Text on 32" 1080p

M

MortalSyn

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Currently I have two 24" Dells which are great, but I am planning to upgrade and I am trying to decide between the Dell 30" or something like the Sharp 32" 1080p. The biggest consideration is that I spend most of my day programming, writing, a web-stuff and not so much on games. I am worried that the lower pixel density on the 1080p would be too much, but I would sure like the extra realestate. Right now I sit about 2 feet away from my two 24" screens. Thus text clarity and eye strain are the only thing that is holding me back now.

I have heard people who used a 1080p say the text is clear and sharp, but maybe they mostly game; while others say that it its blocky or that they would never use a 1080p as a monitor, but it wasn't clear if they were speaking from experience or predjudice.

I was hoping we could have a debate on this. One idea would be for someone with say a 24" LCD and a 32" 1080p to compare this distances at which the pixel density looks the same when someone is 2, 5, 12, 24 inches from the 24". Or similarly, if you were that close to the 30" dell how far back do you have to be comparable?

Best,
MS
 
An additional consideration -- the Sharp does not have a traditional pixel layout, so it won't be quite as clear with text, as, for example, a Samsung TV...
 
I've been using the Sharp 32GP3U for a little over a month now and I came from a 22" LCD. As far as text clarity, adjusting the sharpness makes viewing text no different then my LCD. Keep in mind I'm near sighted and I'm usually always sitting 12" from any screen whether it be 17", 22", 32" when it comes to having to read text. 32" 1080p's imo are the absolute limit for PC use. Anything larger at the same resolution will just get bigger and less defined. Although I don't have issues with text, if I'm browsing a website with small res thumbnail pictures there is noticable pixelation. Eye strain is a definate concern also. I don't spend much time focusing on text but I have no doubt a person that does will strain his eyes rather quickly unless you've got great vision and can read clearly sitting maybe 3' from the 32". So I'd say ultimately it comes down to your vision, the text should be clear enough to read at the farthest distance possible and anywhere inbetween for computer use which probably doesn't exceed 3'.

MortalSyn said:
Currently I have two 24" Dells which are great, but I am planning to upgrade and I am trying to decide between the Dell 30" or something like the Sharp 32" 1080p. The biggest consideration is that I spend most of my day programming, writing, a web-stuff and not so much on games. I am worried that the lower pixel density on the 1080p would be too much, but I would sure like the extra realestate. Right now I sit about 2 feet away from my two 24" screens. Thus text clarity and eye strain are the only thing that is holding me back now.

I have heard people who used a 1080p say the text is clear and sharp, but maybe they mostly game; while others say that it its blocky or that they would never use a 1080p as a monitor, but it wasn't clear if they were speaking from experience or predjudice.

I was hoping we could have a debate on this. One idea would be for someone with say a 24" LCD and a 32" 1080p to compare this distances at which the pixel density looks the same when someone is 2, 5, 12, 24 inches from the 24". Or similarly, if you were that close to the 30" dell how far back do you have to be comparable?

Best,
MS
Click to expand...
 
I'm in the same boat as MS: Have a 2407 -- wanna go bigger -- deciding between 30" 2560x1600 Samsung 305T and 32" 1080p Samsung LN32A550.

I'm a writer who spends lots of time working with lots of documents and lots of text. I think the insane resolution of the 305T is better for my work and games would look stunning. Gaming on a 32" 1080p still would be pretty damn good and the 32" is cheaper, as well. I love the idea of having an LCD that acts as a PC monitor + HDTV in my office. Of course, the trade-off could be poorer text quality. I'm fully aware that today's LCD TVs ain't radiation-belching monsters like CRTs but I'm still a bit concerned about the long-term effects of staring close-range at any TV.

AAAARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!! Why can't these decisions be simpler???
 
Will it be the same as your 24"? No but i just went from a 2407 to a 24" benq to this Toshiba 32" 1080p monitor and everything is easily readable without eye strain.
 
Xr7: Any chance you've got a pic of your 2407 or Benq next to your Toshiba? I'd like to see the size difference which I guess would be pretty substantial.
 
Here's a pic of them in the same spot, kind of a before and after. If you'd still like a sie by side i can do that but it'll have to be later tonight
007.jpg
100_0817.jpg
 
Damn, that IS quite a difference... me like it. :D

Thanks for the pics!
 
