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Upgrade from 4850

Rauelius said:
Maybe instead of exclusively going by reviews and write ups you should test the hardware yourself? Oh, and when I tested them I did it on my 2600k machine, not my Q6600 machine, so no bottleneck. Maybe a little experience will learn you, test the hardware yourself, don't trust others (even me) :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
yeah why trust sites like hardocp, techpowerup, anandtech, legionhardware, tomshardware, hardwarecanucks, techreport and on and on when we can have YOU give us the REAL scoop. :rolleyes:
 
Well, I test with the newest drivers. Lots of the posted benchmarks are using older drivers, therefore inaccurate. The GTS450 and 5770 improved quite a bit with newer drivers. My friend, Cannondale, I stated don't trust ME, prove it to yourself. Overall, I'd recommend a GTX450 or 5770 over a GTX260/275 or 4870/4890, due to lower power consumption and DX11 and when the respective 128-bit cards are overclocked they are comparable to their older DX10 ancestors in performance, just personal experience...take it or leave it, please don't take it as an attack against, I apologize for your limited experience.
 
More info for the OP, this review is recent(8/29/11)using the newest drivers. As I stated previously drivers can make a huge difference in performance, enough to make a highly overclocked GTS 450 almost as fast as a GTX275. At launch the 6850 was noticably slower than the 5850, now after some improvments, the 6850 for the most part overshadows the 5850, however the 6870 is still slightly slower than the 5870. If you hop on that deal I posted for the 6870, that will be quite nice especially since the price difference between the 6850 and 6870 is close enough to justify the 6870 purchase.

http://www.kitguru.net/components/g...-hd6850-vapor-x-edition-graphics-card-review/
 
enough with your bs claims, please. there is NO damn way a gts450 is as fast as a gtx275. AGAIN even the gtx550Ti is slower than a gtx260 so how in the hell do you think a gts450 can match a gtx275. you have no proof of anything and all you do is pull shit out of your ass with claims like that.
 
cannondale06 said:
enough with your bs claims, please. there is NO damn way a gts450 is as fast as a gtx275. AGAIN even the gtx550Ti is slower than a gtx260 so how in the hell do you think a gts450 can match a gtx275. you have no proof of anything and all you do is pull shit out of your ass with claims like that.
Click to expand...

His monitor is upside down so the graphs are all backwards. Must be the case :)It's not his fault, he just needs to trn his monitor right side up and he'll see it's slower, not faster ;)
 
Rauelius said:
Maybe instead of exclusively going by reviews and write ups you should test the hardware yourself? Oh, and when I tested them I did it on my 2600k machine, not my Q6600 machine, so no bottleneck. Maybe a little experience will learn you, test the hardware yourself, don't trust others (even me) :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

I know because I've used the hardware and what you have stated thus far is complete BS.
Show us some graphs and some reals specs, especially screenshots.

I don't want your opinion, mainly because your opinion contradicts every other hardware review, benchmark, and spec in existence.

A GTS450 has 192SP and 57.7GB/s memory bandwidth. Now you tell me, how the hell can it match a GTX275 which has 240SP and 127GB/s memory bandwidth.

Oh wait, you can't. :rolleyes:
 
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not to mention a gtx275 has 80 TMUs compared to the gts450's 32. in fact there is not a single metric where the gts450 would match the gtx275.
 
I commend your vitriol, but am saddened by your limited paradigm. You all have my condolences.
 
Rauelius said:
I commend your vitriol, but am saddened by your limited paradigm. You all have my condolences.
Click to expand...

We both just proved your ass wrong and that's all you have to counter us with? Pfff :rolleyes:

So, what was that you were saying about the GTS450 being faster than the GTX275? :D

Who's paradigm is limited now?
Oh, that's right, yours.
 
I say sell your q6600 and sell your 4850. Buy a 6850/6870/gtx 460 1gb, a q9xxx series chip, and 2gb more ram.

But at that point your not to far off from a sandybridge build. So might want to consider that as well.
 
BrooksyX said:
I say sell your q6600 and sell your 4850. Buy a 6850/6870/gtx 460 1gb, a q9xxx series chip, and 2gb more ram.

But at that point your not to far off from a sandybridge build. So might want to consider that as well.
Click to expand...

+1 Do what he said.
 
a q9 is going to cost more than the base SB quad core i5.

now is a good time to unload 775 hardware as once Ivy hits the new sockets are going to get even more popular and prices on low will will creep down, and the used market will pick up

I did some math in a similar thread on anandtech and it was like 300-350 for a good q9 and the 6870

or about 550 for a cheap SB quad core, then you still got to sell your 775 equipment.
 
gtx260 (216) = 5770=4870 ,give or take a few%.
A gtx275/4890/gtx550ti/6790 = overclocked 5770 or overclocked gtx260 (216), give or take a few%
gts450/5750 overclocked = 5770

Thats basically it.
 
