If you guys till think Brad is the white knight and F&P are creeps...suggest you read this carefully.

https://www.dogarandkazon.com/blog/2019/1/2/injunction-junction-court-instruction

Stardock blatantly ripped off the Hyperspace component in SC2 for Origins. They did NOT use what they got from Atari--the Star Control 3 hyperspace travel system.
Brad is going to be bankrupt after this.

Only thing that matters now is how long Ghost of the Precursors will take to come out....backing it as soon as it goes into crowdfunding...

Is it copyright infringement or an homage? Their first point is that interstellar travel uses hyperspace for pete's sake. How many games use some form of the hyperspace concept?
 
Is it copyright infringement or an homage? Their first point is that interstellar travel uses hyperspace for pete's sake. How many games use some form of the hyperspace concept?

Homage?
Come on, if you made a fighting game and you ripped off Chun Li's moves, looks, special attacks, and outfit, you're going to be sued by Capcom.
Please read the license that Brad got. He was legally entitled to use the star control 3 system--he got everything that was developed FOR star control 3 uniquely. Anything else had to be PAID royalties to F&P.

Anyway I'm clearly not going to convince you haters here. I'm just going to let the judge do his work.
 
Yes, yes. I'm a hater for hating on idiotic court rulings, legal game playing and DMCA chicanery.
 
This is why the original system gave you TWENTY EIGHT YEARS. MORE than enough. This extending into perpetuity is nothing more than a gift to giant corporations like Disney - how is continuing to copyright Mickey Mouse benefiting Walt Disney, who's been dead almost as long as I've been alive? 14 years, plus an option for another 14, so no one can steal your first creation and you can benefit from it, while working on something else. I think that's more than enough time. The idea is to stimulate creativity by giving the creator some time to not have to worry about their idea being stolen, not to shut down creativity by making it possible to live the rest of your life, and your children's lives, without ever having to create anything ever again. A system that extends protection well past the creator's life - how is that solving anything? The whole system as it exists today is COMPLETELY broken - and there are a lot of creators who agree.

So in this fantasy world of yours, you think creators immediately capitalize and commercialize their copyrights? You do realize sometimes it takes years or even decades before something becomes profitable for the creator right?

You think Mickey Mouse was created and then BOOM billions and billions went to Walt? Wrong, the man had to work his ass off to breathe life into Mickey. The work to turn something from an idea into a viable commodity requires a level of devotion and financial risk far beyond what you even think you can comprehend.

I own about 50 copyrights and several trademarks and have worked my ass off to create and nurture them. What the hell do you know about copyright?
 
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If you guys till think Brad is the white knight and F&P are creeps...suggest you read this carefully.

https://www.dogarandkazon.com/blog/2019/1/2/injunction-junction-court-instruction

Stardock blatantly ripped off the Hyperspace component in SC2 for Origins. They did NOT use what they got from Atari--the Star Control 3 hyperspace travel system.
Brad is going to be bankrupt after this.

Only thing that matters now is how long Ghost of the Precursors will take to come out....backing it as soon as it goes into crowdfunding...

Lol, nothing in that table is copyright-able. Its all pretty bog standard and the parts which aren't would only be cover-able by at best design patents.
 
So in this fantasy world of yours, you think creators immediately capitalize and commercialize their copyrights? You do realize sometimes it takes years or even decades before something becomes profitable for the creator right?

You think Mickey Mouse was created and then BOOM billions and billions went to Walt? Wrong, the man had to work his ass off to breathe life into Mickey. The work to turn something from an idea into a viable commodity requires a level of devotion and financial risk far beyond what you even think you can comprehend.

I own about 50 copyrights and several trademarks and have worked my ass off to create and nurture them. What the hell do you know about copyright?

I know that current copyright is basically corp welfare for a select handful of companies that have been sucking at the grave for decades and that in any sane copyright system 28 years is plenty of time for exclusive artificial legal control.
 
