SSD + HDD integration in win7

[Yamaki]

I'm building my mom a computer for her birthday, and I want her to be blown away by its speed (probably not hard since she's currently using a 5-year-old gateway, but I digress), so I decided to use a 500GB WD Blue for storage and an OCZ Agility 30GB for boot.

I'm trying to make it as painless as possible for her to migrate from Windows XP to Windows 7, and part of that is not having to worry about having two separate drives. She has been using only 60GB for the past few years, so I figured if I put OS/software on the SSD and the Users folder on the HDD, there shouldn't be any space problems, and it won't feel much different than the one drive that my mom is used to.

My question is this: What's the best way, on a fresh install of Windows 7, to make this all work behind the scenes? I know I'll probably have to make a symlink from C:/Users to E:/Users, but when is the best time to do this? Before or after installing win7? And will it create any problems when it comes time to use the Migration Assistant?

Thanks.

 

[Surly73]

There are probably a number of ways to do this. If there's only a particular directory in her profile you can use one of the submenus to relocate just that within the system.

If you really want to use a symlink, you'll probably have to use safe mode or the recovery console to make it happen post-install.

I have done something similar with C:\Documents and Settings\ under Win2k3 with an nlite slipstreamed install disk which let's you set the location for D+S. I don't know that any of that knowledge applies to Vista/W7 though.

 

[peanutskeeter]

I would personally do a RAID 0 array that way you have 1 drive that is 530GB big, and she will get her speed. I have found when you go to moving user directories from here to there and having this location point to here and bla bla bla it makes for a HUGGEEE HEADACHE!! DONT DO IT!! especially if you are not going to be around to fix problems for her when they arise.

 

[bastage]

I would personally do a RAID 0 array that way you have 1 drive that is 530GB big, and she will get her speed. I have found when you go to moving user directories from here to there and having this location point to here and bla bla bla it makes for a HUGGEEE HEADACHE!! DONT DO IT!! especially if you are not going to be around to fix problems for her when they arise.

either thats a complete crock of shit or something has really changed with raid since I last set up a raid 0.. By Basic rules of raid 0 you would end up with a single 60gb drive that was faster then the original mechanical drive, but nowhere near the ssd's original speed..

 

[Yamaki]

There are probably a number of ways to do this. If there's only a particular directory in her profile you can use one of the submenus to relocate just that within the system.

If you really want to use a symlink, you'll probably have to use safe mode or the recovery console to make it happen post-install.

I have done something similar with C:\Documents and Settings\ under Win2k3 with an nlite slipstreamed install disk which let's you set the location for D+S. I don't know that any of that knowledge applies to Vista/W7 though.

I think there's a similar tool for win7 (vlite?), I'll have to check it out. I'd love to do it before install to avoid headaches.

either thats a complete crock of shit or something has really changed with raid since I last set up a raid 0.. By Basic rules of raid 0 you would end up with a single 60gb drive that was faster then the original mechanical drive, but nowhere near the ssd's original speed..

This. It would become a slightly-faster-than-HDD 60 gig array.

 

[jen4950]

I would personally do a RAID 0 array that way you have 1 drive that is 530GB big, and she will get her speed. I have found when you go to moving user directories from here to there and having this location point to here and bla bla bla it makes for a HUGGEEE HEADACHE!! DONT DO IT!! especially if you are not going to be around to fix problems for her when they arise.

RTFM: RAID manual.

...

It's real easy- just right click on the folders under her profile and goto Propoerties > Location tab, and change them to you HDD location.

Another cool thing I just discovered is the use of libraries; it will combine folders on different drives into one library folder- so if you needed to add a drive later you could just combine them in a library rather than flirting with RAID on a mainstream or less than power user.

 

[Yamaki]

RTFM: RAID manual.

...

It's real easy- just right click on the folders under her profile and goto Propoerties > Location tab, and change them to you HDD location.

Another cool thing I just discovered is the use of libraries; it will combine folders on different drives into one library folder- so if you needed to add a drive later you could just combine them in a library rather than flirting with RAID on a mainstream or less than power user.

This works pretty well, but I'm concerned about this not working for the Users/AppData directory, as it can get pretty big. It could end up being a non-issue, I just want the SSD to have as much free space as possible for apps. Also, will the Migration Assistant recognize that I moved the folders to the other drive?

 

[jen4950]

This works pretty well, but I'm concerned about this not working for the Users/AppData directory, as it can get pretty big. It could end up being a non-issue, I just want the SSD to have as much free space as possible for apps. Also, will the Migration Assistant recognize that I moved the folders to the other drive?

Maybe get a slightly bigger SSD so you don't have to worry about it? The only thing I would be worried about are the Outlook PST file, swap file and maybe scratch disks depending on the application- along with the apps. All other user data should be in the user folders on the HDD- like music, pictures etc.

What apps does she use?

I'm not a big fan of migrating. I would set up a clean install for Windows, clean install for all of the apps, update all of the software, and then start moving stuff over. If she doesn't have a network, you can get a simple crossover cable and plug them in directly, set up a workgroup, and pick and choose what files to move over.

