Venice core revisions (CBBLE vs LBBLE)?

L

Lukano

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 11, 2003
Messages
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I know I could probably tack this on to the end of my current thread in this forum, or perhaps should put this in the AMD forums instead of the OC forums - but it seems relevant enough to remain here as well as to warrant it's own thread.

What if any differences are there between the two revisions? Does one overclock better than the other?

edit - for instance this thread on DFI-Street indicated LBBLE (which ironically I have) requires 1.6v+ to reach 2.6+ stable. I know I'm having issues getting over 2.6. What am I missing, or are they just full of it?
 
Brando457 said:
I have the LBBLE myself I wonder if its good or not heh
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I don't get the impression LBBLE is so much "bad" as just not as good.
 
my cpu is doing 2.7 ghz right now LBBLE 300 x 9 @ 1.451 vcore, ram at 100 mhz divider, htt at 3

seems to be nice ?
 
Brando457 said:
my cpu is doing 2.7 ghz right now LBBLE 300 x 9 @ 1.451 vcore, ram at 100 mhz divider, htt at 3

seems to be nice ?
Click to expand...

Stock Vcore and you got it that high?! Are you using VID Special Control at all?

What ram/timings?
 
i have also LBBLE and i got 2,7g with 1,6V....1,65v i can`t hit 2,7g so this one don`t like voltages or it heat`s up too much...
 
Lukano said:
Stock Vcore and you got it that high?! Are you using VID Special Control at all?

What ram/timings?
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2_7.jpg


Is 1.45 stock vcore ? I don't know

what is VID special control ?
 
Brando, can you post screenshots of your memory and spd tabs as well?

I just did the math using the table in my sig - 1.6v seems to be the sweetspot for 300HTT on x9 multi - and that seems to be 1.3v + 123% special control on a DFI board - so I'll be giving that a try tomorrow.
 
spd.jpg


memory.jpg


There are the 2 pictures you asked for.

Do you think I should try to push it anymore or be happy with what I'm at ?
 
You've got another at least 50mhz bare minimum that you can squeeze out of your ram - maybe more. Try jumping your ram divider up a notch or two. 200-220mhz would be high end for PC3200 value ram (like what I have) so your 3500 stuff should be (I would guess) get 220-240mhz?

Also - I'm a little confused as to why your SPD for slot #1 shows two different speeds/ratings and even timings. Is that for double sided sticks or something?
 
why running the ram so low? i thin u oughta push that ram higher to at least 200mhz if not 217. Are u just underclocking to run at 2-2-2-5? i would think the extra 50mhz would help more than having timings like that.

most ram shows 2 timings. thats just what the manufacter stored in the SPD. my shows 2 timings, at 166 and 200.
 
Brando457 said:
what is VID special control ?
Click to expand...

Oh - VID Special Control is a setting for X% higher than stock Vcore (it's a DFI motherboard setting - and I mentioned it just in reference to DFI as I'm not sure what board you're running).
 
peterhoang2002 said:
why running the ram so low? i thin u oughta push that ram higher to at least 200mhz if not 217.
Click to expand...

this ram is crappy for some reason if i set the divider to 133 which would be 133 + w/e it is

it won't boot at all, 100 is all that this ram likes and idk why

it is kingston hyper x pc3500

I'm planning on buying a gig of corsair xms in a few weeks.
 
both will OC well, but the CBBLE will probably go a little higher...
 
Brando457 said:
this ram is crappy for some reason if i set the divider to 133 which would be 133 + w/e it is

it won't boot at all, 100 is all that this ram likes and idk why

it is kingston hyper x pc3500

I'm planning on buying a gig of corsair xms in a few weeks.
Click to expand...

what about the interim (if you have them) notches between 100 and 133 and/or between 133 and 166? Try it with stock dram voltage and ramp up the dram voltage to see if it helps. I would assume the kingston hyperx should be able to do at LEAST 200 when rated at 220.
 
I dont have notches between 100 and 133 just 100, 133, 166, 200

part of hte problem why i can't OC great probably is I dont know what to set the cas and shit to

Ill go into bios and take a picture so you can see what i mean.
 
Brando457 said:
this ram is crappy for some reason if i set the divider to 133 which would be 133 + w/e it is

it won't boot at all, 100 is all that this ram likes and idk why

it is kingston hyper x pc3500

I'm planning on buying a gig of corsair xms in a few weeks.
Click to expand...

ok i think the problem is its hyper-x ram. i remember seeing somewhere that these nf4 dfi-boards dont like hyper-x ram. this is a dfi-board, right?
 
peterhoang2002 said:
ok i think the problem is its hyper-x ram. i remember seeing somewhere that these nf4 dfi-boards dont like hyper-x ram. this is a dfi-board, right?
Click to expand...


err i completely forgot ot mention

This board is a nf 3 Epox Ep-9NDA3+ :eek:
 
Brando457 said:
err i completely forgot ot mention

This board is a nf 3 Epox Ep-9NDA3+ :eek:
Click to expand...