I think what seems to hold most people back is the worry about eye strain and text. I agree as well, having the HDTV option would be great and gives you a bit of a 2-for-1 deal. Any other personal stories would be greatly appreciated. Also, good to know about the Samsung vs the Sharp.
 
MortalSyn said:
I think what seems to hold most people back is the worry about eye strain and text. I agree as well, having the HDTV option would be great and gives you a bit of a 2-for-1 deal. Any other personal stories would be greatly appreciated. Also, good to know about the Samsung vs the Sharp.
Click to expand...

=========================
Atari 400 OCed to 1.7 MHz
16 KB Ram
Keyboard Mod
Tape Drive
300 bps Hayes Modem
28" Zenith B/W Cabnet Television
=========================

I had to comment on your sig. My very first PC was an Atari 800. I still have it stored away somewhere. I loved that thing and just couldn't ever bring myself to part with it.

I'm a big Samsung fan. I think they make the best LCDs, HDTVs, DLPs, etc.
 
I sit about two feet from a 42" 1080P HDTV hooked up to my PC as my primary monitor. No complaints here!
 
dang the text looks great in the pictures imo. Man I want to get a 32" or 37" so bad but I don't have money for it.
 
Mr Wolf: Loved those Atari's!. I remember getting a tape drive which would let me write programs, and it would take about 45 minutes to load a game!

Xr7: You mentioned that Toshiba has the "normal" pixel layout, is that normal good like the Samsung or normal bad like the Sharp?

Garret Jax: Thanks, great pics! The text looks pretty good. On the closeup show (Drudge report, lower left corner) what didstance does that represent? You can see the pixelation on "No Way" and "Drudge report". Looking at my 24" inch screen on the same page, that seems comparable to about being 5-6" away.

There was also the chart from Anandtech which shows Pixel pitch vs display size

LCD Pixel Pitch vs. Display Size and Resolution
Panel Size Resolution Pixel Pitch
15" 1024x768 0.297mm
17" 1280x1024 0.264mm
17" WS 1440x900 0.255mm
19" 1280x1024 0.294mm
19" WS 1440x900 0.285mm
20" 1400x1050 0.292mm
20" 1600x1200 0.255mm
20" WS 1680x1050 0.258mm
22" WS 1680x1050 0.282mm
24" WS 1920x1200 0.270mm
26" WS 1920x1200 0.287mm
27" WS 1920x1200 0.303mm
30" WS 2560x1600 0.250mm
32" WS 1920x1080 0.370mm
37" WS 1920x1080 0.427mm
42" WS 1920x1080 0.484mm

Based on this, the 32" has pixels which are about 50% longer and 50% higher than 24". This makes me think that you wouldn't notice graininess an pixelation unless you are less that 15 inches away. However, I do remember back to my 15" laptop and how it had a 1024x768 resolution and that seemed to give me some eye strain -- the crispness seemed like night and day when I moved to 1280x1024 for the same size screen.

One other consideration that I have been thinking about is that because I do have these two 24" panels, that they would be les useful with a 32".
(a) The screen is SO much bigger.
(b) the Bezel is also bigger.
(c) I worry that the 24" panels will feel like they have a better image quality..
(d) At 25x16, it seems like the resolutions would be about the same when moving windows to the other monitors.

All this considered, I do love the 32" but I think I am leaning to the 30" panel.
 
Thanks for the pics, GJ! They look quite good and I think I could get used to the text. I'm sure everything looks better in person, too. MS raises some good points that are worth considering. The 30"'s massive screen resolution is a huge bonus for me. Now, I want to find a pic of a 30" side-by-side with a 32".
 
I went from a Samsung 226BW to a 32" Samsung LN32A550. Both displays are medium-grade quality for their respective model lines. overall, it was a great upgrade, however, text and small icons aren't as clear as the 22". It's not a huge difference, but for for heavy text or coding, i would go with a true monitor. i get some eye strain after aabout 30 mins of reading online articles and forums when i never had any strain before. i have the sharpness at 5, which eliminates the white border around text and small icons.