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Either do it on the cheap and grab a 2nd card for CFX, or grab a mid to lower end card (6870,GTX 460)
If I were in your shoes I would sell it off and grab an i3/560 Ti and be set for a few years again.
 
Or you can get an i3-2100 now with a Z68 board and be in a good spot for Ivy Bridge. I've seen some good write ups on the i3-2100. I have clocked down my 2600k to those speeds (3.1Ghz) and disabled HT. And performance very acceptable...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115078 ($125)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128495 ($115)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133326 ($120 After Mir)

So $360 for a pretty decent upgrade, and you'll be ready for Ivy Bridge (I believe Intel is keeping the same socket)

You can always go with a Cheaper AMD set up in hopes of Bulldozer does well.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103808 ($120)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157262& Tpk=Asrock%20970 ($105)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131374 ($140 After MIR)

The AMD set up will be $365. You can of course mix and match the cards, but either may be cheaper/more sensible than going with a Q9.
 
yes, an i3 2100 = Phenom II x4 @ 3.7

They had a combo special at Microcenter with a motherboard and i3 2100 for 106$. I'm not sure if its still going on.
 
Rauelius said:
Or you can get an i3-2100 now with a Z68 board and be in a good spot for Ivy Bridge. I've seen some good write ups on the i3-2100. I have clocked down my 2600k to those speeds (3.1Ghz) and disabled HT. And performance very acceptable....
Click to expand...
real cores and more cache on the 2600k make that a bit of a stretch for direct comparison.
 
happymedium said:
yes, an i3 2100 = Phenom II x4 @ 3.7

They had a combo special at Microcenter with a motherboard and i3 2100 for 106$. I'm not sure if its still going on.
Click to expand...

Crazy isn't it? It's a sad time to be an AMD fan when the (arguably) Celeron of this generation is comparable to a near top of the line processor from AMD..:(
 
cannondale06 said:
only $106 for a 2100 and mobo? :eek:
Click to expand...

Yea I had a motherboard ,i3 2100 and 4gb of memory for 142$ in my cart. I was gona sell my setup and upgrade and buy a 2500k next year.

Then I decided to just run this system till the end with one more gpu upgrade at the end of the year..
.My motherboard has seen a 8800gt, gtx260, 5750 and a gtx460 so far. ANd a e5400 ,e8400 and q9550 overclocked cpu's.
Amazing value.
 
It's a damn shame that the New i3's don't overclock at all, otherwise, I'd get one to play with. Imagine the overclocks!?!
 
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/gts450_091210205112/24677.png

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/gts450_091210205112/24673.png

Ok I thought I was done, but Check out the GTS450 (an overclocked one) keeping up or less than 10 frames behind the GTX275...and that was around launch, performance has improved a bit with driver enhancements that haven't exactly carried over to the older DX10 parts.

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/gts450_091210205112/24679.png

In that one the GTS450 is SLAUGHTERED by the GTX275...but so is the GTX460! And now the GTX460 ROCKS the GTX275 IN L4D, you don't think these performance improvements carried over to the baby Fermi?

Ok, I'm done, take what you will....I put my piece in...Yes, I am aware the GTX275 OC's to, but the question was an GTS450 OC to the brink vs a Stock GTX275.
 
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10fps is a big jump, and the GTS450, even OCed will not reach even that of a stock GTX275.
Even OCed, the GTS450 might be able to get a few more fps, but not 10fps.
They aren't even close in any of the graphs. It would be one thing if they were neck-in-neck, but they aren't even close!
What was the point of this? You just proved my point earlier.

but so is the GTX460! And now the GTX460 ROCKS the GTX275 IN L4D
Click to expand...
Why do you say this? You don't show a graph backing your statement.
Only one of the graphs show the GTX460 beating the GTX275, and it wasn't on L4D.
 
:rolleyes: I did, did you even check out the EVGA GTS450 FTW (one that at Stock is close my my GTS450's OC) It's neck and neck with a Stock GTX275.

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/gts450_091210205112/24677.png

If you need help, I'll pull the image from Anandtech and then circle the card I am talking about. Let me know.

*Here's a clue, it's the one right next to the GTX275, hope that helps.

