Slow SSD boot?

N

Namakan

Gawd
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Dec 19, 2008
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563
I have 2 Hyper X 3K Kingston 120GB SSDs. I have one in my desktop and one in laptop.

The boot time in my laptop is very fast with windows 8.1 ( Quick video demo www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pEtIvgHDhg)

However using the same SSD in my desktop which I just upgraded to a 4770k a few days ago boots much slower, around 30s to boot into windows. It is in AHCI mode and on an Intel SATA 6Gb/s port. My motherboard is an Asus Z87-Plus.

The SSD seems to run fine in benchmarks on my desktop despite the slow boot time.

AS SSD:
ocjfkXe.png

ATTO:
dePw0nG.png


I tried disconnected my other hard drives and all USB ports but nothing changed. I also tried loading default BIOS settings, also to no change.

I am using the Intel rapid storage driver, and I have made sure TRIM is enabled

Is this normal? Why does my laptop boot much faster with the same drive?
 
Did you enable UEFI fast boot? What is your GPU?
 
Is this based off a fresh install for the desktop or did you image a previous drive (HDD) to the SSD?
 
Z87s can be picky about sata drives. On my MSI Z87-G41, I had to move my Intel X-18M G1 and some older sata hdds to a different controller to prevent slow booting/detection issues.
 
Igthorn said:
Z87s can be picky about sata drives. On my MSI Z87-G41, I had to move my Intel X-18M G1 and some older sata hdds to a different controller to prevent slow booting/detection issues.
Click to expand...

I'm using the Intel rapid storage drivers. I tried moving the hard drives to I think the Asrock? or some other vendors controller but it didn't make a difference.


EDIT: I was under the impression that the intel drivers were better than the Microsoft stock drivers, is it worth trying to revert back to the generic MS drivers?

T4xbGKy.png


Ultima99 said:
BIOS and drivers current?
Click to expand...

Yes to both, most current possible.
 
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The laptop probably has less devices to initialize.

Also, what speed is your RAM running at?

Did you have any other drives hooked up when you installed Windows? If so, it may have stuck a couple things on a different drive. Try booting without any other drives hooked up and see what happens.

How much RAM is in the desktop vs the laptop? Do you have your swap file set to automatic? What about hibernation? If the desktop has a lot more RAM, it could make a difference, especially if you have hibernation turned on and have the swap file size set to automatic.
 
cyclone3d said:
The laptop probably has less devices to initialize.

Also, what speed is your RAM running at?

Did you have any other drives hooked up when you installed Windows? If so, it may have stuck a couple things on a different drive. Try booting without any other drives hooked up and see what happens.

How much RAM is in the desktop vs the laptop? Do you have your swap file set to automatic? What about hibernation? If the desktop has a lot more RAM, it could make a difference, especially if you have hibernation turned on and have the swap file size set to automatic.
Click to expand...

I have the RAM at 1600 Mhz. The laptop and desktop both have 8GB. I had the other drives hooked up when I installed windows but they are purely storage drives, and unhooking doesn't affect the boot time. The swap file is auto I guess? Its all on default on both machines. The hybrid boot is enable on both machines.

Side notes: The laptop is a i7 Sandy bridge, I forget the model number on it but you get the point. The Laptop also has a storage drive inside of it.
 
I'm inclined to think that your laptop is abnormally fast rather than the desktop being abnormally slow. My boot times on a fresh installation on my desktop is ~35 seconds, not including the POST period. On my laptop, the boot time is around 20 seconds, again, not including POST. My laptop is a SB i7 dual-core with 8gb RAM with a GT520m. My desktop has a 240gb Corsair Force 3 while my laptop has an OCZ Deneva 2 480gb. Both running Windows 8.1.
 
Sounds perfectly normal to me. Laptops have simplified motherboards, a streamlined BIOS, and less hardware installed in them. That makes them boot considerably faster than most desktops.
 
Bluesun311 said:
Do you have the AsMedia SATA controller turned on or off in BIOS?
Click to expand...

Yes, I do.


