System build questions

E

esky

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Jul 3, 2004
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I need to build one or two new systems. I've looked through some existing build threads, so here's some more information:

My budget: Under $1000 excluding tax/shipping (in USA)
I need:Case, PSU, Motherboard, CPU, GPU, RAM, HDD, DVD+-RW

It should work with a regular CRT (Analog input?) monitor, but with the possibility to upgrade to one or two 19in LCDs.

The primary purpose should be web / gfx dev, office use, multi task applications well.

I won't be overclocking, but I want potential to upgrade the video card and make it a light gaming system in the future.

Also, are old HDD with the wide cables (i think ATA?) compatible at all with newer motherboards? I guess the same would go for DVD drives, have the connections on those changed?

And last, one of the systems will be for the family, and so I'm curious if it would be better to get them two hard drives, one small one for the OS which will probably need to be reinstalled quite often... or should I just partition a big one?
 
Two computers for under $1000? or $1000 each?

Do you have an OS for each one?

What work will be done on the family computer?

Older PATA drives are still used on newer motherboards, but most have only one IDE connection now, support for two devices.
 
One system for under $1000. Will purchase OS seperate (will be either XP or Vista)

I'll probably just copy the sub-$1000 setup and beef it up a little on a second system for light gaming, even better performance and two 19in LCDs, but the initial system just needs a simpler vid card for an analog CRT monitor - with possibility of upgrading the vid card.

System should be good for web / gfx development, and solid for multi tasking heavy applications (like Adobe CS3 suite) if that makes sense...
 
It seems like you don't need anything special. Why not get a Dell? or two? You could get some nice prebuilt systems w/ monitor and OS for under $800.

If you're still willing to build...

Will you be doing any light gaming at all?
Will you be watching any HD content at all?
Did you need an OS?
How many old PATA drives do you have and want to re-use in the new system(s)?

$105 - WD Caviar SE16 WD5000AAKS 500GB 7200RPM SATA300 16MB Cache
$145 - G.Skill 4GB(2x2GB) DDR2-800 F2-6400CL5D-4GBPQ
$276 - Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 G0 2.40GHz 8MB L2
$83 - Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L Rev. 2.0 Intel P35 Express LGA775
$60 - PowerColor X1650PRO512MB Radeon X1650PRO 512MB ($15MIR)
$76 - Corsair CMPSU-450VX 450W PSU ($10MIR)
$60 - COOLER MASTER RC-690-KKN1-GP Mid Tower ($20MIR)
$30 - Samsung 18X DVD±R DVD Burner w/ LightScribe Black SATA SH-S183L - OEM
==========
$831 + tax and shipping - $45 MIRs

I chose a dual DVI card for when you upgrade to two LCD monitors. If you don't mind having one of them D-SUB, you could get an even cheaper card:
$38 - XFX PVT72SWANG GeForce 7200GS 256MB ($10MIR)

If you plan on doing some light gaming:
$88 - XFX PVT73GUGF3 GeForce 7600GT 256MB ($20MIR)

If you plan on watching HD content along with some light gaming, one of these would be better:
$69 - MSI NX8500GT-TD256E GeForce 8500GT 256MB ($10MIR)
$94 - Leadtek PX8600GT TDH GDDR2 GeForce 8600GT 256MB ($15MIR)
$100 - HIS Hightech H260XTF256DDN-R Radeon HD 2600XT 256MB ($15MIR)

If you don't plan on upgrading RAM to 8GB anywhere down the road, you can go with 4x1GB sticks instead... just get two of these kits:
$55 - G.Skill 2GB (2x1GB) DDR2-800 F2-6400CL5D-2GBNQ

For the 2nd system, you can just partition the HDD. However, I still recommend having two HDDs in a system. I keep a small OS partition on my storage drive, just in case the main drive goes out. I backup any sensitive data to an external drive and DVD media. You won't probably won't need 4GB of RAM for the 2nd system. For the gaming card on the 2nd system, what size monitor will they be gaming on and what games will they be playing?
 
Since you mentioned pre-built systems, can you recommend which Dell (or another company) I should go with?

Also, what could I do to make building a system on my own more worthwhile - or in other words, what advantage if any do I have in building myself here?
 
esky said:
Since you mentioned pre-built systems, can you recommend which Dell (or another company) I should go with?

Also, what could I do to make building a system on my own more worthwhile - or in other words, what advantage if any do I have in building myself here?
Click to expand...

I'd go for whatever was on sale that fit my needs. Check gotapex.com for good deals on pre-built systems.

Aside from the satisfaction of building it yourself, the main advantage is full customization. You also get longer individual warranties on certain components (most pre-built deals come with only a 1yr warranty for everything -- extended warranties usually kill the "deal"). You get to choose good quality hardware that gives you the option to OC if you want to. Upgrading is slightly easier, since you don't typically have to worry about any proprietary complications (some OEMs use BTX, which won't work well with a dual slot PCI-E vidcard).

Some people don't have the time to do the research and get involved with the hardware aspect of a system, or the work needed in building it yourself isn't worth it to them, so they go pre-built. Its simple, easy, and fits their needs.

If you don't mind doing the homework (figuring out which component best fits your needs for the lowest price possible), dealing with RMA's if needed, troubleshooting any hardware problems on your own, then build it yourself -- its a very satisfying feeling.
 
1. About the HDD: Would it work well to get a smaller 10,000 RPM drive for the OS and main applications, and then get the 7200 RPM for additional storage? Or will the slower HDD bottleneck the big one in most cases anyway?

For example, if you install Photoshop and the OS on the fast HDD, but store all your work on the slow HDD, will the application still run faster because everything is cached on the fast HDD?

2. Is the RAM limit on XP Pro 4GB (does it matter if it's 64bit XP or not)? Which version of Vista would be the best value?

3. What're the cons of using D-SUB for the monitors?
 
1) For the most part, the two hard drives will act independent of each other. However, in your specific example, as long as your scratch disk is your faster drive, you should not see any performance issues.

2) The limit is more like a memory address limit, so it might be 3.5 if you have a 512 MB video card for example. 64bit XP can address more, but I've heard it's a pretty bad port of Server 2k3? Or something like that. Anyway, as for which version of Vista has the best value, just look up the different ones. You're better off deciding which features you want and which ones you don't, my opinion anyway.
 
RAM limit on any OS that is x86 and not x64 is 4gb minus the memory mapped devices. Comes out to around 4gb-videocard-256mb.
 
Raptor HDDs aren't really worth their price premium anymore. The recent 7200 RPM drives have come very close to the Raptors' sustained transfer rates, and they're much cheaper. The only thing Raptors can't be beat at is seek time (with non-scsi drives). However, two 7200RPM drives in RAID0 is still a good alternative to a single Raptor. Two Raptors in RAID0 isn't worthwhile either, since seek times don't improve in RAID0.

Avg Transfer Rate, Access Time: HDD info, Price
78MB/s, 08.2ms: WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB, $160AR
72MB/s, 15.4ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3250410AS 250GB, $65
65MB/s, 13.7ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS 320GB, $80
65MB/s, 13.2ms: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3300620AS 300GB, $60
52MB/s, 14.0ms: WD Caviar SE16 WD2500KS 250GB, $70
112MB/s, 13.2ms: RAID0 'cuda's, 600GB total, $120 (ICH9R on P35-DS3R)

As you can see, the 'cuda is twice the size and half the cost, for nearly the same performance. Stick them in RAID0, and you've got an even more cost effective solution. Though, the seek time of the Raptor can't be beat. If you have cash to burn, do so on a Raptor if you really want it. Otherwise, there are better cost effective solutions.
 
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