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Time for major sound upgrade... input?

P

pbXassassinX1524

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 24, 2003
Messages
1,295
whats up everyone, after purchasing D3 I realize that I need to get a sound upgrade, onboard audio and 2.1 creatives arent cutting it. I am putting it before my graphics upgrade because sound doesn't evolve nearly as quick as graphics do, so I'm going to sit on this piece until I'm looking at slideshows in everything I do.

So, I was origionally planning on going with the classic Audigy 2 ZS and the Logitech Z-680 5.1 setup, sounds good, full THX certification, 500 watts, the works. Then I stumbled upon the M-audio revolution 7.1, which in all aspects equals and sometimes beats out the audigy cards. But I've also seen its more for like music and movies then games. So does anyone here even use this card? Has anyone ever heard of it? It doesn't have the THX like the audigy, so I'm just looking for opinions on the audigy/logitech setup or the M-audio card.

Here's the link to the m-audio card
 
Let me be the first to inform you that THX certification is %99.44 marketing gimmickry that means virtually nothing. Please pay no attention to it. Can I get a witness?

I own a Revo. I like it. It has clean output that makes my headphones happy. The bass management and Circle Surround 2 features are excellent and will make integrating it into an eventual HTPC much nicer. I feel that the control panel software interface could use some work, but compared to the sprawling mess that makes up Creative software, it looks like genius.

I don't do FPS games on it, however. Some say that lack of support for hardware positional audio on the Revo will hit your framerates. I have no idea.

Techreport did some testing on the performance hit that soundcards can cause. That's 3DMark and UT2004 however, and I have not seen Doom 3 benchmarks. I have also heard that Doom 3 does all its audio in software anyhow, so I'm not sure how much a soundcard could influence framerates.
 
Clown is right, THX doesn't mean shit. No one in the world would notice the difference between hearing THX and non-THX sound.

Only a consumer whore would pay $250 for a sound card. (Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Pro)

Don't get any Creative Labs products, read some post on this board and you'll learn they have horrible drivers and they're just very over rated.

Get a nforce 2 motherboard or an Audiotrak Maya 5.1 sound card and hook it up to a receiver.
 
uhh... ownsalot I have no where near enough room to get ANOTHER reciever for my PC to power speakers bsaed around it, so thats a no. When did I mention the platinum pro anywhere? Why would I buy a motherboard to lessen my current performance and toally change platforms... don't ever post again.

Hmm, I always thought THX meant something, thanks, learn something new every day.

That "sprawling mess" that is creative is the exact reason I'm trying to stay away from them, I know exactly what your talking about. But that test... I don't know, thats a big hit I'm trying to avoid from my current setup.

Now, my onboard audio right now will support 5.1 channels but I lose Mic support, and about (according to [H]) a 30% drop in performance.

Looks like a toss up between performance and TERRIBLE software. Hrm, I'm leaning towards terrible software. Looks like the audigy is still working on top in that and several other tests. *deep breath* audigy it is.
 
GodsMadClown said:
Let me be the first to inform you that THX certification is %99.44 marketing gimmickry that means virtually nothing. Please pay no attention to it. Can I get a witness?
Click to expand...
Agreed,

My friend flipped his lid when I told him he wasted a lot of money spending extra on a receiver just to get THX certification. It's hoopla.
 
So what do you guys think about that speaker set? I know its very very popular, but the 50 bucks I spent on the Creative speakers I have right now I feel was a very good deal and they sound much better then I thought. So I was also thinking about the Creative set; the model escapes me right now, but its very similar to the logitech.
 
Klipsch Promedia 5.1 >> Logitech 680. Don't worry about a receiver. Tell us a budget. Perhaps you can get an new 2.1 set for the front, hook up your old 2.1 to the rear channels and have a 4 point surround system. Center channels aren't that big a deal in gaming.
 
The Klipsch I've heard is nice but I'm only 16... so it being over 100 bucks more then the Logitech is too much for me.

I would think that in gaming any dialogue (exactly like dolby digital movies) would come through the center channel. Thats not the case in games?

would doubling up systems still sound good? I assume that they are all the same satellite speakers but I would have to run 2 subs, looking on newegg (where I bought the creatives I have now) they either stopped showing them or creative stopped making them. They are Inspire 2500s.

by the way this was the Creative set I was looking at.
 
If you already have a receiver, buy a Audiotrak Maya 5.1($40) and hook it up to your receiver with optical out.

About the consumer whore comment, alot of people blow money on products cause of hype and labels such as "THX certified".
 
pbXassassinX1524 said:
I would think that in gaming any dialogue (exactly like dolby digital movies) would come through the center channel. Thats not the case in games?
Click to expand...

