Temp/OC Problems - have pics, need suggestions!

D

dbaldus

Gawd
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
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563
I cannot seem to get a good overclock with decent temps no matter what. As a matter of fact, the best temps that I can get running at STOCK speeds are 41 idle, 54 load. I've reapplied AS5 and reset my Ninja twice now with little difference both times so I don't believe that is the problem. Here is a pic of my setup:





One thing that I think may be the problem is that I cannot seem to get any airflow from my bottom right intake fan. Here's a pic of the fan grills, which are essentially the same on the front of the case:



Yeah, I know the wires are a mess down there, but even if I pull them off to the side and feel in front of the fan I can't feel much air moving at all. The front of the case just snaps on and there is a little one inch or so space between the front metal part of the case and the front plastic part of the case that snaps on where the intake is sucking air in from. This is shown here:



What should I do to get some intake coming? Are my fan grills too small and restricting airflow or is it just shitty design for the intake fan on the front of the case? I was thinking about figuring out a way to put an inch or two's worth of space between the front of the case and the fan so maybe it would start blowing better, even if it was just circulating air. I can't mount anything on my side panel because the Ninja fan hits it. If I could actually get some airflow from my fans going, then I spend some time hiding the wires, but there's no use now if there's no air to restrict!
 
For starters. Drill out ALL your fan holes. The one at the back, and the front look especially restrictive. Then, after that, you need to do something about that "mesh" in the front intake... is it removable? Can you keep those silver pieces in place?
 
How big should I drill out the holes? As big as the ones for the 92mm fan mount in the bottom right or even bigger? Don't have a Dremmel...

Taking apart my computer as we speak to see about removing that mesh.
 
Okay, I was able to get the mesh off and I was able to drill about half of the holes (if I drilled 2 next to each other, they would combine into one big, misshaped hole) to the size of the 92mm fan mount on bottom right. Working on drilling the holes on the exhuast, top left.

Any other suggestions? Do I need to make the holes even bigger?
 
Crap... I said drill. I meant, remove totally :). Like, with tin snips, pliers etc. Make it a full open hole. If it looks like hell (and you can clearly see it looking like hell, like the exhaust fan), cover it with a wire fan grill for optimal airflow. You really want the hole the same size as the blades of your fan. I'd try to go for a full 120mm on the front intake, if at all possible (it might not be)...


Next, Clean up the cables, with some zipties/sleeving. Think about making some molex terminals/splitters, and get rid of like 90% of that rat's nest :).
 
Crap... well, here's my progress so far on the fan grills:



Although it may not be evident from the pictures, the grills (both intake and exhaust) are the size of the blades of a 120mm fan, which is what I have mounted on both. What do you mean a "wire grill" over the hole if it looks like crap? Yes, I could cut the whole thing out if I wanted to, but yes, it would look like crap. Pics of this wire grill or some links to where I can buy some would be nice...

Thanks for your help, there's already a definite improvement!

By the way, what way would you suggest having the fan for the Ninja mounted? On the right so it blows through the Ninja and out the back exhuast or as is to blow up into the PSU and then out?
 
apparently imageshack isn't working right now... but the grills don't look bad, take my word for it.
 
first of all - re position the fan on your cpu cooler.
I've never owned that heat sink but if you can have the fan point horizontally vs. vertically, it will make a difference. So basically, don't put it on the bottom of your cooler, put it on the right side.
then, you'd get almost a push-pull configuration with your CPU cooler and the case exhaust fan.

look at that layout. Intake fan pushes air in.
some of it floats up, the rest goes underneath your video card.
almost none would go right above the video card where your fan is.

and finally: WIRE MANAGEMENT.
you'd be surprised at how restrictive round wires can be when clustered and obstructing the airflow. you need to rewire your setup.

if you don't want to do all that -
move your optical drive up a bay or two and use the now empty slot to stuff some wires into. that may be the easiest solution without having to re-wire the whole case.

that clusterfaak of wires prevents cool air from flowing up.
 
@ Above poster. I do believe he has 2 optical drives... Do you need both of them? If you put a (unh) http://www.ocmodshop.com/ocmodshop.aspx?a=379 in to cool your drives you'll also get an awesome amount of air to your HSF...


Grills...

Pretty ones like these.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=111

Just choose the right size for the job. you'll probably only need 1 for the back exhaust port. Oh, and maybe one for the front port, behind the silver plastic of the front of your case.

The other side of the holes should be covered, by fans and made invisible. I still recommend removing the ENTIRE grill. You'll have a definite improvement.