Gaming on the 32" is great. Be sure to disable Digital NR (Noise Reduction). it's not as sharp and doesnt seem to display as wide or accurate of a color spectrum as my 22" monitor, but the size makes up for it. i mainly play FPS games and there's no visible ghosting. for racing games i can sit back a good 5-6' from the display and feel comfortable and still have great control. i'm normally about 3' from the display.

overall, i'm satisfied with my purchase. i'm a big Samsung believer, and for the money spent, i think i'd be hard-pressed to find a better purchase. 30" LCD monitors cost more than this LCDTV, and rightly so. they are higher resolution, higher quality panels. higher reslution isnt always good, though. i wanted something my GFX card could still run at high (ended up upgrading anyway) and that i could see from good distance away. i'm a big fan of higher resolutions, but i was basically looking for a moderate res in a big display to be able to see farther away, and TVs are currently the only choice.


here's a quickie pic i snapped after i 1st set it up a few days ago. didnt take one with the 22" for comparison.
Picture_002.jpg
 
Great info, Somnambulator. Sharp text is a big deal for me. I'm a big Samsung fan, too.

However, I got a look at the new Sony Bravia XBR KDL-32XBR6 over the weekend. If I buy an LCD TV for my PC, it'll be this new Sony.
 
Somnambulator please take some more pictures of that screen in action. I am interested in it.
 
Somnambulator said:
this thread helped me calibrate the display and it now looks great. keep in mind the lower Sharpness to b/w 0 and 5 and disable Digital NR for PC use.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1020612
text is much crisper and Windows GUI looks more vibrant.
Click to expand...

Something doesn't sound right. Text should be perfectly sharp on your TV.

And settings like Sharpness and digital N/R shouldn't even be options with a PC hookup. (They should be greyed out. At least they are on the 65F model...)

Do you have it setup in PC mode? HDMI? 1:1 pixel (at 1080P)?
 
I used an LG 37LB5D TV as a monitor for eight months, and outside of some input lag that I had, I never got eyestrain with it. It was just as defined as a monitor, just bigger.

I sat about 3' away from it, and never had any issues. Occasionally I found I was turning my head, but I mounted it low enough so I wasn't craning my neck.

Gaming on it was absolutely immersive (even with the lag) with Crysis or other PC games. ON a 32" 1080p it should look pretty darn good, even with the Sharps and their "split pixels".

I agree with SH1. Text should be very sharp at 1080p (1920x1080 resolution) with no overscan at 1:1 pixel mapping.

I think most Samsungs have the "just scan" feature which gives full 1:1 pixel mapping, or can be used in "Pc input label" mode or something like that similarly to the LGs. Maybe that will help you Somnambulator.

Regards,

10e
 
I took the leap and went with the HP 30". I found one on eBay for $850 + $50 shipping. (There were a few more if anyone was interested).

Some reason I made this choice?

1) Because I do mostly text-based work (coding/reading), I was worried that pixel pitch would cause eye strain I got eye strain on my old laptop with 1024x768. Of course, it may also have been caused by the small size or the lower quality, but I couldn't risk it.

2) The 32" 1080p are more of a commodity than the 30" monitors. I think as a computer monitor I will get more life out of it.

3) Integration:

i. The 30" will integrate better with my two 24" monitors because the bezel is thinner than, and because it is a little smaller.

ii. With a similar pixel density as the 24"s, You dont need to resize windows when moving between the other 24" displays.

iii. The picture on the 24"s is tight and I think I would have been distracted if my main display was not the best in as far as image quality.

4) Price: It was hard to justify $1,200 for a 30", but $900 I could do.

Hope this helps someone else. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

MS
 
Good luck with your HP. Post pics and comments when you get it. I'm still deciding between a 32" and 30".
 
I think you made the right choice. I loved gaming on my Sharp Aquos and Westinghouse (both 1080p), but I would never recommend it over a PC monitor for any text based work.
 
CJRP said:
I think you made the right choice. I loved gaming on my Sharp Aquos and Westinghouse (both 1080p), but I would never recommend it over a PC monitor for any text based work.
Click to expand...

I agree -- I wouldn't recommend those two either versus a Samsung or Sony TV.
 
