp2770-led.htm

    "The native gamut is a little too wide for sRGB, and the sRGB emulation attempts in other preset modes fell a little short, not quite matching the colour space as accurately as you would hope."

    Can anyone really notice this?
     
  16. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    No, it will only be an issue for the most professional professionals who would likely never buy this display for work any way because they have high end NEC/Lacie/Eizo's with hardware calibration, 10 bit+ LUT's and high end colorimeters.

    sRGB color space coverage is usually only an issue if it is way out of wack or when the coverage falls below 85%. Usually only low end A-MVA and AH-IPS monitors have "real," color space coverage issues.
     
  17. BababooeyHTJ

    BababooeyHTJ [H]ardness Supreme

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    NCX, you are the man dude. This monitor seems like the way to go for a gamer. Good find.
     
  18. Ktf Fang

    Ktf Fang [H]Lite

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    just put in an order for one on amazon!
     
  19. Superjoe

    Superjoe [H]ard|Gawd

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    Just got mine today, loving every bit of it. The only thing that is a disappointment is that the HDMI port is apparently not 1.4 so it won't do more than 1080p on HDMI. That seems like a huge miss but DVI is working great. I only really cared because I'm running two computers through it and I want to run the speakers off of the monitor so I could bounce back and forth between HDMI and DisplayPort. Oh well I guess.
     
  20. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    Apparently a lot of owners have ran into a manufacturing defect where there are eraser marks on the backlight.
     
  21. Deredox

    Deredox [H]Lite

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    i really dislike the design but oh well
     
  22. Ktf Fang

    Ktf Fang [H]Lite

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    just got this! very solid base and beautiful picture. but there seems to be a bit of backlight bleed in the corners?


    whats the best way to test?
     
  23. der_bothaus

    der_bothaus Limp Gawd

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    Turn off the lights, set up a black full screen image, and crank up the brightness.
     
  24. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    Just ordered one for Tomb Raider. I'll probably off myself if there's a dead pixel.
     
  25. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    Everything but this.

    Monitors only come with cranked brightness so that they look good when set up in stores, which are usually very bright.

    High brightness=high black level=greyish (sometimes grey) blacks, more obvious screen uniformity issues and IPS/PLS glow.

    Reduce the brightness half way or less, then look at a black screen in dark.
     
  26. der_bothaus

    der_bothaus Limp Gawd

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    You'd know that way. It would be obvious. Why don't you keep it at the brightness you actually use then?
    "Everything but this"? Surely throwing it out the window is a far worse way to measure. Or turning brightness down entirely to 0. That is worse. There are quite a few other behaviors worse than "Everything" opens up, no? I mean, if we are nitpicking as we are.
     
  27. alek

    alek Limp Gawd

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    so hows this screen doing compared with other screens? its certainly glossier than the gw2760hs...:cool: and more expensive too damn ;P
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2013
  28. 5150Joker

    5150Joker 2[H]4U

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    Just ordered one. I currently own an Achieva Shimian QH270-Lite and hate the backlight bleed and crap build quality (you get what you pay for). IMO buying a local U2713HM, Asus or this Viewsonic is a far better idea than those imported Korean monitors.

    Will post back with impressions once the screen arrives on Tuesday--Prime FTW!
     
  29. xbiker321

    xbiker321 Limp Gawd

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    Nice, let us know! I'm in the market for a good 27" monitor. Was leaning toward the Dell until I spotted this thread, lol.
     
  30. NCX

    NCX [H]ardness Supreme

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    I ordered one from Amazon Canada (OOS currently) since they have the lowest price and are the only Canadian retailer with a good return policy.

    Right now I have a Samsung S27A850D which I sent into Samsung twice for dropping frames (they sent it back without fixing it once) and I think they will replace it with the 970D (edge-to-edge glass) which I do not want since I already have a glossy CrossOver 2720MDP and I like having 1 matte+glossy set up. Was also looking at the Ezio EV2763W but it costs 1000$ in Canada, has higher input lag and worse color presets.
     
  31. xbiker321

    xbiker321 Limp Gawd

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    I was looking at buying it from Amazon here in the states. Pretty good deal right now. $711
     
  32. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    I got mine from J&R for $710. $10-off coupon and free shipping.

    I still don't know what to think about the monitor. The poor black levels drive me nuts, and there's also an obvious bit of backlight bleed near the top that I keep focusing on whenever I watch a trailer or movie.

    My eyes also feel like they're melting whenever I'm on a site with a lot of white content. I'm starting to believe that LED isn't completely safe for the eyes (though I have absolutely no issues with the display on my MacBook Pro).
     