Homage?
Come on, if you made a fighting game and you ripped off Chun Li's moves, looks, special attacks, and outfit, you're going to be sued by Capcom.

Yet how many fighting games have some karate gi wearing character that threw fireballs, and how many have that same exact quarter turn plus punch to do so?
 
The only thing Accolade still owned (then Atari) was the name "Star Control" and the trademark. But the universe, lore and aliens belonged to the original creators.

How did these two get separated in the first place? It seems reasonable to believe that the original intent was for Accolade to market the StarControl IP for a period and pay royalties to the devs. If Paul and Fred can produce any documentation that this was not intended to be a perpetual license then they have a good case.
 
How did these two get separated in the first place? It seems reasonable to believe that the original intent was for Accolade to market the StarControl IP for a period and pay royalties to the devs. If Paul and Fred can produce any documentation that this was not intended to be a perpetual license then they have a good case.

As far as I understand these things, there are several different types of contracts between creators and publishers. That kind of contract sometimes happens with movies or books as well. The creator will own the rights to certain elements, characters, plots, etc while the name will be owned by the people financing the production. I’m not sure about the goal behind those kinds of contracts but I’d believe it might encourage more cooperation between creator and financier. It also allows each to go their separate ways and keep control of different elements of the product.
 
How did these two get separated in the first place? It seems reasonable to believe that the original intent was for Accolade to market the StarControl IP for a period and pay royalties to the devs. If Paul and Fred can produce any documentation that this was not intended to be a perpetual license then they have a good case.

Because IP law is fucked up. You can carve up IP in so many different ways it is retarded. However, at least on the surface, the agreement isn't that out there. Having trademark and works separated is not common, but not rare either. Suppose I own a trademark for something you like. You contact me and say "I wanna make something in that universe," I say "Sure, pay me $5k for a license and you get a license to use it for a single work." You do that and release your work (meaning game, book, whatever). Well you own the copyright to that work, not me. I didn't hire you to make it, so it is yours. However you do NOT own the trademark, nor continual rights on the mark. The license is for that one work only. I continue to own the trademark, I just licensed you to use it in this particular case.

However bullshit like this is also (one of the reasons) why these days publishers will never do anything like this. They fund a project as a work for hire and own the entire thing, and they don't sub-license.
 
How did these two get separated in the first place? It seems reasonable to believe that the original intent was for Accolade to market the StarControl IP for a period and pay royalties to the devs. If Paul and Fred can produce any documentation that this was not intended to be a perpetual license then they have a good case.

They already have.
The entire original license agreement was posted by them already.
The two sticking points are:
1) accolade not paying royalties for 3 (I think) years, which meant the original agreement rights (aliens, lore, etc) reverted exclusively to F&P.
2) the bankruptcy of Atari, who bought accolade, which now brings into question what Stardock actually got from them, and whether that sale was legal to begin with (as F&P were NOT consulted about this).
This is very important because if anyone got the IP that Accolade owned, they would have to pay royalties for any non "Star control 3" unique lore, as well as the bankruptcy bringing into serious question whether this IP can even be transferred.

That is for the judge to decide.
 
They already have.
The entire original license agreement was posted by them already.
The two sticking points are:
1) accolade not paying royalties for 3 (I think) years, which meant the original agreement rights (aliens, lore, etc) reverted exclusively to F&P.
2) the bankruptcy of Atari, who bought accolade, which now brings into question what Stardock actually got from them, and whether that sale was legal to begin with (as F&P were NOT consulted about this).
This is very important because if anyone got the IP that Accolade owned, they would have to pay royalties for any non "Star control 3" unique lore, as well as the bankruptcy bringing into serious question whether this IP can even be transferred.

That is for the judge to decide.

2) bankruptcy provisions can get complicated... Esp when dealing with transfer of property and timings of such transfers. Transfers while in bankruptcy proceedings but before the bankrupt has closes are commonly considered to happen before the bankruptcy (aka the bankruptcy occurs when the bankruptcy proceedings close and the creditors take control).

