upgrade or no

[silents]

I'm building a new computer and need advice on buying a new sound card or not.

current system
logitech z-2300
creative x-fi music

I game a lot and listen to music

 

[Nenu]

I would, but I would also upgrade the sound system.
Creative Z or ZXR if you can afford it.
For music, f you can afford a decent external USB stereo DAC, that would be even better but you wont get its real performance until you get much better amp/speakers.

 

[biggles]

Rumor has it the new realtek 1150 codec is as good as some of the lower end discrete sound cards. Why not try onboard sound first to see if you like it? If not, you can always add a sound card later.

 

[dragonstongue]

game movies and music, Asus Xonar(like the DX), primarily game with some of everything else, the mentioned Z or ZXR

 

[spaceman]

I would put most of your money towards upgrading the speakers first. Then maybe a dac or Zx. Depends on your budget as to what speakers but always look towards used receivers and speakers. Those can get you killer sound for cheap.

 

[atarione]

if you are keeping them logitech speakers wouldn't worry about it much


if you want to upgrade upgrade the speaker set up.


tons of ways to go :: powered monitors (sub optional) / T-amp + bookshelf speakers (and sub optional) // receiver + bookshelf speakers /sub (optional)


I personally have a bunch of vintage audio stuff... at my pc I use a late 80s vintage Kenwood KR-V106R (100WPC) and a pair of JBL J2050 speakers

the receiver is in very good shape and cost me $20 the speakers are also in excellent conditon and cost $40~ for $60 this set up is very good indeed.

I also have a Pioneer VSX-D1S (135WPC) cost $40 and a pair of DCM Timeframe TF-250's hooked up to my pc this set up also it excellent


pics..

Kenwood + JBL's

Pioneer VSX-D1S

DCM Timeframe TF-250

used as you can see is my preference..

right now I'm using on of these I got for $12.99 at fry's

http://www.amazon.com/Conversions-T..._3?ie=UTF8&qid=1376762832&sr=8-3&keywords=dac

from the optical out on my new Z87X-UD3H to my VSX-D1S it sounds fantastic.



going on 2yrs ago i replaced my old Logitech Z560 multimedia speakers w/ stereo gear and have not regretted it for 1 second.

 

[atarione]

if you lack deskspace t-amp plus little speakers is a good option also

here is my SMSL SA-S3 t-amp which is hooked up to these surprisingly good sounding Optimus PRO-X44AV speakers (speakers $10 t-amp $60~ shipped)

 

[silents]

damn
so the logitech z-2300 isn't that good?
I spent a lot of money on them too.

 

[spaceman]

damn
so the logitech z-2300 isn't that good?
I spent a lot of money on them too.

Not terrible but compared to a real stereo it sucks yes. No biggie though, just buy something real and sell the logitech later. If you have the room, full sized speakers are the best value in audio.

 

[silents]

so what do I need if I want to go the t-amp + speaker + sub? (cost wise and hardware wise)

creative Z sound card => t - amp => speakers
t - amp => subwoofer

am i getting this right? Where does the DAC comes in?

if this even matter this is the mobo im probably getting
Z87 Pro Socket LGA 1150

 

[spaceman]

No just get a Zx and that is the dac. Probably the easiest and best sounding you can get for gaming and everything else around $100. They work really well.

So if you get the sound card, amp, speakers and subwoofer. You are looking at around $100 for the sound card, $30-50 for the amp, $30-80 for speakers and the sub I would get is around $120.

If you want new gear, I would buy a sound card, amp and speakers first. That will be around $200. Then add the sub for $120 or so later. Even without the sub, the right speakers will sound better but not have as much bass. However, the parts express 12" sub is the $120 one I mentioned and it will hit way harder than the logitech.

 

[silents]

im sold for a better sound system for around 300 - 350 .

so which brand and model am i looking at.
i only got ~120 Creative Zx so far

 

[spaceman]

This is the best I can put together around that budget and new. You need a spool of speaker wire and a 1/8th to rca cable to run from the sound card into the amp. Then the speaker wire goes from the amp into the sub and then from the sub into the speakers. Really easy to do and everything is labeled.

Dayton Audio SUB-1200
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-629

Lepai LP-2020A+
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=310-300

Fluance SX6
http://www.amazon.com/Fluance-SX6-D...1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1376792307&sr=1-1

 

[silents]

is there smaller speakers i could use? like the size of the Optimus PRO-X44AV atarione mention? I'm going to be running 3 monitors on my desk and I don't think i have room for 2 more bookshelve speakers

 

[atarione]

so you can get realistic minimus 7 (similar to my X44AV's) on ebay pretty much any day for about $50~ (the 7's are actually much more common and where made for many years and all) the difference's my X44AV's are ported in the back (vs sealed cabinets on the 7's and mine are shielded (which only matters realistically if you wanted to put them next to a CRT monitor)


alternately if they come back in stock the micca motion MB42's are rather small and should be similar in size to the Minimus 7's

http://www.amazon.com/Micca-MB42-Bookshelf-Speakers-Tweeter/dp/B009IUIV4A


you could get something like these jbl control 1's also (not so cheap however.)