As for the HSF placement... What you have right now is probably gonna be about the same than if you mounted it pushing air towards the back exit... but I'd try moving the fan, and seeing if it helps at all... If not, meh, if so, well good for you!
 
here's a detailed guide of what I mean - done using CGI from my friends at Pixar.

wtfairflow.jpg
 
lol. i wanted to illustrate my suggestions.

but seriously threadstarter - you're getting nothing but heat floating off that video card... right into the CPU cooler. Even if the video card was not hot, your still not getting much air in that 2 centimeter space.

and WTF is going on with that spaghetti bomb in the bottom of your case? what are you powering there? a friggin lite-brite display?
 
Yes you can, it takes a bit of force, however... as the attached screws were hard as hell to turn without stripping (in my case at least).
 
Arcygenical said:
@ Above poster. I do believe he has 2 optical drives... Do you need both of them? If you put a (unh) http://www.ocmodshop.com/ocmodshop.aspx?a=379 in to cool your drives you'll also get an awesome amount of air to your HSF...
Click to expand...

Well, I have 2 5.25" drives that I need and one open space and then I have 1 floppy drive in my 3.5" and have recently mounted my hard drive in the only other 3.5" slot. Looks like the only way that I'd be able to mount this Kama Bay is the Bezel way. Can't figure out exactly how this is going to help me much. Isn't that just going to grab air from above the floppy drive and then push it right up against the bottom of the disk drive above?

Also, is it a good idea to have my hard drive mounted up in extra 3.5" bay? I just put it there because I wanted to open the bottom right space up for airflow, but now it's generating a lot of heat just to the right of my CPU cooler.

Here is some pics of what the hard drive area would look like if it were in its normal spot:

http://www.overclockercafe.com/Reviews/cases/X-Blade/1021.htm

http://www.overclockercafe.com/Reviews/cases/X-Blade/1022.htm
 
I really like the idea of getting another really quiet fan in there though. You keep mentioning "removing" the fan grill. You mean cutting it out, right? As far as I can tell, there is no way to just "remove" my fan grill besides cutting it out, which will probably look pretty sloppy. Just making sure before I mutilate my case ;)

Looking at this thing for the bottom right intake fan so I don't get crap everywhere in my case:

http://www.jab-tech.com/120mm-Plastic-fan-filter-pr-2470.html

Good idea, should I just go with a wire fan grill, or should I just completely leave the hole wide open after cutting it out?
 
Okay, I've got some pics of how it's going so far. Know I've got some more to go and am still waiting on replies to the fan grill questions, but other than that there's been a definite improvement of a few degrees. Running at about 39 C idle, 51-52 load now instead of 42 idle 54-46 load. Posted a path of the air path from the front intake through that nest of wires that I pinned up above the fan. Any suggestions on where else/where better any of these wires could go? I like the graphical suggestions too, that was nice!









Also had trouble up top between the CPU and drive bays. Those wires don't seem to be able to go anywhere else, but now there's at least some breathing room for everything. Suggestions??? :D





Thanks you guys have been so helpful so far!
 
still not quite where I'd like to see it but a HUGE improvement from your prior pics.

Good job. Keep at it with the wiring. Tuck things away, find better routes for cables, tie cables up (using zip-ties) etc etc.

you'll creativity will kick in and you'll start seeing routes you didn't see before.

It wouldn't hurt to unplug EVERYTHING and give it a go from scratch.

good work so far tho.
 
if you do decide to unplug everything, don't think about all the things you have to plug in.

Most bad wiring jobs starts with a curtain of wires dangling from the PSU. Then people tend to just plug any free molex into the different devices.

instead, start with the "curtain" and work one cable at a time.
see how much ground one cable connection can cover and see what it can power in that distance - maybe 2 or 3 devices?
then go to the next cable and repeat...

you'll end up with efficient wiring that can power multiple devices with one cable and whatever's left over, just zip tie it and tuck it away somewhere.

hope that helps
 
Getting a fan controller this week so I'll be redoing the fan wiring and only using the 3 pin instead of molex - that will clear some things up. Maybe I will give it a go from scratch, who knows what type of time I'll have next weekend?

And for the rest of my questions above (hard drive placement, fan grill stuff, filters, etc.)?? Other suggestions? Want to get to lower temps if possible so I can start overclocking!
 
I think its the Scythe that is the problem , have you tried putting the fan directly in front of the rear fan , if you do this then the warm air goes straight out instead of still circulating in side and if the fear fan is in the way then takie it out..

Also the wires at the bottom which looks messy . Before i use to think nothing of this but they makea lot of difference, clean them up , every case has holes where you can guide them in and out also remember that warm air rises so use that and have a fan at the top that can blow it out.

I have a similar problem like you but mine is due to the HSF i am using , i should have stayed with the older HSFwhich kept my temp much lower but i thought it could be better and i learnt sometimes it helps if you are contempt in situations.