  33. xbiker321

    xbiker321 Limp Gawd

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    Thanks for the input. I have the monitor sitting in my Amazon cart right now... is their one that you wish you bought instead?
     
  34. Falconetti

    Falconetti [H]Lite

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    Thank god for the paper mode on my EV2736 , its so easy on the eyes ;)
     
  35. 5150Joker

    5150Joker 2[H]4U

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    Just got the display and quick impressions:

    1. Backlight bleeding: VERY minimal to the point where you can't really notice it. It's not fully dark in my room right now but even with this much lighting, the Achieva Shimian used to light up like a Christmas tree. This one only has a faint trace of it in the upper part. It's so faint that my girlfriend couldn't even notice it when I showed her.

    2. Pixels: Not pixel perfect I'm afraid, I have one dark pixel that almost looks like a piece of dirt towards the bottom. Fortunately I purchased it from Amazon so I already put in a request for an exchange which was a PITA because Amazon uses offshore employees now. I remember a few years back they had Americans who took care of issues right away..sigh. Replacement order arrives on March 14th (2 days, wish it would get here tomorrow).

    3. Factory calibrated color: The display comes with a factory calibrated color display report. Out of the box this thing is GORGEOUS. Colors are spot on and the contrast ratio is quite good, definitely the 900:1 that some sites have reported.

    4. Panel uniformity: Very uniform from what I can see after running solid colors on the panel.

    5. Input lag & ghosting: To be tested in BF3 in a few minutes.

    Bottom line: You get what you pay for! For those of you looking to save a few hundred by purchasing one of those Korean monitors, well you might luck out and get one that isn't full of flaws but IMO they really aren't worth it. I've seen the Dell U2713HM and this Viewsonic looks just as good if not better and the best part is the AG coating is better than the Dell.

    Pic of monitor with black background using DPT:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/lh6d4gr0dpl3u9r/IMG_20130312_155909.jpg

    What you see in the bottom left corner is NOT light bleed. It's just the stupid cell phone camera capturing what's really not there.

    Other images:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/hoecsmvcw7l13s8/IMG_20130312_153259.jpg
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/ndeephjg9f5u7ou/IMG_20130312_153249.jpg

    Dirt/Dead pixel, looks more like a piece of dirt stuck back there:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/blhxvofnfmt9hz3/IMG_20130312_160303.jpg


    EDIT:

    Factory calibration report for my display: https://www.dropbox.com/s/fbuyn6oliwrpxb9/IMG_20130312_164908.jpg


    Just tested this thing at night with all the lights off and I see virtually no backlight bleed. Very impressed so far. Played BF3 with advanced motion control and there was hardly any discernible ghosting or lag. Don't have the tools to give you guys accurate measurements and its purely subjective but I feel this thing is leaps and bounds better than the Korean cheapo stuff. Only thing the Achieva had over this is that it was slightly brighter.
     
  36. Megalith

    Megalith 24-bit/48kHz Staff Member

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    I'm pretty sure I'm going to return mine. The blueness of the LED backlighting is killing me; there is an obvious blue cast on any calibrated (sRGB) setting I try. The warm setting is a little more comfortable but not ideal because it isn't D65.

    I also think there's something detrimental about the AG coating even though it's been reported everywhere as being light and non-aggressive. I wear glasses, and sometimes it feels as if the screen is imparting glare into my lenses. Other times, the image looks like there's a very subtle layer of haze on it.

    This is weird because I also own a Dell U23, which supposedly has very thick AG coating, and the image looks and feels much more natural to me. That is a CCFL monitor, though, so maybe it's just the LED lighting creating problems.
     
  37. 5150Joker

    5150Joker 2[H]4U

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    I don't have any of the problems you described.
     
  38. Murzilka

    Murzilka Gawd

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    That's definitely CCFL that you are missing on that display.
     
  39. Ktf Fang

    Ktf Fang [H]Lite

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    Yeah I do notice a bit of backlight bleed but its only on a black screen in the dark. I'll try to get a pic of it tonight but so far I am very happy with this monitor. Wish the stand wasn't so big though.

    Whats the best way to adjust the brightness/contrast? I know these screens are factory calibrated already, but that doesn't take into account the lighting scenario.

    I did the test where I have a white box inside a black screen with the contrast at 100, then decrease until the white box turns gray then increase a little.

    for the brightness, I start at 0 then increase until I can see box #1 here:
    http://www.maximumpc.com/files/u16580/HowMonTest1.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2013
  40. Peat Moss

    Peat Moss Limp Gawd

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    Which sites reported that number? TFT Central got 752:1