is the st20g5 a lot worse / less stable than the sn25p? cuz in hardocp's reviews of these 2, theres pretty much nothing but praise for the sn25p, but theres this huge list of crap for the st20g5. but at another site it said the g5 was great. and also, does the g5 oc at all like the sn25p can, or no? i dont really need oc tho; i mainly just want stability. is it as bad as kyle makes it sound?
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ST20G5 vs SN25P
- Thread starter Soymilk
- Start date
Well let me tell You some differences between P and G chassis XPC's first.
P chassis are just superior to a G5 chassis.
Power supply is bigger and better too.
P series are bigger and some people doo not like it or design of it. Many people find G5 design nicer.
So 350 watt PSU should be more stable although 240 watt Silent X PSU is stable to.
Also Pchassis has biger mainboard and better layout and better cooling of a VRM on mainboard.
Difference in cooling is also noticable. Although G chassis evolution in 5 generations and many versions made G chassis quieter and better cooling P chassis has complitly different approach.
G5 chassis relays on single path airflow thrue a chassis. Nice 92 mili fan pulls air out of ICE and case. Air comes strategicly from many sides into a chassis but sadly thru many small holes resulting in some intake noise. Mash cover reduses it a bit. This intake nosie is not noticable in smart fan and low fan settings but becomes very audible with high speed settings.
P chassis ICE radiator part and heat pipes are smaller then once on a G5 chassis. Also it's ducted partialy. ICE Fans generate different and separate airflow direction then rest of a fans in P chassis. ICE is smaller but uses two fans. Front duct one in 60 mili and back exhaust one in 80 mili. Both fans have two functions. 60 mili puls air in a case thur a duct over a VRM part of a mainboard cooling it and delivers air to a 2/3 of a radiator of a ICE.
80 mili fan works with 60 mili in push pull configuration and pulls air out of ICE. Though as allready sad 60 mili covers only 2/3 of ICE so 80 mili pulls also air out of chassis thru 1/3 of a ICE and helps cooling chassis it self.
Fact that 60 mili + duct cools mosfets on mainboard is cool but then again it delivers hoter air to cool CPU.
Also 80 mili profitc from what could be cooler inside air but if case is hot then it's a down side.
Further there is a PSU fan that pulls air out of chassis and PSU and two top fans pulling hot air from a top of a chassis (there are HDD mounting brackets so HDDs can be colled there) out of a case.
So airflow has 4 different paths. Intake is only front right and exhausts are on left front side and back side. Air exits on four places. Also path over a ICe is double. One part thrue a duct and one over it.
There is a chipset cooler fan to.
So P chassis has 1 40x40x 10 mili fan. 3 60x60x10 mili fans and two 80 mili fans plus Your grafic card fan. And it has more holes.
It has smaller ICE radiator and ICE is lighter.
All those things say it should be more noisy and should cool worse then G chassis.
Well it isn't so it just works great and cools great and it's very very quiet in smart fan mode. Install 6600Gt or stronger card and mostprobobly ony noise You will hear is GPU fan.
Sometimes DVD drives and HHD's are audible to. Cooling is only noisy in full blast mode or when things gett really really hot.
In full blast mode G chassis has still bit of a advantage cuse ICE is havier and bigger and radiator has bigger urface and fan makes 50 CFM. With some mods G5 chassis is a killer.
Only HDD cooling int that great in G chassis.
G chassis ahs also very poor grafic card slot position to.
So consdering heat both sytems are extremmly good and any unstablity will come sooner from software or mainboard then from heat and CPU and other hot components.
That sad I have to say that I'm not goingto by mobo with ATi chipset on it ever agian.
I've build for customers few of them (like once in ASUS Pundit R) and preformance and stability are poor.
Kyle gett's or buys things to test in their early stages and almost beta versions (RC2
)
hence He shares what He finds with Us. He have tested SN95G5 V1,0 and found shit.
Shuttle reacted and made V2,0 mobo and all those things where solved so many people enjoy SN95G5.
He found many shit with ST20G5 but I doo not recall wich revision was it. I've stayed away from it so I realy doo not know have they fixed it. I've found many people and reviewers saying bad things about it and few saying it's great.
I've build SN25P (I'm just building 3 of then today ) and I find then very very good.
They supprot x2 CPUs to.
IMHO affter building many XPc's I would rather take SN95G5 then ST20G5. Although I would build SN25P rather then any of G5 XPC's.
SN25P>SN95G5>.............>ST20G5
MD
P chassis are just superior to a G5 chassis.
Power supply is bigger and better too.
P series are bigger and some people doo not like it or design of it. Many people find G5 design nicer.
So 350 watt PSU should be more stable although 240 watt Silent X PSU is stable to.
Also Pchassis has biger mainboard and better layout and better cooling of a VRM on mainboard.
Difference in cooling is also noticable. Although G chassis evolution in 5 generations and many versions made G chassis quieter and better cooling P chassis has complitly different approach.
G5 chassis relays on single path airflow thrue a chassis. Nice 92 mili fan pulls air out of ICE and case. Air comes strategicly from many sides into a chassis but sadly thru many small holes resulting in some intake noise. Mash cover reduses it a bit. This intake nosie is not noticable in smart fan and low fan settings but becomes very audible with high speed settings.
P chassis ICE radiator part and heat pipes are smaller then once on a G5 chassis. Also it's ducted partialy. ICE Fans generate different and separate airflow direction then rest of a fans in P chassis. ICE is smaller but uses two fans. Front duct one in 60 mili and back exhaust one in 80 mili. Both fans have two functions. 60 mili puls air in a case thur a duct over a VRM part of a mainboard cooling it and delivers air to a 2/3 of a radiator of a ICE.
