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Thermal compunds in 2013?

J

JimmiG

2[H]4U
Joined
Apr 3, 2008
Messages
2,429
So it's time for me to build a new system, and I'm wondering about one minor detail - TIM.

I have in my possession from previous builds:
1x Syringe of Arctic Silver 5 (probably 6 years old, used only once)
1x Syringe of Zalman STG-2 (about 3-4 years old, also used only once)

-Are any of those still competitive in 2013 or have they been surpassed by newer compounds?
-Is the age a concern?
-Should I go for the AS5, the STG-2 or buy something else? If so, what?

I've been trying to find reviews, but the results are all over the place. In some, AS5 was still almost on top, while in others it was a good 4-5C higher than more recent ones.

Obviously, thermal paste is cheap compared to other computer parts, but if you go with the "wrong" one, removing it and starting over is a bit of a pain. The cooler may never perform as great as it would have done with a clean application of TIM.
 
How anal arr you about getting every last centigrade due to tim? AS5 has been long surpassed... But a better tim will only net you at most a handful of centigrade.
 
Skripka said:
How anal arr you about getting every last centigrade due to tim? AS5 has been long surpassed... But a better tim will only net you at most a handful of centigrade.
Click to expand...

Well, the difference might be small, but thermal compound only costs a few bucks for a tube. Might as well throw one in with the rest of the order if it makes a noticeable difference over what I already have..
 
AS-5 is temperamental to say the least...

- It takes around two weeks of heat cycling to fully "cure" AS-5.
- It's only good for around two years because it begins to break down.
- It's slightly capacitive, so it's not 100% safe for use on bare components.
- It only lasts about two years in the tube. It separates, and it's very difficult to recover it for additional uses once that happens.
- The silver content makes it as expensive as thermal compounds that don't have the above issues.

These days I usually go with Arctic Cooling MX-4 for most applications. MX-4 can be a bit thick, so I'll use Noctua NT-H1 for anything that requires a thinner thermal compound.
Curing time on both MX4 and NT-H1 is practically non-existent, they're guaranteed to last 10+ years, and they're not electrically conductive or capacitive in any way.
 
JimmiG said:
Well, the difference might be small, but thermal compound only costs a few bucks for a tube. Might as well throw one in with the rest of the order if it makes a noticeable difference over what I already have..
Click to expand...

Unknown-One said:
AS-5 is temperamental to say the least...

- It takes around two weeks of heat cycling to fully "cure" AS-5.
- It's only good for around two years because it begins to break down.
- It's slightly capacitive, so it's not 100% safe for use on bare components.
- It only lasts about two years in the tube. It separates, and it's very difficult to recover it for additional uses once that happens.
- The silver content makes it as expensive as thermal compounds that don't have the above issues.

These days I usually go with Arctic Cooling MX-4 for most applications. MX-4 can be a bit thick, so I'll use Noctua NT-H1 for anything that requires a thinner thermal compound.
Curing time on both MX4 and NT-H1 is practically non-existent, they're guaranteed to last 10+ years, and they're not electrically conductive or capacitive in any way.
Click to expand...

AS-5, among any TIM comparison is actually one of the cheapest TIMs on a per application basis. For the amount of money a syringe of say Shin-Etsu 7783D costs that does only 3 CPU mounts...You can get an AS-5 syringe that'll last for a dozen or more mounts.

I'll second the MX4 rec though. Nice stuff, easy to work with, not too expensive, and can be used on any old component.
 
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Unknown-One said:
Not at the current prices I'm seeing. Just hit up Amazon and came up with this:

3.5g tube of AS-5, $8.23 + Free shipping
4.0g tube of MX-4, $2.01 + $4.99 shipping

Even after the shipping fee, that makes the smaller tube of AS-5 more expensive than the larger tube of MX-4...
Click to expand...

And you can get a 12g syringe of AS5 on Amazon for $16USD that does 3X as many CPU mounts. In other words, MX4 is 30% more expensive per mount. Same story goes for just about any 3g syringe of TIM compared to the 12g AS-5 syringe.
 
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As an Amazon Associate, HardForum may earn from qualifying purchases.
Skripka said:
Helps that you're posting mega-sales that are seldom seen. ;)

If you're paying close to normal price, 12g AS-5 wins the economy category every time.
Click to expand...
$19 isn't unusual for the 20g tube of MX-4 as far as I've seen, it's not even $5 more than that ordering it directly from Arctic Cooling (who tend to have waaaaay higher prices than Amazon) :confused:

And $0.95 per gram (MX-4) vs. $0.75 per gram (AS-5) isn't that big a difference, especially considering you're advised to re-apply the AS-5 every 2 years. Re-applying kills the cost savings outright.