1) is going to be a cluster to prove in court most likely due to the transfers and likely poor documentation on both sides.
 
I know that current copyright is basically corp welfare for a select handful of companies that have been sucking at the grave for decades and that in any sane copyright system 28 years is plenty of time for exclusive artificial legal control.

28 years is not a whole lot of time. I'm 41 and remember 1991 like it was yesterday....maybe its because that was the year I got my first blow job. Anyway, lets imagine any other industry, take Elon Musk and Tesla for example. Ignoring their current financial troubles, etc, etc..Imagine if Tesla was ultra successful then after 28 years they no longer had the right to sell their product....yea that would make zero sense for any sane entrepreneur or investor....I dunno maybe your a commie or a socialist.

Copyright law works both ways....yea it gives smart corporations a license to print money and milk an IP for all its worth, however, that only works as long as the audience is willing to consume the content. What you ignore is the fact that copyright law is also great for the little guy, for the artist, for the creator, the idea person. You think ideas are easy? An idea can and has changed the world many times over, and if it were so easy, where are all your great ideas?

If you don't like copyright move to China and get a real good hard look at Shenzhen. Copyright means jack shit to them, ideas are freely shared, ripped and stolen.....and guess who is getting rich over there? THE BIG FUCKING CORPORATIONS AND GOVERNMENT. In China, the little guy gets a cockmeat sandwich.
 
28 years is not a whole lot of time. I'm 41 and remember 1991 like it was yesterday....maybe its because that was the year I got my first blow job. Anyway, lets imagine any other industry, take Elon Musk and Tesla for example. Ignoring their current financial troubles, etc, etc..Imagine if Tesla was ultra successful then after 28 years they no longer had the right to sell their product....yea that would make zero sense for any sane entrepreneur or investor....I dunno maybe your a commie or a socialist.

Copyright law works both ways....yea it gives smart corporations a license to print money and milk an IP for all its worth, however, that only works as long as the audience is willing to consume the content. What you ignore is the fact that copyright law is also great for the little guy, for the artist, for the creator, the idea person. You think ideas are easy? An idea can and has changed the world many times over, and if it were so easy, where are all your great ideas?

If you don't like copyright move to China and get a real good hard look at Shenzhen. Copyright means jack shit to them, ideas are freely shared, ripped and stolen.....and guess who is getting rich over there? THE BIG FUCKING CORPORATIONS AND GOVERNMENT. In China, the little guy gets a cockmeat sandwich.

Actually, Tesla only has protection for a max of 20 years from initial filing (which is generally several years before the product is sold). So the reality is that Tesla only has protection on their products for ~15 years, 13 years LESS than what you would consider insane. Also, another shocker for you, there are people and companies that make all their money just selling things in the public domain. When a patent or copyright expires, it doesn't mean the owner loses the right to sell their product, it merely means others now have the unrestricted right to as well.

Also, I find it interesting you think that the founding fathers of the US were communists and socialists.

Ideas aren't copyrightable, only patentable.

And its the rare creator who gets really anything out of a patent or copyright on their work, fyi, here or in china.
 
Actually, Tesla only has protection for a max of 20 years from initial filing (which is generally several years before the product is sold). So the reality is that Tesla only has protection on their products for ~15 years, 13 years LESS than what you would consider insane. Also, another shocker for you, there are people and companies that make all their money just selling things in the public domain. When a patent or copyright expires, it doesn't mean the owner loses the right to sell their product, it merely means others now have the unrestricted right to as well.

Also, I find it interesting you think that the founding fathers of the US were communists and socialists.

Ideas aren't copyrightable, only patentable.

And its the rare creator who gets really anything out of a patent or copyright on their work, fyi, here or in china.