Might be a really silly question - but have you made sure the bios is as up-to-date as it can get? I've heard that venice cores have some funkiness with memory and most boards need bios fixes (or perhaps it was JUST DFI).
 
It's most, DFI just has an abundance of beta versions.

Brando, what cooler are you using, what temps is it getting, and don't suppose you can take a digicam to the BIOS settings (or just post all the ones you changed)?
 
ashmedai said:
It's most, DFI just has an abundance of beta versions.

Brando, what cooler are you using, what temps is it getting, and don't suppose you can take a digicam to the BIOS settings (or just post all the ones you changed)?
Click to expand...


The cooler is the stock AMD HSF, Idle Temp atm according to MBM is 29 C and I'll take a picture of the bios settings for the ram in a minute and post it here.

Any other pictures you want besides the ram settings?
 
I'm more interested in how yours is running 0.1V lower than mine at the same CPU speed, but if you can get the extended memory settings hopefully we can help you get your memory up to a reasonable speed.

If nothing else I haven't tweaked it since I built it so it can probably do with a bit less voltage now that the TIM has cured a bit.

Hmm...it IS prime stable, right?
 
Try increasing the CPU voltage a bit and see if it lets you increase the memory ratio...100 is horrible. The memory controller is built in to the CPU so it can indirectly affect it. That Kingston stuff isn't half bad, and it says it can do 2-3-3 on the SPD table which is notoriously conservative. If ya give it a bit of extra voltage (probably no more than 2.9V tops) it might help a bit.

By preference:

1T
As low as possible (2 is the "good" score)
Same as CAS
Doesn't matter, put whatever number makes it most stable in Memtest86+
Same as CAS

A note, CAS of 2 or 2.5 is equally acceptable, however Trcd & Trp have a larger effect and if you can get them down to 3 or 2 it's very helpful. CPU-Z says you're running 2-2-2-5 right now, try manually setting them to the ones designated in the SPD table (2-2-2-8, although it'll be in the order 2-2-8-2 in the BIOS) and see if it helps you get it off that 100 ratio setting.

I can supply my CPU with much lower voltage and still have it boot into XP, the thing is it doesn't show up as fully stable in Prime95. You can download a copy here to test your computer with.
 
ashmedai said:
Try increasing the CPU voltage a bit and see if it lets you increase the memory ratio...100 is horrible. The memory controller is built in to the CPU so it can indirectly affect it.

By preference:

1T
As low as possible (2 is the "good" score)
Same as CAS
Doesn't matter, put whatever number makes it most stable in Memtest86+
Same as CAS

A note, CAS of 2 or 2.5 is equally acceptable, however Trcd & Trp have a larger effect and if you can get them down to 3 or 2 it's very helpful.

I can supply my CPU with much lower voltage and still have it boot into XP, the thing is it doesn't show up as fully stable in Prime95. You can download a copy here to test your computer with.
Click to expand...

I'm semi-hijacking the thread here, but is it even remotely possible that 2 or 3 for TRCD and TRP when pushing FSB up high (like 300) would make it more stable than say 4 or 5?
 
Lukano said:
I'm semi-hijacking the thread here, but is it even remotely possible that 2 or 3 for TRCD and TRP when pushing FSB up high (like 300) would make it more stable than say 4 or 5?
Click to expand...

Depending on the type of chips in the memory, it will lose stability like all hell if you put the latency too high (Winbond & Micron being the more pronounced cases).

HT clock != FSB, they operate differently. What's important from a strictly memory angle is the clock rate it's running at. Memory divider = round up the CPU multi divided by the memory ratio (expressed as something like 5/6, 7/10, 166/200, not just 166 or 133 or something, if that's what you have put it over 200). Then you take the CPU speed divided by the memory divider to get the actual memory speed.
 
ok so i messed with the ram timings and stuff and it still wont go to a divider of 133 or above at any speed.

I was able to do a fsb of 240, htt of 3 and divider of 133 and mutli of 9 though
 
That's still only 154MHz, you're not even up to PC2700 levels. That stuff says its rated for PC3500 / 217MHz.
 
ashmedai said:
That's still only 154MHz, you're not even up to PC2700 levels. That stuff says its rated for PC3500 / 217MHz.
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I know, I have no idea wtf to do or why it won't operate as it should at those speeds.