In any case, spending an extra $3 upgrades you from 12g to 20g, and it's 20g of better stuff. I'll take the $3 hit ;)
 
Last edited:
Was about to start another thread, but found this one that is pretty much on the same topic and quite recent, so I'd figure it would be best to bump it instead.



So, after reading this comparison, are the best effective thermal paste options the Phobya HeGrease, the Prolimatech PK-1, and the Tuniq TX-4 if one were wanting to squeeze every last degC of cooling out of their TIM? I didn't count the Indigo Xtreme since it's not a simple paste...

Does anyone with the experience of any of the three mentioned options feel that it would make a decent difference for my system?

i7-3770K
Xigmatech Loki 92mm
AS5

Right now, my average idle temps are between 26-38C depending on the core. Typical load temps while gaming, depending on the game, are between 64-80C for the hottest core. A few months ago I did use some AS5 that is 3+ years old in the syringe, not realizing that it has a bit of a limited shelf life, which could explain what I feel is hotter temps than what I should be realizing. Anyway, can anyone help out?
 
I'm still a big fan of MX-2. Its dirt cheap and I have never seen a difference between it and MX-4. MX-2 actually seems a bit more consistent.
 
The best of the best atm (afaik) is the junpus d9000. Pricey as hell compared to others but as someone else here wrote...if temps matter to you A LOT then it's worth the extra $ imho.
 
If you don't muck around with your build a lot, Indigo Xtreme is probably the best. Otherwise NT-H1, MX4, etc. are all good. Avoid AS5 for the above mentioned reasons, it had its day, but there are better and more convenient pastes around now.
 
scbesterman said:
The best of the best atm (afaik) is the junpus d9000. Pricey as hell compared to others but as someone else here wrote...if temps matter to you A LOT then it's worth the extra $ imho.
Click to expand...

I just checked out some reviews, and while the D9000 does perform remarkably, it has a limited shelf life on in-use life that's about the same as AS5.
 
Hmm, I have an old, heavily OC'd C2D (6320) being cooled with a modified Nautilus 500 using AS5 paste. Haven't touched it since I built the system some 5 years ago, and now I'm wondering if I shouldn't take it apart and reapply.

Still runs 33C idle and 47C with Prime 95, and the two cores seem to report similiar temps, so I don't know if I will bother with it.
 
Mr. K6 said:
If you don't muck around with your build a lot, Indigo Xtreme is probably the best. Otherwise NT-H1, MX4, etc. are all good. Avoid AS5 for the above mentioned reasons, it had its day, but there are better and more convenient pastes around now.
Click to expand...
I really don't know why IX doesn't get more attention in these discussions. Yeah it's weird to apply but once it has melted there's no real way to have a bad application. I saw some review of a bunch of different types of TM where they tried to compare the differences between poor, decent, and expert applications of TIM, and IX was the same for every test, there was no bad way to apply it, and to top it off it had the best performance at all test levels. Sure it's expensive but it also never goes bad, there's nothing to dry out or degrade, so if you're like me and intend to never upgrade your CPU without upgrading the whole system too, then it really doesn't get any better than IX, one and done.
 
-Dragon- said:
Sure it's expensive but it also never goes bad, there's nothing to dry out or degrade, so if you're like me and intend to never upgrade your CPU without upgrading the whole system too, then it really doesn't get any better than IX, one and done.
Click to expand...
After seeing the way CPU's were going and having my Sandy sitting comfortably at 4.8GHz, I decided to take a step back in upgrading as well. At ~$10 it's damn expensive TIM, but again, if you only apply once and that's it, why need a tube? Truth be told I believe it has a more pronounced improvement in air coolers, but even on water it was better than the MX4 I had on it before.
 
Yeah I used to pay $5-10 for a tube only to use one application then throw it in a drawer for 2 or 3 years and by the time I need it again it's all separated, thick, or otherwise nasty and I have to buy another tube anyway. I've not seen any reviews that include IX that didn't have IX winning handily, and like I said it's practically impossible to screw up the application. The only reason not to use IX is if you're delidding but if I was going to delid something I'd try to find a vapor chamber to act as a heat spreader then probably use the IX on the heat spreader to water block interface.

Unless someone made a water block with an integrated vapor chamber heat spreader, which would be amazing.
 
DejaWiz said:
I just checked out some reviews, and while the D9000 does perform remarkably, it has a limited shelf life on in-use life that's about the same as AS5.
Click to expand...

Good point DejaWiz. Op asked for the best...I took that as max performance and excluded the points you raise. I use the junpus exclusively for sub-zero and the longest it's on a given cpu (and cold) is only a few hours.
 