80 mili fan works with 60 mili in push pull configuration and pulls air out of ICE. Though as allready sad 60 mili covers only 2/3 of ICE so 80 mili pulls also air out of chassis thru 1/3 of a ICE and helps cooling chassis it self.
Fact that 60 mili + duct cools mosfets on mainboard is cool but then again it delivers hoter air to cool CPU.
Also 80 mili profitc from what could be cooler inside air but if case is hot then it's a down side.
Further there is a PSU fan that pulls air out of chassis and PSU and two top fans pulling hot air from a top of a chassis (there are HDD mounting brackets so HDDs can be colled there) out of a case.
So airflow has 4 different paths. Intake is only front right and exhausts are on left front side and back side. Air exits on four places. Also path over a ICe is double. One part thrue a duct and one over it.
There is a chipset cooler fan to.
So P chassis has 1 40x40x 10 mili fan. 3 60x60x10 mili fans and two 80 mili fans plus Your grafic card fan. And it has more holes.
It has smaller ICE radiator and ICE is lighter.
All those things say it should be more noisy and should cool worse then G chassis.
Well it isn't so it just works great and cools great and it's very very quiet in smart fan mode. Install 6600Gt or stronger card and mostprobobly ony noise You will hear is GPU fan.
Sometimes DVD drives and HHD's are audible to. Cooling is only noisy in full blast mode or when things gett really really hot.
In full blast mode G chassis has still bit of a advantage cuse ICE is havier and bigger and radiator has bigger urface and fan makes 50 CFM. With some mods G5 chassis is a killer.
Only HDD cooling int that great in G chassis.
G chassis ahs also very poor grafic card slot position to.
So consdering heat both sytems are extremmly good and any unstablity will come sooner from software or mainboard then from heat and CPU and other hot components.
That sad I have to say that I'm not goingto by mobo with ATi chipset on it ever agian.
I've build for customers few of them (like once in ASUS Pundit R) and preformance and stability are poor.
Kyle gett's or buys things to test in their early stages and almost beta versions (RC2
)hence He shares what He finds with Us. He have tested SN95G5 V1,0 and found shit.
Shuttle reacted and made V2,0 mobo and all those things where solved so many people enjoy SN95G5.
He found many shit with ST20G5 but I doo not recall wich revision was it. I've stayed away from it so I realy doo not know have they fixed it. I've found many people and reviewers saying bad things about it and few saying it's great.
I've build SN25P (I'm just building 3 of then today
) and I find then very very good.They supprot x2 CPUs to.
IMHO affter building many XPc's I would rather take SN95G5 then ST20G5. Although I would build SN25P rather then any of G5 XPC's.
SN25P>SN95G5>.............>ST20G5
MD
I agree completely with MD as I have built numerous Shuttle's models and had issues with two different ST20G5's - where the performance would drop off for several minutes in games due to limitations of the ATI/ULI chipset utilized for the Motherboard.
If you are a heavy gamer the ST20G5 is not for you - Definitely go with the SN25P as it uses NF4 Ultra chipset and is an awesome overclocker. I was able to clock my new X2 3800+ to 2.4ghz stable and played hours of BF2 on the SN25P. The only limitation is that you can't use an Audigy soundcard due to the PCI-E 1x slot. The SN25P also runs practically silent and will allow you to run any current or future high end video card (7800GTX / X1800XT) sicne it can fit an ATI card with double slot cooler!
If you are a heavy gamer the ST20G5 is not for you - Definitely go with the SN25P as it uses NF4 Ultra chipset and is an awesome overclocker. I was able to clock my new X2 3800+ to 2.4ghz stable and played hours of BF2 on the SN25P. The only limitation is that you can't use an Audigy soundcard due to the PCI-E 1x slot. The SN25P also runs practically silent and will allow you to run any current or future high end video card (7800GTX / X1800XT) sicne it can fit an ATI card with double slot cooler!
new one will prob be better but if the sn25p gets a lower price I would still get it. since when did looks matter over performance? lol my sn25p is one of the fastest pcs out there period and it's tiny and dead silent! what's not to love?
i'd rather not have to look at something that i think is ugly every day on my desk
also, i was debating between shuttle and qpack, and i like qpacks more than the sn25p, but i was thinking that maybe the st20g5 would b better than any current matx boards. guess i was wrong
also, i was debating between shuttle and qpack, and i like qpacks more than the sn25p, but i was thinking that maybe the st20g5 would b better than any current matx boards. guess i was wrong
However, the Qpack is back up on the list of huge ass XPCs. IMHO XPCS are getting too big and are basically sacrificing their "XPC-ness" by just becoming micropcs. Meh, IF I have to get anythign bigger than my SN95G5v3 I'd just got with a fullsize alumninum midtower and pimp it out to the max.
eastvillager
[H]ard|Gawd
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2004
- Messages
- 1,093
the qpack is ten times uglier than the sn25p.
I don't understand why people think the sn25p is ugly. Only two things come to mind, 1) they've never seen one in person, and/or 2) they want bling.
On the other hand, I never understood why people would put Type R stickers on ford escorts either, go figure.
I don't understand why people think the sn25p is ugly. Only two things come to mind, 1) they've never seen one in person, and/or 2) they want bling.
On the other hand, I never understood why people would put Type R stickers on ford escorts either, go figure.
true, i havent seen one in person. i'm also hoping that these new c51 boards r good oc'ers etc, though. and the price difference between the shuttle and a qpack w/ mobo and psu is still around $100, which is a little steep for me assuming that theres a decent matx board by the time i want to buy. my brother's friend has a sn25p though, i may go over to his house and check it out in person.