http://www.amazon.com/JBL-Control-O...&qid=1376806133&sr=1-1&keywords=jbl+control+1


these are going to be somewhat bigger but not particularly big

and would be pretty nice :: Mordaunt Short Carnival 1

http://www.amazon.com/Mordaunt-Shor...272&sr=1-27&keywords=small+bookshelf+speakers


and one more pretty compact speaker option :: Cambridge Audio S20

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-eVAxfb4w9Tm/p_779S20DO/Cambridge-Audio-S20-Dark-Oak.html

 

[silents]

how are the micca motion MB42' compare to the Fluance SX6?

also, does it matter if the cable is 1/8th to RCA or it's a 1/8th to 1/8th? I see the Lepai LP-2020A+ can support both

 

[spaceman]

http://www.noaudiophile.com/Micca_MB42/

The MB42 probably needs more power to sound its best. If your desk space is at a premium, you might just consider getting some small powered monitors. I haven't used any in so long that my opinion doesn't count but M-Audio makes some decent ones around $100.

 

[silents]

what t-amp would i need if i want to get the MB42?

 

[spaceman]

what t-amp would i need if i want to get the MB42?

Nothing in your price range. The Lepai will work fine and be plenty loud for a desktop stereo. Just don't expect it to blow you out of the room.

 

[silents]

ok im set on getting the lepai and MB42 but as i was searching around, some guy got the Behringer UCA202 instead of a sound card. so how does the Behringer UCA202 compare to the creative zx?

 

[Nenu]

Its a very cheap external DAC.
If you are after quality sound, its not what you want.

 

[silents]

ok thanks guys
im set then

creative Zx
MB42's
Lepai LP-2020A+
Dayton Audio SUB-1200

I'll let you guys know how much i like it once the MB42 is back in stock.

on another note
are these wire good enough
http://www.amazon.com/AH1650SR-Feet-16-Gauge-Speaker-Wire/dp/B0029HO66G/ref=pd_sim_e_2 how do you know what gauge is good for the speakers?

and does banana plug even matter? will i get the same sound quality just tigthen it in without the banna plug?

 

[Nenu]

Dont touch that wire, it is aluminium.

In my experience (using a very good wire), the fatter the better for deepest bass reproduction - up to a point.
I'm using 9AWG 6mm square (3mm dia) pure copper, bi wired.
The 16 gauge wire you were looking at is 1.3mm dia aluminium - coated with impure copper, not good at all.
I changed from 1.5mm dia bi wired to 3mm dia bi wired (both van damme) and noticed a good difference in bass depth even at low volume.

My advice is get some OFC Van Damme wire if possible, perhaps 12AWG (2mm) or fatter, sadly Van Damme is not on the US Amazon that I can see.
The smaller the number, the fatter the wire.
Get this 14AWG (1.6mm) OFC wire as a minimum:
http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-100-Feet-High-Purity-Oxygen-Free-Speaker/dp/B001UNLRGC
Plenty of wire to play with, you can double it up and see if that gives any benefit for you.


If you dont use banana plugs, you will have a better connection. Every banana plug adds an extra poor connection point, defeating the point of a securely fastened wire. Not the best thing for audio.
Direct wire connection is best at both ends, this is what I use.

 

[silents]

$120 Creative Zx
$60 Micca MB42
$24 Lepai amp
$169 Dayton Audio SUB-1200 12"
$38 monoprice 12 awg speaker wire
$5 Monoprice 3.5 to RCA

 

[Nenu]

Its cheaper to buy the speaker wire direct from Monoprice.
http://www.monoprice.com/products/search.asp?keyword=12awg
You can buy 50ft instead of 100ft also.
Costs $14.68

 

[AlmostEvil]

I have a used Zx I'm no longer using. Switched receivers and using hdmi audio. Pm me if interested. Card is working flawlessly

 

[matteos]

I would put most of your money towards upgrading the speakers first. Then maybe a dac or Zx. Depends on your budget as to what speakers but always look towards used receivers and speakers. Those can get you killer sound for cheap.

^^This x 1000

Your soundcard is absolutely fine until you have better speakers. If you care mostly about music a good set of stereo speakers or 2.1 solution would be best.

As of right now the best budget option for new gear is a set of the Pioneer SP bookshelves on sale for $80, a $30-$50 T-amp and a sub like the Bic F12 or Dayton 1200 if you want to be cheaper ($120-$200)

Or look at used gear.

 

[matteos]

Its cheaper to buy the speaker wire direct from Monoprice.
http://www.monoprice.com/products/search.asp?keyword=12awg
You can buy 50ft instead of 100ft also.
Costs $14.68

Just make sure you get the 99.99% oxygen free copper (not copper coated aluminum wire). Seems for whatever reason a lot of speaker wire is copper coated aluminum which is inferior, though I really can't imagine how copper coated aluminum can be much cheaper to produce.