I'd leave all of the nasties and vestiges on the old box, and only pull over what is important.

 

[Surly73]

RTFM: RAID manual.

...

It's real easy- just right click on the folders under her profile and goto Propoerties > Location tab, and change them to you HDD location.

.

This doesn't change the location of Users for ALL users. I believe that this also won't work for Application Data, which can be very large depending on what all is being done.

 

[King Icewind]

Is your mom going to know (and remember) how to save to the 500gb hard drive, not to the SSD? It's going to get full real fast, she'll complain, and you'll have to fix it. Probably many times...

With W7 you can change the location of the Pictures, Documents Video folders, and don't forget the downloads.

I just still think it's going to be a hassle for both of you...

 

[jen4950]

This doesn't change the location of Users for ALL users. I believe that this also won't work for Application Data, which can be very large depending on what all is being done.

How many users are going to be on his Mom's machine?

What other apps other than Photoshop, Outlook and the swap file are going to be hard to find and move?

Sometimes simple and ignoring all possible permutations of how this machine might possibly be operated is more effective for the end user.

 

[jen4950]

Is your mom going to know (and remember) how to save to the 500gb hard drive, not to the SSD? It's going to get full real fast, she'll complain, and you'll have to fix it. Probably many times...

With W7 you can change the location of the Pictures, Documents Video folders, and don't forget the downloads.

I just still think it's going to be a hassle for both of you...

I have some very hard headed, technologically challenged users. People understand "save to your folder" a lot better than "goto the D:, find Users, Find your folder, find My Documents, and 'SAVE IN THERE'".

I know it's hard for a lot of us to not dive into the details, but most of the time it's not neccessary, and is frankly against what the Windows designers have worked so hard at perfecting- idiot-proofing the UI.

Personal folders are all over Windows 7- shouldn't be a problem.

 

[bastage]

just get a samsung f3 & the difference will be enough considering the long term simplicity.

 

[Chimel]

Lol, a 30GB boot and apps SSD with Windows 7, are you dreaming?
The Windows folder alone takes 17GB, with an extra 4-5 for %ProgramFiles%.
I have 127GB in my Users folder (1GB of Google Earth cache, and 650MB of Virtual Earth) although most of this will move to your symlink folder.

You can fill up that boot and apps drive very fast, I would not consider anything below 128GB for my own use, perhaps less for your mum, but certainly much more than 30GB.
The hibernation file and the page file will take another toll, and you need to have initial disk usage under 60% for better performance and usage scalability.

Get a single SATA III HDD fast enough to amaze your mum and spend the extra money on better speakers, an internal multi-card reader, a webcam, a nice wireless laser mouse, an external backup drive, a blu-ray player, better hardware specs, software, a 5¼" jewel tray or front panel that says her name in LEDs, etc. I think it's better to have a great multimedia computer with all the bells and whistles peripherals than one with a complex mix of invisible fast and slow disks hidden inside the computer case that, I'm afraid to say, appeals only to geeks like us.

 

[[LYL]Homer]

300-600gb VelociRaptor and be done with it.

 

[bastage]

300-600gb VelociRaptor and be done with it.

raptors lost there flair when the samsung f3 drives came out..

 

[Surly73]

How many users are going to be on his Mom's machine?

If nothing else the All Users and Default User folders. I've seen a bunch of apps which write logs and store configs there. Maybe mom, dad, the sibling that still lives at home? Don't assume.

The right click and change location method is simple, and I'm betting it's based on the same code which supports the GPOs used in an Active Directory environment to move folders like "My Documents" to network filers. It's built in, but it misses lots of stuff since you can only move "My *" and not things like Application Data. Firefox and it's entire cache live in Application Data, for instance.

What other apps other than Photoshop, Outlook and the swap file are going to be hard to find and move?

Sometimes simple and ignoring all possible permutations of how this machine might possibly be operated is more effective for the end user.

My Win7 build including a whack of apps (incl Photoshop, office, video tools, conferencing stuff etc...etc....), hibernation file (4GB) and page file (4GB) can in under 30GB. A non-enthusiast system should be able to fit in a 30GB SSD without a problem. If critical on space, the system builder can move the swap file once.

 

[Surly73]

I have some very hard headed, technologically challenged users. People understand "save to your folder" a lot better than "goto the D:, find Users, Find your folder, find My Documents, and 'SAVE IN THERE'".

I know it's hard for a lot of us to not dive into the details, but most of the time it's not neccessary, and is frankly against what the Windows designers have worked so hard at perfecting- idiot-proofing the UI.

Personal folders are all over Windows 7- shouldn't be a problem.

This is why you use symlinks, not telling them to use D:.

If you use the vlite/nlite relocation of C:\Users it will indeed look like D:\Users\.... to the user, but "My Documents" and clicking on their user folder on the desktop still works seamlessly regardless of the fact that it's been moved to D:. I don't know why you think you need to tell the user to "save your files on D:"

If you use symlinks, it looks and acts just like C:\Users but doesn't actually live there. No re-training of the user base is required.