Tsumi said:
I'm inclined to think that your laptop is abnormally fast rather than the desktop being abnormally slow. My boot times on a fresh installation on my desktop is ~35 seconds, not including the POST period. On my laptop, the boot time is around 20 seconds, again, not including POST. My laptop is a SB i7 dual-core with 8gb RAM with a GT520m. My desktop has a 240gb Corsair Force 3 while my laptop has an OCZ Deneva 2 480gb. Both running Windows 8.1.
Click to expand...




arentol said:
Sounds perfectly normal to me. Laptops have simplified motherboards, a streamlined BIOS, and less hardware installed in them. That makes them boot considerably faster than most desktops.
Click to expand...


Alright, well this is acceptable. I just wanted to make sure everything is going normal. This is my first experience with SSDs, and I haven't built a system since my Core2Quad I just upgraded from, so I'm a little out of the loop on this stuff.

Thanks for the help! :)
 
Namakan said:
Yes, I do.
Click to expand...
Wait. What? That wasn't a yes or no question lol.
Alright, well this is acceptable. I just wanted to make sure everything is going normal.
Click to expand...
Definitely not normal. My 8.1 build boots in ~3.7 seconds, the Task Manager has a BIOS load timer. This is probably about your BIOS being set to Compatibility mode instead of Full Secure Boot, it hasn't got anything to do with your SSD settings.
 
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Bluesun311 said:
Wait. What? That wasn't a yes or no question lol.

Definitely not normal. My 8.1 build boots in ~3.7 seconds, the Task Manager has a BIOS load timer. This is probably about your BIOS being set to Compatibility mode instead of Full Secure Boot, it hasn't got anything to do with your SSD settings.
Click to expand...

Is this the build in your signature with only one SATA device?
 
Bluesun311 said:
Wait. What? That wasn't a yes or no question lol.

Definitely not normal. My 8.1 build boots in ~3.7 seconds, the Task Manager has a BIOS load timer. This is probably about your BIOS being set to Compatibility mode instead of Full Secure Boot, it hasn't got anything to do with your SSD settings.
Click to expand...

I'll go make sure that Full Secure Boot is enabled.

And I meant yes, it is disabled.
arentol said:
Is this the build in your signature with only one SATA device?
Click to expand...

My signature build is very out of date. My newer specs are listed above in the thread.
 
Bluesun311 said:
Wait. What? That wasn't a yes or no question lol.

Definitely not normal. My 8.1 build boots in ~3.7 seconds, the Task Manager has a BIOS load timer. This is probably about your BIOS being set to Compatibility mode instead of Full Secure Boot, it hasn't got anything to do with your SSD settings.
Click to expand...

Are you sure that's 3700 ms? Or 37000?
 
Okay with CSM enable, I get this:
Image

The current BIOS setting do not fully support the boot device. Click OK to enter the BIOS Setup. then in yellow text: Go to Advanced>Boot>CSM Parameters and adjust the CSM (Compatibility Support Module) settings to enable the boot device."]The current BIOS setting do not fully support the boot device.
Click OK to enter the BIOS Setup.
Go to Advanced>Boot>CSM Parameters and adjust the CSM (Compatibility Support Module) settings to enable the boot device.


Which lead me to this thread

It looks like my SSD is not compatible with secure boot.
 
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Namakan said:
Okay with CSM enable, I get this:
Image
It looks like my SSD is not compatible with secure boot.
Click to expand...

No, I've run 8.1 with secure boot on HyperX 3Ks, they are.
Maybe your video card doesn't support UEFI

arentol said:
Is this the build in your signature with only one SATA device?
Click to expand...

As opposed to 2?

Yes. And same speed with 3. I recently sold 2 Kingston HyperX 3k 120GBs.

Tsumi said:
Are you sure that's 3700 ms? Or 37000?
Click to expand...

Yes, I'm sure. Welcome to z87/win 8.1 properly configured.
 
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Tsumi said:
That's not the correct boot time. My bios startup time is 9.7 seconds with all the extra stuff I have.

To really find out your OS boot time, use this guide:

http://howto.cnet.com/8301-11310_39-20101652-285/find-your-computers-boot-time-in-windows-7/
Click to expand...

That's OK, I'll just look at the BIOS startup time in the Task Manager so I don't have to follow your guide for windows 7 and waste a buncha time worrying about how long it takes my computer to boot (my monitor takes almost as long to turn on). If you want to compare apples, lets see your screenshot, with all your extra stuff, lol. So competitive.