Center channels are for audiences of 2+ people. One person can get by w/o a center channel by sitting in the sweet spot. Tell Windows and your soundcard driver that you have 4.1 speakers and the dialogue will get sent to the front chanels. I watch movies at home with a stereo pair of speakers. The dialoge for me is just fine, but my wife complains. I'm going to get a center soon. On the computer, I leave my center turned off. I think it sounds weird.

pbXassassinX1524 said:
would doubling up systems still sound good?
Click to expand...

It'll sound fine. It's better to spend all your speaker budget on a good 2.1 system, rather than to spend that same budget on a 5.1 system. Using the old speaker s for surround duty will give you the surround experience w/o you buying speakers that you don't really need. I'm not really a gamer, but I wouldn't think it critically necessary for super nice sound on the rear channels if they're really only there to give positional cues. Front channels are much more important than surrounds.

pbXassassinX1524 said:
...but I would have to run 2 subs...
Click to expand...
Sounds below about 80 Htz are non-directional. You just can't effectively tell where they are coming from. So, two subwoofers is no problem, as long as they have decently low crossovers. If you start to notice that the the bass is coming from "over there", then you should turn down the level on the back of the subwoofer, or route the bass away from those channels on the soundcard level. Buzzing or rattling because of sympathetic vibrations can also give away the location of a subwoofer. Having two subwoofers is not much more of a challenge than having one subwoofer. You still need to set it up properly.

pbXassassinX1524 said:
this was the Creative set I was looking at.
Click to expand...

So we can assume that $200 is your upper limit?
Here are some ideas.

REFURBISHED: Swans T-120 w/ Subwoofer 2.1 Hi-end Multimedia Speakers -OEM
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=36-136-103R&type=Refurbish
$135.85
FedEx Saver Shipping $8.99

Swans T-120 w/ Subwoofer 2.1 Hi-end Multimedia Speakers -OEM
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=36-136-103&depa=0
$149.00
FedEx Saver Shipping $10.99

Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX Certified Personal Speaker System -RETAIL
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=36-119-101&depa=0
$159.99
FedEx Saver Shipping $13.50

ALTEC LANSING MX5021 2.1 Multimedia Speakers -RETAIL
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=36-113-139&depa=0
$133.49
FedEx Saver Shipping $10.00
 
My upper price limit for speakers ends at the Logitechs being 240 bucks.

Now, I don't wan't to sound like I'm saying you don't know what your talking about(you obviously seem to), but it just doesn't feel best to mis match speakers like that. I've done it before for home theater and it sounds atrotous compared to nice voice matched speakers that were meant to work together.

I mean, I'd rather pay the extra to get the whole set of speakers (besides the Klipsch, they're too much like I said) that should are voice matched, powered nicely to sound equal, stuff like that. I get the fact that the best way to go would be the Klipsch, like you said its better to pay more for a 5.1 system then equal for 2.1 and 5.1. The system I have now is a whopping 50 watts, and pairing it with that Klipsch 2.1 system at 200 watts, I think at higher volumes it would fall apart on me.

Ok, how about this. It's just a matter of saving up for the Klipsch 5.1 kit and the Audigy 2 ZS, I mean if I'm sacraficing something now that I will regret later I don't wan't to put myself in that spot. It's going to take me a while cause of car payments and what little coin I make now, since it seems impossibly hard for me to get a job right now w/o being able to drive myself.
 
GMC - based on what you said in your last post about a center channel not being necessary for gaming are you suggesting that, say, a klipsch 5.1 system would be more than needed and a 4.1 would do just fine? i'm also trying to figure out the best bang for my buck.
 
If you are considering other alternatives don't rule out the Boston Acoustics BA7900. This is hands down the best 5.1 set that I have owned, and at 89.00 for the set, its a steal. I have owned z-5300, Klipsch GMX-D and my brother has Klipsch PM Ultras that I've compared them to and they actually sound smoother in the high frequencies, although the bass output of the Klipsch's is a bit more powerful. I paired this set with the M-Audio Revo, (I wanted good DACS on all outputs not just for stereo like the Chaintech and other Envy24-HTS cards), and it amazes me every single time especially with DVD-Audio.

I play D3 with the revo using positional audio, at 1280x1024, high quality, no AA (the game looks so good that AA isn't really needed IMO. Only rarely do my fps drop into the non-playable range. (I have a moderately powerful setup, see sig)
 
Having run both the Revo and the A2, I'd have to say the Revo is top notch for Music/Movies, but not as good as the A2 when it comes to gaming. Specifically in the FPS genre of games.

Personally my system runs like this. (all using digital outs to a receiver)

Revo 7.1 for listening to my movies/music

SoundStorm for my games. Nothing beats DD 5.1 encoding on the fly :D

I wasn't all the pleased with the A2 ZS' digital out. Just couldn't get it to sound "right".
 
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