If you want to come to NJ and help me out heh
 
Dear god no, I get airsick like crazy.

Try this...stop trying to OC everything BUT the memory for a bit and let's test both sticks individually at their stock advertised rating. Set the memory ratio to 200, CPU multi 9, HT clock 217. Run Memtest86+ for a few passes on those settings, one stick at a time, see if there are any errors. If they are, RMA time. If they aren't, something else is causing the problem.
 
ashmedai said:
HT clock != FSB.
Click to expand...

Yah, I know. My biggest mental roadblack is convincing myself NOT to refer to them synonymously. I'm bad at that! :)
 
I think im going to buy new ram and see how that goes

this kingston seems to be buggy as fubar

anyone suggest some good ram like a gig for less than 150?
 
Brando457 said:
I think im going to buy new ram and see how that goes

this kingston seems to be buggy as fubar

anyone suggest some good ram like a gig for less than 150?
Click to expand...

I just ordered this ram (this is USD conversion pricing, NCIX is in Canada though) and it's getting good reviews. Capable of 2-2-2-8 @ 3.2v after a bit of burn in. I'm sure with a bit of digging you american's can find a better pricing on Newegg or somesuch to drop it down the other $20 to fit in your budget.
 
Lukano said:
I just ordered this ram (this is USD conversion pricing, NCIX is in Canada though) and it's getting good reviews. Capable of 2-2-2-8 @ 3.2v after a bit of burn in. I'm sure with a bit of digging you american's can find a better pricing on Newegg or somesuch to drop it down the other $20 to fit in your budget.
Click to expand...

in my bios the most vdimm i can do is 2.8 ....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820146883

I think I might buy that ram
 
Brando457 said:
in my bios the most vdimm i can do is 2.8 ....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820146883

I think I might buy that ram
Click to expand...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are they not the same sticks?

Mine has the part # OCZ4001024ELDCGEVX-K
Yours has the part # OCZ4001024ELDC-K

Only difference is the GEVX (can someone clue me in on what that denotes?)

edit - oh, "EV" is for;

NCIX enlightened us by saying said:
OCZ EVP® (Extended Voltage Protection) is a feature that allows performance enthusiasts to use a VDIMM of 3.5V ± 5% without invalidating their OCZ Lifetime Warranty.
Click to expand...
 
so this ram will be nice ?

Gonna rma my kingston hyperx i think and get this and then sell the kingston :)

LMK you've been awesome and so has this whole thread
 
Brando457 said:
so this ram will be nice ?

Gonna rma my kingston hyperx i think and get this and then sell the kingston :)

LMK you've been awesome and so has this whole thread
Click to expand...

As far as I can see, yes the ram will be decent. You don't need the high voltage stuff - nor could you utilize it without a DDR Booster anyways - so my semi-educated opinion is go for it. The price is right at least.

You may want to wait for a voiced opinion from Ashmedai though - as it'll likely be recommending TwinMOS :)

edit - hahah. Just read the reviews on newegg on the ram you're considering. Some people really need to grammar and phrasing check things before they post them.

Some NewEgg Idiot said:
This is some serious RAM. I have used it twice now and it runs flawlessly. OC'ed to 448Meg and running like a champ.
Click to expand...

That reads to me as if overclocking your ram magically increases the sheer volume of it. Plus you'd think that simply using the same ram twice (and only twice) would hardly be a fair evaluation of it's merits.

Maybe I'm just over-tired and laughing at things that aren't terribly funny though :D
 
Brando457 said:
a buddy of mine who works for a computer shop up in canada recommended me some nice OCZ ram

http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merc...duct_Code=140338&Category_Code=Unbuffered_OCZ

so i think i'll order 2 gigs tomorrow
Click to expand...

.... the timing on that is really just value-ram quality. If you're not wanting beefy ram, and you don't mind poor timings, you can get this Corsair Value-Select from NCIX for a whopping $40 CDN more all told, and at least have CAS 2.5 rated SPD instead of 3.

Or even get the same/similar Corsair VSR from Monarch for even less.

My only warning is you'll likely kick yourself if you aim for value stuff now, and want to push your rig a bit higher later. Remember that I warned you from personal experience, that's it's worth spending the extra $50-60 per gig (and why do you need 2 gigs anyways?) for some nice CAS 2 2-2-X rated stuff. Trust me, it just is.
 
I am still debating about it. My friend also works in Canada and has the same ram and he says his OCs like a charm so idk.

Im considering getting the gig of OCZ ram I linked to at newegg before whatcha think?
 
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