LOL you actually took my very loose Tesla example and ran with it ahahahahahahaha

Oh, so I was wrong....your not a commie. Your one of those no idea, non-original Ebay hustlers who was slinging knock off counterfeit Mario & Princess Peach fuck dolls until being called to the carpet by Nintendo and now your all butt hurt over it ROFL...

Yes those people and companies selling knock off unlicensed counterfeit products in the public domain are all capitalizing off of the sweat equity and goodwill of the copyright holder because they are too lazy to create their own original ideas and too cheap to compensate the people who do. Also, their quality is most likely sub par, which does further damage to the brand....that is why I told you to look at Shenzhen, but you conveniently left that out of your rebuttal.....yall got so hot and bothered over thinking your were gonna get a win with Tesla lol

I get it now, you would like unrestricted rights to original IPs (Disney for example) so that you can sell trinkets with Mickey Mouse on them and line your own greedy pockets. Why don't you buck the fuck up and spend your own time and money and create some original shit and leave other people's property alone.
 
LOL you actually took my very loose Tesla example and ran with it ahahahahahahaha

Oh, so I was wrong....your not a commie. Your one of those no idea, non-original Ebay hustlers who was slinging knock off counterfeit Mario & Princess Peach fuck dolls until being called to the carpet by Nintendo and now your all butt hurt over it ROFL...

Yes those people and companies selling knock off unlicensed counterfeit products in the public domain are all capitalizing off of the sweat equity and goodwill of the copyright holder because they are too lazy to create their own original ideas and too cheap to compensate the people who do. Also, their quality is most likely sub par, which does further damage to the brand....that is why I told you to look at Shenzhen, but you conveniently left that out of your rebuttal.....yall got so hot and bothered over thinking your were gonna get a win with Tesla lol

I get it now, you would like unrestricted rights to original IPs (Disney for example) so that you can sell trinkets with Mickey Mouse on them and line your own greedy pockets. Why don't you buck the fuck up and spend your own time and money and create some original shit and leave other people's property alone.

Fine, we can just go back to the way things were historically and you'll have no IP rights, sound nice? The whole point of patents and copyrights is a grand bargain. The state will *artificially* protect the economic interest of creators and in return they'll make more and society will benefit. The key word there is *artificially*.

Also, sorry for pointing out that your example was so flawed that it could only be written by someone that had zero actual understanding of both actual US IP laws and the basic theories behind IP.
 
I get it now, you would like unrestricted rights to original IPs (Disney for example) so that you can sell trinkets with Mickey Mouse on them and line your own greedy pockets. Why don't you buck the fuck up and spend your own time and money and create some original shit and leave other people's property alone.

Funny you would bring up Disney... since the majority of their stuff comes from public domain works. Snow White? That's a Brother's Grimm work (they did a lot of those). Pinocchio? From an Italian novel. Alice in Wonderland, Peter Pan, Aladdin, etc, etc. All based on public domain works.
 
Funny you would bring up Disney... since the majority of their stuff comes from public domain works. Snow White? That's a Brother's Grimm work (they did a lot of those). Pinocchio? From an Italian novel. Alice in Wonderland, Peter Pan, Aladdin, etc, etc. All based on public domain works.

Yes the brothers grimm and other ancient tales. However, Disney put new life into those works and made them their own with original characters and other creative additives. It does not take much to modify an existing work (public domain or private copyright) into a different legal entity.

I once had an artist tell me there are no original ideas anymore, that everything is a copy of something else. However, I reject that belief, much like how people falsely thought technology was at an epoch in the late 1800's, I believe there is always something new to discover and create. Firing that artist was one of my best ideas!

Anyway, the fact of the matter is, if you are a creative living in modern times, exposed to the vast amount of metadata that we are on a continuous basis...then the probability is you have many influences to your works....In fact I would say modern creatives have the potential to be even more superlative vs classic creatives because they are exposed to so many more influences.