Just a quick note, I pulled a 4 year old tube of AS5 out of the box where it has been for the past 2 years. Other than a dried tip at the end of the syringe, it appeared to be pretty much the same consistency as when I bought it. Considering now if I'll use it on my up and coming build or not.
 
TastEPlasma said:
Just a quick note, I pulled a 4 year old tube of AS5 out of the box where it has been for the past 2 years. Other than a dried tip at the end of the syringe, it appeared to be pretty much the same consistency as when I bought it. Considering now if I'll use it on my up and coming build or not.
Click to expand...

I have a tube of AS5 that I bought probably 9 years ago, when I was building a dual CPU AMD system. I don't do that many builds, so the tube is still not empty. And it seems to still spread out OK. But after reading this thread, I got a tube of MX-4 for my latest build.
 
Those only matter if they are actually over the CPU heat spreader itself, I use IX on a H100 just fine, pretty sure those screws are outside the contact area that matters.
 
TastEPlasma said:
Hmm, I have an old, heavily OC'd C2D (6320) being cooled with a modified Nautilus 500 using AS5 paste. Haven't touched it since I built the system some 5 years ago, and now I'm wondering if I shouldn't take it apart and reapply.

Still runs 33C idle and 47C with Prime 95, and the two cores seem to report similiar temps, so I don't know if I will bother with it.
Click to expand...

If you still get good temps then you're fine. It does dry out but if it's not disturbed it should be okay. However, I just reapplied some on an old PC and it did make a little difference.
 
Skripka said:
How anal arr you about getting every last centigrade due to tim? AS5 has been long surpassed... But a better tim will only net you at most a handful of centigrade.
Click to expand...

Why would you sign up on an enthusiast forum to criticize people for being picky about their setup?

As far as TIM's go, yes I think there are several choices which are better than AS5 (even if only marginally better). I switched from AS5 to Diamond IC7 and saw a couple of degrees drop in temps. Only down-side with IC7 is that it will stain your processor/heatsink. This is only cosmetic though and does not cause damage or reduce performance.

Coolaboratory Pro is supposed to be excellent but it is a bit more expensive and possibly trickier to apply. I've also read good things about Indigo Xtreme.
 
I am tempted to go Indigo Xtreme, but I find the burn in process a bit much. Forcing a chip to its thermal max, even for a few minutes, just seems counter-intuitive to the point of a TIM.
 
TastEPlasma said:
I am tempted to go Indigo Xtreme, but I find the burn in process a bit much. Forcing a chip to its thermal max, even for a few minutes, just seems counter-intuitive to the point of a TIM.
Click to expand...
~85C isn't the thermal max of modern chips.
 
Hmm, but it is the temperature at which thermal throttling kicks in? Oh, right, and thermal throttling can be disabled in most BIOS. Just don't know if I am feeling adventurous enough.
 
Artificiary said:
Why would you sign up on an enthusiast forum to criticize people for being picky about their setup?
Click to expand...

I'm a cheap bastard. And if you have a working component that works and doesn't really pose any IRL harm in performance, why ditch it? Like I said I'm a cheap bastard. It is a different thing if you're out and have to buy new,

Mr. K6 said:
~85C isn't the thermal max of modern chips.
Click to expand...

Depends on the flavor of chip, as well as what you call "thermal maximum".
 
You don't disable thermal throttling, it's suggested to set BIOS settings to default, default clocks, voltage, thermal throttling enabled. Since most modern CPUs have circuits that prevent them from frying themselves you just let it get hot enough to melt the IX for a few seconds (I didn't even have to boot into windows just sat in BIOS until it melted, had to unplug the H100 pump to let it melt). It's actually easier to melt the IX with a LCS vs a large HSF with multiple heat tubes, as they can practically cool a CPU passively, turning the pump off melts the TIM quick.
 
Decided on MX-4. Looking at my platform (RIVG and 3820), its unlikely that those few degrees that IX could bring would be enough to see any gains beyond the probable limitations I already face.

However, I just couldn't bring myself to be comfortable with the unnamed paste on the h80i or the 5-yr old tube of AS5 I have.

MX-4 has quite a positive rep, and good benchmark scores, so it had to be the one.
 
Honestly I didn't get IX as much for it's cooling gains but for the fact that it's practically impossible to screw up, which is always my biggest fear when building a new system, screwing up the TIM. Too much, air bubbles, whatever, even if I do a test run or two I'm always certain I'll screw up the final application, but with IX if it hasn't melted then your CPU overheats and throttles so it's obvious you screwed it up, if your CPU doesn't throttle then you're pretty much guaranteed a great application. I'll pay a bit extra and do a bit more work to be sure it's good.
 
For MX-4 that is only 4 g, how many CPU can you do? I don't do 1 drop, I use a blade to smoothen the entire surface w/ the TIM
 
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