I have the Sharp Aquos 32" 1080p and the text to me is damn sharp. I have no problem reading anythign on any website, plus I set my DPI to 120 to enhance my experience :p
 
I didn't have a problem with text either. Best I could tell, the shape of the characters was similar to text on a Sony Trinitron, but sharper with the increased ANSI contrast ratio.

(Would still have the Sharp today, if my particular set had not had a panel defect...)
 
Wow....

I just bought the HP L3065c off eBay for $895 including shipping (See link below they have 11 more). I've been eying the 30" screen since they first came out, but I knew I would have to wait until I could get one for about $900 or less.

Some background for anyone who is interested or wants some more information. I have a HP2335 and a Dell 2407 (First model) and was running these of a 8800GT. Mostly I program, write and surf the internet. I don't do much gaming.

The reasons I decided to go with the 30" over a 32" 1080p was because:

(a) I was worried about eye strain
(b) I was going to keep using my two 24" screens and so the thinner bezel was better, and because the dot pitch of the 30" was closer to the 24" screens the windows would have similar scaling when moving between monitors.

I am glad I made the decision I did.

As far as "image" goes, there is more similarity between the Dell 2407 than te HP2335 that I have. Thus, while the Dell clearly has a much nicer "image" than the HP2335, I hardly notice a difference with te 2407. Note thatthe 2407 was the first 24" that dell put out, so its not even the HC screen. This isn't a cut to the HP3065c, I just think the improvements with the new screens are fairly minor. In short, the grass is objectively greener with the HP3065c, but you'll never notice. however, comparig the HPL3065c or the Dell 2407 with the HP2335, the grass is subjectively greener -- not to mention the HP2335 has a much bigger (and silver) bezel. This is good news for anyone who can get one of the old Dell panels for cheap. They wont look bad sitting next to the 30" panel, or if you just want a 24" but are worried that the new more expensive ones are SO much better (they're not).

Some other notes. When I set this up, I put the 30" in the middle flanked the 2407 on the right and the HP2335 on the left. The 3065 came with a dual DVI cable and the 8800 GT is able to run both the 3065 and the 2407 at their maximum resolutions. I had an extra Nvidia 6200 PCI which I used to drive the HP. I was worried that there might be some problems, and there seemed to be after I installed the 6200 drivers, but I just needed to go into Windows Display Settings and I moved one of the grayed out monitors. This asked me if I wanted to enable it (which I did) and everything worked out fine. To reposition the screens you can use the SHIFT key to move the boxes in smaller incremeents like when you move windows in in POWERPOINT.

I am going to mention the obvious. This set up is HUGE. I've been running the two 24"s for awhile now, so I am used to realestate, but at the moment this seems almost overwhelming. The set up I had to do feels a bit weird. The screens seem to jump out at you and you feel a need to sit WAY back, although my desk is fairly shallow. Consquently, so that the screen is straight on, I had to tild the 30" down toward me a bit; consequently, to perserve the perspective, I had to rotated the two 24"s about 8 degrees and tuck them behing the 30" just enough so that their bezels can be see. However in this position, I kind of feel like I am in the space shuttle. What was also fortunate is that the portrait display on the Dell rotates clockwise and the HP rotates counter clockwise.

Finally, and I don't know if is just my initial impression, but I might actually be getting some eye strain from all these monitors and all the light that is coming at me. Alternatively,I currently have a black background so maybe it is too much contrast for my eyes. Nevertheless, I do feel like I need to sit back just because the amount of visual information is so overwhelming. Something which I almost think would be helpful would be to have a couple of keys set up would dim and un-dim the side monitors.

And if anyone is interested there are still 11 of these left on eBay through the seller I bought mine from. I don't know how the rest of them will be but this one is great. No dead pixels, no scratches. As far as I can tell it it came from the factory. The only downside is that it only has a one-year warranty whereas a new one has a 3 year (I think). It also come with the "optional clip-on speaker bar", but this turns out to be useless, even if you are using it as a kind of center channel because it has no power output even though it is power by USB. Here is the link if you are interested: link
 
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Picture 1
SetUp1.jpg


Picture 2
Pan.jpg



I decided to stand to run the two LCDs in portrat display. I think this setup works a little better. Looking at the image you certianly cant appreciate how big it actually is. You can see the Calculator program running which should give ou some idea of the size in relation to other monitors.
 
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