30+ second boot startup on z87 means UEFI isn't properly configured or some components aren't UEFI compatible, I zoom in on the problem, you want to argue about how to see your "real" bootup time.
 
Bluesun311 said:
That's OK, I'll just look at the BIOS startup time in the Task Manager so I don't have to follow your guide for windows 7 and waste a buncha time worrying about how long it takes my computer to boot (my monitor takes almost as long to turn on). If you want to compare apples, lets see your screenshot, with all your extra stuff, lol. So competitive.

30+ second boot startup on z87 means UEFI isn't properly configured or some components aren't UEFI compatible, I zoom in on the problem, you want to argue about how to see your "real" bootup time.
Click to expand...

I'll tell you my event viewer boot time says about 35-40 seconds on average (unless there's a Windows update), while my task manager bios time says 9.7 seconds.

The two measurements are measuring completely different things. You cannot compare the two and give the OP a good idea of what's going on.

There are even cases where it shows 0 seconds, and that obviously cannot happen. http://superuser.com/questions/543039/last-bios-time-on-task-manager

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_8-performance/last-bios-time/615cbc89-10ef-4441-ac65-e3b4df256e73 This says that it shows bios startup time, not OS boot time. My 9.7 seconds is most likely due to the fact that I can't GOP boot with 580s.

Additionally, the steps for Windows 8 are the exact same as 7, and I suspect the exact same for Vista as well.
 
Bluesun311 said:
No, I've run 8.1 with secure boot on HyperX 3Ks, they are.
Maybe your video card doesn't support UEFI
Click to expand...

When I enabled secure boot my SSD disappeared from the BIOS until I reverted the settings. with secure boot disabled the system runs, just in the way I have gone over in this thread. The Windows BIOS time you are mention, I get 14.8 seconds.

Anyway in that thread I linked about my SSD and z87, it just does not work in secure boot mode, is whats going on in the thread. The SSD disappears from the BIOS when it is enabled

A Quick google says my GTX 770 from PNY is UEFI compatible.
 
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Tsumi said:
That's not the correct boot time. My bios startup time is 9.7 seconds with all the extra stuff I have.

To really find out your OS boot time, use this guide:

http://howto.cnet.com/8301-11310_39-20101652-285/find-your-computers-boot-time-in-windows-7/
Click to expand...

Here is my boot log
Code: 
Windows has started up: 
     Boot Duration		:	32391ms
     IsDegradation		:	false
     Incident Time (UTC)	:	‎2014‎-‎02‎-‎08T17:10:35.770693100Z

Code: 
- EventData 

  BootTsVersion 2 
  BootStartTime 2014-02-08T17:10:35.770693100Z 
  BootEndTime 2014-02-08T17:12:26.174201500Z 
  SystemBootInstance 30 
  UserBootInstance 45 
  BootTime 32391 
  MainPathBootTime 22291 
  BootKernelInitTime 19 
  BootDriverInitTime 98 
  BootDevicesInitTime 696 
  BootPrefetchInitTime 0 
  BootPrefetchBytes 0 
  BootAutoChkTime 0 
  BootSmssInitTime 17479 
  BootCriticalServicesInitTime 44 
  BootUserProfileProcessingTime 62 
  BootMachineProfileProcessingTime 37 
  BootExplorerInitTime 3003 
  BootNumStartupApps 4 
  BootPostBootTime 10100 
  BootIsRebootAfterInstall false 
  BootRootCauseStepImprovementBits 0 
  BootRootCauseGradualImprovementBits 0 
  BootRootCauseStepDegradationBits 0 
  BootRootCauseGradualDegradationBits 0 
  BootIsDegradation false 
  BootIsStepDegradation false 
  BootIsGradualDegradation false 
  BootImprovementDelta 0 
  BootDegradationDelta 0 
  BootIsRootCauseIdentified false 
  OSLoaderDuration 450 
  BootPNPInitStartTimeMS 19 
  BootPNPInitDuration 1009 
  OtherKernelInitDuration 516 
  SystemPNPInitStartTimeMS 1517 
  SystemPNPInitDuration 43 
  SessionInitStartTimeMS 1569 
  Session0InitDuration 14568 
  Session1InitDuration 91 
  SessionInitOtherDuration 2819 
  WinLogonStartTimeMS 19048 
  OtherLogonInitActivityDuration 140 
  UserLogonWaitDuration 739
 
Namakan said:
When I enabled secure boot my SSD disappeared from the BIOS until I reverted the settings. with secure boot disabled the system runs, just in the way I have gone over in this thread. The Windows BIOS time you are mention, I get 14.8 seconds.