I have a 7950 and its a XFX XXX version and that gets very hot , i never thought of water colling but because ot the 7950 i am seriously considering. I have stuck 2 120mm fans which has bought the temp down by about 30% , which is brill but it is loud
 
nooh said:
I think its the Scythe that is the problem , have you tried putting the fan directly in front of the rear fan , if you do this then the warm air goes straight out instead of still circulating in side and if the fear fan is in the way then takie it out..

Also the wires at the bottom which looks messy . Before i use to think nothing of this but they makea lot of difference, clean them up , every case has holes where you can guide them in and out also remember that warm air rises so use that and have a fan at the top that can blow it out.

I have a similar problem like you but mine is due to the HSF i am using , i should have stayed with the older HSFwhich kept my temp much lower but i thought it could be better and i learnt sometimes it helps if you are contempt in situations.

I have a 7950 and its a XFX XXX version and that gets very hot , i never thought of water colling but because ot the 7950 i am seriously considering. I have stuck 2 120mm fans which has bought the temp down by about 30% , which is brill but it is loud
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if I understand what you're saying. You want me to put the fan that I have on the Scythe to the left of it, sucking air out of it and pushing it out the back of the case? And you want me to get rid of my exhaust fan that is just to the left of that? Seems a little strange to me to get rid of the push-pull that I have going here and instead set up a pull only without having any air going across the Ninja.

As for the wiring, did you look at my most recent pics or the older ones? I know my wiring still isn't great, but I'm waiting until I get a new fan controller to re-do the wiring. I think I've made some improvements so far though. Any suggestion on what the hell I should do with that monster 20-pin cable for the mobo? That's taking up a LOT of space!
 
What i have done is that i fed most of my wires under the mobo and then i screwed the board in . Also did that to the atx 24 pin
about the scythe , if you are having the scythe fan sucking the air out then let the air go straight out of the system and not let it wonder around in the case.

You have holes where the rear fan is so use that fan to suck the air out and the HSF place it in a certain way where you can use that vqacuum to get the air out,

Also try and put another fan on the Psythe, it will make a lot of difference.
 
nooh said:
What i have done is that i fed most of my wires under the mobo and then i screwed the board in . Also did that to the atx 24 pin
about the scythe , if you are having the scythe fan sucking the air out then let the air go straight out of the system and not let it wonder around in the case.

You have holes where the rear fan is so use that fan to suck the air out and the HSF place it in a certain way where you can use that vqacuum to get the air out,

Also try and put another fan on the Psythe, it will make a lot of difference.
Click to expand...


Will there be any problems with tucking the wires underneath the mobo? Just wondering how hot the backside of it gets and didn't want to have a bunch of wires tucked underneath there in a nest and have things get hot and cause problems (ie fires).

As for putting another fan on the Ninja... where would I put another fan? See the picture of how I currently have it mounted and then tell me where to put the fan. Also, I don't have a way to mount another fan on there anyway because I don't have another fan clip.
 
The bottom side of the mobo shouldn't get any warmer than 50'c on a hot day, in the middle of a desert. Most wire insulation is rated for at least 70'c before it melts. Following that trend, I'd expect the flash point (correct term?) of molten wire insulation to be way above that.
 
You have a shield that comes with the mobo tuck it under that , it makes a lot of difference.I have loads of things in mine and i am surprised what tucking wires under the mobo can do to the whole circulation.
 
Also another fan could be added , use super glue if you have to , where there is a will there is a way. :)
 
How about a fan filter for when I cut out the entire front intake grill? Should I just use a wire grill or should I get some sort of filter to block all the dust from getting inside? And if I were to get a filter for it, would I really be getting any better airflow than I am now that I have drilled them out as shown in the pictures?

Any recommendations for a filter that works good but lets plenty of air through? Need to figure out what to buy so I can just get it all at once and not mess around ordering stuff 1 thing at a time and taking a month to get everything I need.
 
you know the sheild foam you get for mobo made of foam , well theraltake use that for the filter, i have it everywhere in my kandalf case.

It does keep the dust out cos i can clean it from the outside which it collects when sucking air.
 
nooh said:
you know the sheild foam you get for mobo made of foam , well theraltake use that for the filter, i have it everywhere in my kandalf case.

It does keep the dust out cos i can clean it from the outside which it collects when sucking air.
Click to expand...

You have any pictures? I'd like to see what you've done with it. Also, I'm not so sure if I have a shield like that, or maybe I tossed it when I put my computer together a few years ago. Are you talking about something that is mounted behind the mobo or something that was used for padding when the mobo was shipped?
 
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