Red Falcon said:
10fps is a big jump, and the GTS450, even OCed will not reach even that of a stock GTX275.
Even OCed, the GTS450 might be able to get a few more fps, but not 10fps.
They aren't even close in any of the graphs. It would be one thing if they were neck-in-neck, but they aren't even close!
What was the point of this? You just proved my point earlier.


Why do you say this? You don't show a graph backing your statement.
Only one of the graphs show the GTX460 beating the GTX275, and it wasn't on L4D.
Click to expand...
 
Guess I was looking at the TOP model. Wow, the new architecture definitely makes a difference, even though there are fewer SP and memory bandwidth. Good call.

One thing for sure though, push more than 4x AA and the GTS450 will buckle due to the lack of memory bandwidth.
That is the one advantage of the GTX275.
 
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I'd say that a 6870 is well worth the upgrade...about twice as fast as a 4850 plus double the RAM and DX11...

I just played Deus Ex: Human Revolution max settings DX11 no AA @ 1080p and ran at near constant 60fps (Vsync enabled).

Of course I'm running a i7-950 at 3.8ghz too so I'm pretttty sure thats on a whole other level than the Q6600 ;-)

Either case, for $160 its a totally awesome card...only games I've played that gave me slow down is Metro 2033 at max DX11 1080p (given) and GTA4 but I also have GTA4 modded out the ass.

However I will say that if you have $220 to spend or so...sell your current CPU/MOBO/RAM and upgrade to a used i5-750 or there abouts, decent motherboard and 4GB DDR3 with the left over ~$100 plus what $ you have after the sell (considering you also sell the 4850) and you'll be on a whole new level! The Q6600 is a decent CPU, but it is starting to show its age with newer video cards for sure...
 
Deus Ex LOVES cache...it runs great on the i7 and believe it or not the Phenom II Quad-Core and higher.
 
Rauelius said:
:rolleyes: I did, did you even check out the EVGA GTS450 FTW (one that at Stock is close my my GTS450's OC) It's neck and neck with a Stock GTX275.

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/gts450_091210205112/24677.png

If you need help, I'll pull the image from Anandtech and then circle the card I am talking about. Let me know.

*Here's a clue, it's the one right next to the GTX275, hope that helps.
Click to expand...
so you found ONE game where a highly oced gts450 can match the gtx275? it could simply be something strange about that game or a driver issue with older cards. the next closest the overclocked gts450 gets in a game still has the gtx275 beating it by 18%. after that the stock gtx275 is over 20% faster overall than a highly oced gts450. so again what happy and I said earlier is true in 99% of cases. its just like there is a game or two where Phenom 2 can match he 2500k but overall its still slower.
 
The GTS450 certainly is powerful, but where it lacks is memory bandwidth. Though the GPU itself, if OCed, is able to keep up with the GTX275, it is only with low AA.

Increase the AA beyond 4x and the GTX275 will blow the GTS450 out of the water.
 
OK....fine, I will show you

http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gts-450-review-roundup/21

The Palit Sonic Platinum gts450 is within 2 frames of the GTX275 (Mine is OC higher)

Looked for more benches comparing the two but that's the only one I could find with the GTX275.

So, no it's not isolated. And driver improvments now has the GTS (OC) running with the GTX275. Deal with it, it's a better architecture...Your not going to sit there and tell me that the 8600GT is not faster than the 7800GT? That's the nature of the industry, the next mainstream is comprable to the last mid-high. 6850 is now faster than the 5850 (again driver improvments).
 
I'd get the 6950 or even a 6970 if you can find an open box or refurbished one on newegg or such. It's overkill for his monitor atm, but he may want to upgrade to 1920x1200 eventually so could futureproof a little.
Would also agree on a SB setup tho, makes a world of difference for a not so bad price.
(In my case, NEVER going back to 1920x1200 once i upgraded to 2560 lol)
 
Rauelius said:
OK....fine, I will show you

http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gts-450-review-roundup/21

The Palit Sonic Platinum gts450 is within 2 frames of the GTX275 (Mine is OC higher)

Looked for more benches comparing the two but that's the only one I could find with the GTX275.

So, no it's not isolated. And driver improvments now has the GTS (OC) running with the GTX275. Deal with it, it's a better architecture...Your not going to sit there and tell me that the 8600GT is not faster than the 7800GT? That's the nature of the industry, the next mainstream is comprable to the last mid-high. 6850 is now faster than the 5850 (again driver improvments).
Click to expand...

I hate to admit it, but I was wrong. The new architecture has improved drastically over the last. GTX200 series SP /= GTX4/500 series SP.

The one thing that really amazes me is that even at 8x AA, the GTS450 still holds close to the GTX275, even though it has only a little over half the memory bandwidth.

-salutes- ;)
 
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