Anyway in that thread I linked about my SSD and z87, it just does not work in secure boot mode, is whats going on in the thread. The SSD disappears from the BIOS when it is enabled

A Quick google says my GTX 770 from PNY is UEFI compatible.
Click to expand...

I see, that would have surprised me if the 770 wasn't compatible with UEFI, was a bad guess. SO--

Then I think you simply haven't installed windows 8 in UEFI mode. This is best done by installing windows 8.1 from scratch with a flash drive. You have to get the BIOS to show the installation media as: UEFI: "Media Type". During the install. If you install from media that doesn't have "UEFI:" in front of it for the boot mode it will install the operating system in legacy mode.
 
Check the boot log for your laptop as well. I would be interested to see what the numbers say.

32391 translates to about 32 seconds. Coupled with the bios time, that adds an additional ~15 seconds. UEFI boot mostly cuts out that 15 seconds, down to around the 5 seconds Bluesun reported. UEFI boot can help the OS boot time to a degree, but I doubt it will be much.
 
Bluesun311 said:
I see, that would have surprised me if the 770 wasn't compatible with UEFI, was a bad guess. SO--

Then I think you simply haven't installed windows 8 in UEFI mode. This is best done by installing windows 8.1 from scratch with a flash drive. You have to get the BIOS to show the installation media as: UEFI: "Media Type". During the install. If you install from media that doesn't have "UEFI:" in front of it for the boot mode it will install the operating system in legacy mode.
Click to expand...

I'll look into doing this soon.

Tsumi said:
Check the boot log for your laptop as well. I would be interested to see what the numbers say.

32391 translates to about 32 seconds. Coupled with the bios time, that adds an additional ~15 seconds. UEFI boot mostly cuts out that 15 seconds, down to around the 5 seconds Bluesun reported. UEFI boot can help the OS boot time to a degree, but I doubt it will be much.
Click to expand...

So with the hybrid shutdown in Win8.1 my laptop is reporting a resume duration of 3304ms, and doesn't seem to create Event 100, but instead event 300

Code: 
 Standby Incident Time (UTC)	:	‎2014‎-‎02‎-‎09T02:39:29.598561400Z
     Resume  Duration		:	3304ms
 
Event viewer ID 300 means that your computer isn't shutting down. You're going into standby mode based on what I can find online.
 
Tsumi said:
Event viewer ID 300 means that your computer isn't shutting down. You're going into standby mode based on what I can find online.
Click to expand...

Isn't that the Hybrid shutdown is supposed to do? It uses the hybrid file for a faster shutdow. I only use the shutdown command and my laptop hasn't had Event 100 since December 28th. (I use it daily for school)

There are resume times from when I woke it up from idle and those are like 600 ms. I'll reboot without hybrid shutdown and find out the time

Bluesun311 said:
I see, that would have surprised me if the 770 wasn't compatible with UEFI, was a bad guess. SO--

Then I think you simply haven't installed windows 8 in UEFI mode. This is best done by installing windows 8.1 from scratch with a flash drive. You have to get the BIOS to show the installation media as: UEFI: "Media Type". During the install. If you install from media that doesn't have "UEFI:" in front of it for the boot mode it will install the operating system in legacy mode.
Click to expand...

Okay to touch on this again, is there a way to check if it is installed in UEFI mode other than just reinstalling it because I installed from usb stick, and I'm pretty sure that it said UEFI over the stick when I set the boot order up.
 
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Namakan said:
Isn't that the Hybrid shutdown is supposed to do? It uses the hybrid file for a faster shutdow. I only use the shutdown command and my laptop hasn't had Event 100 since December 28th. (I use it daily for school)

There are resume times from when I woke it up from idle and those are like 600 ms. I'll reboot without hybrid shutdown and find out the time



Okay to touch on this again, is there a way to check if it is installed in UEFI mode other than just reinstalling it because I installed from usb stick, and I'm pretty sure that it said UEFI over the stick when I set the boot order up.
Click to expand...