So when it comes to wanting everything in the public domain such as you do, I find that very boring and lazy. Building characters & worlds and naming them like your children is a rush better than any other and watching them grow is extremely satisfying. Making money off them is secondary but necessary, however the thought of having creative control fall into a strangers hands without due compensation is unthinkable. If there is no protection for your hard work and sacrifices then what is the point, you would be better off having a career as a fucking real estate appraiser if there were no protections.
 
Fine, we can just go back to the way things were historically and you'll have no IP rights, sound nice? The whole point of patents and copyrights is a grand bargain. The state will *artificially* protect the economic interest of creators and in return they'll make more and society will benefit. The key word there is *artificially*.

Also, sorry for pointing out that your example was so flawed that it could only be written by someone that had zero actual understanding of both actual US IP laws and the basic theories behind IP.

Your lack of respect and understanding of the creative process is extremely evident. It is very simple really, a creative work is property. PERIOD.

Would you let strangers live in your home and fuck your wife? No? Why not? By your logic is the state not "artificially" allowing you to own...ahem rent a structure tethered with a bundle of rights over land which has existed for billions of years? Why deny others the right to tap your wifes ass? Why deny others the use of a portion of mother Earth?

Take your commie ass to China, Good Day Sir.
 
Your lack of respect and understanding of the creative process is extremely evident. It is very simple really, a creative work is property. PERIOD.

Would you let strangers live in your home and fuck your wife? No? Why not? By your logic is the state not "artificially" allowing you to own...ahem rent a structure tethered with a bundle of rights over land which has existed for billions of years? Why deny others the right to tap your wifes ass? Why deny others the use of a portion of mother Earth?

Take your commie ass to China, Good Day Sir.

Your lack of understanding of copyright is rather revealing. The whole point of copyright is that it isn't actually property. We give it the legal fiction of property temporarily to encourage its creation and dissemination (same with patents).

Also, does your wife know that you consider her your property? Cause that's what you are implying here.

You keep using commie but I don't think it means what you think it means... Once again, you position would have the founding fathers of the US as communists. I'm sure that will come as quite a shock to basically all of the historians out there.
 
The nonsense continues, its been going on for over a year now since the beta of SC Origins. Good thing I downloaded the game on steam after getting it free with a video card, still haven't played it yet though.
Same with me. Is there any chance of losing access to this? Are there still going to be patches for people who already own it?
 
Homage?
Come on, if you made a fighting game and you ripped off Chun Li's moves, looks, special attacks, and outfit, you're going to be sued by Capcom.
Please read the license that Brad got. He was legally entitled to use the star control 3 system--he got everything that was developed FOR star control 3 uniquely. Anything else had to be PAID royalties to F&P.

Anyway I'm clearly not going to convince you haters here. I'm just going to let the judge do his work.

Chun-Li is a character. Capcom owns the character of Chun-Li and her look. However, they do not own the gameplay concept of Chun-Li. There is a world of difference between a character and a concept. You cannot copyright gameplay. You can copyright audio/visual elements and game code, but not an entire idea or concept (aka game design). Whatever the contract says about the matter is actually irrelevant. Contracts cannot supersede other laws. Ranulfo asking if it is copyright infringement or a homage is pretty important. That is something the court is going to have to decide. There is a fun pop-culture term that applies in these situations "similar but legally distinct". Basically making something that is directly referencing something else, but making barely enough changes so that it is legally different. I'm not a lawyer so I don't know all the complexities at play here, but looking at what both sides state about SCO's space travel (and assuming both sides are being completely truthful) Stardock just might be "similar but legally distinct". Though, that's up to the courts to decide.
 
This got me to go look up an old game lost to time. Nexus the Jupiter Incident. It had a failed kickstarter to get a version 2 back around 2012. It looks like the ip was bought by nordic games, now THQ nordic... not sure what that means but there is zero mention of this property being developed.

In any event, I hope if they do have the legitimate and uncontested rights to the game, they eventually make something. Otherwise it might be like another gearbox situation and homeworld 3, which is still not here and does not look to be coming.
 
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