I don't think so. I know for sure UEFI boot is set up properly on my computer, and hybrid boot as well. It still shows event ID as 100.
 
Tsumi said:
I don't think so. I know for sure UEFI boot is set up properly on my computer, and hybrid boot as well. It still shows event ID as 100.
Click to expand...

I can not get it to create an event 100. Who knows, I'm not really worried about the laptop right now anyway. So anyway, when I get back home tomorow I'm going to check if Windows on the desktop is installed in UEFI mode.

I found this guide on the net
 
Just my 2 cents:

Stop fussing over the UEFI, stop fussing over the secure boot BS.
The ASSD and ATTO threw very different results and I am sussing that there is driver issues at play. The OS is taking too long to get going but then even longer to load the system drivers and bloat.

The Five stages of a system boot;
  1. Power on = BIOS loads and does POST and gives you either a stupid graphic or gives you actual system info. Once done, it gives the go-ahead to the first boot device.
  2. OS starts and loads the kernel and bulk core. this is when you are seeing the windows logo, when this logo goes, the OS is loaded.
  3. After logo goes, you get the black-screen bit as the OS loads the core drivers including video.
  4. You then get the welcome screen when all the third-party drivers and software is loading.
  5. Log-in, this is when third-party junk unique to your profile loads.

Now you can look and get an idea what is taking too long.

If you have the SSD on the Intel 6Gbps port in AHCI and no RAID, then remove all RST junk. Intel RST is a known bloater.....


As for Windows 8 boot times, DON'T use it as a guide unless you are restarting or have killed the hybrid boot. Normal shutdowns are NOT clean loads.

http://windows8build.com/2011/10/windows-8-hybrid-boot-enable-or-disable/
http://www.thewindowsclub.com/force-windows-8-hybrid-boot
 
Last edited:
Namakan said:
I can not get it to create an event 100. Who knows, I'm not really worried about the laptop right now anyway. So anyway, when I get back home tomorow I'm going to check if Windows on the desktop is installed in UEFI mode.

I found this guide on the net
Click to expand...

I found it was actually installed in Legacy mode, I could reinstall to UEFI mode soon.

Lost-Benji said:
Just my 2 cents:

Stop fussing over the UEFI, stop fussing over the secure boot BS.
The ASSD and ATTO threw very different results and I am sussing that there is driver issues at play. The OS is taking too long to get going but then even longer to load the system drivers and bloat.

The Five stages of a system boot;
  1. Power on = BIOS loads and does POST and gives you either a stupid graphic or gives you actual system info. Once done, it gives the go-ahead to the first boot device.
  2. OS starts and loads the kernel and bulk core. this is when you are seeing the windows logo, when this logo goes, the OS is loaded.
  3. After logo goes, you get the black-screen bit as the OS loads the core drivers including video.
  4. You then get the welcome screen when all the third-party drivers and software is loading.
  5. Log-in, this is when third-party junk unique to your profile loads.

Now you can look and get an idea what is taking too long.

If you have the SSD on the Intel 6Gbps port in AHCI and no RAID, then remove all RST junk. Intel RST is a known bloater.....


As for Windows 8 boot times, DON'T use it as a guide unless you are restarting or have killed the hybrid boot. Normal shutdowns are NOT clean loads.

http://windows8build.com/2011/10/windows-8-hybrid-boot-enable-or-disable/
http://www.thewindowsclub.com/force-windows-8-hybrid-boot
Click to expand...

The slow part is when the windows logo appears.

I ran ASSD and atto with the intel RST drivers uninstalled and on the MS driver and I got worse results (specifically on the 4K and 4K-64Thrd in ASSD) on the benchmarks and no difference in boot time
 
I don't mean to thread necro but I wanted to post an update. I swapped to a Samsung 840 Evo and I got windows installed with UEFI and secure boot enabled and the boot times off the hybrid boot are around 2-3 seconds like the laptop and this seems to have fixed whatever the issue was.
 
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